Healing the Chasm Between Tradition and the Future: What are the concrete solutions?

[maurin]

I’ve been reading through the other thread–great stuff, but I admit that I have not read any practical advice other than to pray. Prayer, of course, is the best “weapon” in any arsenal of strategy, but I haven’t gotten past the nagging feeling that practical steps must also be taken in concert with prayer.

However, one thing I’m bothered by is: what concrete steps can be followed in order to correct the problems?

I live in a Diocese–just moved here almost 5 months ago now–and have been so discouraged and disturbed by the lack of Reverence in the Liturgy, the heterodoxy being preached from the Ambos. Letters–nicely written and edited by friends who do not necessarily share my Traditionalist views–to Pastors and to the Bishop remain unanswered after months. (I stress that these letters were edited and edited again by those I respect who are perfectly at home in these same Parishes.)

I have stopped going to Mass at these Parishes. I have begun to attend Mass at the SSPX Chapel locally, however I refrain from Communion. Because I work on some Sundays, there are some Sundays I do not go to Mass at all. Nota Bene: I do not make this claim proudly, but let it serve as an admission of despair–the wounds are still so fresh that I cannot bring myself to enter through the doors of Parishes whose Priests and Deacons rewrite the CHurch’s prayers at will and counsel contrary to the Church’s Teachings on Morality.

I have tried to place an ad in the Diocesan paper seeking others in this area who are also wanting to find a haven of Orthodoxy here. Here is the text of the ad:

Latin Mass Society of …

With great reverence for our Bishop, The Most Reverend “N”, and in accordance with the guidelines set for th in the Motu Proprio, Summorum Pontificum, issued by His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI, we wish to promote the Tradtional Liturgy of 1962 by petitioning His Excellency, Bishop “N” with the names of those interested in restoring the Extraordinary Form of the Mss to its rightful place along side the Ordinary Form of the Liturgy by making it more available to the Faithful in the southern Deaneries of the Diocese.

Please contact me@myaddress . com for details…
…

The paper has not outright declined the ad but asked me to wait while they consider it.

I am at my wits end…I’m not sure what else I can do, and am quite distressed at the situation I find myself in.

Any suggestions for positive action?

 

[Jacafamala]

I think it looks just fine. It’s perfect. You go, maurin! I am so, so proud of you, bro! Very pro-active of you.

I hope they put it into the diocesan paper. You do realize they’re probably waiting for a green light from your Bishop before printing it, don’t you? I really hope they print it; I hope you get lots and lots of replies.

If not, send it along to Rome. Seriously. This is your right. Persevere.

 

[JReducation]

Maurin et al:

I’m not sure if I’m going to be able to say everything I would like in this little box, but I’ll do my best, LOL.

I founded the other Healing Thread. The focus of that thread was to help people heal spiritually. That’s why you didn’t find much by way of strategies. Those who came to the thread, from both sides of the aisle (OF and EF) were really looking for spiritual peace. This is very necessary when one is struggling with any aspect of one’s faith. There is a sacred inner space that must be filled with Divine Life as we work on the things around us. If we do not work on that inner space, the efforts that we put into the things around us will collapse. As St. Teresa of Avila said, we must work on the Interior Castle and that’s done through the development of a deep contemplative life.

It’s interesting, but I too have struggled with many issues and events in the Church. What worked for me to help me face these situations with calm and patience was to embrace the rule and life of our Holy Father Francis of Assisi. I came to an abundance of peace through the embrace of poverty and obedience. Everything is not the way that I would like it and I still work toward seeing the ideal come about someday, but I no longer feel that sense of urgency. I learned from our Father Francis that urgency is not the solution to reaching the ideal, total submission to the authority of the Church, our speriors and total detachment even from our will is the only answer to holiness.

I believe that Mother Teresa said it best when she said that if she had to live in eternal darkness because it pleased Jesus, she was willing to do so. You may want to pick up a copy of her private writings The Private Writings of the Saint of Calcutta by Brian Kolodiejchuk, MC.

You ask a very important question in your post.

However, one thing I’m bothered by is: what concrete steps can be followed in order to correct the problems?

