Hideous Catechesis

[jmcrae]

What are they required to know before they get confirmed? Before their first reconciliation and first communion, they have to understand the sacrament they are about to receive and at least some basic principles about their faith. It makes sense that they should be able to explain what it is that’s happening, and at least something big about the religion they are being confirmed in.

Before they are Confirmed, they are expected to be able to recite the Gifts of the Holy Spirit, the Fruits of the Holy Spirit, the names of the Seven Sacraments, and identify which three are Sacraments of Initiation, and something about their Patron Saint. Their book contains the information that the Sacrament of Confirmation is a strengthening of the Holy Spirit, and that the oil signifies “strengthening” (hence its use in Baptism and in the Anointing of the Sick).

I understand that you can’t teach an empty room, but you can’t just start passing out sacraments on the corner like an ATM either. These kids have to understand what it is they are standing up and agreeing to, so to speak.

This is where the balancing act comes into play, to make it interesting enough for the kids to come, and also informative for them. But the Bishop doesn’t really test them before they get Confirmed. He does ask them questions, but last year, half my class answered everything wrong (they didn’t show up for the sessions) and they were still Confirmed.

 

[Princess18]

But the Bishop doesn’t really test them before they get Confirmed. He does ask them questions, but last year, half my class answered everything wrong (they didn’t show up for the sessions) and they were still Confirmed.

Sigh :crying:

 

[Shin]

This is where the balancing act comes into play, to make it interesting enough for the kids to come, and also informative for them. But the Bishop doesn’t really test them before they get Confirmed. He does ask them questions, but last year, half my class answered everything wrong (they didn’t show up for the sessions) and they were still Confirmed.

He should have slapped them, and NOT Confirmed them.

 

[ricmat]

I don’t believe that the problem is hideous catechesis, per-se.

I teach 3 high school CCD classes (one First Communion / Reconciliation, and 2 confirmation classes.)

The vast majority (24 out of 25) of the high school kids in my First Communion class have been in church exactly one time before in their life. For baptism. I have an hour per week for perhaps 12 weeks before first reconciliation and another 7-8 weeks before first communion. Good catechesis in those 20 weeks is not enough to prepare these kids. We had first reconciliation a few weeks ago, and the following weekend exactly 1 of the 25 students went to mass. Yes, I’ve been telling them since week 1 about the 3rd commandment and mortal sin.

The majority of my confirmation students have been in church exactly 2 times before in their lives. For baptism, and for first communion. So I guess they’re twice as smart as the first communion bunch.

If the problem is catechesis, it is with catechesis of the parents. WHERE ARE THE PARENTS? If the parents don’t care, if the parents don’t demonstrate the faith, if the parents don’t take the kids to church - improving the quality of catechesis will not be a silver bullet.

Many of these kids and their parents think that their child’s weekly class fulfills their Mass obligation. HELP!!!

Now the rest of you can count your blessings

Please excuse my frustration.

 

[stuart12]

I helped to teach with the RCIA at my parish but got tagged as an ‘extremist’ for saying that missing Mass without an excuse (laziness for example) was a mortal sin.

its a sad time when you can break two of the ten commandments in a one-er and still your act is considered ‘okay’.

 

[jmcrae]

He should have slapped them, and NOT Confirmed them.

And lose them to some easy-believe-it sect, or to outright atheism. I don’t think they would shape up if they were denied the Sacraments; I think they would just quit altogether.

I don’t know what the answer is, but extinguishing the flickering spark of faith is not the answer, I don’t think. It would be nice if there were some sort of tangible consequences for not knowing what’s going on, but for now, we carry on and we do our best to help these people as much as we can.

 

[jmcrae]

I helped to teach with the RCIA at my parish but got tagged as an ‘extremist’ for saying that missing Mass without an excuse (laziness for example) was a mortal sin.

its a sad time when you can break two of the ten commandments in a one-er and still your act is considered ‘okay’.

I feel your pain. I was asked to quit leading RCIA Inquiry because the Inquirers knew more than the Catechist, when they went for Catechesis after the completion of their Inquiry period with me.

I was thinking, “How is that my problem? He should learn his faith.” But I still had to be the one to leave. I’m not sure if they even have an Inquiry period, any more.

 

[stuart12]

I dont know what to do, i feel like there’s no point of me giving my time to be attacked for my orthdoxy which will just be rubbished and contradicted when I am not there.

i want to help out, but it seems hopeless.

those in the RCIA will suffer because of this, and I told the woman that she was putting their souls in danger by not teaching correctly. she did not like that.

