HHS Mandate - What should Catholics do?

[frattura30]

Throughout the history of the church, Christians were forced to denounce Christ or die or some sort of persecution. Today, Catholics mainly are being told to essentially denounce Christ or face a fine.

If Catholic institutions are forced to provide abortifacients in their healthcare plans, what will the Catholic church do moving forward? Closures of hospitals? Clinics? etc?

 

[Cojuanco]

Throughout the history of the church, Christians were forced to denounce Christ or die or some sort of persecution. Today, Catholics mainly are being told to essentially denounce Christ or face a fine.

If Catholic institutions are forced to provide abortifacients in their healthcare plans, what will the Catholic church do moving forward? Closures of hospitals? Clinics? etc?

Probably defy the government to enforce the law. I mean the courts can rack up the fines, but what if they refused to pay them? Are they willing to jail enough personnel to close down a third of the hospital beds in this country?

 

[Catholic1954]

The Church has already closed down all most all Catholic adoption agencies, because they refused to place children with gay couples. I think the same will happen if the government forces the mandate on other Catholic institutions.

 

[Cricket2]

Throughout the history of the church, Christians were forced to denounce Christ or die or some sort of persecution. Today, Catholics mainly are being told to essentially denounce Christ or face a fine.

If Catholic institutions are forced to provide abortifacients in their healthcare plans, what will the Catholic church do moving forward? Closures of hospitals? Clinics? etc?

Actually some have closed.

If any of the Catholic Hospitals and Clinics are receiving funds from the State they might stop taking them, but that probably would shut them down.

What if the Catholic Church developed their own insurance for everyone who is known to be a practicing member in a Parish? But, then I suppose they would still be told they had to provide for abortions etc. Just thinking out loud.

 

[globaljim]

I do not think it is helpful to pose this question in its most extreme form. I would willingly give my life to prevent an abortion - and I believe the Court decision to allow abortions was a very harmful decision. But there is a reason why a present day Supreme Court with six Catholic Judges has not been able to find the way to do this in a secular Nation. It is not as black and white a case as people might think and these are quite conservative judges with the exception of one but I believe even she would oppose.abortion I present this scenario so as
to put the Mandate in proper setting. Catholic Judges have been permitted to grant divorce even in the case of A Catholic marriage because their rulings only effect the secular aspect of marriage -not the Sacrament. It is not helpful to make this into an all or nothing matter for our Faith. Of course, we would refuse to do what is opposed to conscience and defy the Government to punish us for it. We would simply refuse to pay the tax I have friends who have refused to pay taxes as a protest to War. The way I see it .this would be a wonderful way to take a stand for conscience and I am certain the Government would back away very quickly. .The last thing I would ever consider is shutting down our hospitals. That would be the worse possible betrayal of our Gospel mission. If a tiny band of Christians stood up to the Roman Empire and conquered it. Surely millions of Catholic can do the same here. .

 

[globaljim]

I do not think it is helpful to pose this question in its most extreme form. I would willingly give my life to prevent an abortion - and I believe the Court decision to allow abortions was a very harmful decision. But there is a reason why a present day Supreme Court with six Catholic Judges has not been able to find the way to do this in a secular Nation. It is not as black and white a case as people might think and these are quite conservative judges with the exception of one but I believe even she would oppose.abortion I present this scenario so as
to put the Mandate in proper setting. Catholic Judges have been permitted to grant divorce even in the case of A Catholic marriage because their rulings only effect the secular aspect of marriage -not the Sacrament. It is not helpful to make this into an all or nothing matter for our Faith. Of course, we would refuse to do what is opposed to conscience and defy the Government to punish us for it. We would simply refuse to pay the tax I have friends who have refused to pay taxes as a protest to War. The way I see it .this would be a wonderful way to take a stand for conscience and I am certain the Government would back away very quickly. .The last thing I would ever consider is shutting down our hospitals. That would be the worse possible betrayal of our Gospel mission. If a tiny band of Christians stood up to the Roman Empire and conquered it. Surely millions of Catholic can do the same here. .

" The evils of our world – and those of the Church – must not be excuses for diminishing our commitment and our fervour. Let us look upon them as challenges which can help us to grow. With the eyes of faith, we can see the light which the Holy Spirit always radiates in the midst of darkness, never forgetting that “where sin increased, grace has abounded a
all the more" -Pope Francis

 

[Captain_America]

Civil disobedience.

For my part, I’ve written to my representatives and the president. I’ve also complained to the HHS and entered comments onto the regulation comments section.

