HBO Scientology documentary

[Hoosier_Daddy]

You may want to YouTube the Megyn Kelly (Fox News) interview with Mike Rinder, one of the “whistle blowers” featured in the documentary:
youtube.com/watch?v=xXfg4NLVbug

Was Megyn Kelly - who called it “shocking” - making a big deal out of it? Was Fox News? Is Fox News in cahoots with HBO?

And, no disrespect, but I think it’s a little…well, silly, for a lack of a better word, to think anyone (self-respecting or not) would want to pay thousands of dollars for Scientology “auditing” courses only to find out the world was created by an intergalactic warlord named Xenu and risk having that same church spy on you and harass you and your family members and demand that you “disconnect” from them. Really? I don’t even think the “50 Shades” crowd would be hip to that. With all due respect, on exactly what basis do you believe Scientology is the beneficiary of “Going Clear” when their membership rates are dropping worldwide, when even Fox News has called them out on their “pro-abortion”/anti-life practices, and there’s even a White House petition to revoke their tax-exempt status (currently at over 12,000 signatures)?
petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/revoke-scientologys-tax-exempt-status

It doesnt really matter to me that much. You think their membership will go down and this may just be the light shed that destroys this false faith.

I think it will be watched by few and forgotten by most. And yes, there are quite a few wackos out there. Branch Davidians, Heaven’s gate. Or the countless people that really think a zombie apocalypse is coming. Remember Y2k? Or the 2012 groups? There are shows devoted to finding bigfoot. And guess what, there are actual groups that have gained members because of it.

I have a lesser view of society than you obviously do. I think their numbers will grow, that this documentary gives credence to a group that was relegated to circus status.

But either way, if it sheds light on it or grows it, the motives behind HBO and the producers are DEFINITELY not on the side of the angels here, and certainly not friendly to Catholicism.

We live in a world where some religions chop infants heads off in front of their mothers, or etc.

Think about it. A few short years ago a polygamist cult the FLDS was in the news, in texas (a common theme here) and Utah. The “light” shown on this organization detailed kidnapping and child rapes.

Now TLC (And HBO) have shows detailing the polygamist lifestyle. Big Love was HBO’s attempt and “Sisterwives” was TLCs. But these are not the only shows about it. And these shows glorify it and keep it going. By showing these “families” These networks have normalized the deviant and crazy behavior. Sure, it was to use them as tools to advance the homosexual marriage agenda, but it has other consequences as well…

And it is not charitable, nor Christian to spread rumors as journalism. But that is the world we live in now. There are no journalists, no Woodwords.
just Brian Williams, Geraldo, and Michael Moores
Come to think of it, this sure has a Michael Moore flavor too it. And possibly an Al Gore flavor.

It is sloppy, hit piece journalism. And every one is just ok with it because it isn’t talking about sex abuse in the Church, or the oddities of believing in transubstantiation or that the Sun Danced in the Sky…

 

[randomuser]

And it is not charitable, nor Christian to spread rumors as journalism.
…
It is sloppy, hit piece journalism. And every one is just ok with it because it isn’t talking about sex abuse in the Church, or the oddities of believing in transubstantiation or that the Sun Danced in the Sky…

Are we talking about the same thing here? What, I ask with all due respect, is uncharitable or un-Christian about Lawrence Wright’s 2013 book “Going Clear: Scientology and The Prison and Belief”? I don’t think there was anything remotely “sloppy” or “hit-piece”-y about the product of a well-researched, well-corroborated, and well-documented investigation. We have the promise of Matthew 16:18 (the gates of hell shall never prevail) - Scientology doesn’t. We’re tax-exempt and don’t charge people exorbitant fees to go to confession or to go to Mass on Easter Sunday, and we can easily tell people in a few words what it means to be Catholic - Scientologists can’t. I cannot think of any anti-Catholic analogue to “Going Clear” - there isn’t any, and there won’t be. Ever.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Are we talking about the same thing here? What, I ask with all due respect, is uncharitable or un-Christian about Lawrence Wright’s 2013 book “Going Clear: Scientology and The Prison and Belief”? I don’t think there was anything remotely “sloppy” or “hit-piece”-y about the product of a well-researched, well-corroborated, and well-documented investigation. We have the promise of Matthew 16:18 (the gates of hell shall never prevail) - Scientology doesn’t. We’re tax-exempt and don’t charge people exorbitant fees to go to confession or to go to Mass on Easter Sunday, and we can easily tell people in a few words what it means to be Catholic - Scientologists can’t. I cannot think of any anti-Catholic analogue to “Going Clear” - there isn’t any, and there won’t be. Ever.