 

[jmcrae]

I dont know what to do, i feel like there’s no point of me giving my time to be attacked for my orthdoxy which will just be rubbished and contradicted when I am not there.

i want to help out, but it seems hopeless.

those in the RCIA will suffer because of this, and I told the woman that she was putting their souls in danger by not teaching correctly. she did not like that.

What is the priest like? Is he involved at all in the RCIA process? Does he understand the goals of the process? And is he reasonably orthodox, himself? If “yes” to these, I’d ask his advice, what you should do.

 

[stuart12]

both of our priests are very friendly and they have announced that they are going to make sure everything they do and say is entirely orthodox. from what i have noticed, they have not been far wrong with that one. the pastor tries to please everyone though and is quite indecisive. He is a very holy priest, with a great nature and patience, but the lay people control a lot.

 

[Shin]

both of our priests are very friendly and they have announced that they are going to make sure everything they do and say is entirely orthodox. from what i have noticed, they have not been far wrong with that one. the pastor tries to please everyone though and is quite indecisive. He is a very holy priest, with a great nature and patience, but the lay people control a lot.

That is a very fatal flaw for a priest, that indecisive, please everybody, lack of taking responsibility and authority. I pray he learns his vocation is one of authority and responsibility for delivering truths and doing deeds that pain the worldly as well as please the soul… or he may not even save his own however holy he is!

Ave Maria. . .

 

[stuart12]

Yeah I understand that. I am at university in Edinburgh just now, hoping to move to the city next year, therefore I will probably change my parish - to the FSSP one

Let us all pray for our priests, that they may be strong in this uncertain age, and provide a self-giving service for the Lord’s Church.

 

[BSHoop96]

I was wondering if people out there have a similar experience to me with getting their 2nd graders ready for the sacraments. My wife and I have put our first 3 daughters through our church’s program with some muscle added at home. One of my daughters said that they barely took any time learning about the Eucharist and never learned anything but it being a community meal. They also learned what to do at their first communion, but not that the mass is a bloodless sacrifice. In fact, she said they spent a good part of their year learning about Noah.
I recently had a discussion with the leader of all our religious ed. programs, which concerns around 6-7 churches in our parish, and an elementary Catholic school. She said, “we don’t teach about purgatory anymore because it scares the kids. Besides, purgatory doesn’t exist.” I responded with a quote by Christ Himself about settling with your opponent on the way to prison, and not being released until you’ve paid the last penny. She replied that no one can tell what the authors of the Bible intended because it was written so long ago.
Needless to say, I was disgusted and we now conduct our religious ed. at home!

Is ccd for the young a disaster elsewhere as it is in my neck of the woods?

Please for the sake of the future of our Church speak to someone higher up about this woman being in charge of “teaching” our young people.

 

[Shin]

Yeah I understand that. I am at university in Edinburgh just now, hoping to move to the city next year, therefore I will probably change my parish - to the FSSP one

Let us all pray for our priests, that they may be strong in this uncertain age, and provide a self-giving service for the Lord’s Church.

Yes we must pray and support them in their good works and needful tasks in word and deed!

That being said, if you do change, you cannot do better than FSSP in these times. No better! Deo gratias for the FSSP.

 

[stuart12]

Yes we must pray and support them in their good works and needful tasks in word and deed!

That being said, if you do change, you cannot do better than FSSP in these times. No better! Deo gratias for the FSSP.

because of the problems with the trains and the difficulty getting to their Masses on sundays, I have only been able to attend twice.

the first homily was on hell.
the second homily was on how liberals (in austria/germany) were destroying the Church and how we needed to pray continually for the Pope to stand up for orthodoxy.
in the same Mass, he also preached on penance

 

[Shin]

because of the problems with the trains and the difficulty getting to their Masses on sundays, I have only been able to attend twice.

the first homily was on hell.
the second homily was on how liberals (in austria/germany) were destroying the Church and how we needed to pray continually for the Pope to stand up for orthodoxy.
in the same Mass, he also preached on penance

Well you can tell I love them because of the audio homilies linked below!

 

[Princess18]

Personally, I got excited about my faith when my priest showed me that our faith is more about celebration than punishment. Think of the words we use with weekly service … we celebrate Mass. All the sacraments are happy events. Baptism, washing away uncleanliness. Reconciliation, removing sin and freeing us. Communion, being able to share in the Body and Blood of our Lord. Confirmation, being filled with the Holy Spirit. (you get the idea). There’s nothing approximating “here, take your ball and chain and welcome to the punishment of being Catholic”.

God wants to share his love with us and for us to be happy, and that makes me excited to learn all I can about it … we have to figure out a way to make young people excited too. Not that we hide the hard times, but the hard times are what make it good.

:yup:

 

[jazzy_987]

I was wondering if people out there have a similar experience to me with getting their 2nd graders ready for the sacraments. My wife and I have put our first 3 daughters through our church’s program with some muscle added at home. One of my daughters said that they barely took any time learning about the Eucharist and never learned anything but it being a community meal. They also learned what to do at their first communion, but not that the mass is a bloodless sacrifice. In fact, she said they spent a good part of their year learning about Noah.
I recently had a discussion with the leader of all our religious ed. programs, which concerns around 6-7 churches in our parish, and an elementary Catholic school. She said, “we don’t teach about purgatory anymore because it scares the kids. Besides, purgatory doesn’t exist.” I responded with a quote by Christ Himself about settling with your opponent on the way to prison, and not being released until you’ve paid the last penny. She replied that no one can tell what the authors of the Bible intended because it was written so long ago.
Needless to say, I was disgusted and we now conduct our religious ed. at home!

Is ccd for the young a disaster elsewhere as it is in my neck of the woods?

Well, I remember that when I was in Grade 8, we went on a Confirmation retreat. We were talking about the sacraments and the priest asked us about why the Eucharist was important and what the Eucharist was. Then he made us raise up our hands and vote… about half voted that the Eucharist was just symbolic. =( And then Father took quite a bit of time to explain transubstantiation to us and a lot of people were shocked.

 

[palmas85]

I dont know what to do, i feel like there’s no point of me giving my time to be attacked for my orthdoxy which will just be rubbished and contradicted when I am not there.

i want to help out, but it seems hopeless.

those in the RCIA will suffer because of this, and I told the woman that she was putting their souls in danger by not teaching correctly. she did not like that.

My friend, I fought this exact same battle for over twenty years. Twenty years, I made sure that I kept all my certifications current, made sure that everything I taught was correct and complete and behind the scenes never let the DRE and the head of RCIA off the hook for one second. Not one.

Each and every time they stepped over the line, I was right there. I had printouts of every essential doctrine and dogma of the Church, adjusted for the age group that we were dealing with. If there was a problem, it was corrected at the lowest level possible and if that meant going to the Bishop, then that is where I went.

I took my role very seriously and would not let them run the program into the ground or introduce new concepts, heresies and personal opinions in the place of facts. At first they howled and wailed like wounded sheep. But when they saw that I was not going to back down and they could not get rid of me, they essentially stopped pushing the new age ideas that they were so fond of except in my absences. But even then, I would usually get a call if something didn’t sound right.

One thing that I did, was provide anyone in RCIA that wanted one, a Catechism, both the current and an updated Baltimore and when they came out a copy of the Compendum. Another was to talk with any person, Catechuman or cCandidate at any time, day or night that I was able to.

The DRE and the RCIA director hated it, but what could they do? It pretty much threw a monkey wrench into their whole program and so for about my last five or six years on the team we enjoyed a truce of sorts. Since I have gone, who knows what happened. I pray that they have kept the nonsense down to a minimum but who can say?

The point is, it takes a lot to stand alone in the face of criticism, of having your motives and orthodoxy and knowledge questioned. It isn’t easy. Sometimes you just want to quit and walk away. It’s easier.

AND

You have to be right. It can’t be your personal opinion. It has to be 100% factual. Everything that you present. No it isn’t real easy or a lot of fun in many cases.

But I believe it was worth it then and I think if you are willing to stand firm and take these people on in the fight for orthodoxy in the faith, it will be worth it now,

 

[loida]

I have reservations about approaching the parish priest. Although he is a good guy and a decent priest, he is not known for adherence to orthodoxy. He once called Father Corapi a “moron.” I happen to like Father Corapi for his orthodox, no compromise stance.

On the other hand, our bishop, Bishop Malone, is a really good guy.

That is a highly inappropiate thing to say. Especially from one priest about another very highly respectable priest. However, I think that this issue definitely needs to be adressed to the parish priest for the main fact that she is not doing her job correctly. And that job as Director of Religious Education is to educate students on everything our Church teaches, which includes purgatory and the Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist!