Help finding Orthodox College

  • Thread starter Thread starter qmvsimp
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
“Does ND require its theology professors to take the Mandatum? If not, why not?”

No, Sarpedon – they do not (which should automatically cross ND off many Catholic parents’ list of a potential school for their children).

nodito,

I know what you are saying – that is all well and good. There are many fine things going on at ND – bravo! (The philosophy dept. – according to Catholics United for the Faith – is outstanding [Rice, McInerny among the gooduns])

Just because you managed to avoid bad theologians does not mean every child who goes there will. This, then, should automatically render them thumb’s down. There are way too many naive Catholics out there who automatically think that there child is going to get an authentic Catholic education at places like ND, BC (or any other Jesuit school for that matter - tho ND is Holy Cross), and they will get fed garbage. Trying to avoid land mines, especially when you are not aware they are there, is a risk too high to take (particularly when it comes to the salvation of souls).

For a good example of that - see the link (story originally appeared in Donna Stecihen’s Prodigal Daughters):

stcatherine.k12.nd.us/famfor/ffproginformation/iwasrobbed.pdf
 
QM, I know you already know about Steubenville, but I just wanted to put in a good word for my old school! I give it credit for saving my faith, teaching me to fall in love with the Mass, and putting my life on a much happier and holier course than I could have thought possible.
 
I’ve heard that Saint Mary’s college (the one across from N.D.) as unorthodox theology. They were also on the list of catholic colleges that had a some form of a homosexual club/rights organization type dealio.

Holy Cross College, on the other hand, is hardcore catholic! They don’t offer many majors though. Theology, psychology, elementary education… I think there may be one or two more, but that’s it.

I’m finding that you have to be really careful which schools you’re going to if you’re planning on going into theology or religious studies. Even the colleges who’s professors must receive a mandatum from their bishop can have poor theology. It’s too bad.
 
nodito said:
I have no idea. But I do believe that, per canon 812, the mandatum is an obligation of the professor, not of the university.
Click to expand...
Do you know the percentage of ND professors who voluntarily take the Mandatum? I do not know myself. If few or none of the faculty members voluntarily take the Mandatum, does this indicate anything about the orthodoxy of the professors, as opposed to the institution?
 
Cajun_Girl said:
QM, I know you already know about Steubenville, but I just wanted to put in a good word for my old school! I give it credit for saving my faith, teaching me to fall in love with the Mass, and putting my life on a much happier and holier course than I could have thought possible.
Click to expand...
Here is another vote for Stubie U. Back in the day (20 years ago) there were more Theology majors at this tiny school than ND and Catholic U combined. I bet that ratio is even greater today. I was there last month and the Orthodox vibe was alive and well.
 
raindr0ps said:
I’ve heard that Saint Mary’s college (the one across from N.D.) as unorthodox theology. They were also on the list of catholic colleges that had a some form of a homosexual club/rights organization type dealio.

Holy Cross College, on the other hand, is hardcore catholic! They don’t offer many majors though. Theology, psychology, elementary education… I think there may be one or two more, but that’s it.

I’m finding that you have to be really careful which schools you’re going to if you’re planning on going into theology or religious studies. Even the colleges who’s professors must receive a mandatum from their bishop can have poor theology. It’s too bad.
Click to expand...
I can’t speak for St Mary’s theology department, since I didn’t major in it. My best friend did a double major in psychology and theology, though, and she’s never said that they taught anything unorthodox.

I will say that ND was not the most wholesome place to socialize. Honestly, the drinking and the pressure to drink that goes on there is incredible. The Knights of Columbus house was well known as a party den, and the members would have their girlfriends sleep over in order to avoid following parietal rules. 😦
 
My dd is a freshman at Belmont Abbey College in Belmont, NC and she loves it there. Seems to be a solidly Catholic college and her faith is growing as she is pretty well immersed in it there. She has met many young people who are serious about their Catholic faith.
 
Sarpedon said:
Does ND require its theology professors to take the Mandatum? If not, why not?
Click to expand...
According to the Newman Guide (which had overall some great things to say about Notre Dame) there are over 40 theology professors holding the Mandatum. According to www.nd.edu, there are 46 theology professors currently at Notre Dame (many of which are shared between the philo and theo departments). So, they’re doing VERY well with regards to the Mandatum. Get McBrien to retire (and trust me, there are parish priests out there who are SOOO progressive they make McBrien look as orthodox as Fr. Benedict Groeschel!!!) and Notre Dame theology will be darn near if not 100%. Two years ago, the theo chair, Cavadini, told me personally that the department was over 80% with regards to its faculty requesting and receiving the Mandatum. This number must have already grown significantly in just two and a half years. GO IRISH 🙂
 
Thank you Domer for this great news!

I, as one being critical of ND’s academics towards the faith, am very hopeful about this and appreciate Fr. Jenkins’ efforts (among others I am sure).

I love that place – and huge part of my conversion to the Catholic faith happened at the Grotto there. 👍

PS: How 'bout that Irish football staff snagging Manti T’eo?? :eek: Sweet!
 
Domer1997 said:
According to the Newman Guide (which had overall some great things to say about Notre Dame) there are over 40 theology professors holding the Mandatum. According to www.nd.edu, there are 46 theology professors currently at Notre Dame (many of which are shared between the philo and theo departments). So, they’re doing VERY well with regards to the Mandatum. Get McBrien to retire (and trust me, there are parish priests out there who are SOOO progressive they make McBrien look as orthodox as Fr. Benedict Groeschel!!!) and Notre Dame theology will be darn near if not 100%. Two years ago, the theo chair, Cavadini, told me personally that the department was over 80% with regards to its faculty requesting and receiving the Mandatum. This number must have already grown significantly in just two and a half years. GO IRISH 🙂
Click to expand...
Yes, the Newman Guide said several nice things about Notre Dame University but in the end it does not recommend it (i.e. the bad far outweighs the good).

To the OP: I would look seriously at the other colleges and universities listed in and recommended by the Newman Guide.
 
Domer1997 said:
. Two years ago, the theo chair, Cavadini, told me personally that the department was over 80% with regards to its faculty requesting and receiving the Mandatum. This number must have already grown significantly in just two and a half years. GO IRISH 🙂
Click to expand...
Glad to hear its not as bad as I thought!
 
jkarp said:
Yes, the Newman Guide said several nice things about Notre Dame University but in the end it does not recommend it (i.e. the bad far outweighs the good).
Click to expand...
To be fair, jkarp, I didn’t get that impression at all. They lauded the spirituality on campus and criticized the leadership and V-monologues. But their conclusion was that students need to indvidually discern whether Notre Dame is the right school for them. They never concluded anything like the “bad far outweighs the good,” and in fact my impression was that they felt that for devout Catholics who aren’t “struggling with their faith” Notre Dame could be excellent choice.

But decide for youself. Here’s the last section of the Newman document called ‘The Botttom Line’:

"Notre Dame is a high-quality university with an international reputation and an extensive alumni network. In many ways, the university clearly takes its Catholic identity seriously.
But administrators seem sometimes caught between a commitment to Catholic teachings and a desire to maintain and build its reputation as a research university committed to a
secular view of academic freedom. Catholic identity and academic reputation are not incompatible, but successfully pursuing both requires strong leadership. Despite
our disappointment with some decisions, we are optimistic about Father Jenkins’s character and ability to achieve reform. The Catholic hiring program is one notable example, although we are awaiting more evidence of its impact. We also are impressed by the existence of a strong spiritual environment, which is a partnership of both students and young priests.

The situation at Notre Dame, in our opinion, is complex. One eminent professor there told us “a kid who is struggling with his faith will sink like a stone.” Clearly, that is a chilling comment. And for that reason, we encourage students to discern whether they are prepared for the Notre Dame experience and
what it offers and fails to offer. It is our hope that Notre Dame will “wake up the echoes” of its wonderful, faithful history
and be a beacon for other large universities in returning to its original and muchneeded mission."
 
nodito said:
To be fair, jkarp, I didn’t get that impression at all. They lauded the spirituality on campus and criticized the leadership and V-monologues. But their conclusion was that students need to indvidually discern whether Notre Dame is the right school for them. They never concluded anything like the “bad far outweighs the good,” and in fact my impression was that they felt that for devout Catholics who aren’t “struggling with their faith” Notre Dame could be excellent choice.
Click to expand...
Yes, it does say those things, but it does not recommend the University of Notre Dame. The article is quite clear:
“But there are issues, many of which have
concerned us for some time, that prevent us
from recommending Notre Dame.”
Click to expand...
In other words, there are 21 other Catholic Colleges and Universities that the Cardinal Newman Society recommends, Notre Dame is not among them.