What do you mean we? The "c"atholic person down the street who has no idea why they go to Mass twice a year?

I guess we are talking about different things.

Enjoy the high horse.
Meanwhile, my state is the flavor of the month for the media to expose religious nutjobs just because they back religious freedom. And yes, that includes those crazy Catholics that believe things that no secular person can understand and no, we cannot explain our faith to the HBOs of the world when we ourselves pray the “Mysteries” of the Rosary.

Point fingers and laugh at the circus sideshow of a religion exposed. It will never happen to us!

 

[DakiniArtist]

Are we talking about the same thing here? What, I ask with all due respect, is uncharitable or un-Christian about Lawrence Wright’s 2013 book “Going Clear: Scientology and The Prison and Belief”? I don’t think there was anything remotely “sloppy” or “hit-piece”-y about the product of a well-researched, well-corroborated, and well-documented investigation. We have the promise of Matthew 16:18 (the gates of hell shall never prevail) - Scientology doesn’t. We’re tax-exempt and don’t charge people exorbitant fees to go to confession or to go to Mass on Easter Sunday, and we can easily tell people in a few words what it means to be Catholic - Scientologists can’t. I cannot think of any anti-Catholic analogue to “Going Clear” - there isn’t any, and there won’t be. Ever.

On this I agree 110%.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Here are some more HBO “documentaries”
But they attack something closer to home…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mea_Maxima_Culpa:_Silence_in_the_House_of_God
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twist_of_Faith

Here is a Catholic report on Mea Maxima

catholicworldreport.com/Item/1735/sex_lies_and_hbo_documentaries.aspx

You can see how absolutely dedicated to the Truth HBO is with hard hitting excellent journalism, like this:

The film actually claims that the late pontiff “celebrated” the reports that Maciel was abusing people. At the screening that this author attended, the line actually elicited audible gasps from the audience, who genuinely believed the film’s wild claim. “Oh, my God,” one woman responded.

The Pontiff in question here is SAINT JPII

You’ll forgive me if I don’t jump on the dogpile on Scientology here.

HBO is not a friend of Catholics, or the truth. And has taken the opportunity of the Tragedy of the Sex abuse cases and used it to sensationalize rumor monger and give credence to outright lies spewed by spurned and hurt people. Sound familiar?

 

[randomuser]

Here are some more HBO “documentaries”

Non sequitur.

The thread title is: “HBO Scientology documentary,” which is based upon Lawrence Wright’s book “Going Clear: Scientology and The Prison of Belief.”

Many (though not all) of its allegations were parodied on an SNL skit that has already gone viral.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Non sequitur.

The thread title is: “HBO Scientology documentary,” which is based upon Lawrence Wright’s book “Going Clear: Scientology and The Prison of Belief.”

Many (though not all) of its allegations were parodied on an SNL skit that has already gone viral.

Oh snl parodied it? I stand corrected!
My point was HBO has a long reputation of its documentaries.
It is hit piece driveby. And it is not credible. Perhaps there is a wolf in Scientology but HBO has cried wolf so many times and lied in its documentaries about our very faith.
Not s non sequitur at all, But perhaps you feel this time they are on the side of angels.
Honestly I find it hostile to any faith and not exactly theological at all…

 

[randomuser]

It is hit piece driveby. And it is not credible.

The material originated from author Lawrence Wright, not HBO. The book “Going Clear” was published in 2013. Two year ago. So…that’s one non sequitur and one ad hominem and no comment on the substance of the original post - namely, the allegations of pro-abortion policies (among other abuses) at the hands of an organization benefiting from tax-exempt status. As I and others in this thread have mentioned, there’s no anti-Catholic content in either the book or the adaptation by HBO, so I have to wonder what value the persistent ad hominem brings to the topic.

 

[colliric]

I suggest those people who are saying that this HBO documentary is a “hitpiece” get a copy of the BBC’s documentaries made through the Panorama program, including the original one from the 1980s.

Journalist John Sweeney was viciously targeted by the espionage division of the church and his two documentaries for the program from 2007 and 2010 are even more shocking and eye-opening, especially because they mainly show the lengths to which this organization will go T harrass it’s perceived critics.

And yes you read that right, the Scientology church has an espionage division, currently called “The Office of Special Affairs” with it’s own network of Spies and private investigators. Also as their biggest “scalp” they launched the largest espionage campaign ever committed again the United States government in the late 1970s. They were previously known as the “Guardian’s Office”.

