Help: RSV-CE, NASB, etc for E-Sword?

[Manfred]

Jerry-Jet,

Well, I will agree the NIV (aka the “Non-Inspired Version”) is nowhere as good as the NASB, but the KJV and even the NKJV aren’t all that “bad”.

Consider: when the Catholic Biblical Association of Great Britain came up with the idea in 1954 of “Catholicizing” the RSV, it was probably because there were no other modern Protestant versions at the time on which to draw. But when others did come along, none got any of the same editing that the RSV received, even though they each had their good and bad points, and still we got the “NIV NT Catholic Edition” (I mean, really!) and the infamous NRSV-CE; there is nothing Catholic about these latter two! And you know the modern Catholic bibles that also appeared needed as much, if not more, editing than the RSV received.

Something else comes to mind, though, re the RSV/RSV-CE; to wit, the wording of Romans 5:5, 8:11, 9:5. I’ll reproduce eacj here from the Protestant RSV.

Romans 5:5 “… and hope does not disappoint us, because God’s love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us.”

8:11 “If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will give life to your mortal bodies also through his Spirit which dwells in you.”

9:5 “… to them belong the patriarchs, and of their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ. God who is over all be blessed for ever. Amen.”

Notice how the first two verses refer to the Holy Spirit with a neuter pronoun “which”, and the third verse inserts a period between “Christ” and “God”. In the latter case, it could be seen - and usually is - as an attempt to avoid stating explicitly that Christ is God.

The RSV was unique in these places. The D-R, RSV-CE, NASB, NIV, NKJB all used “who” when referring to the Holy Spirit; after all, He is the third Person in the Trinity. And for a “Person” or “persons”, “who”, not “which”, is more appropriate.

In the D-R, RSV-CE, NASB, NIV, NKJV, there is no period between “Christ” and “God”. Again, the RSV was unique.

Unique, but wrong, in all three places. The RSV-CE had to “fix” this; the other versions did not need to be fixed here, at least. It’s amazing the editors of the CE deemed the RSV worthy of “Catholicizing”! Would that these editors had worked with Fr. Alexander Jones and his team on the 1966 JB instead! Maybe we’d’ve gotten an edition of the JB that wasn’t so careless in so many places.

 

[foundthelight]

I have used e-sword for years and love it. I have also e-mailed the owner asking him to include Catholic resources and have never received an answer.

 

[foundthelight]

I e-mailed the NCc to see why the RSV wasn’t on line.

Mr. Brown: Thank you for your message regarding the use of an online edition of the Revised Standard Version (RSV) of the Bible. A bit more information might be helpful in understanding the context for our copyright policy.

Unlike the older translations (for example, the King James Version), the RSV/NRSV was prepared after the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls and other important archaeological findings. The RSV/NRSV translations involved years of painstaking work by teams of translators and other scholars who used these new resources. Their translation work was done under the auspices of by the National Council of Churches (NCC). The copyright of the RSV (and the NRSV) is owned the NCC, and its Bible Translation and Utilization Committee (BTU) has responsibility for the formulation of copyright policies regarding its use.

Today, the RSV/NRSV texts are available in print, audio, and electronic editions from many publishers who have licensed the right to produce Bible products. Proceeds from these licenses are used to support the ministries of the NCC, including scholarships to assure that a new generation of biblical scholars has the training and resources necessary for the ongoing work of translation.

Many publishers have made the RSV/NRSV available in electronic products that provide easy use of the texts; this includes both CD-ROM and PALM versions. These products are available at many different price points, and may be purchased from your favorite Christian bookstore or online reseller. For example, electronic editions of the RSV/NRSV are available from:
www.accordancebible.com
www.augsburgfortress.org
www.biblesoft.com
www.cokesbury.com
www.laridian.com
www.linguistsoftware.com
www.logos.com
www.mediashout.com
www.olivetree.com
www.oaktree.com
www.stmaryspress.org

Of course, we cannot endorse any particular product over the others. However, we trust that readers will find an electronic edition of the RSV/NRSV that provides the scripture texts in an easy-to-use electronic form that will meet their needs.

To be continued:

 

[foundthelight]

Continued from previous post:

The NCC regularly receives requests to post the entire text on the Internet. As stewards of the copyright, have declined to grant permission for any unprotected, unlimited posting/use of the RSV/NRSV on the web. This longstanding policy is regularly reviewed and affirmed by the NCC.

