HELP with addressing a widespread abuse!

[Sherry_G]

I agree with Benedictgal’s posts about the adherence to the proper liturgy, however I do believe that as Catholics, we owe a level of respect to our priests and that is why I suggested a softer approach at the outset. Offering the priest our support in the first place, while pointing out the apparent abuse in a most respectful manner, preferablly in a private and scheduled meeting would be a most Christian way to approach this matter, IMHO. I agree with the theory of standing firm in our convictions, it is only the method that bears further discernment. Why not do the most charitable thing first? If met with resistance, one can always pull out the bigger guns further down the road. Parish priests are constantly under pressure from various groups withing the congregation, and not all priests are great administrators. Priests can be people-pleasers, too. In a perfect world, things like the abuse described by the original poster would never happen, however I vote for taking perhaps a lengthier route, giving the priest the courtesy and respect due him at the outset, and let him know in the most kind and charitable way what our objection is, backed up by the documentation and allowing him the opportunity to correct it.

 

[diggerdomer]

I agree with Benedictgal’s posts about the adherence to the proper liturgy, however I do believe that as Catholics, we owe a level of respect to our priests and that is why I suggested a softer approach at the outset. Offering the priest our support in the first place, while pointing out the apparent abuse in a most respectful manner, preferablly in a private and scheduled meeting would be a most Christian way to approach this matter, IMHO. I agree with the theory of standing firm in our convictions, it is only the method that bears further discernment. Why not do the most charitable thing first? If met with resistance, one can always pull out the bigger guns further down the road. Parish priests are constantly under pressure from various groups withing the congregation, and not all priests are great administrators. Priests can be people-pleasers, too. In a perfect world, things like the abuse described by the original poster would never happen, however I vote for taking perhaps a lengthier route, giving the priest the courtesy and respect due him at the outset, and let him know in the most kind and charitable way what our objection is, backed up by the documentation and allowing him the opportunity to correct it.

It’s not only about respecting the priest, it’s also about respecting the Bishop (Ordinary) of the diocese, who has the primary responsibility and authority to regulate liturgy in his diocese. If a given practice is experienced in a diocese, it’s up to the bishop, primarily, not Rom, to determine and regulate what’s appropriate. The diocesan Bishop of course takes into account guidance from Rome, but in the end, he’s the primary liturgical authority acting in accord with liturgical law promulgated by the Church.

 

[JerrySeibert]

Hard one to call. Then should we get rid of all hymns? There are quite a few Christian Rock bands that all claim to be inspired by God. Depends upon personal taste.
I for one enjoy calm soothing classical music or chants that play in the background between Masses. But if heavier stuff if your taste, is that wrong? Or is it wrong because you do not agree with the choice?

 

[agapewolf]

The problem here is what is defined as “rock”, which is an umbrella term. The american use of the word is extremely different than other’s ideas of what it means.

In America, “Rock” can sometimes encompass:
-Marylin Manson
-Hairbands
-Screamer heavy metal
-Celine dion
-Maroon 5
-billy joel
-eagles
U2
-Heart
-Christian “rock”
Praise and worship
-anything with drums

There’s a huge range here, which actually are many different genres of music, that sound nothing alike, yet they somehow are considered “rock” by some.

 

[benedictgal]

It’s not only about respecting the priest, it’s also about respecting the Bishop (Ordinary) of the diocese, who has the primary responsibility and authority to regulate liturgy in his diocese. If a given practice is experienced in a diocese, it’s up to the bishop, primarily, not Rom, to determine and regulate what’s appropriate. The diocesan Bishop of course takes into account guidance from Rome, but in the end, he’s the primary liturgical authority acting in accord with liturgical law promulgated by the Church.

Hoever, the bishop does not have carte blanche authority over the liturgy in the same manner that Rome does.

According to the GIRM:

1. The Diocesan Bishop, who is to be regarded as the high priest of his flock, and from whom the life in Christ of the faithful under his care in a certain sense derives and upon whom it depends,148 must promote, regulate, and be vigilant over the liturgical life in his diocese. It is to him that in this Instruction is entrusted the regulating of the discipline of concelebration (cf. above, nos. 202, 374) and the establishing of norms regarding the function of serving the priest at the altar (cf. above, no. 107), the distribution of Holy Communion under both kinds (cf. above, no. 283), and the construction and ordering of churches (cf. above, no. 291). With him lies responsibility above all for fostering the spirit of the Sacred Liturgy in the priests, deacons, and faithful.