 

[ajcstr]

Was just wondering, it appears to me though called a religion, the people involved view it more as a self help mechanism. I am thinking that the people involved are basically atheists and this is more or less a philosophy to them. Does that make sense?

 

[colliric]

Was just wondering, it appears to me though called a religion, the people involved view it more as a self help mechanism. I am thinking that the people involved are basically atheists and this is more or less a philosophy to them. Does that make sense?

Nope. They believe in things such as Thetans(Alien Souls) and there is a dogmatic system of belief in Scientology called the Operating Thetan levels, based on the beliefs of Hubbard. So that disqualifies them from being atheists.According to their beliefs, L Ron Hubbard achieved God-like status when he “choose” to “drop the body” in the 1980s. From that point of view it is certainly a religion, but a cult-like one with limited membership and a masonic system of progression.

 

[randomuser]

Was just wondering, it appears to me though called a religion, the people involved view it more as a self help mechanism. I am thinking that the people involved are basically atheists and this is more or less a philosophy to them. Does that make sense?

The people involved may view it as a “self help mechanism,” but the people who run Church of Scientology consider it a “religion” and it is on that basis alone - of it being a “religion” - they sought and obtained tax exempt status from the IRS. Of course, as is pointed out in the “Going Clear” documentary, the IRS is comprised of accountants and attorneys - not theologians - and so, the IRS really isn’t in the business of proving or disproving whether an organization claiming tax exempt status is really a “religion” at all. The fact that they (the Church of Scientology) are allegedly encouraging some of its members to kill their unborn children, or hand over custody of the child to the “church” once the child is born…is all the more troubling when you consider they still enjoy the benefit of tax exempt status. Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Islam…those are de facto religions that don’t charge you exorbitant fees to partake of the “self help mechanism” they offer. Accordingly, countries like Germany still treat the Church of Scientology as a business. Can you imagine a priest charging you to go to confession? Having to pay to go to church? Or having to pay tiered rates to read St. Augustine? Anybody but anybody can be Catholic for free, without ever having to pay anyone, but you simply can’t say that about Scientology.

 

[Tarpeian_Rock]

The people involved may view it as a “self help mechanism,” but the people who run Church of Scientology consider it a “religion” and it is on that basis alone - of it being a “religion” - they sought and obtained tax exempt status from the IRS. Of course, as is pointed out in the “Going Clear” documentary, the IRS is comprised of accountants and attorneys - not theologians - and so, the IRS really isn’t in the business of proving or disproving whether an organization claiming tax exempt status is really a “religion” at all. The fact that they (the Church of Scientology) are allegedly encouraging some of its members to kill their unborn children, or hand over custody of the child to the “church” once the child is born…is all the more troubling when you consider they still enjoy the benefit of tax exempt status. Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Islam…those are de facto religions that don’t charge you exorbitant fees to partake of the “self help mechanism” they offer. Accordingly, countries like Germany still treat the Church of Scientology as a business. Can you imagine a priest charging you to go to confession? Having to pay to go to church? Or having to pay tiered rates to read St. Augustine? Anybody but anybody can be Catholic for free, without ever having to pay anyone, but you simply can’t say that about Scientology.

As the book points out, Scientology basically battered the IRS with hundreds of lawsuits, overwhelming even the government’s resources, in the battle to be declared a “religion.” The government basically gave up for a token payment of a fraction of the back-tax liability. The status of “religion” was sought for tax purposes only, as their deepest belief is in revenue stream and profitability, not God, who is basically a bystander in their system. They do not, according to the book, pray. At some point their “image” people had the movement adopt a cross and had some of their staff wear clerical collars in furtherance of the “religion” aura. Foreign governments that have found them to be a business and not a religion have made the right decision.

 

[colliric]

Scientology is most accurately described as a cult and also a fraternal secret society that also happens to be obsessed with money making. It is strongly linked to freemasonry in it’s history, the system of belief changes depending on “what OT level” you are, prominent businessmen and celebrities are involved in the cult.

The “final OT level”(Level 8) was only originally taught in the Espionage division(The Guardian’s Office) of the church through a program called “The Masonic Program”(you read that right!) and basically said that “LRH is literally on level with Jesus and Buddha”.

Nancy Many and many other ex-members of the GO division have witnessed to this publically. It is so embarrassing to the modern organization that they no longer teach this as having been written by their “source” and they pretend it never happened and “OT8” is “still being worked on”.