We are aware that well-meaning organizations have assumed that the translation is no longer copyrighted and have posted the RSV/NRSV on the Internet. However, any such use is unauthorized and unfair to the many publishers who have valid licenses with the NCC. The University of Virginia web site was one such unauthorized posting. When the site was brought to our attention, we contacted the University and they were very cooperative in removing the RSV text from their site.

Again, many thanks for your message and your concern for our policies. Please let me know if you have any questions or if I can be of further assistance. --RR

**Rachel Riensche, RSV/NRSV Copyright Administrator
Voice: 952-926-7642 Email: NRSVCopyright@aol.com
Fax: 732-909-7642 Web: nrsv.net/licensingPermissions.html

 

[ricmat]

I have used e-sword for years and love it. I have also e-mailed the owner asking him to include Catholic resources and have never received an answer.

I also emailed the owner a year or two ago - he did respond that there were copyright issues with the NAB and the RSV-CE. I didn’t ask about the Jerusalem Bible, but I assume the answer would have been the same.

 

[Jerry-Jet]

I know it’s impossible but a Catholic version of the NASB would be a good bible–I’m sure that the Foundation that did the NASB would never let it happen, though.

 

[PC_Master]

Please remember that it’s ultimately in control of the publishers as to where they release their translations. However, if you own a hard copy of a translation that isn’t freely available on the e-Sword site, you are still (as I understand) entitled to an electronic copy of it.

Ben’s e-Sword Tool (BeST), which you can find for download on various web sites, will import text from any of the major web sites (Crosstalk and Bible Gateway, among them), and does a fairly good job. It’s also capable of importing the translation notes and such.

 

[Catholic_Dude]

Please remember that it’s ultimately in control of the publishers as to where they release their translations. However, if you own a hard copy of a translation that isn’t freely available on the e-Sword site, you are still (as I understand) entitled to an electronic copy of it.

Ben’s e-Sword Tool (BeST), which you can find for download on various web sites, will import text from any of the major web sites (Crosstalk and Bible Gateway, among them), and does a fairly good job. It’s also capable of importing the translation notes and such.

PC Master is the one who introduced me to E-Sword!
I am a very happy person in my studies now and thankful for this great find.

 

[PC_Master]

It has definitely helped me a lot in my studies as well. To anyone who chooses to download it, I recommend a few things…

1. Download a lot of different translations (I have 10 - 12 that I look at regularly). Having more translations lessens (though it doesn’t eliminate) the likelihood of misunderstanding proper interpretation of a verse. One translation team can make a grave error. Two can do so as well…but eight, or nine? It’s less likely.
2. Download several Greek and Hebrew dictionaries and lexicons. Make sure you have the “KJV+” (KJV w/ Strong’s Numbers) enabled [which comes with e-Sword by default], as it has interlinking with the Strong’s numbering system, allowing you to mouse over a word and see a definition.
3. Make use of the King James Concordance and King James Dictionary (KJC/KJD tabs in the bottom pane). These provide complete lists of verses where a given Greek/Hebrew word is found (granted, this is based on the “received text”, and not on any of the other critical texts).
4. Download and install a lot of different commentaries. Read them. You may not agree with them, but reading 4 or 5 commentators’ views on a passage may change your own understanding of it.
5. Use “Gospel Harmony” (found in the “Bible” menu) to look up parallel passages in the gospels. Just go to the verse you want a parallel of, and open the Gospel Harmony feature.

If anyone has questions or is looking for a particular resource, feel free to PM me. For as long as I can manage helping, I’m willing to share all I know about e-Sword (and I’ll help you look for other resource sites as well).

 

[lak611]

It has definitely helped me a lot in my studies as well. To anyone who chooses to download it, I recommend a few things…

1. Download a lot of different translations (I have 10 - 12 that I look at regularly). Having more translations lessens (though it doesn’t eliminate) the likelihood of misunderstanding proper interpretation of a verse. One translation team can make a grave error. Two can do so as well…but eight, or nine? It’s less likely.
2. Download several Greek and Hebrew dictionaries and lexicons. Make sure you have the “KJV+” (KJV w/ Strong’s Numbers) enabled [which comes with e-Sword by default], as it has interlinking with the Strong’s numbering system, allowing you to mouse over a word and see a definition.
3. Make use of the King James Concordance and King James Dictionary (KJC/KJD tabs in the bottom pane). These provide complete lists of verses where a given Greek/Hebrew word is found (granted, this is based on the “received text”, and not on any of the other critical texts).
4. Download and install a lot of different commentaries. Read them. You may not agree with them, but reading 4 or 5 commentators’ views on a passage may change your own understanding of it.
5. Use “Gospel Harmony” (found in the “Bible” menu) to look up parallel passages in the gospels. Just go to the verse you want a parallel of, and open the Gospel Harmony feature.

If anyone has questions or is looking for a particular resource, feel free to PM me. For as long as I can manage helping, I’m willing to share all I know about e-Sword (and I’ll help you look for other resource sites as well).

Excellent advice, PCMaster. I have done all that you suggested. I also have the NASB downloaded (even though is it not free), and I have the Strong’s keyed to the NASB also. Whenever I quote Bible verses on CAF, I usually use e-Sword.

 

[Harmony1988]

If you want Catholic editions on e-sword, simply do this:

Download e-sword first:

www.e-sword.net

Now download the Douay-Rheims Version (Catholic) from:

www.e-sword.net/bibles

Now download the New American Bible (Catholic) either from:

(Click on the download button with the green arrow pointing down)
esnips.com/doc/3b754b17-6c61-4613-939a-1bd8ef2cd6b4/New-American-Bible-with-Apocrypha-(Catholic)-(NAB-A)-(1987

OR

esnips.com/doc/a4a6833b-17ab-422b-a7c3-edf54ac110ee/nab

They both are new american bible versions.

Now go to:

C:\Program Files\e-sword\

Or wherever you installed e-sword, simply drag the new american bible files you downloaded into that folder. Also install the Douay-Rheims version by opening up that downloaded file and following the instructions.

Open up the e-sword program, and it will be in there.

Cheers

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

estudysource.com/platform/site/homepage/index.aspx
e-sword.net/niv.html

The NIV bundle costs about $30

Before you start a project of compling catholic bibles into esword format, get Written permission from the publisher who owns the copyright to that Bible. Also seek permission to make it avilable online, likely the publisher may want each download to pay a fee, look into paypal and other such options

Then locate that Bible online or on cdrom in plain text format.

Join groups to download importing, compling tools.

Use the tools to import ( read directions at links below ).

Test that new module on your computer.

Release it online in accordance with the permissions you recieved.

User Created Utility Programs
Users have created a number of tools to ease the process of creating new resources. Whilst documentation is lacking, their usage can be seen in the number of resources bearing a line stated that the tool was used to create the resource.

The most popular utility programs are:

Biblos, used to import text files into Bible and Dictionary resources;

Ben’s e-Sword Tool, used to import text files into different types of resources;

answers.com/topic/e-sword

groups.yahoo.com/group/eSword/files/%21%20e-Sword%20UTILITIES/

groups.yahoo.com/group/eSword/

Biblos This program imports a plain text file and makes the file compatible with Microsoft Access. It was developed to help in the creation of Bible modules for the e-Sword program. Also let edit the Bibles made with it or other programas if they are in Access 97 format.

mipagina.cantv.net/computronica/indexe.htm

How to create an e-Sword Bible modules
davidcox.com.mx/e-swordmodules/Create_Bibles.htm

google.com/search?hl=en&q=Biblos+esword+import

 

[jblake]

Daniel Marsh;:

Before you start a project of compiling catholic bibles into esword format, get Written permission from the publisher who owns the copyright to that Bible. Also seek permission to make it available online, likely the publisher may want each download to pay a fee, look into paypal and other such options

+1

I’d also suggest contacting Rick Meyers prior to sending the resquest to the organization that owns copyright. Whilst the odds of Rick Meyers, Equipping Ministries, or eStudySource currently negotiating with a Catholic publisher, or for a Catholic resource are negligible, it can happen.

Use the tools to import ( read directions at links below ).

esnips.com/web/eSwordFAQs/ contains The e-Sword Utility Program FAQ. This is a set of documents covering every aspect of using e-Sword and the utility programs for it.

Test that new module on your computer.

+1

This can not be emphasized enough. The Spanish 1st edition of the Jerusalem Bible, 2nd Edition of the Jerusalem Bible, 3rd edition of the Jerusalem Bible, and the English 1st edition of the Jerusalem Bible have a number of minor errors in them. (Usually skipped words. The first release of the Spanish 1st edition Jerusalem Bible skipped a couple of chapters, in addition to omitting an entire book.) (And before anybody asks, I’ll point out that none of these were released with the permission of the copyright holder.)

Release it online in accordance with the permissions you received.

Include a copy of the permission that you recieved to distribute the resource in the “Description” field of the comments table of the resource. And, if using BeST to create the resource, in the “notes” field of the copyright table.

xan

jonathon

 

[jblake]

foundthelight;:

I have used e-sword for years and love it. I have also e-mailed the owner asking him to include Catholic resources and have never received an answer.

a) I’m sorry that you didn’t receive an answer from Rick. He tries to reply to every email, but sometimes misses them;

b) Rick Meyer is a conservative, fundamental, evangelical Protestant. e-Sword was created to meet the needs of that audience. He has made some changes to e-Sword, so that it works better for Catholics. The only significant issue left is that there are no slots for The Story of Susana, Bel and the Dragon, The Song of the Three Young Men, and the mess that Greek Esther makes of Esther.This is an issue only because it would enable one to create a Catholic Commentary that included the understanding of those passages, and clearly demarcate which verse it was to be applied to;

c) Rick is working, albeit extremely slowly, on converting *The Catholic Encyclopedia * to e-Sword format. Between its size, and the fact that he receives far more requests for other, protestant resources, he hasn’t progressed very far with it. When I finish The Book of Common Prayer (1979, 1928, and a couple of earlier editions), I’ll be tackling The Catholic Encyclopedia.

d) Earlier in this thread I posted a dozen or so resources that I’d like to see in e-Sword format. That list is about the extent of what Rick knows would be “good” catholic resources. There is a huge gulf between what Protestant Christianity reads and study, what Catholic Christianity reads and study, what Orthodox Christianity reads and studies, and what Celtic Christianity reads and studies. This is where users groups can make a major difference. The major reason why most Spanish resources are for Catholics, is because of a Catholic woman who lives in the Canary Islands. She converts the resources that she wants in e-Sword format, and everybody else benefits;

xan

jonathon

 

[jblake]

TheOneTrueFred;:

Are you sure there’s an NASB version of the deuterocanonicals?

I was wrong.

Somebody had sent me the NAB with deuterocanonical material, that was mislabeled as NASB-A. I didn’t realize that when i wrote my original message. Lockman Foundation’s NASB for e-Sword does not include deuterocanonical material.

I am cleaning up my e-Sword Bible collection, deleting duplicates, and renaming the files so that I can more easily determine what I do have. Hopefully, I won’t make any more mistakes along those lines.

xan

jonathon

 

[jblake]

PC Master;:

Please remember that it’s ultimately in control of the publishers as to where they release their translations.

FWIW, one major reason publishers aren’t as willing to provide material in e-Sword format, as they are for other Bible Study Software, is because of the perception that e-Sword users do not respect copyright.

Ben’s e-Sword Tool (BeST), which you can find for download on various web sites, will import text from any of the major web sites (Crosstalk and Bible Gateway, among them),

The option for direct import off of the Internet was removed from BeST at the beginning of December 2007. Chalk up the reason as “respecting copyright issues”.

xan

jonathon

 

[Hollis]

One more time:

The RSV-CE (1965-66) is NOT online.
quote]

I don’t know what year these versions of RSV-CE are, but they are the ones I use. Both EWTN and Crossroads have it. I once had a pretty good website that allowed quick lookup and/or reading of verses from the RSV-CE, but when the webhosting company was bought by another, things got messed up in the move and I’ve never been able to fully restore the site. But I did try to get the Scripture Lookup tool working.

Go to martinsen.com/cyw/fixquote.htm and give it a shot.

 

[mawst]

Here it is folks…

Douay Rheims for E-Sword and more Catholic Resources for E-Sword. Enjoy.

esnips.com/web/esword-catholic

Also, Catholics DO have their own software, not many people seem aware of this:

clerus.org/bibliaclerus/index_eng.html

Latin Vulgate, Greek, and Hebrew Side-By-Side with English, (or your language).

Enjoy. By the way, Hello, this is my first post. Be sure to check out my blog:

divinusmentis.blogspot.com/

I’m sure most of you would enjoy this article:

divinusmentis.blogspot.com/2008/02/monsters-of-bible-deism-attacks.html

Thanks, Happy reading.

 

[Rose_Commander]

I have some Catholic files for E-Sword:

esnips.com/web/e-swordfolder-eh

Try it out and leave any comments.

 

[Catholic_Dude]

I have some Catholic files for E-Sword:

esnips.com/web/e-swordfolder-eh

Try it out and leave any comments.

I am so glad you reminded me of this. My computer recently crashed and I lost all my Esword stuff.