Headscarf ban

[meedo]

Hello ,

This is a poll about head scarves and stuff. Hope you participate and write your opinion.

Peace

 

[meedo]

i chose to allow all because secularism is in teh relation between a person and the state not between the person and himself. People who wear riligious symbols dont necessarily object to whatever rules that are in the secular plece that theya re living in . That means by wearing those symbols they arent defyuing a certain rule or equality or somthing .

Thanks

 

[twiztedseraph]

If they can ban a muslim girl from wearing something that highlights her feminity, and shows her as a follower of God then they can stop a Priest from wearing his collar, a Catholic from wearing the rosary or scapular and so on. If they can do it to you, they can do it to us.

 

[Pug]

I was stunned when the whole France thing with the headscarves hit the news. I realized then that France is different from the USA in ways I had not previously thought.

A woman ought to be able to wear modest dress and cover herself to her satisfaction! Let her wear a scarf, veil, full gown, etc. Also, a man ought to be able to cover his head with a yarmulke out of respect for his traditions or for God or any decent reason. To deny simple freedoms of this sort seems unjustified.

Simple religious expression or observance in dress isn’t a threat to society.

 

[JCPhoenix]

I think the headscarves worn by Muslim women are a beautiful display of their faith and a powerful testament.

As a Catholic, I wear one at Mass or in the chapel, and if my faith called for me to wear it outside in the secular world, I would do so joyfully.

I wear a crucifix or other small signs of my faith, or on days off, t-shirts proclaiming various Catholic messages. For example, I’m currently wearing a t-shirt proclaiming “CATHOLIC” in large letters.

If signs of faith such as headscarves were banned anywhere, it would be a sad state of affairs indeed. It’s true that in wearing an item it is not in defiance to the government, but a personal expression.

That said, though, through history there have been regimes which have been extremely restrictive, and even in the Middle East, and Africa, people are killed for their faith.

I would never support to ban an expression of faith.

 

[Monarchy]

I’m an atheist, and I believe you should be able to wear what you want (assuming it doesn’t interfere with the workplace/school/etc…). I would only have a problem if religious wear was forced.

 

[Matt25]

There is a law of unintendended consequences as the Germans discovered news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3731368.stm

** A German court has ruled that a regional ban on Muslim teachers wearing headscarves in state schools must also apply to Christian nuns, reports say. ** The south-western state of Baden-Wuerttemberg passed a law in April, preventing teachers from wearing Islamic-style headscarves.

But Germany’s highest administrative court says the law must apply to all faiths, Der Spiegel magazine reports.

Last year, the Constitutional Court said states could ban headscarves.

No exceptions

“Exceptions for certain forms of religiously motivated clothing in certain regions are out of the question,” the federal judges of the Federal Administrative Court wrote in their ruling as quoted by Der Spiegel, in an advance copy of its Monday issue.

A copy of the ruling was not available.

The court’s decision means that nuns, who often work in state schools in the predominantly Roman Catholic Black Forest region of Baden-Wuerttemberg, will have to remove their habits before going into classrooms.

But the author of the legislation in Baden-Wuerttemberg, law professor Ferdinand Kirchhof, said the nuns’ habits were “professional uniforms” and so not subject to the ban.

Baden-Wuerttemberg’s parliament - dominated by a coalition of the opposition Christian Democratic Union and liberal Free Democrats - backed the legislation almost unanimously.

Another five out of 16 states are in the process of passing similar legislation.

The issue has been fiercely debated in Germany since Fereshta Ludin, who was denied a job in Baden-Wuerttemberg in 1998 because she wore a headscarf in school, went to court.

She argued that the German constitution guaranteed her religious freedom.

Last September, the federal Constitutional Court ruled by five votes to three that, under current laws, she could wear the scarf.

But it also said new laws could be passed by individual states banning them if they were deemed to unduly influence pupils.

In France, there is similar controversy about a ban on the wearing of religious symbols by pupils in state schools.

 

[hawk]

Pug:

I was stunned when the whole France thing with the headscarves hit the news. I realized then that France is different from the USA in ways I had not previously thought.

A woman ought to be able to wear modest dress and cover herself to her satisfaction! Let her wear a scarf, veil, full gown, etc. Also, a man ought to be able to cover his head with a yarmulke out of respect for his traditions or for God or any decent reason. To deny simple freedoms of this sort seems unjustified.

Simple religious expression or observance in dress isn’t a threat to society.

I think however it does end up being a divider, that is why they have uniforms in british school system.

So everyone there is exactly the same.

 

[Pug]

hawk:

I think however it does end up being a divider, that is why they have uniforms in british school system.

So everyone there is exactly the same.

I agree that school uniforms are a worthwhile policy, one that I’d like to see employed more often in the USA. What do they do in Britain about the headscarves in combination with a school uniform? Make an exception?

I do think any alteration in dress (say rich verses poor) can be divisive amongst children.

 

[KathleenElsie]

I voted to allow all religious symbols and religious dress. That being said if the clothing proves to be a safety hazzard then some common sense must rule. The freedon to worship and follow your religious dictates is the reason that many of us have served in the armed forces throughout the world.

 

[Hospitaller]

Ideally, Islamic dress would be banned, or at least thoroughly discouraged, and Christian symbols exalted, but we’re unlikely to see wide-spread attitudes like that in our life-times, I shouldn’t wonder.

 

[hawk]

Hospitaller:

Ideally, Islamic dress would be banned, or at least thoroughly discouraged, and Christian symbols exalted, but we’re unlikely to see wide-spread attitudes like that in our life-times, I shouldn’t wonder.

The truth of Christianity permits all freedom , without immorality, let them dress as they wish.

 

[Pug]

Hospitaller:

Ideally, Islamic dress would be banned, or at least thoroughly discouraged, and Christian symbols exalted

I disagree that this is ideal by Christian standards. Let a Muslim wear what they wish. Their clothing is modest and safe.

 

[jcaz]

It is disgusting to see the strength of these liberals in trying to run America. This reminds me of the ten commandment issue.

Even as a Muslim, it was sad to see how the gov. felt forced to remove the ten commandments statue. This country was founded on Christianity AND freedom for all. The liberals have taken the freedom part and ran with it. The freedom was meant to be freedom from oppression that was faced in Europe, freedom to practice (or not) what you believe. Religious freedom does not mean that they can dictate their lack of belief on the lives of Christians in America. They can choose to not believe. But this is a christian country and the freedom should exist for all to practice (with in acceptable limits) as they wish.

 

[Hospitaller]

hawk:

The truth of Christianity permits all freedom , without immorality, let them dress as they wish.

Yes, let them dress as they wish, in their own countries.

 

[KathleenElsie]

Hospitaller:

Yes, let them dress as they wish, in their own countries.

Over the centuries the dress of immigrants to far places have conformed to the norm of the host countries. It may take time for the young perple to dress more western. Peer pressure has both its good and bad sides.

When out shopping or just for leasure I see many families with the mother in traditional dress and the children, both girls and boys, in western dress. This is how it slowly changes.

But then again I love the diversity of the many ethnic groups and their traditional clothing. IMHO it makes this country great.

Now that being said, I can find very little in the clothing that is offered and avilable to us in the stores to make me want to run out to purchase it. Maybe, IMHO, if a modest and not “slutty” form of clothing were available it would be adopted rather quickly by many people. I am RC and I still cover my head when in church my choice. I also try to keep modestly dressed out in public most of the time. But it is hard. I can find alot of short, slinky and “slogan” clothing. Finding modest skirts and 3/4 sleeve shirts, dresses and slacks that are not suggestive is hard and most of the time requires me to sew for my family and I.

 

[Hospitaller]

KathleenElsie:

Now that being said, I can find very little in the clothing that is offered and avilable to us in the stores to make me want to run out to purchase it. Maybe, IMHO, if a modest and not “slutty” form of clothing were available it would be adopted rather quickly by many people. I am RC and I still cover my head when in church my choice. I also try to keep modestly dressed out in public most of the time. But it is hard. I can find alot of short, slinky and “slogan” clothing. Finding modest skirts and 3/4 sleeve shirts, dresses and slacks that are not suggestive is hard and most of the time requires me to sew for my family and I.

I simply object to headscarves and other paraphanelia on the basis of them being an expression of Islam, not because they’re modest.

 

[meedo]

well we say again and again and again and again that they aremt a political statement .

Its is all in the eye of the beholder. If you wanna see it a policical statement then do . If you wanna see it as modest clothing then do .

But muslims women wear it to be modest clothing. Its people with negative perception Like you Hospitaler that drives sometimes the political statement to kick in Its a sort of defiance against invading ones privacy. What if muslims decide to wear Pink sandals!!! i mean this is pretty rediculous !!!

Hopefully it wont happen.

True powerful identity comes from self confidence and not bieng annoyed from other peoples attire. At least that is the opinion of the French Minister Nicola Sarcozy.

Peace

 

[contemplative]

I wish everyone could listen to this lecture series before answering this question.
In my order from Roman Catholic Bookswas a free CD titled Islam: The Score The Greatest Threat to Our Civilization by Dr. Srdja Trifkovic. Dr. Tifkovic is Foreign Affairs Editor for Chronicles magazine published by Rockford Institute.

Actually the CD given to me is the 30 minute bare-bones introduction to Islam. That alone was pretty clear & concise & informative. The series includes 3 other CDs

I. The Teaching: Muhammad, the Koran, the Sunna
II. The Fruits: Thirteen Centuries of Jihad
III. The Ambition: Infidel Submission

I recommend listening to even the 30 minute introduction.

 

[Timidity]

Hospitaller:

Yes, let them dress as they wish, in their own countries.

Therefore, the Protestant majority in America should forbid the Catholic minority from wearing the Crucifix.