Help! RCIA is killing me!

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JDHallKY:
Until last night. Last night I attended my second RCIA meeting and I was told several things which greatly troubled me: “The Catechism is out of date.” “The Church no longer talks about indulgences.” Statements were also made about the Bible that I felt were way too far down the “figurative language” route.
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You are not entering the Church to get half-truths. You can get half-truths in a number of Protestant sects. You seem to want the fullness of Truth, but some want to keep you from that!

Heaven forbid you are taught the Truth! :banghead:

Even though I am vexed and you may be too, do not get discouraged. My advice: stay grounded and pray.

Sadly you have run into the Cafeteria Catholics. You will have to learn how to deal with them because America is fulled with 'em.
 
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JDHallKY:
I am a lifelong Baptist who is just beginning the inquiry phase of RCIA. For the past couple of years I have read numerous books, watched a lot of EWTN, spent a lot of time on this site, etc. Throughout that time, I have gone from being skeptical or hostile to uniquely Catholic beliefs, to being more open to them, to embracing them as my own. I have been very excited about beginning RCIA and finally coming home to the Catholic Church!

Until last night. Last night I attended my second RCIA meeting and I was told several things which greatly troubled me: “The Catechism is out of date.” “The Church no longer talks about indulgences.” Statements were also made about the Bible that I felt were way too far down the “figurative language” route.

This does not seem to be the Catholic Church of EWTN, Catholic Answers, or (it seems to me) John Paul II. It is going to be difficult persevering in an RCIA program that I feel is trying to make me LESS Catholic than I already am. To make things worth, I live in a small town and this is the only Catholic parish!

Can someone please give me some advice? Encouragement? Anything?
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I just heard a Cardinal describe the three most important contributions of John Paul II. He taught us how to live, how to suffer and how to die. The Cardinal, who was close to JPII, said nothing about the hope of Resurrection to eternal life in heaven.

Much of the Catholic Church in America is Semi-Pelagian at best. For a great many Catholics its all about being a good person, giving money to the poor, not missing Mass on Sunday, and pretending to keep all the rules, especially the rules about sexuality and sexual expression.

EWTN is considered too rigid and somewhat nutty…Catholic Answers some sort of dreaded Protestant fundamentalist intrusion. These people are the Catholic elites…usually white collar types. They have multiple Bachelors, Masters, and Doctorates from institutions which fashioned them to carry on the agenda of liberal socialists in the way they think and operate. Many of the people running these programs are children of the 60’s generation…older baby boomers who are seeking some sort of meaning to their lives. Some are religious “sisters” with profound priest-envy and an axe to grind with every white heterosexual male who dares to step in their way. They all read Andrew Greeley, or Thomas Cahill with a passion, and sometimes confuse what they read in the DaVinci Code with the Gospel.

Often the latest fads in Catholic circles are the things the mainline Protestants were running with 10 to 15 years ago. Especially as regards scripture and its interpretation. Why we are people of “Easter faith” don’tcha know. Haven’t you heard? The Jesus Seminar is all the rage. Form and redactionary criticism are the way to go. For sure, Jesus was one of those Essenes…or at least John the Baptist was. And of course, Paul hated women and that’s why there are no women priests. Not to worry, little flock, when Cardinal Daneels becomes the next Pope, the conservative and traditionalist grip on the Church will all change. New meaning will be given to the term “extraordinary minister,” if you know what I mean.

My advice…know thyself, and if the RCIA program at the Church you have been going to is messing with your mind, go find a better (i.e more orthodox) one.
 
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Pax:
JDhallKY,
I second the motion on the Catechism. Take a copy to class with you and do not waver from what is contained therein. When challenged on its contents, turn the tables on your antagonists. Insist that they provide the updated materials upon which they draw their errant views.
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RCIA class is not the place for a convert to be arguing Catholic apologetics with the catechists!

If the pastor at a church accepts an RCIA program in his parish that is teaching error, then the only solution is to get out of that RCIA program - pronto. Find a different parish that teaches orthodoxy, and explain to the pastor of that parish why you could not continue to endure an RCIA program that teaches the Catechism is out of date. An orthodox pastor will understand your frustration, and he will give you refuge from the wolves in sheep’s clothing.
 
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JDHallKY:
My problem with going to an out-of-town parish is that it would prevent me from joining in the local community of the faithful to as full an extent as I could with the parish in my town.
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You can receive the Sacraments of Initiation at a different parish, and later, enroll in your local parish.
 
Dear JDhallKY

My husband is a convert from the Presbyterian church and went through much the same thing as you describe.
At one point he was so tired of hearing JPII be criticized that he dropped out for a time.

The truth is - the catechism is reliable.
Do not rely on what these people tell you without checking their info as compared to official church documents.

The vatican has a website. Council documents are available for catholics to review.
Study church history, and pray.

These folks will be very excited in the near future thinking the new pope will further their agenda.
The Holy Spirit guides the Church and will not allow error to enter its teaching.

Many of these people fail to consider that it is possible some things have not entered church teaching due to the protection of the Holy Spirit FROM introducing them!
 
Your RCIA instructor is not God, the pope, your bishop or your priest. He/she may be a volunteer who knows very little more than you already know, and who may only be in charge of RCIA because no one else will do it. When things are said that go contrary to the Catechism, bring that up to your instructor, not in front of the whole class, but in private. If you don’t get satisfaction, make it clear why you differ with your instructor.

Keep notes. When you are accepted into the Church, volunteer to work with RCIA. Try to undo the mischief of the person you are talking about. If he/she is in error, you will be doing that person a kindness by challenging and correcting the errors. Someday you might make a great team, a sort of God-Squad for RCIA!
 
All you comment is very very sad, I can´t believe it, poor catholics
 
JD,
I have also begun in the RCIA process and attended my 2nd class this past Monday. I am lucky enough to have many parishes to choose from within a short distance from where I live, and all of them have RCIA. I found one where I feel at home and am very fortunate to have a wonderful Sister running our class and she is filled with such a love of the Church, of JPII, of the teachings of the Bible, etc.

I have to agree with what Gilbert Keith said and talk to your instructor privately. I purchased a copy of the Catehism of the Catholic Church from my local bookstore and have been looking through that when there are things said I don’t understand, or want clarification of,(especially as we are hearing so much of the Church in the news, its easy to be misdirected).

Another book I found EXTREMELY helpful, (and there are many out there), is “Born Fundamentalist, Born Again Catholic” by David Currie. It is so far a very personal story of his journey in faith and one I know I can relate to as a soon to be (Easter, 2006) Catholic. I am definately a skeptic of what people say, so of course I refer to my Bible when he quotes from it…and he’s been right-on everytime. I have actually been brought to tears on occasion. Of course my “Aha!” was actually reached while referring to the Bible on a verse quoted in his book, in Matthew 26, as odd as it may seem, and this was after I had already reached the decision to convert after years of soul searching.

Anyway, I didn’t mean to make my response so lengthy, but the nuts and bolts of what I am trying to say, is please don’t be discouraged, as I’m sure it has been quite a journey for you to have come this far and this close. Speak with your instructor privately, and if this doesn’t work, seek out another parish from which to learn. This website has been a great source of information for me, as well as the forums, especially the ask an apologist. Just reading through a lot of the posts has been useful and many of the questions I have had have already been posted and answered. Good luck and feel free to IM or message me for moral support as we go through our learning process this year and the continuing learning for the rest of our lives! God Bless!
 
If you are willing to make the long drive from Frankfort, I recommend you try St. Luke parish in Nicholasville, KY. It is by far the most orthodox parish in the diocese. Unlike most parishes, the RCIA here is an actual class meant to thoroughly teach the doctrines of the Catholic Church rather than just sharing “faith journeys.”
Even if you don’t decide to enroll in RCIA there, you should at least attend ONE mass there, just to see what a catholic mass is supposed to look like. I hope you decide to give it a try, the comfort of knowing you’re only being taught what the Church teaches, without any pollution from heresy or watering-down, is definitely worth the drive from Frankfort. (BTW, the parish and its pastor. Fr. Bush, are well known for their orthodoxy, so people come from all over the diocese to attend mass there).
God bless your righteous endeavors.
 
Interesting. My wife and I got our marriage license in Nicholasville (we were married at Asbury Seminary, which my wife had attended). I wish I’d known to tell my [very traditional] Catholic groomsman to go to Mass there (the wedding rehearsal was on the feast of the Assumption–I’m not sure where he did go to Mass but I think it was probably in Lexington).

Edwin
 
Please please find another RCIA program! It’s difficult enough to covert without being subjected to the pathetic sort of nonsense you’ve described !!! There are wonderful RCIA programs out there… at mine they GAVE us a Catechism, a Bible, two books about the history of the church and the Catholic Source Book which talks about the mass, holy days & prayers. I would’ve never made it through without the support of those staunch traditional Catholics. I feel so sorry for you! Please drive to a different parish if, after speaking to your Priest, nothing changes. You are in my prayers - don’t give up!
 
God bless you in your suffering. Jesus is Truth and He wants you to come to Him and His Church. Consider what happened to Him when He was trying to teach! Always remember His grace is sufficient. Such places as the Coming Home Network, Catholic Answers, Catholics United for the Faith have great resources to put you in touch with those who can help you on your journey. Ask His Holiness, John Paul II, to pray for you and show you the Way,the Truth and the Life. Welcome Home. Callie
 
If RCIA is killing you I’m not surpised. Drop it now, go search the net and find the Baltimore catechism or find a traditional Catholic church either run by the FSSP or (hazard the thought - (not really)) even the SSPX where you can have confidence you will learn the long held docrines of the one true faith from a well-trained priest. Why not also check out a wonderful site www.pamphlets.org.au/cts It has loads of Catholic Truth Society pamphlets - the ones that every church once had in the front porch and many of them a directed at explaining Catholicism to enquirers. You will do you spiritual life no harm and I’m sure much good by reading some of these worthy tracts.
 
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JDHallKY:
I am a lifelong Baptist who is just beginning the inquiry phase of RCIA. For the past couple of years I have read numerous books, watched a lot of EWTN, spent a lot of time on this site, etc. Throughout that time, I have gone from being skeptical or hostile to uniquely Catholic beliefs, to being more open to them, to embracing them as my own. I have been very excited about beginning RCIA and finally coming home to the Catholic Church!

Until last night. Last night I attended my second RCIA meeting and I was told several things which greatly troubled me: “The Catechism is out of date.” “The Church no longer talks about indulgences.” Statements were also made about the Bible that I felt were way too far down the “figurative language” route.

This does not seem to be the Catholic Church of EWTN, Catholic Answers, or (it seems to me) John Paul II. It is going to be difficult persevering in an RCIA program that I feel is trying to make me LESS Catholic than I already am. To make things worth, I live in a small town and this is the only Catholic parish!

Can someone please give me some advice? Encouragement? Anything?
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You absolutely and must find another RCIA program!!! I have never heard of this before. Can you go to another town and find a parish there? Usually towns aren’t far apart and I truly believe it would be worth the sacrifice of driving. Also, check with the diocese of your area and ask them about what is going on. Also, who is teaching the class? Many times that makes a big difference.
 
Thanks to everyone for your encouraging words. It has been a few days since I’ve had a chance to check the forums and was quite surprised at the number of responses my post has continued to receive.

This week at RCIA was somewhat better. I believe most of those involved with the program are wonderful, faithful Catholics. The lady who has been meeting with the new inquirers is fairly new to working with RCIA and is definitely a little on the liberal side. But, I’ve had the opportunity to speak with those who are completing the program and entered the Church at Easter, and the way they spoke was very encouraging to me.

I don’t believe the parish is as overrun by liberals as I had thought. At least I hope that’s the case.

Guess I should exercise a little more patience next time before I spout off. 😃
 
Hi, JDHallKY!

I’m a bit late joining the discussion, but I wanted to second what you have said about your RCIA class - and not all RCIA classes are so bad, I have been affirmed of, but many (here, at least) fall into a very agendized circuit. I wrote about just one occurance at my parish on this thread just yesterday.

I didn’t want to go back to RCIA the next week, I was absolutely shaken up to what had occured before my very eyes. After all was said and done (everything is detailed in my post on the A.a.A. thread) my more liberal instructor said that she just wouldn’t bring up controversial topics anymore, presumably since no one agreed/sided with her “progressive” opinions.

Which of course will be a disservice to anyone who doesn’t think to ask the “hard” questions about birth control (and she alluded that she didn’t hold a Church stance on that, either), abortion, adultery, any instance like the Terri Schiavo case - all this will no longer be discussed because she feels we “judge” - when our judgements were actually formed from what the Church teaches!

Through patient guidance of not only prayer, but the support of my boyfriend (who has been there every step of my Catholic journey thusfar), I realized this was EXACTLY the sort of thing God has called me to do - stand witness to what is happening, and interject with the appropriate and correct information. I do plan to carry my Catechism to my weekly sessions from now on, and I do intend to keep asking my “silly” questions.

Though, I’ll admit in my case I may be a bit lucky - we have a more conservative, better educated theology-minded traditional Catholic RCIA instructor who knows her Doctrine left and right and back again, but she’s often sick, and unable to always meet with the class. I’ll be sure to mention the concerns I brought up here with her the next chance I get to see her - for I believe she’ll have a good talk with our other instructor in order to see if she’s truly right for this post.

In closing - I do hope you don’t stop sharing your experiences, good or bad, for all to see and respond to. There is nothing at all wrong with questioning something that in your heart and mind has been rightly explained elsewhere. The comfort I take in becoming a Catholic is that there is so much wonderful literature out there that is approved by the Church, and is free of error, in order for us to live our lives as fully informed as we could possibly be.
 
I think the best thing to do, is when the teacher says something about a teaching that is ‘old-fashioned’ or something, raise your hand and reply,

“I respect your opinion, but I really want to learn about what the Catholic Church actually teaches from the Vatican so I can decide for myself. I think everyone here wants to be able to make their decisions on the facts so that they are free to decide for or against the Church without worrying if they are being taught opinion, or getting suprised later on and feel manipulated.”

If your classmates ask you after class, what you are talking about you can mention the Catechism and Catholic.com or the Vatican website where they can go to the source.

You don’t have to be ranty when talking to the teacher, just try to be as respectful and determined as possible. And I think your class would probably feel very relieved that someone sort of stood up to ask for ‘actual Catholicism’ so that they don’t have to worry about getting the facts or having to hunt for them themselves.

Honestly, in my opinion, people that water-down the faith and then try to pass it along to me as ‘Teaching’ are being dreadfully unfair, autocratic, and don’t allow me the dignity of making my own choices.
 
Don’t know where you live, but my archdiocese (Washington DC) has some great resources for RCIA posted on their site. Here is the link:

adw.org/resources/default.asp

Under categories, select RCIA. It will bring up a buch of books on the subject–even one official one from the USCCB!

Hope it helps!

Dominus Vobiscum

-Stephen
 
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Pax:
JDhallKY,

The leaders in your RCIA program had to do something to justify their errant views, and I was not surprised to read your statement that they claimed the Catechism to be out of date. Ditching the Catechism enables them to say what suits them as individuals. Their claim that it is out of date is their way to invalidate what is contained therein. Naturally, they have taken liberties with scripture as well. Apparently, it’s a very ancient book and probably out of date too. Obviously, the immutable teachings of scripture and those of the Church do not go out of date and these people need a wake up call.

I second the motion on the Catechism. Take a copy to class with you and do not waver from what is contained therein. When challenged on its contents, turn the tables on your antagonists. Insist that they provide the updated materials upon which they draw their errant views. When they cannot produce the full text of an encyclical that establishes their claims or a clear statement from the Magesterium, you can ask them by what authority they teach the things that you find contrary to official Church teaching.

Don’t get discouraged. You have been called by God to the Church and you have been planted in a place that needs help. You just might be the best thing that could happen to that Parish’s RCIA program. Naturally, make you approach gentle and loving beyond measure. Just let the truth speak for itself.

If you need help, go to the pastor. It that doesn’t work go to the bishop. Just make sure that your points are well established and documented. My prayers and encouragement are with you.
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As a former Protestant who was baptized in the Baptist denomination as a child, I second Pax’ great post. Stand up for your views, and don’t let the revisionists spoil your journey home!
 
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