Yes, the bishop regulates, but, it needs to be in tandem with the authoritative guidelines of the Holy See. He does not have the authority to deviate from them. In fact, all of the authoritative documents state that he must safeguard the integrity of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass under the guidelines establshed by the Church.

 

[Brendan]

Ioffense. People think they’re benefiting the Church by enforcing the rules and rubrics, but 99% of it seems to me to just be a power trip. I just don’t get it.

Why do you feel that the Church issues liturgical rules and rubrics?

 

[kinderbueno]

“The primary direction of liturgical worship is vertical. We want to adore God, praise Him and thank Him. We want to celebrate the mysteries of Christ our Savior. All participants in the liturgy should watch out for, and avoid temptations to draw attention to oneself. The priest who preaches, the choir that leads the singing and the reader who proclaims a lesson, should not attract attention to themselves…

We come to Mass and other liturgical celebrations to adore God, not to entertain one another. All forms of horizontalization, making a show, or amusing the congregation should be avoided.” (Cardinal Arinze’s Address to Denver Liturgical Conference – March 8, 2003, The Sacred Liturgy Builds up the Church)

We need to put things into proper context. If it takes your attention away from the Blessed Sacrament before you (sort of the point, isn’t it), then what are you doing?

I have nothing against praise music OUTSIDE of the context of a liturgical celebration, but there are volumes that speak to what is proper within liturgical celebrations…this sounds like what you’ve experienced does not fit within those norms.

Peace, -Mike

 

[ljubim]

Well, to make a long story short, after a lot of thought, prayer, and a really good confession, I’m getting the vibe that I need to take this somewhere. I’ve drafted a letter, that I will send to both the priest and the Diocese’s youth coordinator (personal meetings would be ideal, but very difficult, both are a long drive away, and this is exam season ). Before I send it, I have stormed the inboxes of various apologists asking my original question once again, is this wrong? I ask this just to make absolutely sure…

Thanks for the quote Mike, mind if I use it

God Bless you guys, and any of your prayers would be much appreciated!!

Ljubim

 

[diggerdomer]

Hoever, the bishop does not have carte blanche authority over the liturgy in the same manner that Rome does.

According to the GIRM:

Yes, the bishop regulates, but, it needs to be in tandem with the authoritative guidelines of the Holy See. He does not have the authority to deviate from them. In fact, all of the authoritative documents state that he must safeguard the integrity of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass under the guidelines establshed by the Church.

Of course.

 

[kinderbueno]

Thanks for the quote Mike, mind if I use it

God Bless you guys, and any of your prayers would be much appreciated!!

You certainly have my prayers. Of course you can use the quote since it’s not mine, though I’m sure you don’t need my permission. Here’s another like it from the Holy Father himself, although I got it from a friend and not sure where he wrote/said it – sounds like something from The Spirit of the Liturgy, now I have to go check:

“Wherever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment. Such attraction fades quickly – it cannot compete in the market of leisure pursuits, incorporating as it increasingly does various forms of religious titillation.” - Pope Benedict XVI

 

[ljubim]

I’ve just sent the email to the youth director! Thanks for the prayers guys, I would rather keep the rest of the events personal… God Bless you all!!

 

[mdgspencer]

I agree that it is best to go up the chain of command, and start by speaking peaceably with the parish priest. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding on your own part and speaking with him would clear it up.
If you write to the bishop, you should provide evidence for what you say. Of course, he does not know who you are and would want to know if they is a solid basis for what you say. Perhaps for example the evidence would be in the parish bulletin.
You have a perfect right to send your complaint to Rome if writing to the bishop proves of no avail. The cardinal in charge of the Vatican’s Congragation in charge of the liturgy has insisted that the Catholic people have the right to go to them. Obviously he had heard of complaints that people had written to him about abuses, and this was his response.