Heretical Priest

[Balcerhouse]

It’s been about three months now so to actively do soemthing about a certain priest I’ve probably missed my opportunity if there was one at all, I’d like to see what you think.

I went to a monday evening “learn about the catholic faith” type event and a priest from the parish closest to me but not the church I actually attend was there. There was a question and answer time where you could write anonymous questions for him and at some point the evolution creation issue came about. He was a physics teacher before he was a priest he told us. He then said that if we had to make a valid decision one way or the other “of course we would choose evolution” and then sequed into how the Church and science aren’t enemies.

I’m a new convert to Catholicism and had been a member not even a month when that event happened so I don’t want to be a bull in a china shop but that made me furious because he misrepresented the Church to a room full of mostly non-Catholics.

 

[bilop]

It’s been about three months now so to actively do soemthing about a certain priest I’ve probably missed my opportunity if there was one at all, I’d like to see what you think.

I went to a monday evening “learn about the catholic faith” type event and a priest from the parish closest to me but not the church I actually attend was there. There was a question and answer time where you could write anonymous questions for him and at some point the evolution creation issue came about. He was a physics teacher before he was a priest he told us. He then said that if we had to make a valid decision one way or the other “of course we would choose evolution” and then sequed into how the Church and science aren’t enemies.

I’m a new convert to Catholicism and had been a member not even a month when that event happened so I don’t want to be a bull in a china shop but that made me furious because he misrepresented the Church to a room full of mostly non-Catholics.

Not heresy, at all. Belief in evolution is entirely compatible with Catholic belief.

It is entirely possible that God used evolution to create life on this planet. And evolution doesn’t explain at all how something came from nothing; i.e. the “Big Bang” or how life arose from non living matter.

God Bless

 

[1ke]

I’m not sure how he misrepresented Church teaching. Can you elaborate your line of thinking?

 

[Balcerhouse]

It is entirely possible that God used evolution to create life on this planet. God Bless

My issue isn’t that evolution may exist but creation must exist. God used evolution to CREATE.

 

[Balcerhouse]

I’m not sure how he misrepresented Church teaching. Can you elaborate your line of thinking?

Maybe I’m wrong but I’ve assumed that the Church teaches that God created all things. So if you had to choose one it must be creation not evolution. I’m not saying evolution doesn’t exist on a day to day basis, on the contrary I do believe that. But ex nihilo- God made it all out of nothing that’s far more miraculous than the mutation of cells.

 

[bilop]

Maybe I’m wrong but I’ve assumed that the Church teaches that God created all things. So if you had to choose one it must be creation not evolution. I’m not saying evolution doesn’t exist on a day to day basis, on the contrary I do believe that. But ex nihilo- God made it all out of nothing that’s far more miraculous than the mutation of cells.

But it need not be only one, it can be, and probably is both.

I would imagine that if the priest was dismissing creationism, he was dismissing “young earth” creationism, i.e. the world is only 7,000 years old.

God Bless

 

[tafan]

It’s been about three months now so to actively do soemthing about a certain priest I’ve probably missed my opportunity if there was one at all, I’d like to see what you think.

I went to a monday evening “learn about the catholic faith” type event and a priest from the parish closest to me but not the church I actually attend was there. There was a question and answer time where you could write anonymous questions for him and at some point the evolution creation issue came about. He was a physics teacher before he was a priest he told us. He then said that if we had to make a valid decision one way or the other “of course we would choose evolution” and then sequed into how the Church and science aren’t enemies.

I’m a new convert to Catholicism and had been a member not even a month when that event happened so I don’t want to be a bull in a china shop but that made me furious because he misrepresented the Church to a room full of mostly non-Catholics.

I will make no statement regarding evolution, but as regards to the Church and science not being enemies, this is not only true, it is part of our faith.

There are two orders of knowledge, which can be classified based on their source and their object. Typically these are faith and reason. It is actually heretical to hold that there can ever be any contradiction between the two. If we regard science as a subset of the knowledge we learn from reason (which we should), then there your priest is correct on the compatibility of science and our faith.

You should read Chapter 4 from the degrees of the 1st Vatican Council papalencyclicals.net/Councils/ecum20.htm#4.

In particular, here is one quote

Even though faith is above reason, there can never be any real disagreement between faith and reason, since ◦ it is the same God :black_medium_small_square:who reveals the mysteries and infuses faith, and
who has endowed the human mind with the light of reason.

This is an article of faith for Catholics.

 

[Balcerhouse]

I completely agree that the Church isn’t against Science at all. I understand that and yes evolution and creation both are likely to exist but if there is one like he said if we had to choose one we would naturally choose evolution that then assumes that we wouldn’t choose creation which then leaves us with no creator.

 

[1ke]

Maybe I’m wrong but I’ve assumed that the Church teaches that God created all things.

If you mean that God created all that is ex nihilo, then yes of course. He called forth the material universe by his Word. I don’t think the priest contradicted that.

If you mean that God specially creates each thing, then no.

So if you had to choose one it must be creation not evolution.

Perhaps you misunderstood the priest. I take it to mean Creation (big C as in the literal, 6 day creation) versus Evolution (process by which God created over a long period of time).

But ex nihilo- God made it all out of nothing that’s far more miraculous than the mutation of cells.

I don’t disagree and I would venture to say that if you asked him the priest would agree. God created ex nihilo, without which there would be no cells to mutate.

I would suggest that, in charity, you might want to refrain from tossing around the label “heretic priest” based on something so ambiguous. It would be better, IMHO, to ask for clarification in such situations, either on the spot or afterwards in private.

 

[1ke]

I completely agree that the Church isn’t against Science at all. I understand that and yes evolution and creation both are likely to exist but if there is one like he said if we had to choose one we would naturally choose evolution that then assumes that we wouldn’t choose creation which then leaves us with no creator.

I really do think perhaps you missed the nuanced meaning he was applying to “Creation”. He was likely referring to Creationism, which posits a literal 6 day creation and a 6,000 year old earth.

Also, please note that Evolution, strictly speaking, is a banned topic on the forum. So, this thread may be over that line and might be locked shortly.

 

[Balcerhouse]

That’s very possible. It’s probably best that I didn;'t say anything. I’d like to think that I took him wrong anyway. And I also didn’t know that evolution was banned. Ah well, thanks for the brief discussion.

 

[Ohana]

I have difficulty with Creationism for the reasons described earlier - the fallacy of the 6000 year old earth etc. On the other hand, I like the concept of “Intelligent Design”, which assumes God as the Creator and time is not a factor. After all, God is timeless. He did not even create earth day until the “Fourth Day” of creation so who knew how long his other days were?

I think it was Pope John Paul II who stated there was no contradiction between evolution and God as creator.

I like the gradualism of evolution. It give one the feeling that we are still in process of creation. God is good!

 

[devoutchristian]

Also, please note that Evolution, strictly speaking, is a banned topic on the forum. So, this thread may be over that line and might be locked shortly.

I thought that they unbanned it.

I think it was Pope John Paul II who stated there was no contradiction between evolution and God as creator.

It was Pope Pius XII.

 

[fitz1984]

Church and science can’t be apart, but science is the mechanisim for understanding the creation of God.
People have a misunderstanding of science thinking that its at odds with the church, with some bad fact findings there have been untrue statements made by scientists, but if God made everything and science is the explanation of those things, they technically can never be at odds with each other.

 

[maltmom]

I thought that they unbanned it.

The sticky is still there. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=410885

 

[grannymh]

It’s been about three months now so to actively do soemthing about a certain priest I’ve probably missed my opportunity if there was one at all, I’d like to see what you think.

I went to a monday evening “learn about the catholic faith” type event and a priest from the parish closest to me but not the church I actually attend was there. There was a question and answer time where you could write anonymous questions for him and at some point the evolution creation issue came about. He was a physics teacher before he was a priest he told us. He then said that if we had to make a valid decision one way or the other “of course we would choose evolution” and then sequed into how the Church and science aren’t enemies.

I’m a new convert to Catholicism and had been a member not even a month when that event happened so I don’t want to be a bull in a china shop but that made me furious because he misrepresented the Church to a room full of mostly non-Catholics.

If a particular scientific theory intersects or collides with a particular Catholic doctrine regarding faith and/or morals, then the Catholic Church has a responsibility to present and preserve the truth.

In my humble opinion, the priest was indicating that science has priority over Divine Revelation. Over the years, there has been a lot of press where people, including some clergy, want to see the Catholic Church update some basic Catholic doctrines, especially in the areas of human origin, human nature and original sin. Or they may prefer that some of these doctrines be deleted.

What is now important is that Catholics learn the basic Catholic doctrines in depth via the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition.
Link scborromeo.org/ccc.htm

 

[Michael_Francis]

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