 

[frattura30]

I do not think it is helpful to pose this question in its most extreme form. I would willingly give my life to prevent an abortion - and I believe the Court decision to allow abortions was a very harmful decision. But there is a reason why a present day Supreme Court with six Catholic Judges has not been able to find the way to do this in a secular Nation. It is not as black and white a case as people might think and these are quite conservative judges with the exception of one but I believe even she would oppose.abortion I present this scenario so as
to put the Mandate in proper setting. Catholic Judges have been permitted to grant divorce even in the case of A Catholic marriage because their rulings only effect the secular aspect of marriage -not the Sacrament. It is not helpful to make this into an all or nothing matter for our Faith. Of course, we would refuse to do what is opposed to conscience and defy the Government to punish us for it. We would simply refuse to pay the tax I have friends who have refused to pay taxes as a protest to War. The way I see it .this would be a wonderful way to take a stand for conscience and I am certain the Government would back away very quickly. .The last thing I would ever consider is shutting down our hospitals. That would be the worse possible betrayal of our Gospel mission. If a tiny band of Christians stood up to the Roman Empire and conquered it. Surely millions of Catholic can do the same here. .

In the early church the Apostles gave their lives to preach what Christ told them. It was nothing or all. In the book of Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego were told they must worship the god that King Nebuchadnezzar made out of gold. Of course we all know the story but they refused to denounce God.

I believe the current administration operates under the very same spirit of King Nebuchadnezzar. I also do believe these attacks against the church will become stronger. The good news is, we know they will not prevail.

I would be curious to know what the Pope will suggest once hospitals, and other institutions close.

 

[JimG]

Follow the example of the Little Sisters of the Poor. Refuse to cooperate. Refuse to cooperate with evil. Refuse to be bullied by the HHS.

 

[anex]

But the thing is the USCCB ( the United States Confrence of Catholic Bishops ) does support the change that our government has done, UP TOO the abortion part only, last I checked these bishops are catholic, so what is it they are trying to tell the rest of us and what is it that they actually do support instead of a full repeal of the law.

I whole heartedly disagree with the USCCB in regards to their only pushing a repeal of the abortion aspect and not supporting for a full repeal of the law itself.

Obviously there needs to be a change but it should not have gone down the way it did, and it is obvious that hoping things will just get better is not the way to go as people have been waiting for upgrades or changes to our health care system.

Our Country is ready for a change, but we still do not know exactly what is in the bill due to its enormous size, and if anything there should be only 2 choices, either Obama keeps his promise that ended in " Period " or we get a full repeal of the law, dissect what is really in the bill and then make take the points that are good, re write it into law with the Promise that was originally given to keep what one has and that one does not have to sign up for government health care if they don’t want it and stick to that promise.

Either that or we are eventually going to see peaceful civil disobedience from Catholic Americans’ turning into only revolting Americans on the president, his administration and the capital itself. But I do not see any more leadership going to come from our Bishops’ or the Vatican on this HHS mandate as they only want to focus on the abortion issue.

If they were that concerned about abortion in the HHS Mandate they should have been just as riled up and working on religious freedom a long time ago to put an end to abortion in America in all 50 states. Not waiting around for the situation to get worse and then speak up about it as if abortion was some new topic.

 

[edwest2]

Lawsuits were filed and continue to be filed.

catholicsentinel.org/main.asp?SectionID=2&subsectionID=34&articleID=18309

Catholic Radio commentator, Al Kresta, directed Catholics to the stopHHS.com web site to learn what to do and why this matter is so important in the recent past. The web site is no longer there but if you google stop HHS, you’ll see that efforts to stop this or get exemptions from those parts that violate our Religious Freedoms are ongoing.

There are others fighting for Religious Liberty.

becketfund.org/top-ten-victories/

Peace,
Ed

 

[Captain_America]

This affects me in two substantial ways:

FIRST, as an American, I DO see a real erosion of liberty in this.

Second, as a Catholic, it seems as though the administration is targeting us.

ALSO, there are some guesses I’ve generated here:

—is this a meta-effort to push Catholic institutions into private hands. . . help consolidate healthcare and thus easier for federal control?

 

[ishii]

Throughout the history of the church, Christians were forced to denounce Christ or die or some sort of persecution. Today, Catholics mainly are being told to essentially denounce Christ or face a fine.

If Catholic institutions are forced to provide abortifacients in their healthcare plans, what will the Catholic church do moving forward? Closures of hospitals? Clinics? etc?

