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xong111
Guest
A question i have been meaning to ask, I know we believe in the after life, “heaven” but in the apostles creed, “Life everlasting, Amen” does it mean life in Heaven or earth? “thy kingdom COME ON EARTH”
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Cluny
Guest
I don’t know how the Lord’s Prayer reads in native Filipino languges, but in English, Greek, Latin, and Slavonic, it does NOT say “Thy Kingdom come on earth.”
It says “Thy WILL BE DONE on earth, as it is [done] in heaven.”
It says “Thy WILL BE DONE on earth, as it is [done] in heaven.”
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xong111
Guest
our father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name, THY KINGDOM COME, thy will be done ON EARTH as it is in heaven.
So will his kingdom come down to earth? or us go to heaven after we die?
So will his kingdom come down to earth? or us go to heaven after we die?
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NeedImprovement
Guest
Everything we know comes to us initially through our senses; they are like windows for our mind. Even God’s Word comes to us first usually by our senses…we either hear it, or we read it.
So it would seem that God accommodates us in our human state…sort of bowing down to embrace us : First , He became one of us - someone we could see, hear , touch, kiss (and unfortunately, crucify), then similarly, all the sacraments He gave us are also *sense perceptible *signs (which effect what they signify).
So it’s quite in keeping with this humanness of our nature to imagine unending life here on earth … perhaps we could say, unending life under terms we are familiar with.
But a clue can be taken from the word used for this thread’s title - ***Eternal ***(life). Although philosophers are far from unanimous in their definition of time oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Time, they all have to admit time exists. Just as importantly, time will end. Though it depends on whose philosophy one adheres to for precise terminology of descriptors, the point is that time and eternity are not the same.
Time will end…
Catechism of The Catholic Church; 820
Toward unity
820 "Christ bestowed unity on his Church from the beginning. This unity, we believe, subsists in the Catholic Church as something she can never lose, and we hope that it will continue to increase until the end of time."277
… but eternity cannot end. Roughly speaking, I think it could be said that even before the “END” (final judgement), at the end of our earthly life,in a certain sense time ceases for each one of us. We are either with God for all eternity (directly or through Purgatory), or we are without God for all eternity. So ultimately time, as we know it, will be no more. So also the way we see things within the dimension of time (ie – our life here on earth) are only seen dimly when compared to the “big picture” we’re considering… as St. Paul says,
( 1 Corinthians 13:12 [NAB]) :
At present we see indistinctly, as in a mirror, but then face to face. At present I know partially; then I shall know fully, as I am fully known
Of course we have to try and keep an open mind, otherwise we might just as easily be confused by sacred scripture as it relates to both Heaven and earth; such as in
Revelation 21:1 [NAB]
1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. The former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea was no more.
My personal preferred passage of scripture relating to the thread’s question, are Christ’s own words to us from
John 14:1-3 [NAB] :
"Do not let your hearts be troubled. You have faith in God; have faith also in me.
In my Father’s house there are many dwelling places. If there were not, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back again and take you to myself, so that where I am you also may be.
Along with Christ ascending into Heaven, we might also add that our Blessed Mother – the Virgin Mary was assumed body and soul into Heaven.
I prefer (only my preference) when contemplating Heaven, to focus on* WHO * ( “face to face… know as I am known” ; “…take you to myself…” [and as Jesus told the good thief from the Cross, "Today, you shall be **with me in Paradise] ),…rather than where.
In my own personal limited view, I think the most I could say about Heaven is that it will be* different*. I try to regard Heaven as being in the Father’s embrace. That takes some imagining for sure. Perhaps it means being held by God like a father or mother holds their infant close to them, yet simultaneously acknowledging, because He is God He is more immense than my mind can conceive, so surely a mere glance towards the Light radiating from him would behold more beauty than that emanating from every sunset and sunrise on every planet that has ever been or ever will be …combined, and yet, to be in His embrace would mean to be bathed in this same Light. ( 1 John 1:5 , [NAB] )
I think we have to try to dream BIG.
St. Bridget was blessed with visions of angels from time to time. She said this about it:
“*One day, when I was assisting at the Holy Sacrifice, I saw an immense number of holy angels descend and gather around the altar, contemplating the priest. They sang heavenly canticles that ravished my heart; heaven itself seemed to be contemplating the great Sacrifice *[Revelations (cf. St. Hildegard, Scivias 11,6)]”
“*If we saw an angel clearly, we should die of joy”
(* one version I read substituted the words *in all its glory *for clearly).