There are several things that one can do and I believe that you have tried some. 1) Speak to the local pastor; 2) Write the local bishop; 3) Write the Sacred Congregation on the Liturgy.

I would not place an ad in the local Catholic news. Perception is everything. It can be perceived as going over the bishop’s head to the media. If there is one thing that really upsets the hierarchy is the media. Unfortunately, the media has been used for character assasinations against the clergy and religious. Especiallay if you use an ad that makes reference to traditionalmass.org. That may get you more negativity than you bargained for. What you’re looking for is for the Extraordinary Form of the mass, not for a conflict with your local ordinary. You want something good. Becareful that you do not use a means that opens a can of worms.

You also said

I have stopped going to Mass at these Parishes. I have begun to attend Mass at the SSPX Chapel locally,

I would strongly recommend against this. It is true that the mass at the SSPX chapels is valid, but it remains illicit. It is also true that the SSPX are not in a state of schism, but they are in an irregular relationship with the Vatican. The Holy Father made it very clear in the Motu Proprio that we are not to lend support to the SSPX.

I understand your hunger for orthodox liturgy. I’m not sure what diocese you’re in, but you may want to keep asking around for suggestions. There must be a parish or a religious community that celebrates an orthodox in the Ordinary Form. Religious houses of men usually have masses on Sunday that are open to the public, especially formation houses. Also, you local Catholic seminary may allow the laity to attend their Sunday mass.

Here is what happens. You tell your bishop that you want the Extraordinary Form celebrated and you attend mass at an SSPX chapel, what it looks like to him is that you’re giving him an ultimatum, “either celebrate a mass in the EF or I’ll turn to the SSPX.” This sounds too much like the ultimatum that the SSPX has been giving the Vatican for decades. It makes you sound the same as those whom the Church has already labeled as disobedient and defiant.

Because I work on some Sundays, there are some Sundays I do not go to Mass at all.

If you work on Sundays and can’t go to mass, there is no sin involved. However, many parishes do celebrate the vigil mass on Saturdays. If a person does not take advantage of the Saturday night vigil mass because they are uncomfortable with how it’s celebrated, then they are guilty of two sins, failing to fulfill their Sunday obligation and pride. The mass is valid and is available, even if we have to bite a bullet. For us not to attend because we are uncomfortable is placing ourselves in a position that is dangerous. We cannot create our own Magisterium that permits us to opt out of mass. My fraternal suggestion is that you avail yourself of the Saturday evening vigil mass to fulfill your Sunday obligation, if you have to work on Sundays. Many people do this: physicians, nurses, fire fighters, flight attendants, police officers and more.

I am at my wits end…I’m not sure what else I can do, and am quite distressed at the situation I find myself in. Any suggestions for positive action?

Have you ever thought of penance? St. Bonaventure preached a sermon on our Holy Father Francis. He was speaking about how we have to act and wait. He said that waiting can be an affliction. In his sermon he told the laity that they needed to learn from our Holy Father. “St. Francis was purified through penance in fasting, abstinanc and afflictions.” He compared our Holy Father to St. Benedict who also faced afflictions as a penance. Eveentually, both men became great saints because they accepted what they could not change as an opportunity that God was providing in their lives. It was the opportunity of a lifetime. Sometimes God wants us to live with afflictions as a means of purifying us and the Church. It is also a means that God uses to show us that he is not far. It feels like a gastly night, but the fact that you can turn it into a loving wait for God and the Church to act is a great grace that is being bestowed upon you.

God is very close to you right now. Don’t waste the opportunity. Write, call, ask for what you need from the pastor, bishop and the Vatican. But in the meantime, you must not waste this gift of grace. Tell God that you are willing to suffer through these masses and worse, if it pleases him and if it will save the souls of those who do not know him.

Remember, the masses are still valid. The unbloody sacrifice of Calvary is still present. Unite your afflication to the sacrifice of the cross and volunteer to live with it for all eternity if it will please God and save souls.

Fraternally in St. Francis,

JR

 

[Jacafamala]

JReduction, I agree with many of your points regarding sacrifice and making every effort to obey authority.

