Heaven

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Faith1960

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I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Since Jesus has ascended to Heaven and Mary was assumed into Heaven, where exactly is this place and where are they?

NASA has observed the heavens for quite a long time and has seen nothing as described in the Bible, so…where is Heaven, Jesus and Mary?
 
Nothing necessitates that Heaven be on a physical plane. Mary and Jesus are in Heaven, but they have glorified bodies. We don’t know the properties of the construction of a glorified body but surely, Mary and Jesus’s bodies don’t possess the limitations of ordinary matter contained in space within a physical plane. This is Heaven we’re talking about, after all.
 
A “physical plane” need not be visible to our sight; it may lie in a higher dimension. As that is needed is that it be a “space” wherein bodies can “be” and move around, etc.

A higher dimension would be all around our world despite never being visible by us.

ICXC NIKA
 
GEddie said:
A “physical plane” need not be visible to our sight; it may lie in a higher dimension. As that is needed is that it be a “space” wherein bodies can “be” and move around, etc.

A higher dimension would be all around our world despite never being visible by us.

ICXC NIKA
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How?
 
Faith1960 said:
How?
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Because we have three-dimensional eyes, projecting images through two-dimensional retinae onto a three-dimensional brain. Any spaces or bodies lying outside our dimension will not register on our retinae. Nor would our 3D heads imagine such.

ICXC NIKA
 
passus said:
Nothing necessitates that Heaven be on a physical plane. Mary and Jesus are in Heaven, but they have glorified bodies. We don’t know the properties of the construction of a glorified body but surely, Mary and Jesus’s bodies don’t possess the limitations of ordinary matter contained in space within a physical plane. This is Heaven we’re talking about, after all.
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Bodies, by definition, demand a physical place. A body, by definition, has the accident of location whether glorified or not. Heaven, while being a physical place, does not prove to be a visible place to us in our current condition of humanity, however.

– Nicole
 
Faith1960 said:
I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Since Jesus has ascended to Heaven and Mary was assumed into Heaven, where exactly is this place and where are they?

NASA has observed the heavens for quite a long time and has seen nothing as described in the Bible, so…where is Heaven, Jesus and Mary?
Click to expand...
Pope Benedict, in Jesus of Nazareth, said God is heaven, meaning that God is what makes heaven what it is-a “place” of inexhaustible happiness. I don’t think we can know much more about it than that.
 
GEddie said:
Because we have three-dimensional eyes, projecting images through two-dimensional retinae onto a three-dimensional brain. Any spaces or bodies lying outside our dimension will not register on our retinae. Nor would our 3D heads imagine such.

ICXC NIKA
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Faith1960 <------- WHOOSH
 
Faith1960 said:
I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Since Jesus has ascended to Heaven and Mary was assumed into Heaven, where exactly is this place and where are they?

NASA has observed the heavens for quite a long time and has seen nothing as described in the Bible, so…where is Heaven, Jesus and Mary?
Click to expand...
Do you really expect to find our LORD by looking through a telescope when something so huge as the Andromeda galaxy is seen only as a faint spot in the sky?

What we think of as space is not all there is to space; and the body that rolls back it’s eyes in death is in no way all there is to bodies. “There are earthly bodies, and there are heavenly bodies…there is a natural body [psychikon soma] and there is a spiritual body [pneumatikon soma]” (1 Co 15).

Heaven is physical, but lies outside our entropic unvierse.

ICXC NIKA.
 
Faith1960 said:
I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Click to expand...
I don’t know what that means, but Eternity is not a physical place, afaik. It’s outside of Time and Space.

Try reading up on Dark Matter, sounds like Eternity to me.
 
Often the word “spiritual” congers up a thin, not quite real image. Just as a ghost might appear transparent because it no longer has a body.

But CS Lewis said that the spiritual realm is a higher dimensional order than this one, and therefore more real, dense and solid, just as a cube is more solid than a flat square.

After the Resurrection Jesus, in his transformed body, walked right through the wall as if it wasn’t even there, like a fog if you will. In fact, don’t scientists tell us that matter is mostly empty space? That should give us a clue to the level of reality we are living in.

I can imagine viewing a painting from a point of view three feet away from the painting. I could see and study everything about the painting and know it intimately, but no one living in the painting could know me. They couldn’t even look in my direction, since they would constrained to look up and down or left and right, and never “out” of the painting.

This idea helps me trust more in the reality of Jesus, Mary and the saints in heaven. They would know all about me, while I would simply have to have faith in them. It also allows me to understand better what power could flow from heaven to earth, and to understand what it means to have heaven at hand. If Jesus in real in the Eucharist, it is because he is real in heaven first.
 
Faith1960 said:
I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Since Jesus has ascended to Heaven and Mary was assumed into Heaven, where exactly is this place and where are they?

NASA has observed the heavens for quite a long time and has seen nothing as described in the Bible, so…where is Heaven, Jesus and Mary?
Click to expand...
Heaven is outside of our physical world. That’s where they are, and that’s why NASA can’t “find” heaven. 🙂
 
I like to think of Heaven as surrounding us, rather than being “outside”. This would better explain “The kingdom of Heaven is near” (Mt 10:7).

It would be like living on a square plane somewhere in the middle of a cube. Our view of the cube would be extremely limited since we don’t have eyes to look out from the plane of the square. Beings in the cube, however, would have mobility and vision throughout the cube, including an excellent view of us in our own little square in the middle.

But our limitation is caused by self imposed ignorance and neglect. We can come to know, love, and communicate with God and everyone in Heaven by means of spiritual eyes, given to us as a supernatural gift, which are to be developed and improved by use of the holy sacraments and prayer.
 
Faith1960 said:
I read in another thread about NDE’s that the Bible says Heaven is on a physical plane.
Since Jesus has ascended to Heaven and Mary was assumed into Heaven, where exactly is this place and where are they?

NASA has observed the heavens for quite a long time and has seen nothing as described in the Bible, so…where is Heaven, Jesus and Mary?
Click to expand...
Excellent questions, my friend! I for one have seen an alignment of the Word with imagery from NASA, which demonstrates a concept of a Heavenly Kingdom. Please consider the following:

Before consideration however, please recognize two factors: 1. God’s purpose is to spread Love, not only Loving us, but showing us how to Love as He Loves. Therefore, His Word is not intended to provide highly detailed accounts of the science of creation. 2. God’s Word is Wisdom, therefore Vast. In one statement, God can be telling us thousands of things. Therefore, although the story of Creation can be somewhat aligned with the Big Bang Theory, the Word is describing more than just the Big Bang Theory.

To help imagine a tremendous and physical Heavenly Kingdom, consider:
In the following image, use the following name substitutions:
Quantum Fluctuations=Light of God
Afterglow Light Pattern=heaven
Dark Ages=earth
1st Stars=light for earth
Dark Energy Expansion=dividing the light from darkness



And, consider
[BIBLEDRB]Genesis 1:1-5[/BIBLEDRB]

Therefore, it could be playfully interpreted as:
  1. In the beginning Quantum Fluctuations created Afterglow Light Pattern and Dark Ages.
  2. And the Dark Ages were void and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep;
  3. And the Quantum Fluctuations made light, and the 1st Stars were made.
  4. And Quantum Fluctuations saw the stars that it was good; and it expanded the dark energy.
Thank you very much for your time and consideration!
 
Faith1960 said:
I said “WHOOSH” meaning your answer whooshed right over my head. 🙂
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:):)🙂 Ok.

We have 3D eyes, 2D retinae and a 3D head.

This equipment simply will not picture a 4th or higher dimension, so looking for Heaven from
our natural bodies will do us no good.

ICXC NIKA
 
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