Being in our Father’s embrace, will definitely be different, but it will also be the most natural thing for us that could possibly be – it is why we were created, and it is why Christ came to die for us and to redeem us.
So it would seem that God accommodates us in our human state…sort of bowing down to embrace us : First , He became one of us - someone we could see, hear , touch, kiss (and unfortunately, crucify), then similarly, all the sacraments He gave us are also *sense perceptible *signs (which effect what they signify).
So it’s quite in keeping with this humanness of our nature to imagine unending life here on earth … perhaps we could say, unending life under terms we are familiar with.
But a clue can be taken from the word used for this thread’s title - ***Eternal ***(life). Although philosophers are far from unanimous in their definition of time oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Time, they all have to admit time exists. Just as importantly, time will end. Though it depends on whose philosophy one adheres to for precise terminology of descriptors, the point is that time and eternity are not the same.
Time will end…
Catechism of The Catholic Church; 820
Toward unity
820 "Christ bestowed unity on his Church from the beginning. This unity, we believe, subsists in the Catholic Church as something she can never lose, and we hope that it will continue to increase until the end of time."277
… but eternity cannot end. Roughly speaking, I think it could be said that even before the “END” (final judgement), at the end of our earthly life,in a certain sense time ceases for each one of us. We are either with God for all eternity (directly or through Purgatory), or we are without God for all eternity. So ultimately time, as we know it, will be no more. So also the way we see things within the dimension of time (ie – our life here on earth) are only seen dimly when compared to the “big picture” we’re considering… as St. Paul says,
( 1 Corinthians 13:12 [NAB]) :
At present we see indistinctly, as in a mirror, but then face to face. At present I know partially; then I shall know fully, as I am fully known
Of course we have to try and keep an open mind, otherwise we might just as easily be confused by sacred scripture as it relates to both Heaven and earth; such as in
Revelation 21:1 [NAB]
1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. The former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea was no more.
My personal preferred passage of scripture relating to the thread’s question, are Christ’s own words to us from
John 14:1-3 [NAB] :
"Do not let your hearts be troubled. You have faith in God; have faith also in me.
In my Father’s house there are many dwelling places. If there were not, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back again and take you to myself, so that where I am you also may be.
Along with Christ ascending into Heaven, we might also add that our Blessed Mother – the Virgin Mary was assumed body and soul into Heaven.
I prefer (only my preference) when contemplating Heaven, to focus on* WHO * ( “face to face… know as I am known” ; “…take you to myself…” [and as Jesus told the good thief from the Cross, "Today, you shall be **with me in Paradise] ),…rather than where.
In my own personal limited view, I think the most I could say about Heaven is that it will be* different*. I try to regard Heaven as being in the Father’s embrace. That takes some imagining for sure. Perhaps it means being held by God like a father or mother holds their infant close to them, yet simultaneously acknowledging, because He is God He is more immense than my mind can conceive, so surely a mere glance towards the Light radiating from him would behold more beauty than that emanating from every sunset and sunrise on every planet that has ever been or ever will be …combined, and yet, to be in His embrace would mean to be bathed in this same Light. ( 1 John 1:5 , [NAB] )
I think we have to try to dream BIG.
St. Bridget was blessed with visions of angels from time to time. She said this about it:
“*One day, when I was assisting at the Holy Sacrifice, I saw an immense number of holy angels descend and gather around the altar, contemplating the priest. They sang heavenly canticles that ravished my heart; heaven itself seemed to be contemplating the great Sacrifice *[Revelations (cf. St. Hildegard, Scivias 11,6)]”
“*If we saw an angel clearly, we should die of joy”
(* one version I read substituted the words *in all its glory *for clearly).
Being in our Father’s embrace, will definitely be different, but it will also be the most natural thing for us that could possibly be – it is why we were created, and it is why Christ came to die for us and to redeem us.
C
Crumpy
Guest
His Holiness Benedict XVI discusses this question (which I’d never thought about) in his recent book, Vol 2 of Jesus of Nazareth.A question i have been meaning to ask, I know we believe in the after life, “heaven” but in the apostles creed, “Life everlasting, Amen” does it mean life in Heaven or earth? “thy kingdom COME ON EARTH”
He is explaining John 17, which contains the “high priestly prayer” of Jesus Christ. He focuses on 17:3 (“This is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.”)
So, eternal life begins now, it is not necessarily an after-life situation.
He has a lot to say on this chapter of John. This verse specifically shows that Jesus is sent from God, just like Moses was sent from God in the OT. So, Jesus is the “new Moses,” the great prophet that was foretold to follow Moses.
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