A couple things though, in general, don’t local Bishops run the Diocesan papers? That’s the way it is around here, in NJ. Regarding running the add, Maurin was told he’d have to wait while the paper considered whether or not they’ll do it. This says to me it’s got to be rubber stamped by Maurin’s Bishop. Do you think so, too?

Also, just how are people supposed to go about getting a group of interested individuals if not by running an add?

I think Maurin’s running an add through the bishop’s own paper (assuming it is his paper) is well within the guidelines set by the Holy Father last summer with the Summorum Pontificum, in the spirit of creating a stable group of Catholics interested in the Tridentine Latin Mass.Don’t you agree?

 

[JReducation]

JReduction, I agree with many of your points regarding sacrifice and making every effort to obey authority.

A couple things though, in general, don’t local Bishops run the Diocesan papers? That’s the way it is around here, in NJ. Regarding running the add, Maurin was told he’d have to wait while the paper considered whether or not they’ll do it. This says to me it’s got to be rubber stamped by Maurin’s Bishop. Do you think so, too?

Also, just how are people supposed to go about getting a group of interested individuals if not by running an add?

I think Maurin’s running an add through the bishop’s own paper (assuming it is his paper) is well within the guidelines set by the Holy Father last summer with the Summorum Pontificum, in the spirit of creating a stable group of Catholics interested in the Tridentine Latin Mass.Don’t you agree?

Not all Catholic Newspapers are run and owned by the diocese. It varies from paper to paper. There is a larger organization for Catholic News Service.

However, in order to market themselves as a Catholic newspaper and be allowed distribution in parishes, they must play the by rules of the diocese or the religious order who runs the parish.

For example, if you have written a letter to the bishop requesting something and have not received a response, many Catholic papers will not take your ad because it places them in a compromising position with the bishop. There is an answer pending and they paper may not want to play middle man.

Some papers have a liturgy or spiritual life section and it may be easier to ask for an interview with someone in that section and talk to them about running an article on the subject, in this case the Extraordinary Form of the mass and those people who would like it. This does not put the paper in the middle. It’s just an article, not a call to the bishop for action.

Another option is write an article an submit it to the paper for publication. But you must always make sure that the article is worded in such a way that it makes it very clear that you and your group are faithful to the Pope and the bishop and are willing to wait for a response at their discretion. If the article sounds like you’re pushing, they become suspect that you may have an agenda. Motu Proprio or not, agendas are not well tolerated in the Catholic Church, especially after the SSPX disaster this summer where Bishop Williamson spoke in response to the Vatican’s proposal to the SSPX, when in fact Bishop Fellay is the Superior General of the SSPX. This gave many bishops reason to suspect that Williamson is on another agenda that is different from Fellay. Be careful with agendas.

Someone said that a bishop had said, “The Pope is not the bishop of this diocese, I am.” This was a rather rough statement, but it is legally true and binding. The Pope is not the Orindary of every diocese in the world. He is the Ordinary of the Diocese of Rome. The Motu Proprio is kind of tricky. While it is a mandate from the Holy Father and it must be obeyed, it has built in exceptions and safeguards. For example, it does not apply to religious orders. It specifically mentions that religious orders must follow the directions of their major superiors. It also says that the bishops must report the progress in three years. Therefore, some bishops feel they still have time to act on it. It says that the bishops should ask for help if they have problems implementing it. We don’t always know what problems the bishop may be having in the its implementation.

When writing ads for Catholic newspapers, articles for the papers, or letters to the bishop, keep in mind that there are situations that the bishop must factor into the equation, as well as the news paper. A Catholic news paper can be easily closed down by the Bishops, even if they do not own it.

For example, EWTN is a private non profit corporation. But the Franciscan Friars of the Eternal Word are closely related to it. If the Bishops of the USA withdraw their support the friars must withdraw from the corporation. Just like a news paper, it would collapse because its target audience is the Catholic community. If Catholic see the Friars pull out because EWTN is in conflict with the bishops, many will stop their financial and moral support of the corporation. Any private organization that markets to Catholics exclusively, such as newspapers, magazines, and mas media, has to be sensitive to the bishops and their target audience.

Catholic press makes money by selling to parishes. They must then weigh the above facts and decide whether it’s good or not to put such an ad in the paper. They must also find out if the bishop is working on this so as not to step on his toes.

I hope this helps a little bit.

Fraternally,

JR

 

[Jacafamala]

Thanks, JR.

Maurin, Here’s a few writing tips from Fr. Z’s blog:

wdtprs.com/blog/tips-for-writing-to-bishops-and-to-the-pc-ecclesia-dei/

 

[John70]

I wish I had read this thread before I posted on the “meet and greet” thread, I just signed up tonight! Maurin, I’m in the same predicament you seem to be in,and it’s not fun,I know. I too, attend a SSPX Church, and am very comfortable doing it. The Church has said attending a society Mass fulfills a Catholic’s obligation. As far as I’m concerned, as long as it’s o.k. with Rome and the Pope, who can say different? I wish it wasn’t so late I would love to discuss this more. I’ll be back tonight and see if anyone’s around.

 

[Cinette]

I’ve been reading through the other thread–great stuff, but I admit that I have not read any practical advice other than to pray. Prayer, of course, is the best “weapon” in any arsenal of strategy, but I haven’t gotten past the nagging feeling that practical steps must also be taken in concert with prayer.

I have stopped going to Mass at these Parishes. I have begun to attend Mass at the SSPX Chapel locally, however I refrain from Communion. Because I work on some Sundays, there are some Sundays I do not go to Mass at all. Nota Bene:

Your hunger for orthodox liturgy should not cause you to abstain from taking communion. I have an issue with my local Parish Priest and I am mad as anything with him but it does not prevent me from taking communion. I go to Mass for Jesus and the sacrament. The priest sometimes says such insightful things but I consider him to be too lenient at other times (it is a long story).

I wish the office of the Bishop had a kind of Canonical Court where one could lodge complaints. I am taking action and see how things unfold.

I hope you will think of your soul first, receive communion, pray, pray, pray and let things unfold. You never know - you might succeed sooner than you think.

I have said a prayer for you

 

[maurin]

Thank you all, for your advice and for your prayers.

JR, it seems to me that in your very good advice in response to my opening post you did not address this paragraph:

I live in a Diocese–just moved here almost 5 months ago now–and have been so discouraged and disturbed by the lack of Reverence in the Liturgy, the heterodoxy being preached from the Ambos. Letters–nicely written and edited by friends who do not necessarily share my Traditionalist views–to Pastors and to the Bishop remain unanswered after months. (I stress that these letters were edited and edited again by those I respect who are perfectly at home in these same Parishes.)

This is why I find myself in such a dry and arid place right now.

 

[maurin]

I wish I had read this thread before I posted on the “meet and greet” thread, I just signed up tonight! Maurin, I’m in the same predicament you seem to be in,and it’s not fun,I know. I too, attend a SSPX Church, and am very comfortable doing it. The Church has said attending a society Mass fulfills a Catholic’s obligation. As far as I’m concerned, as long as it’s o.k. with Rome and the Pope, who can say different? I wish it wasn’t so late I would love to discuss this more. I’ll be back tonight and see if anyone’s around.

Dear John,

Please remember me in your prayers. I think what is beginning to bother me the most is that even in the new Mass, Reverently and Soberly Celebrated, the fact that we are at the foot of the Cross made present again is totally lost.

Have you read “Calvary and the Mass” by His Excellency Arbishop Sheen?

 

[maurin]

maurin;4071483:

I’ve been reading through the other thread–great stuff, but I admit that I have not read any practical advice other than to pray. Prayer, of course, is the best “weapon” in any arsenal of strategy, but I haven’t gotten past the nagging feeling that practical steps must also be taken in concert with prayer.

I have stopped going to Mass at these Parishes. I have begun to attend Mass at the SSPX Chapel locally, however I refrain from Communion. Because I work on some Sundays, there are some Sundays I do not go to Mass at all. Nota Bene

:

Your hunger for orthodox liturgy should not cause you to abstain from taking communion. I have an issue with my local Parish Priest and I am mad as anything with him but it does not prevent me from taking communion. I go to Mass for Jesus and the sacrament. The priest sometimes says such insightful things but I consider him to be too lenient at other times (it is a long story).

