Healthy Distance from Sinners

[CRATUS]

A lot of the saints went to deserts or other places to get closer to God. Does anyone else feel being around people for too long can become draining? I know God wants us to hang out with all sorts of people. Certain types of people can easily lead me (ME PERSONALLY) into certain sins that I have tried to avoid.

 

[cjw75]

I too feel like this. I was friends with a person for over 10 years who is pagan (wiccan). Over that 10 year period I found myself more and more setting aside my Christian faith to appease her and make her see that “not all Christians are bad”.

She likes to use the typical “you’re a hater” because of Christian beliefs. I finally made the decision and severed that friendship permanently after one of her facebook posts took things too far and I was told to “suck it up”. I found that my faith bubbled up to the top again afterwards. Slowly at first but it has taken front seat again.

No longer will I ever allow someone else to dictate what I should feel and believe. Or that I’m a bad person for being a Christian with strong traditional values and morals. My thought is, if they can’t respect that I have a right to my beliefs, while I respect theirs, I promptly cut ties. Respect is a two way street.

 

[Jelrak_TB]

If people of faith avoid all bad influences how do people of bad influence get their healthy dose of good?

 

[friardchips]

A lot of the saints went to deserts or other places to get closer to God. Does anyone else feel being around people for too long can become draining? I know God wants us to hang out with all sorts of people. Certain types of people can easily lead me (ME PERSONALLY) into certain sins that I have tried to avoid.

We are all sinners. We are not perfect until we get to Heaven.

However, not spending too much time with people who evidently don’t live with any Christians principles, and by this I mean, that they don’t even try or seem to care about living up to Christian levels of moral behaviour and also neither care about your opinion over such behaviour, is sensible. This does not mean we need to cut ourselves off from civilisation. Though sometimes, to progress spiritually, we do need to cut ourselves off from some groups of people. We act as a support on occasion to those whom we assess could be bad influences and consider friends as those whom we know to have our best (Christian) interests at heart - who hear the Word and don’t reject.

And your comparison with early hermits and saints is a valid one.

In the world but not of the world.

 

[CRATUS]

If people of faith avoid all bad influences how do people of bad influence get their healthy dose of good?

I said for ME. I know some Christians who can mingle with all sorts of people without ever becoming like them. Not everyone has that gift.

 

[friardchips]

I said for ME. I know some Christians who can mingle with all sorts of people without ever becoming like them. Not everyone has that gift.

No one is perfect and we are all vulnerable. Prayer is the key, to making sure we can discern wisely over what to say, with whom and when.

 

[CRATUS]

No one is perfect and we are all vulnerable. Prayer is the key, to making sure we can discern wisely over what to say, with whom and when.

Something else I do not understand. I hear “no one is perfect” all the time. Does that excuse mortal sins or having disappointment in others? It always shocks me when I hear of priests who are mean or caught doing scandalous sins. If they preach the gospel daily, pray daily, see poverty, see the sick and helpless, I am sure they have experienced people of all walks of life, why do they still sin? I do not understand. I guess each of us has certain vulnerabilities that the other CANNOT UNDERSTAND.

 

[Arizona_Fat_Gir]

I am alone by default. Sometimes it is lonely, but sometimes it is peaceful. Being with someone is a good thing, but crowds sort of take over. If a group pulls one way it is hard to resist going along with them.

For instance, kids. Every time my daughter got together with one girl in particular, she broke curfew. That happened all the time whenever she saw her friend.

I knew a man who loved his wife and family, but whenever he got together with the guys, it was a disaster. He would go out with them and stay out all hours of the night. Once he and the others slept in the car because they were too drunk to drive home.

So, I think without being judgmental, it is a good thing to avoid some people because of the situations you will probably encounter.

 

[friardchips]

Something else I do not understand. I hear “no one is perfect” all the time. Does that excuse mortal sins or having disappointment in others? It always shocks me when I hear of priests who are mean or caught doing scandalous sins. If they preach the gospel daily, pray daily, see poverty, see the sick and helpless, I am sure they have experienced people of all walks of life, why do they still sin? I do not understand. I guess each of us has certain vulnerabilities that the other CANNOT UNDERSTAND.

