Helping Friends from Regnum Christi

  • Thread starter Thread starter Augustine
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
A

Augustine

Guest
We have friends who are members of Regnum Christi and they are an inspiring family to all in our parish. However, I noticed that they were rather sad on Sunday and then it fell on me on Monday why after the news that Fr. Maciel led a depraved life behind doors and possibly with the knowledge of his close associates.

The LC and the RC are fine congregations of priests and laity which certainly bear no trace of their founder, on the contrary. Yet, all other similar congregations yearn to see their founder holiness and by extension their congregation confirmed by the Church by beatifying or canonizing them. After all, a loving child desires to see his spiritual father be recognized as a person of virtue and grace. If this is true, Fr. Maciel’s children’s desire has just been shattered and they are certainly scandalized, perhaps even questioning the whole enterprise, in spite of the good fruits of LC or RC in their lives.

I just do not know how to approach these friends and console them, restoring a bit of the hope that they’ve just lost. Please, lend me a word of advise to me, as I’m a callous jerk.

TIA

:blessyou:
 
Augustine said:
We have friends who are members of Regnum Christi and they are an inspiring family to all in our parish. However, I noticed that they were rather sad on Sunday and then it fell on me on Monday why after the news that Fr. Maciel led a depraved life behind doors and possibly with the knowledge of his close associates.

The LC and the RC are fine congregations of priests and laity which certainly bear no trace of their founder, on the contrary. Yet, all other similar congregations yearn to see their founder holiness and by extension their congregation confirmed by the Church by beatifying or canonizing them. After all, a loving child desires to see his spiritual father be recognized as a person of virtue and grace. If this is true, Fr. Maciel’s children’s desire has just been shattered and they are certainly scandalized, perhaps even questioning the whole enterprise, in spite of the good fruits of LC or RC in their lives.

I just do not know how to approach these friends and console them, restoring a bit of the hope that they’ve just lost. Please, lend me a word of advise to me, as I’m a callous jerk.

TIA

:blessyou:
Click to expand...
Are you the right person to say anything? Maybe you can just let them know your praying for them. Pray that their faith in Christ and His Church remains strong through this trial.

I know several members of Regnum Christi. Good people, very good people, but that organization left me feeling uncomfortable. We don’t need to join any other organizations within the Church to be “good Catholics”. Maybe your friends won’t want to talk about that, but if they might leave the Catholic Church over this priestly scandal, maybe gently bring that up.

Our faith should be built on Christ, the Rock. Storms of life will come, but if our faith is built on Christ, it will endure. Priestly scandal is a storm. It shakes up people’s faith within the Church. I pray your friends built their faith on Jesus, not Fr. Maciel.
 
Just some quick points
  1. Just pray for us and the Legionary priests, some are hurting very badly.
  2. What we know should not be hiden in a PR attempt, what happened happened. We are Catholics we don’t do PR! I sure don’t have time for it.
  3. priests are men - men are weak - pray for all men!
  4. As we have seen in the past this will change very little, our faith in Christ is not wraped up in any one man, other then Christ.
  5. RC is not (in my opinion) about being a “good Catholic” it is about getting closer to Christ.
    a) there is more out there then just being a “good Catholic”, also there is nothing wrong with being a “good Catholic”. 🙂
Just my 2 cents, I wrote it quick sorry,
Jim
 
From Pope Benedict’s address to youth in NY this past April:

“Today, I wish to draw your attention to the positive spiritual renewal which congregations are undertaking in relation to their charism. The word charism means a gift freely and graciously given. Charisms are bestowed by the Holy Spirit, who inspires founders and foundresses, and shapes congregations with a subsequent spiritual heritage. The wondrous array of charisms proper to each religious institute is an extraordinary spiritual treasury… Through the discovery of charisms, which yield such a breadth of spiritual wisdom, I am sure that some of you young people will be drawn to a life of apostolic or contemplative service. Do not be shy to speak with religious brothers, sisters or priests about the charism and spirituality of their congregation. No perfect community exists, but it is fidelity to a founding charism, not to particular individuals, that the Lord calls you to discern. Have courage!”
 
This is from a friend to her brothers, who are studying to be Legionaries, I am with holding her name.

Hi you two…

First of all I want to say I’m sorry… and I wanted to see how you are doing…

I, like everyone else just got the hard to swallow news. But after a day in class (without paying attention much because I couldn’t get this off of my mind) I realized a few things. First I was hurt, and felt like it was all fake, and then I was angry…but it didn’t take me long to realize that there is so much left to do in the world.

Fr. Maciel was an amazing man, regardless of this moral setback that took place. He was a man who loved God and served the church his entire life. We hold him on a pedestal of sorts because he is a great model for our spiritual lives. And I believe that he still is. He was human, and he was overcome simply by that at a moment in his life, but that does not discredit all that he taught us. All of his letters and prayers, came from God.

If it were not for him neither of you…or me for that matter…or countless other people would be even half as close to christ as they are. He taught us how to make a place in our lives for christ to be our best friend, our role model, and our guide. It was never Fr. Maciel’s plan for us to become like him…rather to become like Christ.

The mission of the Legion is still the same today as it was a few days ago…the same before and after this scandal…to serve Christ and build His Church. I know it must be very hard for you two especially because he was seen by you as a father, both spiritually and personally. But know that your mission is still the same.

God called you two not to follow a man but to follow Him on the path he laid out for you. He has given you both an amazing gift, the ability to be in constant service of Him and the Church. I can see how it would be possible for you to doubt, or be angry, or wonder if you are still in the right place…but remember…Fr. Maciel has been gone from this life for a year now and you still continued to be faithful to Christ and the Legion, even with him gone. Do not let your faith be swayed by this. It is still the same Church, and the same movement, and the same congregation. Granted it will take a while to heal the wounds in the hearts of a lot of people, but God will never give a cross that is more than we can bear. And especially the Brothers of the Legionaries of Christ, you have each other to get yourselves through this…

Look to Mary for help and strength. She always helps her family. She will shelter you with her veil and keep you safe in her arms. That image always helps me anyways…

The Church needs faithful men to answer God’s call to serve the church through their vocation to the priesthood. I have always admired both of you…even though Ill admit…it is hard to have you gone…God is more important than anyone in this life, and our whole reason for being is to get back to him and to bring others along with us.

Sorry if I’m rambling…

The Holy Father said that if we are who we are meant to be we will change the world…(or what I remember him saying!) Be who God has told you that you are…Be what and who you are meant to be. Continue your journey in the legion if that is God’s plan for your life knowing that you are not doing it for men …but that your sole purpose for your vocation is Christ and the Church.

When there are good things the devil will add persecution to try to rip it apart…be strong! It is during the fight for Christ through persecution that saints are formed.

I miss you …I am praying for you (everyday)…I love you…and remember to always be faithful to God’s will!

Love C (your favorite sister!)
 
Shipchips, with the three posts above, it seems that you may also be struggling with this news. I will pray for you, your friends and the Legionary priests and seminarians you know.
shipchips said:
This is from a friend to her brothers, who are studying to be Legionaries, I am with holding her name.
…Fr. Maciel was an amazing man, regardless of this moral setback that took place. He was a man who loved God and served the church his entire life. We hold him on a pedestal of sorts because he is a great model for our spiritual lives. And I believe that he still is. He was human, and he was overcome simply by that at a moment in his life, but that does not discredit all that he taught us.
Click to expand...
I understand that the news of Fr. Maciel’s fall is difficult for many to grasp. The letter shipchip’s shared from a sister to her brothers in a Legionary Seminary maybe comforting to some, yet others may find the part I quoted a large stumbling block.

We must be careful with putting people on pedestals and setting them as example for the spiritual life–especially if the person was removed from their priestly positions by Church officials. Someone up on a pedestal can fall further than most. Yes, he was human–we all are. Being human is *not *an excuse for immorality because immorality does not become our dignity as humans.

During Fr. Maciel’s lifetime, we did not see a penitant humman struggling against sin and seeking repentance. Allegations of wrongdoing were denied during Fr. Maciel’s lifetime, and his organizations only recently admitted that there was any type scandal. I certainly don’t know what he confessed in a private confession, but there was no admission of any guilt to the public. Instead there were allegations that he was an innocent man being persecuted like Christ when the Vatican removed him from ministry. I can’t exactly remember if this came from Fr. Maciel directly or others within his organization, but the previous denials certainly makes this news even more difficult for Regnum Christi and Legionary members. Many who staunchly defended and believed in Fr. Maciel’s innocence now learn something ugly.

And it is ugly. It detracts from the good he did. It also detracts from the good his organization does. Yes, he did much good. Someone capable of greatness can do either great good or great evil. He did both. It is difficult to reconcile and understand that, because we see the good he did. Learn from the good and let the bad serve as a warning.
 
Instead of focusing on the mistake that ONE MAN made, why not focus on the good that this order has done? Doing otherwise only tarnishes their repute, and that’s probably just want the Old Sinner (ie. Satan) would want us to do.
 
Matrix_Refugee said:
Instead of focusing on the mistake that ONE MAN made, why not focus on the good that this order has done? Doing otherwise only tarnishes their repute, and that’s probably just want the Old Sinner (ie. Satan) would want us to do.
Click to expand...
The reason why this is such a big deal is because the Legionaries of Christ and Regnum Christi are somewhat famous (or infamous) for showing an extreme degree of admiration towards their founder. Seminarians in the Legion constantly study his works, and the order considers him to be a spiritual role model.

For some examples, read Amy Welborn’s blog post here amywelborn.wordpress.com/2009/02/03/way-truth-and-life/ , and read the comments by “Ingvar” and “Betty Duffy” on the same post.

I am involved with another new religious order, and the founder (still living) is not given nearly as much attention as the Legion gives to Fr. Maciel. This is why this story is noteworthy – if this had happened to any of the other new orders, the consequences would not have been nearly as strong, because other orders do not show this degree of adulation towards a living person.
 
This is what keeps me from joining certain groups. I rather admire Opus Dei, but I don’t really feel comfortable with the degree of…veneration that they show toward J.M. Escrivera. I have been pulled in the direction of becoming a Benedictine Oblate. I will continue to think and pray about it.
 
On my website I just posted an article refuting Jay Dunlaps article which was published in 2003 called “Are there cults in the Catholic Church” (He concludes that there CANNOT be cults in the Church.)

His original article can be found here:
catholic.com/thisrock/2003/0301fea2.asp

Please read my arguments against his article and tell me what you think!

Here is the link to my blog site!

howtostaycatholic.blogspot.com/

I don’t wish to discuss any specific groups but whether
IN THEORY it is possible for a cult to exist in the Church.

This site also contains a lot of resources for people who have been adversely affected by a Catholic group
 
Matrix_Refugee said:
Instead of focusing on the mistake that ONE MAN made, why not focus
Click to expand...
The question is did ONLY one man “make the mistake”
or did the system that he set up allow him to do that?

This news piece on youtube suggests that the problem extends BEYOND just Maciel…

youtube.com/watch?v=-i0VUu3p8GI

The damage is done. The Legion has done good, but unfortunately they also have given the enemies of the Church much ammunition for years to come, “Imagine that, even ORTHODOX orders abuse people.”
 
We also have to question whether practices such as screening incoming and outgoing mail are HEALTHY practices.

Sure they are defended by tradition, but one wonders how much these practices (screening mail and phone calls) contributed to the cover-up of Maciel’s actions.

Just because it was practiced BEFORE in the Church doesn’t in itself make it a good idea.
 
I’m in Regnum Christi. I think it depends on how you know the person, but I think something along the lines of - I heard the news and I am sorry and am praying for you - and leaving it open if the RC member wants to talk with you.

In regards to admiring a founder, the Franciscans do this with St. Francis of Assisi. I also remember going to an outdoor Mass honoring St. Clare for cloistered nuns of her order. We actually sang a hymn to St. Clare. It is really not that unusual.

Edited to add: Not everyone needs to join Opus Dei, RC, third order secular Franciscans, etc. RC members consider it a calling that is helpful for them personally in fulfilling their baptismal vows. It is not essential but for me it seems to be the most helpful thing I have encountered.
 
materdequint said:
In regards to admiring a founder, the Franciscans do this with St. Francis of Assisi. I also remember going to an outdoor Mass honoring St. Clare for cloistered nuns of her order. We actually sang a hymn to St. Clare. It is really not that unusual.
Click to expand...
St. Francis and Ct. Clarie are canonized saints and have been dead for over 700 years. In contrast, Fr. Maciel was receiving this kind of admiration while he was still alive. There is a difference between these two situations, and recent events show why it is dangerous to show so much admiration to someone while they are still alive and all the details of their life are not yet known.
 
I think the Franciscans adored Francis of Assisi when he was alive too.
 
materdequint said:
I’m in Regnum Christi. I think it depends on how you know the person, but I think something along the lines of - I heard the news and I am sorry and am praying for you - and leaving it open if the RC member wants to talk with you.
Click to expand...
I finally met the husband in the couple and said exactly this. He was thankful about the prayers and the reaching and expressed his own disappointment at this scandal.

He added, however, that his wife is asking a lot of questions and is getting quite annoyed at the stonewalling that she’s finding, unfortunately. One thing he’s sure of: he’ll terminate their children’s involvement with RC for the time being.

All in all, I’m relieved to see them with a healthy, questioning attitude towards RC and an unabashed allegiance to Jesus and to His Church.

:blessyou:

PS: may you find peace in Jesus and may He lift up your heavy heart at this ordeal.
 
Augustine said:
He added, however, that his wife is asking a lot of questions and is getting quite annoyed at the stonewalling that she’s finding, unfortunately. One thing he’s sure of: he’ll terminate their children’s involvement with RC for the time being.
Click to expand...
How very very sad, we (RC) here in Covington La. were invited to a meeting with our Legionary priest for our regional area to discuss what as occured. We were invited to ask any questions we felt neccessary, and please understand this, ALL questions asked were answered, and not one person out of the 40+ people there were upset with the answers. The answers made sense and there was no “stonewalling” at all. Your friends need answers and I will be glad to get them in touch with a leader that is willing to do their job as a leader and answer them.

The sad truth is many people want salacious details, and that is not neccessary for our salvation. Salacious details are only good for gossip.

Facts;
Fr. Maciel had a long term relationship with a woman and fathered a girl. This information was found during an investigation by Fr. Alvaro Corcuera General Director of the Legionaries of Christ, not the Vatican. The Vatican will not comment on the subject. How long is long? I don’t know, does it matter for your salvation?

Fr. Maciel was asked to step down from his public ministries by the Vatican, after the Vatican investigated charges against him. Fr. Maciel was never given a formal hearing. Common sense would dictate that if the Vatican found nothing they would not have asked him to step down. What did the Vatican find? We will never know as they are not disclosing their information. And again I ask will it change your salvation?

The only reason I can see any “stonewalling” if that is what it was, is because not everyone found out at the same time. I didn’t find out until about a week ago and I am not the only one. I just hope that is the reason, and the person being asked just needed time to digest the information, and not trying to cover up anything, that would be foolish.

And all of this information will not change anything for me or my wife personally. We are both RC and my oldest boy is involved with ECYD first degree. My oldest girl is in Challenge. My youngest boy is in Conquest my other two girls will be allowed to join Challenge when they are old enough. It seems strange for your friend to pull his kids out of RC programs. Do you think they were teaching his kids about what Fr. Maciel did? We all know they were not. Why would he pull the kids out? only if they as parents were not involved with the kids’ RC programs. These programs are not designed as a “drop off / pick up” system. If he has been even slightly involved he would know better. I only wish I had this kind of formation when I was a child. The formation that my children are receiving today through these programs is superior to any I received as a child. I had “Catholic light” CCD in the 70s in California, what I like to call “God loves you classes”. I learned God loved me, but nothing about the church, that would have helped me be a mature Catholic that was able to defend my beliefs.

I am so sorry for being so blunt, but come on people think like Christians. Pray like Christians. Act like Christians. It always seems like so many Catholics are looking for something to get mad at the Church for just so they have an excuse to leave. How many people do you know that are “ex-Catholics” because of this “one thing” they didn’t agree with?

God Bless
Jim
 
Shipchips,

I’m sorry for the ordeal that you must be going through.

However, I will not discuss my friends’ decisions and I ask those in this forum to not imply that they know what their questions were and the answers that were not forthcoming.

Thank you.

:blessyou:
 
please let me repeat;
shipchips said:
Your friends need answers and I will be glad to get them in touch with a leader that is willing to do their job as a leader and answer them.
Click to expand...
I received all the answers I needed. I am staying with the movement.😃

With as flawed as he was, his teaching was sound, if it wasn’t I don’t think the Vatican would be as supportive of the movement as they are.

I don’t want to know what your friends questions are, and none of us should want to know, that is private.

If your friends realy want answers I can get them in touch with someone in the order that is willing to help them and get them the answers they need and deserve. Chances are in a little time they will be able to get those answers in their own region, but if not I would be glad to help.

I may sound rough, that is the problem with typing so impersonal, but I am doing great, I have a smile one my face, I am just trying to help. 🙂 Thank you so much for your concern and prayers.

God Bless
Jim
 
I find it interesting that so many people who have no apparent connection think they need to know all the details. Why?

If the Legion did what they said (i.e. take their findings to Rome and ask for Rome’s guidance in dealing with it), why do so many people insist that all the details must be made public?

When the priest scandal broke a few years back, did Rome insist on making all details public?

IMHO, we’re such a gossip laden culture, we think we have a right to know everything, when often times, we don’t. (we may want to know, but we don’t need to know)

If they are doing all that Rome asks, I say God bless them!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top