He who endures to the end will be saved!

[SHW]

If your correct, Why does John write that he’s not saying that we should pray for one that has committed mortal sin (sin that leads to spiritual death) but only venial sins? Make sense of that for me. Why wouldn’t we pray for both sin types so the person could repent and receive back the Holy Spirit and be back in good standings with God as you say?

It is a Semitic manner of speaking, using hyperbole/exaggeration to stress a serious point.

John is making the point of the seriousness of mortal sin. Many people who commit mortal sins have no desire to repent. They love their sins very much, so much so, that the prayers of the faithful for this person may not turn them away from their sins and so they might just be wasting their time praying for them.

Of course, it is good to pray for these persons who commit mortal sins. God desires all to come to repentance.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

James 5:19-20
Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.

I asked this same question at one time.

 

[SHW]

Could you find for me somwhere in scripture where the Holy Spirit moves in and out of the believer as a result of unrepented sin?

The Holy Spirit resides in the souls of those who obey God. It is He who brings “spiritual life” to the soul. That is why they call mortal sins “deadly sins.” The Holy Spirit moves out (He can not abide in a defiled temple) and so their souls are made dead by their mortal sins and they no longer have “spiritual life.”

1 Jn 3:24
Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

The Holy Spirit lives within/abides in us when we keep God’s commandments.

Acts 5:32
And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”

As long as we obey God, we have Him residing in our souls. It is His presence in our souls that sanctifies our souls and gives them spiritual life.

Jude 1:17-19
But you, beloved, remember the words which were spoken before by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ: 18 how they told you that there would be mockers in the last time who would walk according to their own ungodly lusts. 19 These are sensual persons, who cause divisions, not having the Spirit.

Disobedient persons do not have the Holy Spirit living in their souls.

Hyperbole again to show how deadly mortal sin is:
Heb 6:4-6
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

Rom 8:11
But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

If the Holy Spirit is abiding in us when we die, then He will give life to our mortal bodies at our resurrection. If He is not abiding in us when we die, then He will destroy (damn) us. God is a consuming fire.

Heb 12:29
For our God is a consuming fire.

So, if persons have no sins on their souls when they die, they go directly to heaven.

1 Pet 1:6-7
In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ,

If persons have venial sins on their souls when they die, then they go to purgatory (prison) until the bad works (venial sins) are atoned for. Matthew 18:34 They are saved, but must be purified first before they can enter heaven because no imperfection can defile heaven. 1 Jn 3:3

1 Cor 3:15
If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

If persons have defiled their souls by mortal sins and do not repent before death, then they themselves are thrown into hellfire.

Mat 13:38-42
The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. 39 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. 40 Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. 41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, 42 and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

God is a consuming fire. We are each tested by fire when we die.

Those who have no sins on their souls when they die suffer no loss at all. They immediately enter heaven because they only have good works.

Those with venial sins on their souls are purified by the fire. They and their good works are saved, but they suffer loss, because their bad works must be burned away before they may enter heaven.

Those who offend God with mortal sins on their souls are themselves thrown into hellfire. They are not saved.

Ez 33:12-16
‘The righteousness of the righteous man shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression; as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall because of it in the day that he turns from his wickedness; nor shall the righteous be able to live because of his righteousness in the day that he sins.’ 13 When I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, but he trusts in his own righteousness and commits iniquity, none of his righteous works shall be remembered; but because of the iniquity that he has committed, he shall die. 14 Again, when I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ if he turns from his sin and does what is lawful and right, 15 if the wicked restores the pledge, gives back what he has stolen, and walks in the statutes of life without committing iniquity, he shall surely live; he shall not die. 16 None of his sins which he has committed shall be remembered against him; he has done what is lawful and right; he shall surely live.

Mat 7:13-14
Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

 

[Rocket_Man]

The Holy Spirit resides in the souls of those who obey God. It is He who brings “spiritual life” to the soul. That is why they call mortal sins “deadly sins.” The Holy Spirit moves out (He can not abide in a defiled temple) and so their souls are made dead by their mortal sins and they no longer have “spiritual life.”

1 Jn 3:24
Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

The Holy Spirit lives within/abides in us when we keep God’s commandments.

Acts 5:32
And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”

As long as we obey God, we have Him residing in our souls. It is His presence in our souls that sanctifies our souls and gives them spiritual life.

Jude 1:17-19
But you, beloved, remember the words which were spoken before by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ: 18 how they told you that there would be mockers in the last time who would walk according to their own ungodly lusts. 19 These are sensual persons, who cause divisions, not having the Spirit.

Disobedient persons do not have the Holy Spirit living in their souls.

Hyperbole again to show how deadly mortal sin is:
Heb 6:4-6
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

Rom 8:11
But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

If the Holy Spirit is abiding in us when we die, then He will give life to our mortal bodies at our resurrection. If He is not abiding in us when we die, then He will destroy (damn) us. God is a consuming fire.

Heb 12:29
For our God is a consuming fire.

So, if persons have no sins on their souls when they die, they go directly to heaven.

1 Pet 1:6-7
In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ,

If persons have venial sins on their souls when they die, then they go to purgatory (prison) until the bad works (venial sins) are atoned for. Matthew 18:34 They are saved, but must be purified first before they can enter heaven because no imperfection can defile heaven. 1 Jn 3:3

1 Cor 3:15
If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

If persons have defiled their souls by mortal sins and do not repent before death, then they themselves are thrown into hellfire.

Mat 13:38-42
The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. 39 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. 40 Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. 41 The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, 42 and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

God is a consuming fire. We are each tested by fire when we die.

Those who have no sins on their souls when they die suffer no loss at all. They immediately enter heaven because they only have good works.

Those with venial sins on their souls are purified by the fire. They and their good works are saved, but they suffer loss, because their bad works must be burned away before they may enter heaven.

Those who offend God with mortal sins on their souls are themselves thrown into hellfire. They are not saved.

Ez 33:12-16
‘The righteousness of the righteous man shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression; as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall because of it in the day that he turns from his wickedness; nor shall the righteous be able to live because of his righteousness in the day that he sins.’ 13 When I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, but he trusts in his own righteousness and commits iniquity, none of his righteous works shall be remembered; but because of the iniquity that he has committed, he shall die. 14 Again, when I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ if he turns from his sin and does what is lawful and right, 15 if the wicked restores the pledge, gives back what he has stolen, and walks in the statutes of life without committing iniquity, he shall surely live; he shall not die. 16 None of his sins which he has committed shall be remembered against him; he has done what is lawful and right; he shall surely live.

Mat 7:13-14
Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Wow, that’s interesting. In all of this I do not any one time read the HS moving in and out of the individual as a result of sin.

 

[Timothy_Piper]

James 2:21-24
Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”And he was called the friend of God. 24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

**Salvation is a life-long process. It is not a one-time event.
**

I have already proven the paradox, that it is a one time deal and a life-long process, but since you see from the human perspective only; although I have demonstrated this numerous times; you still don’t see. I pray that Christ will remove your veil for His Namesake.

nowhere in Scripture does it say water baptism saves you; that is contradiction to the Word of God. Acts 2:38 is the only place where there appears to be a discrepancy, so if you hold on to that, then you hold onto human error and another gospel.

 

[Timothy_Piper]

Do you know what it means to be sealed?

"Write ye also for the Jews, as it liketh you, in the king’s name, and seal it with the king’s ring: for the writing which is written in the king’s name, and sealed with the king’s ring, may no man reverse."

Amen, but the Word is foolishness to those who are perishing; may the wind of the Holy Spirit blow and blow…amen

 

[Timothy_Piper]

Thank you for taking the time to explain your position. I will explain mine for you.

We all had Adam’s sin on our souls when we were conceived. This is how we all sinned. We inherited this sin from Adam.

Romans 5:112
Therefore, just as through one man (Adam) sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, **because all **sinned—

Most, if not all of us, commit venial sins (those sins that do not lead to death/loss of eternal life). Some persons commit mortal sins after baptism (deadly sins which do cause the loss of eternal life). These mortal sins must be confessed and repented before death. If not, then the person who committed these mortal sins (sins that lead to death) does not inherit eternal life.

1 John 5:16-18
If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death (loss of eternal life through mortal sin). I do not say that he should pray about that. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death (venial sins).

18 We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him.
**
A person who is born of God** (baptized, regenerated, born again) keeps himself from sin. He chooses to not sin and this is why he does not sin. He flees from the devil’s temptations instead of succumbing to them. 1 Peter 5:8-9

James 4:7
Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.

This we must do in order to inherit eternal life:

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.

1 John 2:4
He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

What happens to all liars?

Revelation 21:8
But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

Those who do not keep God’s commandments are thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone. 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9

Paul is reminding them that some of them sinned these sins before their baptisms. He is now warning them that if they revert back to doing those same things, then they will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21
Now the works of the flesh are plain: fornication, impurity, licentiousness,
20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, party spirit,
21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and the like. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Paul warns them again that if they do these evil things, then they will not inherit eternal life.

Matthew 13:40-42
Just as the weeds are gathered and burned with fire, so will it be at the close of the age.
41 The Son of man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all evildoers, 42 and throw them into the furnace of fire; there men will weep and gnash their teeth.

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

Based on your analysis of Scripture, no one will be in heaven.

 

[Timothy_Piper]

If your correct, Why does John write that he’s not saying that we should pray for one that has committed mortal sin (sin that leads to spiritual death) but only venial sins? Make sense of that for me. Why wouldn’t we pray for both sin types so the person could repent and receive back the Holy Spirit and be back in good standings with God as you say?

SHW:

Originally Posted by SHW View Post

1 John 5:16-18
If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death (loss of eternal life through mortal sin). I do not say that he should pray about that. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death (venial sins).

RocketMan:

If your correct, Why does John write that he’s not saying that we should pray for one that has committed mortal sin (sin that leads to spiritual death) but only venial sins? Make sense of that for me. Why wouldn’t we pray for both sin types so the person could repent

and receive back the Holy Spirit and be back in good standings with God as you say?

Why does Jesus stand ready to always make intercession for the saints on earth? Because we have an accuser, the District Attorney called Satan, but we have the best defense attorney in Jesus, who has never lost a case & never will before the Father.

 

[Timothy_Piper]

Yes. Baptism puts a permanent mark/seal on our souls when the Holy Spirit removes the Original Sin from our souls and this seal can never be removed. It remains forever even if we do not inherit eternal life (because of mortal sins committed after Baptism).

2 Peter 2:20
For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.

If we become Christians and then fall away from the faith by disobeying His commandments, we are then worse off than if we had never believed in the first place. Hebrews 5:9

Hebrews 10:26-30
For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people

If you sin mortal sins after you have been saved (come to the knowledge of the truth) then you lose your salvation. Jesus’ sacrifice no longer saves you. Instead of eternal life, you reap God’s vengeance.

If you sin mortal sins after you have been saved, then it is like stomping on the Son of God with your feet. You do not think that His sacrifice is worth your obedience to His commandments for the rest of your life. You insult the Holy Spirit by your mortal sins and so He moves out of your soul. He cannot live in a sinful soul. If you die without repenting, then He will destroy (damn) you for eternity.

You defile the cross of Christ with your made up theology in my opinion and I really wish you would do some reading and studying of the Scripture so you don’t just make things up; it is real sickening and blasphemy to God. I say this because you cannot show an ounce of Scripture that demonstrates this new and invented theology of yours. I guess it is getting time for me to move along out of this thread because nothing makes me feel like puking more than the perversion of His Word.

1 Corinthians 3:16-18
Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. 18 Let no one deceive himself. If anyone among you seems to be wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may become wise.

The Scripture does not say that any where; it does say Jesus is a propitiation for ALL of our sins; that is the Christian.

 

[tweetymom]

Why does Jesus stand ready to always make intercession for the saints on earth? Because we have an accuser, the District Attorney called Satan, but we have the best defense attorney in Jesus, who has never lost a case & never will before the Father.

Yes it is a wonderful thing that Jesus is our defense lawyer. Praise God.

 

[Timothy_Piper]

***I’m done with this thread because I get tired of being repetitive and seeing new and invented theologies appear that defile the Word of God and then bring reproach on the Trinity and do not want to be part of enticing people to bring or store more wrath for themselves.

Thanks everyone for the blessings and Lord willing I will see some of you around, I particularly enjoyed reading Rockets posts and the encouragement from the TweeyMom.

God bless each of you this day…amen* **

 

[tweetymom]

***I’m done with this thread because I get tired of being repetitive and seeing new and invented theologies appear that defile the Word of God and then bring reproach on the Trinity and do not want to be part of enticing people to bring or store more wrath for themselves.

Thanks everyone for the blessings and Lord willing I will see some of you around, I particularly enjoyed reading Rockets posts and the encouragement from the TweeyMom.

God bless each of you this day…amen***

Thank you Timothy and God Bless you in your Journey with our Savior.

 

[graceandglory]

Could you find for me somwhere in scripture where the Holy Spirit moves in and out of the believer as a result of unrepented sin?

“If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me” Psalm 66:18

 

[graceandglory]

***I’m done with this thread because I get tired of being repetitive and seeing new and invented theologies appear that defile the Word of God and then bring reproach on the Trinity and do not want to be part of enticing people to bring or store more wrath for themselves.

---

Step away from the cookie jar…
time to take a breather.

 

[graceandglory]

You defile the cross of Christ with your made up theology in my opinion and I really wish you would do some reading and studying of the Scripture so you don’t just make things up; it is real sickening and blasphemy to God. I say this because you cannot show an ounce of Scripture that demonstrates this new and invented theology of yours. I guess it is getting time for me to move along out of this thread because nothing makes me feel like puking more than the perversion of His Word.

The Scripture does not say that any where; it does say Jesus is a propitiation for ALL of our sins; that is the Christian.

You are the one who is denying scripture.
Unrepented mortal sins will keep us out of heaven, even if we say, “Lord, Lord, when did we see You hungry?”

“Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city. 15 Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood. Revelation 22:14-15

Matthew 7:21-23
"Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

The Sheep and the Goats
31"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. 32All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34"Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37"Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40"The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’

41"Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44"They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45"He will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

 

[elvisman]

elvis, I have accepted God’s free gift of salvation and am now justified, declared innocent by the Almighty Judge through the righteousness of Jesus Christ. I am now his adopted Son, not by the works I’ve done but by the perfect work of Christ. And now that I have been purchased by His blood, He did not leave me without help to accomplish what I couldn’t beforehand. He has prepared within me a new heart and has planted His seed within my new heart, and the light and rain to keep it alive and growing is provided by the Master Gardener.

“We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.”

“Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world”

“Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

You’re absolutely right.**
He did not leave you without help to accomplish what you couldn’t beforehand. Unfortunately, you rejected the means by which this help would be manifested - His Church.

The scriptures that say you CANNOT sin are telling you what SHOULD be - not what IS.
If you say you do not sin - you’re a liar.

 

[elvisman]

There is coming a time where God will no longer strive with man in this “time box” we are in. Those in Christ will live in eternity, w/o time or endless time and those who are not in Christ will live in eternity separated from God with an eternity of accusing conscience.

I know exactly where you were going with the timeless or eternity of God, but I am not willing to play any games when it comes to the Lord’s Supper. You either accept what the bible says or you don’t; it is not very difficult to understand how Paul explained it and see how the church in Acts understood, which is exactly as Paul stated. I can do no more than and show you where it is; after that it is between you and God.

No - you’re not willing to have the discussion about eternity and heavenly timelessness - a subject that YOU brought up - because you will be defeated because your views on this subject are flawed.

You either accept what the Church says or you don’t. The NT was born from the Church - not the other way around. I can - and have - proven FROM SCRIPTURE the fact that the Church has the final authority on matters of faith and morals and not one, single non-Catholic has been able to show me where the Bible says that you must adhere to the Bible alone.

Prove that and your credibility will soar. If you can’t prove it - then you’re just full of opinions, not facts.

 

[tweetymom]

No - you’re not willing to have the discussion about eternity and heavenly timelessness - a subject that YOU brought up - because you will be defeated because your views on this subject are flawed.

You either accept what the Church says or you don’t. The NT was born from the Church - not the other way around. I can - and have - proven FROM SCRIPTURE the fact that the Church has the final authority on matters of faith and morals and not one, single non-Catholic has been able to show me where the Bible says that you must adhere to the Bible alone.

**Prove that and your credibility will soar. If you can’t **prove it - then you’re just full of opinions, not facts.

 

[elvisman]

You are confused because you do not see the perspectives. From eternity (As God has purposed) it is already a done deal for the redeemed in Christ. From the human perspective, because of time, we are saved, being saved and will be saved. See the paradox?

Here is a third for your mind to discern.

Phil.1:6
{For I am} confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus. — God’s eternal perspective written in our time perspective - a little addition to the paradox.

It is my belief, that those who believe we can lose salvation, can only see things from the human perspective. Which there could be several reasons for this.

"It is already a done deal for the redeemed in Christ??"
HUH??

The entire WORLD has been redeemed - but not saved. Jesus died for the sins of the entire world but the entire world won’t be saved because they have not and will not cooperate with his saving grace. You’re really having a tough time with redemption vs. salvation. I suggest you go back and read the posts where it was explained.

As for salvation being a done deal - that is correct. BUT, only for those who endure to the end. This is OUR choice and this is the only way we are sure that we are saved. But, we don’t know this until we die. God does not force his love on us nor does he condemn us.
We condemn ourselves by our refusal of his grace.

 

[elvisman]

???

And, this means . . . what?

 

[elvisman]

As I have pointed out numerous times; that is the human perspective, not God’s perspective. It is called a paradox, both, saved in eternity past and being saved in our time or human perspective, are both true. A Christian by virtue of the fuel source, will endure, which is why the notion of falling away or losing a salvation makes a mockery of Jesus because of His completed redemptive/salvivic work on the cross. This paradox should be one that is easily understood by the Christian in my opinion unless they are newborns.

And rejecting the Scriptures - as you have done - is a mockery to God.

The Scriptures themselves tell us (as I have pointed out, ad nauseam) that you do NOT have a guarantee of salvation UNLESS you endure to the end of your life. You can fall away from God. The context of Scripture is adamantly clear about that.

**Unfortunately for Protestants - you have to take the Scriptures out of context to reconcile your beliefs.