I’m not saying that it isn’t possible to receive a high quality education or even a good Catholic education at Notre Dame. What I am saying is that if one is looking for a very good Catholic college experience, there are at least 21 institutions that provide one better than the University of Notre Dame.
 
qmvsimp said:
Please help me with other choices, but only good orthodox schools. For instance, Notre Dame and Boston College do not qualify. Too secular.
Click to expand...
I’m a student at Boston College and I love it. It’s the sort of school where if you want to be serious about your Catholic faith, there are so many opportunities for you to do so.

St. Thomas More Society is a large student group on campus lead by priest and professors that meets once a week for an hour and a half of adoration of the Blessed Sacrament, benediction, and the Rosary (and option to go to confession), followed by an hour of “Theology by the Slice,” where there is speaker and theology discussion.

Sons of Saint Patrick is a Catholic men’s group on campus that meets once a week for Evening Prayer followed by a speaker and theology discussion.

Gratia Plena is a Catholic women’s group on campus that meets once a week, I think for the same thing as Sons does (but I’m a man so I wouldn’t know!).

The Pro-Life club isn’t strictly Catholic (though most students in it are, and the adviser is a seminarian), but every year we go to Washington, DC for the March for Life and SFLA Pro-Life Conference.

There are groups that say the rosary separately on a weekly basis and there is a Catholic homeless ministry that goes into the city every week.

There is also adoration at St. Ignatius for four hours once a week.

There are 14 Sunday Masses each week. There are 44 weekday Masses each week. There are 4 churches/chapels on campus (open most of the time for private prayer as well) and this isn’t including the recently purchased Brighton Campus, next to which is St. John’s Seminary. Confession is available on 7 separate occasions each week.

The theology department isn’t perfect. For example, there are professors of other faiths who teach about world religions. I see no problem with that, and think it is important if you are to have dialogue with other religions. Some professors teach different points of view of theology, and I take it just as that - different points of view. I think it is vital to understand different theologies if you are to be a well-rounded student of philosophy/theology.

However, there are many holy and orthodox professors in the theology and philosophy departments (I have one of them right now), including Dr. Peter Kreeft who you may have heard of.

When I was looking for colleges I had the same dilemma as you. I wanted a school where I could grow in the Catholic faith, and I was skeptical of schools like Boston College that didn’t have the best reputation. But Boston College has given me so many opportunities to continue learning and growing as a Catholic. For example, we have hundreds of priests who live on campus, which is a great opportunity to find a good spiritual director.

The campus is beautiful, and yet we’re twenty minutes from the best city ever 😉 - not to mention academically Boston College is one of the best universities in the world.

So give it a second thought 🙂

Good luck in your search!
 
I’m about to graduate from Franciscan University with an MA in theology and I can still say that the best (and most traditional/orthodox) Catholic college experience I ever had was during my years at UCLA as a undergrad. I think you need to broaden your college search by a wide margin. Notre Dame is a great school but if their apostasy bothers you then why not send your kids to a good university that doesn’t abuse the Catholic name? Your kid will get a better education and probably pay a lot less if they opt to go to a good state school over any of the “conservative Catholic colleges”. I personally think that Franciscan is a TERRIBLE school, I would never send any of my children here (I’m a parent of one daughter).

At big state schools you can at least have the opportunity (simply because of the size) to meet like minded Catholics and share fellowship.

Also none of the “conservative Catholic colleges” are nationally ranked (or ranked very well). This could be very serious if your son/daughter has any ambition. They all claim to have great liberal art/great books programs, but this doesn’t translate well into graduate school, etc. Seriously, I you want them to read the Illiad and the Odyssey then just check it out at the library.

Also, the orthodoxy at these schools is grossly overstated. Plenty of my professors at Franciscan were lacking in this department and the friars on campus are MORE than just lacking in this department. They are pretty much typical TORs and not really plugged into the schools supposed mission.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top