I wish the office of the Bishop had a kind of Canonical Court where one could lodge complaints. I am taking action and see how things unfold.

I hope you will think of your soul first, receive communion, pray, pray, pray and let things unfold. You never know - you might succeed sooner than you think.

I have said a prayer for you







Dear Cinette,

thank you for your prayer…

I refrain from Holy Communion because of the irregular status of the SSPX. I want to be a loyal son of the Church which only finds Her Residence in Communion with the Holy Father in Rome. However, I do not see this Communion in my Church local or Her Parishes in my area.

I am stuck between a rock and an even harder place…Although the SSPX at my local Chapel preaches and teaches what my heart and my soul yearns for: making myself like the Good Thief, St. Dismas, a host who only wants Jesus to remember him, admitting his sin and his desire to be made Holy for the sake of Love, their situation is irregular. But when I assist Mass at these Diocesan Churches I am filled with a hatred for the Priest who changes the Words written by the Church, who bows to the applause of his audience in the pews, who counsels contrary to the Church’s Teachings on Morality, who has stripped the Sanctuary of the Tabernacle and any image of Jesus the Crucified. These things occur at many Parishes in the area, certainly in the ones that are within a reasonably affordable driving distance. Edited to add: this hatred that overwhelms me keeps me from Communion those places. This is certainly my weakness, shortcoming and sin. I am not proud of it. I state it honestly and leave myself open to the devil because of it. St. Michael, the Archangel, protect me and pray for me.

I am not a well educated Catholic, I know next to nothing about the Theology of the Liturgy. But what I do know is that for which my soul yearns, what my heart seeks and what my body craves is lacking here. And the only place I find it is in a Society whose (is Canonical Status the correct word?) is highly irregular.

I only pray that I do not die while in this desert, and if I do, may He, Jesus the Crucified, know that I have only done what my confused soul knew to do, and may He still love and recognize me, and forgive me my betrayals of Him.

 

[Cinette]

Cinette;4099674:

Dear Cinette,

thank you for your prayer…

I refrain from Holy Communion because of the irregular status of the SSPX. I want to be a loyal son of the Church which only finds Her Residence in Communion with the Holy Father in Rome. However, I do not see this Communion in my Church local or Her Parishes in my area.

I am stuck between a rock and an even harder place…Although the SSPX at my local Chapel preaches and teaches what my heart and my soul yearns for: making myself like the Good Thief, St. Dismas, a host who only wants Jesus to remember him, admitting his sin and his desire to be made Holy for the sake of Love, their situation is irregular. But when I assist Mass at these Diocesan Churches I am filled with a hatred for the Priest who changes the Words written by the Church, who bows to the applause of his audience in the pews, who counsels contrary to the Church’s Teachings on Morality, who has stripped the Sanctuary of the Tabernacle and any image of Jesus the Crucified. These things occur at many Parishes in the area, certainly in the ones that are within a reasonably affordable driving distance. Edited to add: this hatred that overwhelms me keeps me from Communion those places. This is certainly my weakness, shortcoming and sin. I am not proud of it. I state it honestly and leave myself open to the devil because of it. St. Michael, the Archangel, protect me and pray for me.

I am not a well educated Catholic, I know next to nothing about the Theology of the Liturgy. But what I do know is that for which my soul yearns, what my heart seeks and what my body craves is lacking here. And the only place I find it is in a Society whose (is Canonical Status the correct word?) is highly irregular.

I only pray that I do not die while in this desert, and if I do, may He, Jesus the Crucified, know that I have only done what my confused soul knew to do, and may He still love and recognize me, and forgive me my betrayals of Him.

If the Priest is an ordained Minister of the Church then the eucharist is valid. You should not harbour hatred for anyone under any circumstances.

I fully understand your emotions but you must conquer them. I will continue to pray for you. Please keep us posted.

Also I believe you must INSIST with the bishop, failing that contact a Cardinal and shout on the roof tops but don’t give up. fight, Fight, Fight. Even if they think you some nut just keep fighting. Even if you go to the Vatican. Maybe someone at CA has a solution for you.

God love you
:yup:

:banghead:

:dts:

:juggle: