Heretical Song for Catholics?

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Our choir is rehearsing a song with a troublesome lyric. At first presentation of the song I commented that it was heretical . Read a repeated lyric and tell me that if I am being overly sensitive or have grounds to complain. The Hymn is titled, Think of Me.
Unfortunately, I haven’t the score in front of me, so this is an impression of the lyric, which although accurate, that a possible variation does not correct.
In the song, the singer / listener sings / hears that when we “eat the bread” and “drink the wine” we are to “Think of Me.” The verb ‘take’ may also be used in repetitions of the line. Although the Priest does take bread and wine at the Offertory the communicants during Holy Communion do not.
The words body and blood are used once in a sense that don’'t mean the bread and wine ever become the Body and Blood of Christ, but again without the score I am at a disadvantage.
This post in a slightly extended form appears in the Thread Liturgy / Protestant Hymns. If this is considered Spamming, and it may well be, accept my apology and delete the other, or both and I’ll get my advice away from the Internet.
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Matthew,

I know one thing FOR SURE! I wouldn’t sing that song!!! It IS NOT what we are doing when we receive Jesus.

Looks like you have a decision to make.

What are you going to do?

John
 
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john654:
I know one thing FOR SURE! I wouldn’t sing that song!!! It IS NOT what we are doing when we receive Jesus.

Looks like you have a decision to make.

What are you going to do?

John
Click to expand...
Thank you for your response, Sir. We are in agreement about this song and Holy Communion. I have said that I would abide by our Pastor’s decision, so until the decision is learned, I intend neither rehearsing nor performing the song. With confidence in his decision, we will never sing it. If the decision is something other than expected, I will resign from the choir and take no additional action.
However, I have offered to edit the lyric to make it appropriate for Catholics, but no agreement has been received from the director.
 
our pastor has forbidden all songs that presume to speak for Jesus, so that the singers are using words that purport to come from the mouth of Jesus. This song wouldn’t make it in our parish. We are also forbidden to use songs, especially by protestant writer Marty Haugens, but there are many others, that speak of Eucharist ONLY as assembly, community, bread wine, without referring to the Body and Blood of Christ, the sacrifice that in other words diminish the full meaning of the Eucharist.
 
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puzzleannie:
our pastor has forbidden all songs that presume to speak for Jesus, so that the singers are using words that purport to come from the mouth of Jesus. This song wouldn’t make it in our parish. We are also forbidden to use songs, especially by protestant writer Marty Haugens, but there are many others, that speak of Eucharist ONLY as assembly, community, bread wine, without referring to the Body and Blood of Christ, the sacrifice that in other words diminish the full meaning of the Eucharist.
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Thank you for your response. Is there a difference between words spoken as coming from Jesus’ mouth and those in the Bible that did come from His mouth? Some of both are below; I only attempted to edit the song to our Catholic belief in the Real Presence. It is weak in many places, however, I am not an editor. There are probably great hymns already treating this subject that we should use, but I am no director, either.
The Bold Type are changes, Italics indicate unchanged lyrics.

Think of Me, by Robert W. Thygerson
edited for a Catholic Choir

When you drink My Blood, believe in*** ***me________, the blood shed for you, think of meAs you come to the table today,humble be with words that you say. Think of Me.

Break the Body, take and eat; Body nailed to the cross, think of Me.. Pray that God’s will be done, let it be.Pray that God’s will be done, let it be______

When you sip from the cup and offer a prayer,___ do this in remembrance of me.__________
*Pray for peace, pray for *union from the Father above. May your heart let me in; think of Me.

When you meet to commune think of Me;___________pour the wine, break the bread, think of Me.________

*As the ***priest renews **God’s pledge made to you,___think of Him, *eat ***His Body **,drink **His Blood **-think of Him, think of Him

Eat His Body, think of Him, **drink His Blood **,__*think of *Him.
 
that is an example of the type of lyrics our pastor dislikes, I guess the thinking is that our songs should be praise, addressed from the people to God, and that we should not presume to speak for God. When proclaiming the Word, of course, it would be more in the nature of a “quotation” from God to repeat the words of Christ. I think this goes back to an effort to clearly enunciate the difference between the priest and the congregation, the sacrificial priesthood of the altar and the baptismal priesthood of the faithful, maintaining the distinctions.
 
Here’s that pestilent fellow, Paul stirring up trouble again: I Cor 11:26: “For as often as youeat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death . . .”

I wouldn’t call that hymn heretical. But it IS confusing.
 
The other thing is that during the sacrifice of the Mass, it is not about going to some “table”, it is an altar. The Protestant insistence that our consecration is just some “common meal” as they call it has infected some of these modern songs.
 
I encountered one of the uglier examples at mass yesterday:
I myself am the bread of life
You and I are the bread of life
Taken and blessed, broken and shared by Christ.
(verse 2) This is our body
This is our blood
Living sign of God in Christ
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(Rory Cooney: "Bread of Life". Text © 1987 NALR, published by OCP Publications).
 
Does anyone know when the idea first came up that it was improper to speak as God (or Christ). I know that it happens all throughout the Old Testament and also occurs in the New Testament. The laity today speak the words of God often when singing the Psalms.

What I am wondering, is this idea new as a backlash against modernism or did it come about in the Middle Ages?
 
pnewton ( Lake Jackson) I was born and raised in Freeport.

About those “choirs”. To me it has seemed for years that we (Catholics) are ALLOWING a minority, read “music directors”, to make an attempt to try to make us more like Protestants.

I can think of no reason except that these knuckle heads think people will come to Mass to hear their choir! It doesn’t work!

I yearn for the days when we had a small choir up in the balcony. And they only sang a very few songs in Latin- Catholic Hymns and a Gregorian chant. I don’t want to be like Protestants. If I did, I would go to a Protestant Church//////////// nuff said!:tsktsk:
 
I think we’re being too legalistic here. To say I ate the bread and drank the wine does not deny the fact that they are the Body and Blood of Christ. They still possess the accidents of bread and wine and so it is not illogical to call them such, as Paul does in the above quote.

Also, a song about the Church as Christ’s mystical body in no way denies the Real Presence. To call ourselves the bread of life is just as true as calling the Eucharist the bread of life. Both are quite true. One is a mystical truth about the Church as Christ’s body (or instrument) on earth. The other is a truth of Jesus’s Real Presence.
 
MattG said:

Our choir is rehearsing a song with a troublesome lyric. At first presentation of the song I commented that it was heretical . Read a repeated lyric and tell me that if I am being overly sensitive or have grounds to complain. The Hymn is titled, Think of Me.

Unfortunately, I haven’t the score in front of me, so this is an impression of the lyric, which although accurate, that a possible variation does not correct.
In the song, the singer / listener sings / hears that when we “eat the bread” and “drink the wine” we are to “Think of Me.” The verb ‘take’ may also be used in repetitions of the line. Although the Priest does take bread and wine at the Offertory the communicants during Holy Communion do not.

The words body and blood are used once in a sense that don’'t mean the bread and wine ever become the Body and Blood of Christ, but again without the score I am at a disadvantage.

This post in a slightly extended form appears in the Thread Liturgy / Protestant Hymns. If this is considered Spamming, and it may well be, accept my apology and delete the other, or both and I’ll get my advice away from the Internet.

​
Click to expand...

It’s not really fair to judge a song without knowing its text though, is it ? 🙂​

 
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Exporter:
pnewton ( Lake Jackson) I was born and raised in Freeport.

About those “choirs”. To me it has seemed for years that we (Catholics) are ALLOWING a minority, read “music directors”, to make an attempt to try to make us more like Protestants.

I can think of no reason except that these knuckle heads think people will come to Mass to hear their choir! It doesn’t work!

I yearn for the days when we had a small choir up in the balcony. And they only sang a very few songs in Latin- Catholic Hymns and a Gregorian chant. I don’t want to be like Protestants. If I did, I would go to a Protestant Church nuff said!:tsktsk:
Click to expand...
Our parish has grown from a handful of families, less than 400 to over 1000 in the last ten years. Freeport, Texas has gone just closed one parish from lack of attendance (and the choir sings from the loft).

What does this mean? Nothing! Just like this post. How I wish someone would try to be more a part of the solution and not just a finger wagger and name caller.
 
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quintessential5:
I think we’re being too legalistic here. To say I ate the bread and drank the wine does not deny the fact that they are the Body and Blood of Christ. They still possess the accidents of bread and wine and so it is not illogical to call them such, as Paul does in the above quote.

Also, a song about the Church as Christ’s mystical body in no way denies the Real Presence. To call ourselves the bread of life is just as true as calling the Eucharist the bread of life. Both are quite true. One is a mystical truth about the Church as Christ’s body (or instrument) on earth. The other is a truth of Jesus’s Real Presence.
Click to expand...
Since the song in question comes from a Protestant Church and they deny that bread and wine ever become the Body and Blood of Christ, it is not a stretch to read the words of the song as a denial of the Real Presence. Indeed, the accidents are the same, but the substance is changed and Eucharist is not a topic of the song. As another grants that not seeing the lyrics makes discussion of them difficult they are:
Think of Me*
by
Robert W. Thygerson
Come and drink the wine, think of me______the blood shed for you, think of me.______As you come to the table today,.______humble be with words that you say. Think of me. Break the bread, take and eat, thinik of me;_______Body nailed to the cross, think of me.__________Pray that God’s will be done, let it be._______Cast away all your sins, think of me.______When you sip from the cup______and offer a prayer,_____do this in remembrance of me.______Pray for peace, pray for love from the Father above, May your heart let me in; think of me.________When you meet to commune, think of me;_____pour the wine, break the bread, think of me.________As you seek to renew_______God’s pledge made to you, ______think of me, drink the wine, think of me, eat the bread, think of me. Drink the wine, eat the bread, think of me.
  • © 1997 Triune Music, a division of The Lorenz Corporation.
Referring to “the table” is not wrong, the first Mass was on a Table at The Last Supper. Nor is it wrong if we acknowledge that Jesus is the Bread of Life, because he said that about himself speaking to the crowd at JN 6:35 “I am the bread of life…” Later, JN 6:48, he also told them again, “I am The bread of Life.”
At the Last supper he took bread, saying, “This is My Body.” and gave it to the Apostles to eat…not bread, but His Body. Later, laking wine and declaring it to be His Blood, He gave it to them to drink…no longer wine, but His Blood.
Nowhere can it be found in the NAB that Jesus ever asks us to “Think of Me,” as the song suggests Jesus asks us to do.
 
MattG,

Just between me and you. I would rather be dead than to utter this PROTESTANT song during the holy sacrifice of the mass. Your first post to me was right on. DON’T let anyone change your mind about this kind of compromise. Stand firm. You understand the cross! Jesus is king! Your light is shinning bright, let your whole parish see it.

You give me hope!

Peace Brother,
John
 
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john654:
MattG,

Just between me and you. I would rather be dead than to utter this PROTESTANT song during the holy sacrifice of the mass. Your first post to me was right on. DON’T let anyone change your mind about this kind of compromise. Stand firm. You understand the cross! Jesus is king! Your light is shinning bright, let your whole parish see it.

You give me hope!

Peace Brother,
John
Click to expand...
Thank you, John. If the song were not to be sung during or after Communion, it might be possible, especially when the words of any song sung actually heard and understood are few in number is considered. Again, there is a huge difference between mere lyricists contending bread is eaten during Holy Communion and Jesus himself affirming twice in JN 6, that He is “The Bread of Life,” and our Catholic song, “I Am the Bread of Life,” which we should be singing, instead.
I have decided to sit this week in the congregation.
 
A first draft of an edited version of Protestant leaning lyrics to a song our choir is singing on Sunday was posted, above. A second draft follows. As before Bold type is Edit, normal type is original.

Think of Me, edited for a Catholic Choir

When you drink My Blood, believe in*** ***me________, the blood shed for you, think of me________

As you come to the table today,________humble be with words that you say. Think of Me.

Break the Body, take and eat; ___Body nailed to the cross, think of Me..

Pray that God’s will be done, let it be.Pray that God’s will be done, let it be___

When you sip from the cup and offer a prayer,___ do this in remembrance of me.__________

*Pray for peace, pray for *union from the Father above. May your heart let me in; think of Me.

When you meet to commune think of Me;___________pour the wine, break the bread, think of Me.________

*As the ***priest renews **God’s pledge made to you,___“This is My Body,”"This is My Blood" -*think of me, think of Me

*Eat His Body, think of Him, **drink His Blood **,__*think of *Him.

This song has the difficulty of speaking unscriptually for Jesus, although, that which is speech of His in The Bible does not have that difficulty.
After reading the original, unedited version and wondering just exactly how how our choir acquied choral scores with another church’s address stamp on them has caused me to decide that the Lyrics are too “Catholic” for them, even though they are too “Protestant” for this Catholic so perhaps we traded copies of Amazing Grace for this.:confused:
 
I wouldn’t get too worked up on this one. Sometimes we say in the Mystery of Faith, “When we eat this bread and drink this cup, we proclaim your death, Lord Jesus, until you come in glory.” This I believe is derived from one of the Epistles. The meaning is not heretical in this context.
 
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