He Calls Himself God

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Zirconia said:
Okay, here goes…

Beginning at Matthew 25:4 (NIV)

"Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming “I am the Christ”, and will deceive many. You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All of these are the beginning of birth pangs.

Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people…And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come."

Picking up again at Matthew 24:23

"At that time if anyone says to you, “Look, here is the Christ!” or “There he is!” do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect–if that were possible. See, I [Jesus] have told you ahead of time.

So if anyone tells you, “There he is, out in the desert,” do not go out; or, “Here he is, in the inner rooms,” do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man."

The Mark and Luke accounts are quite similar to the Matthew one. The way I learned the verses was “as lightning from east to west,” and the way I always thought of it was more like a single flash of lightning that everyone (from the east to the west) could see.

Oh, and there’s also Second Peter chapter 3, which contains an account of how at the Second Coming the heavens will disappear with a bang and the elements melt in the heat, and Second Thessalonians chapter 1 about how Jesus will be revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. And a little later in the Matthew account (I think), it also mentions about how Jesus will return coming on the clouds, with the blast of the trumpet and the shout of the archangel.

So I would say it hasn’t happened yet…

Zirconia
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If Mathew 25:4 is right, I really don’t want him to come back. That sounds horrible.
 
water said:
You are afraid of death?
Death will bring us Home and we are waiting for Christ to come!
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I think all of us are afraid of death to some degree. That is why religion was invented, to foster the belief that we would live forever.

I do not eagerly anticipate the end of the world. That was my point. If you eagerly anticipate the end of the earth, you are disturbed.
 
Imagine23 said:
I think all of us are afraid of death to some degree. That is why religion was invented, to foster the belief that we would live forever.

I do not eagerly anticipate the end of the world. That was my point. If you eagerly anticipate the end of the earth, you are disturbed.
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You have a problem thinking that people are afraid of death and make up religion. Show me the proof of that?

Religion is not based on death but on the eternal life that God has promised us.

I don’t anticipate the end of the world. When it comes, it comes; however, I am eager to meet God in person.
 
Didn’t we also have a discussion about someone who also claims to be Jesus a while back?

http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=112088

EDIT: I just saw that the guy in this thread is the same as the one on the above link (Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda). We also had one of his supporters on that thread…

So, he seems to have gotten into new heights by claiming to be the Antichrist…scary…:eek:
 
water said:
You have a problem thinking that people are afraid of death and make up religion. Show me the proof of that?

Religion is not based on death but on the eternal life that God has promised us.

I don’t anticipate the end of the world. When it comes, it comes; however, I am eager to meet God in person.
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You are disingenous if you say you are not afraid of death. The vast majority of people do not look forward to death.

It’s ironic that you are constantly demanding proof, yet you willingly accept the often unbelievable statements in a book written 2000 years ago.
 
Imagine23 said:
You are disingenous if you say you are not afraid of death. The vast majority of people do not look forward to death.

It’s ironic that you are constantly demanding proof, yet you willingly accept the often unbelievable statements in a book written 2000 years ago.
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Of course I want the proof when you said things such as these:
“I know many catholics using contraceptive”
“I know ‘You don’t believe in prayer’”

I am not failing the “believable statement’s in the Word of God. My proof is billions of people believe in God”. That is my proof.

You have failed to show your own claims.

I am not afraid of death for death is the beginning of a new life.
 
water said:
Of course I want the proof when you said things such as these:
“I know many catholics using contraceptive”
“I know ‘You don’t believe in prayer’”

I am not failing the “believable statement’s in the Word of God. My proof is billions of people are believe in God”. That is my proof.

You have failed to show your own claims.

I am not afraid of death for death is the beginning of a new life.
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First, you’re confusing threads, stay on topic.

Your proof is that “billions of people are believe in God?” Strange because billions of people actually believe in different Gods. Millions of Hindus believe there are thousands of Gods. They don’t believe in Jesus as being the one true god. How does the Hindu position affect your “proof?”
 
weird huh? then what is your claim "I always " want a proof?

Of course I have to point to all the claims you made.

It does not affect me for I’ve seen miracles, prayers being answered, people stop doing evils when they come to the Lord. I also see people who do evil - at least If you know there is evils you must know there is goodness - which is God.
 
Imagine23 said:
I think all of us are afraid of death to some degree. That is why religion was invented, to foster the belief that we would live forever.

I do not eagerly anticipate the end of the world. That was my point. If you eagerly anticipate the end of the earth, you are disturbed.
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In Revelation 22:20, the author prays for exactly that–the Second Coming, which implies the end of the world as we know it.

I think what we are looking forward to is not so much death and destruction as the promise of a new heaven and a new earth, with no curse and no death, and dwelling with God face-to-face for all eternity. Revelation 21 and 22 spell it out, and are the balancer for all the accounts of the horror that will accompany the end of the age.

Zirconia

PS, it’s Matthew 24 that talks about the end of the world, I made a typo and said it was 25, sorry.
 
Zirconia said:
In Revelation 22:20, the author prays for exactly that–the Second Coming, which implies the end of the world as we know it.

I think what we are looking forward to is not so much death and destruction as the promise of a new heaven and a new earth, with no curse and no death, and dwelling with God face-to-face for all eternity. Revelation 21 and 22 spell it out, and are the balancer for all the accounts of the horror that will accompany the end of the age.

Zirconia

PS, it’s Matthew 24 that talks about the end of the world, I made a typo and said it was 25, sorry.
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The scary thing about devout Christians that take Revelation seriously is that they minimize the importance of our earth, comforted by a delusion of an afterlife. We have ample support for the existence of the earth and other humans.

Aside from a book that was written 2000 years ago, you really have no evidence that there is any afterlife. Deep down inside, you know this. You really, really hope there is an afterlife. But we both know you have no real evidence that there is one, only your unsubstantiated faith, i.e. “hope.”
 
Dirk_Skene said:
I read the artical again , verrry slowwwly. :hmmm: This guy is really messed up :whacky:

But in the words of Obie Wan “Who is the more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows him?” 😃

True, that! There are quite a few mentally ill and borderline that fall for this stuff. Perhaps they are not culpable. There also may be some sorcery involved as well. Prayers are needed.

Throw some Miraculous Medals their way next time you drive by. Certainly can’t hurt matters.
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Imagine23 said:
The scary thing about devout Christians that take Revelation seriously is that they minimize the importance of our earth, comforted by a delusion of an afterlife.
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I don’t see how this is true. Christian doctrine states that Jesus came to the earth, died for our sins, and rose again while He was on it; does this sound unimportant? If it does to you, keep in mind it is central to all orthodox Christianity.

Revelation also talks about how the good deeds we have performed on the earth will follow us to heaven. Doesn’t sound unimportant to me.

And nowhere are we given carte blanch to destroy the earth itself; that is God’s prerogative. Rather, we are supposed to take care of it, as is specified in Genesis. Romans also explains that nature is part of the “general revelation” and proclaims the glory of God. Unimportant?
Aside from a book that was written 2000 years ago, you really have no evidence that there is any afterlife. Deep down inside, you know this. You really, really hope there is an afterlife. But we both know you have no real evidence that there is one, only your unsubstantiated faith, i.e. “hope.”
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Good, I hope I do have these things. “And now these three remain: faith, hope, and love…” 1 Corinthians 13:13,

And:

“Hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out His love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.” Romans 5:5

And:

“Without faith, it is impossible to please God…” Hebrews 11:6

You are of course entitled to hold whatever beliefs you wish concerning the validity of Scripture and the existence of the afterlife; but then again, so am I.

I think we have both said enough to make our respective positions clear, so let’s not permanently derail this thread; there is an apologetics forum for debate if you need it.

Zirconia
 
Imagine23 said:
The scary thing about devout Christians that take Revelation seriously is that they minimize the importance of our earth, comforted by a delusion of an afterlife.
Click to expand...
I don’t see how this is true. Christian doctrine states that Jesus came to the earth, died for our sins, and rose again while He was on it; does this sound unimportant? If it does to you, keep in mind it is central to all orthodox Christianity.

Revelation also talks about how the good deeds we have performed on the earth will follow us to heaven. Doesn’t sound unimportant to me.

And nowhere are we given carte blanch to destroy the earth itself; that is God’s prerogative. Rather, we are supposed to take care of it, as is specified in Genesis. Romans also explains that nature is part of the “general revelation” and proclaims the glory of God. Unimportant?
Aside from a book that was written 2000 years ago, you really have no evidence that there is any afterlife. Deep down inside, you know this. You really, really hope there is an afterlife. But we both know you have no real evidence that there is one, only your unsubstantiated faith, i.e. “hope.”
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Good, I hope I do have these things.

“And now these three remain: faith, hope, and love…” 1 Corinthians 13:13,

And:

“Hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out His love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.” Romans 5:5

You are of course entitled to hold whatever beliefs you wish concerning the validity of Scripture and the existence of the afterlife; but then again, so am I.

I think we have both said enough to make our respective positions clear, so let’s not permanently derail this thread; there is an apologetics forum for debate if you need it.

Zirconia
 
Sounds to me that this man really is under the control of the devil, who tempts us to believe that there is no devil. He may be the newest spin on it, but this great sin of believing that we can be as smart as God, is the same sin propogated by the original sin of Adam and Eve!
That’s the same lesson moral relativism or secularism spews at us as well.

More reason to pray for those who he may lead astray.
But you know what! We know who is truly in charge. We have the truth…Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Light!

He who follows Jesus will have eternal life!

Since Jesus is the truth…the truth will truly set us free.
Pray, pray and pray some more!
 
stbruno said:
Sounds to me that this man really is under the control of the devil, who tempts us to believe that there is no devil. He may be the newest spin on it, but this great sin of believing that we can be as smart as God, is the same sin propogated by the original sin of Adam and Eve!
That’s the same lesson moral relativism or secularism spews at us as well.
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Nice reference to The Screwtape Letters there…Screwtape must be writing really joyous letters now to Wormwood over the success of their plans. 😃
 
Its not hard to understand why these people flock to this man as a “god”. Remember the Golden Calf in chapter 32 of Exodus?. Then, as now, some people need to “see” God with their eyes because they have lost the ability to See with Faith. They are tired of waiting for Moses to come down from the mountain and lead them in the desert and they are tired of waiting for the coming of Jesus in the 21st century.

Same story, different year.
 
Imagine23 said:
You are disingenous if you say you are not afraid of death. The vast majority of people do not look forward to death.

It’s ironic that you are constantly demanding proof, yet you willingly accept the often unbelievable statements in a book written 2000 years ago.
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There are two different things…

At my age, I am not afraid of death, because of the life that follows.
But… I do not look forward to death’s ending my time with spouse, kids and grandkids
 
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