Perfection, by that I mean, showing gratitude for our lives, is a daily commitment. Either we can start today and start taking responsibility for our lives or we can just say “Who cares?”.

It sounds to me as if you are being very judgemental. Maybe because you are in a cynical frame of mind.

St. Ignatius of Loyola thought he could out-do the saints. And he didn’t do a bad job, IMO! Why don’t you give it a whirl? The call is for you too!

St. Paul was told, when spiritually oppressed and asked for his oppression to be removed, that it is by our Creator’s grace that we are made strong - when weak, we are strong - because it is in those times that we truly seek our Creator with all our hearts, and when we do this, we experience His power, for nothing is impossible for Him.

The co-operation comes in never ceasing to pray. As St. Theresa of Avila said, that when we have stopped praying, the only thing left to do…is to start praying again!

 

[CRATUS]

Perfection, by that I mean, showing gratitude for our lives, is a daily commitment. Either we can start today and start taking responsibility for our lives or we can just say “Who cares?”.

It sounds to me as if you are being very judgemental. Maybe because you are in a cynical frame of mind.

St. Ignatius of Loyola thought he could out-do the saints. And he didn’t do a bad job, IMO! Why don’t you give it a whirl? The call is for you too!

St. Paul was told, when spiritually oppressed and asked for his oppression to be removed, that it is by our Creator’s grace that we are made strong - when weak, we are strong - because it is in those times that we truly seek our Creator with all our hearts, and when we do this, we experience His power, for nothing is impossible for Him.

The co-operation comes in never ceasing to pray. As St. Theresa of Avila said, that when we have stopped praying, the only thing left to do…is to start praying again!

Where am I being very judgmental? Sorry, isn’t it realistic to expect people who preach the gospel to be at least able to follow it.

 

[Jelrak_TB]

I said for ME. I know some Christians who can mingle with all sorts of people without ever becoming like them. Not everyone has that gift.

Oh fair enough…the issue for me is that I exist in an opposite sphere to yours: I am the potentially bad influence in the lives of the good people around me…being surrounded by those who try to remain upright helps me to at least see the contrast of my own failings…

Naturally if everyone were to begin to avoid me…well what more needs to be said…?

Of course I am not inviting you to hang out with me…

 

[CRATUS]

Oh fair enough…the issue for me is that I exist in an opposite sphere to yours: I am the potentially bad influence in the lives of the good people around me…being surrounded by those who try to remain upright helps me to at least see the contrast of my own failings…

Naturally if everyone were to begin to avoid me…well what more needs to be said…?

Of course I am not inviting you to hang out with me…

Oops I am sorry. I did not see it that way.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Mystics did not go into the desert to get away from men, but instead, to learn how to live with them.

I forget where I read, but a monk advised a person that if they were going into the desert to get away from men, he’d be better to remain among them.

Bad influences from others can mean you’re not root in faith enough yourself. The problem is yours, not theirs.

The spiritual journey is one where we allow Christ dwelling within, to transform us.

Transforming grace doesn’t come by avoiding people, but only from God who we seek to be in union with.

Jim

 

[CRATUS]

Perfection, by that I mean, showing gratitude for our lives, is a daily commitment. Either we can start today and start taking responsibility for our lives or we can just say “Who cares?”.

It sounds to me as if you are being very judgemental. Maybe because you are in a cynical frame of mind.

St. Ignatius of Loyola thought he could out-do the saints. And he didn’t do a bad job, IMO! Why don’t you give it a whirl? The call is for you too!

St. Paul was told, when spiritually oppressed and asked for his oppression to be removed, that it is by our Creator’s grace that we are made strong - when weak, we are strong - because it is in those times that we truly seek our Creator with all our hearts, and when we do this, we experience His power, for nothing is impossible for Him.

The co-operation comes in never ceasing to pray. As St. Theresa of Avila said, that when we have stopped praying, the only thing left to do…is to start praying again!

I think it is very easy not to sin. I think I could become a saint if I sincerely tried, I just do not want to because I do not want to face afflictions.

 

[123me]

I think I understand where you are coming from Cratus, I have family members who are Catholics who do all kinds of heresies such as occult practices, for years I ignored it. (Since returning as a late confirmee some 6 years ago), but as time goes on I know they will ignore me 99% of the time but if I say I am concerned and please be carful rather then outright telling them off then I reckon that’s better than remaining silent. Also I know some Protestants as there are many churches in my small town most of which I visited before becoming Catholic, when someone from an evangelist background says you are not saved until you are born again and I then say when we are confirmed we are sealed with the Holy Spirit it ends up in a holy war so I end up saying I respect him and see we have. Lot in common but then go on explain the basics I the reformation, the Eucharist and everything it has taken 3 sessions to me to decide to lay all the cards on the table, before I was just appeasing him nodding to everything, but I reckon now we should just tell the truth, and leave it to God to sort out, it may take a life time but at least we can feel relief and move on if necessary. I hope my Protestant friend will remain a friend, I am not looking to convert him, only tell the truth, because he was a catholic he spends his life evangelising which is great, but perhaps through bad catechism I don’t know he has gone along the Osas path, and doesn’t believe Catholics have the Holy Spirit through being born again, and doesn’t believe in saints, that was hard to explain too.

I’m not going to give up I think Catholics should engage more in dialogue, it can be painful I agree but then the next day go for a long walk in your spiritual desert perhaps.

God Bless.

 

[CRATUS]

Mystics did not go into the desert to get away from men, but instead, to learn how to live with them.

I forget where I read, but a monk advised a person that if they were going into the desert to get away from men, he’d be better to remain among them.

Bad influences from others can mean you’re not root in faith enough yourself. The problem is yours, not theirs.

The spiritual journey is one where we allow Christ dwelling within, to transform us.

Transforming grace doesn’t come by avoiding people, but only from God who we seek to be in union with.

Jim

I did not know that.

 

[123me]

Ps I Was UPSET when he implied I am not saved but having thought about the latest encounter I am even more strengthened after re evaluating where I stand in faith. God Bless.

 

[BlueKnight]

I enjoy he company of others when they are kind, loving, thoughtful, and passionate about the things of god.

But the constantly complaining, unhappy, backbiting, chip on the shoulder, never happy, and bossy are a constant cause of strife and disturbance.

I would never tire of the former but the latter try the soul.

We live in a time of selfishness and entitlement and bizarre liberal ideas that disrupt human relations.

In a world such as this, it bodes well to celebrate God alone and rest in his companionship and that of sensible people.

If I could afford it I would seclude myself on a farm in the mountains.

After Jesus returns and perfects human beings then I’m sure friendship and companionship will take on unknown levels of love and regard.

After all do you let weeds grow in you garden?

Life is trial, testing, and toil.

Bk

 

[friardchips]

Mystics did not go into the desert to get away from men, but instead, to learn how to live with them.

I forget where I read, but a monk advised a person that if they were going into the desert to get away from men, he’d be better to remain among them.

Bad influences from others can mean you’re not root in faith enough yourself. The problem is yours, not theirs.

The spiritual journey is one where we allow Christ dwelling within, to transform us.

Transforming grace doesn’t come by avoiding people, but only from God who we seek to be in union with.

Jim

That is not entirely accurate. Hermits went to fight their demons and to be with our Creator. And hermits often didn’t live with others. And sometimes they left to be away from the noise and hustle and bustle in order to contemplate in silence. And this would have been impossible to do in amongst - let’s say Babylon, as an example - rife sinfulness.

It is not about avoiding but about discerning. It is not about fear but about wisdom. The Bible says quite clearly, that “there is a time and place for all things”.

Yes, our Lord is within. But there was even a time to go and preach. Not all the time. We are told: “Do not put the spirit to the test.”

 

[friardchips]

I think it is very easy not to sin. I think I could become a saint if I sincerely tried, I just do not want to because I do not want to face afflictions.

We are all in the same boat. I don’t exactly look forward to affliction either and so the only thing to do is pray. Remember, Peter was nervous to get out the boat, but did, and floated for a while, until He began to sink; nevertheless, the Lord lifted Him back up. But He had to get out of the boat to experience this miracle.