Help needed with this line of reasoning

[ATraveller]

“At least when he does anything good, I know it comes from his heart and not because some religion tells him to do it or because he’s trying to avoid hell”

Except according to evolutionary biologists, altruism happens because seeing suffering is unbearable and so good works are done to stop those bad feelings. That’s hardly out of an atheist’s or anyone’s heart from this atheistic POV. This, by the way, is derived from Richard Dawkin’s work.

Implying, simply, that any good action from a Christian is tainted with selfishness or predicated on avoiding hell.

That line of reasoning falls flat for Protestants because we believe one can’t earn their way to Heaven through good works. However, many (particularly Calvinists) do believe all good works done by anyone is still tainted by selfishness.

 

[RebeccaJ]

What is wrong with fearing hell? It only indicates we believe our actions or inactions have consequences, because we believe someone is judging us.

An atheist doesn’t believe in sin, or in judgement by God, so their ideas are that either there is no moral objectivity or that there is and it’s defined by humans.

In the first instance, one cannot do a good act or an evil act so one cannot claim to doing good. One could then say, one cannot do good without God.

In the second case the fear of judgement is from the law or from one’s peers. Why not do whatever criminal act, since there are no criminal acts? What is “good” is meaningless.

So in short, we cannot do good without God. But if God has defined for us what is good, then we can do good , therefore we can then do evil. There are consequences for us. All your sister is saying is that she believes there is no judgement about her actions or inactions. That only logically means, her actions have no moral value. So she can’t really claim she is doing good.

 

[phil19034]

Your view of charity, in this scenario, will likely be viewed as nothing more than butting in.

In your scenario…. no women wants her brother telling her about her own husband and what motivates him to do good works. That is how it will be perceived. .Trust me on this one. No good will come from it.

Let’s just agree to disagree.

 

[PennyinCanada]

Let’s say I was your neighbor and laid up with a broken leg. You make a lasagna and while you’re at it, you make two, and bring me one. I am not going to care whether you did it because you are afraid of hell or are selfishly motivated. What I will know is that you are a good neighbor and loved me when I was sick. Let that motivation for doing so be left between them and God. I am grateful for the kindness.

 

[Bluebright]

All good comes from the grace of God no matter who does it… atheist or Christian. The difference is that the Christian knows that and the atheist or unbeliever does not. God is good and all good is caused by him and that includes things we do not reason as good.

Your fallen away sister sounds very wounded, God bless her. She is right in one way, wisdom begins with a fear of God ie, the fear of repercussion for sins (just like children fear being given a hiding or having love withheld for being naughty) but this quickly surpasses that as love grows and then they ‘fear’ offending or upsetting God, out of nothing but love and desire to please him (again much like children ( in a healthy family) who desire to please their parents in love and seek their approval).

 

[Inquirer]

Thanks for Dawkin quote!