What should Catholics do? Stop voting for the politicians who institute these kinds of laws! Obama was elected with the support of Catholic voters. The Republican party may have its problems, but the Democrat party and Obama don’t deserve any support from Catholics. The problem is that there are so many Catholics in the laity and the clergy who think that 1) Voting Democrat is “helping the poor.” and 2) the Republican party is for the rich.

Until Catholic voters figure this out, things will get worse.

Ishii

 

[GeorgetownGirl]

What should Catholics do? Stop voting for the politicians who institute these kinds of laws! Obama was elected with the support of Catholic voters. The Republican party may have its problems, but the Democrat party and Obama don’t deserve any support from Catholics. The problem is that there are so many Catholics in the laity and the clergy who think that 1) Voting Democrat is “helping the poor.” and 2) the Republican party is for the rich.

Until Catholic voters figure this out, things will get worse.

Ishii

I agree that the government should back down on the HSS mandate for those groups that find it morally wrong.

However, I STRONGLY disagree with your assertion that to be a good Catholic you must
vote Republican.

 

[JB_Dugan]

I agree that the government should back down on the HSS mandate for those groups that find it morally wrong.

However, I STRONGLY disagree with your assertion that to be a good Catholic you must
vote Republican.

GeorgetownGirl:

I would just like to point out the obvious…

Currently the majority of Republicans (Conservatives) seem to support Catholic values, morals and ideals.

It would seem to me that a Republican candidate (for any office) would be a better choice (religiously speaking) than any democrat.

 

[GeorgetownGirl]

GeorgetownGirl:

I would just like to point out the obvious…

Currently the majority of Republicans (Conservatives) seem to support Catholic values, morals and ideals.

It would seem to me that a Republican candidate (for any office) would be a better choice (religiously speaking) than any democrat.

On some issues perhaps. On other issues, like social justice issues, definitely not.

 

[ishii]

I agree that the government should back down on the HSS mandate for those groups that find it morally wrong.

However, I STRONGLY disagree with your assertion that to be a good Catholic you must
vote Republican.

Hi GeorgetownGirl. It goes beyond just the HHS mandate. The Democrat party is morally bankrupt on so many key issues - abortion, gay marriage - so many Democrats are on the wrong side of the issues - even many supporting euthanasia. So while I did not explicitly assert that one must vote Republican to be a good Catholic (those are your words, not mine) I do think Catholics have 3 choices in the upcoming elections: vote for the morally bankrupt Democrat party. Vote for Republicans, who, while far from perfect, at least don’t say “God bless Planned Parenthood” as Obama did. Or they can stay home and do nothing. To me, the choice is obvious.

Ishii

 

[ishii]

On some issues perhaps. On other issues, like social justice issues, definitely not.

Good people can disagree on the social justice issues and still be consistent with Catholic teaching. Not so with the other issues like abortion, gay marriage, etc.

Ishii

 

[Ridgerunner]

The Church has already closed down all most all Catholic adoption agencies, because they refused to place children with gay couples. I think the same will happen if the government forces the mandate on other Catholic institutions.

I think that boat has already sailed over the horizon.

As a Catholic doctor said to me: “There is no such thing as a Catholic hospital anymore.” I think perhaps there are a handful of diocesan hospitals in the east that are probably different, but most Catholic hospitals nowadays are just as secular as any others. I know, for example, a professional who was forced from her job with a “Catholic” hospital clinic because she wouldn’t prescribe birth control drugs. In time, that hospital will provide abortions, if it doesn’t already, and I have no doubt at all of that.

I’m not sure how many “Catholic” universities can still be called genuinely Catholic, but I suspect it’s the minority now. There are a few bright lights among some of the newer ones, though.

The era of the great Catholic institutions in the U.S. is past, and has been past for some time. As with some of the new universities, they can possibly be rebuilt, but when it comes to healthcare, that’s so government controlled that I don’t look for any new, truly Catholic hospitals to spring up.

 

[Ridgerunner]

On some issues perhaps. On other issues, like social justice issues, definitely not.

Since the Democrat party does not promote social justice either, then there’s really not much but more than the issues like abortion and homosexual “marriage” to determine one’s vote.

I’m not a Repub. Never have been. I was a “cradle democrat” and held office in the party. But a person like me had to, at some point, decide whether my political philosophy or my religion was going to drive my behavior. So, I made my choice, and now I’m not affiliated with any party.

But since I saw the worship of abortion on demand from the “inside” and know how utterly pervasive it is, I don’t so much vote “for” Repubs, as “against” the abortion supporting Dems.

But I’ll say too that the Dem party has moved away from any concept of social justice, and does absolutely nothing for the truly poor. So, while my “divorce” from the party was hard long ago, it’s a lot easier now.