High-Church Lutheranism

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Belcanto said:
That is correct. Fr. Christopher Phillips at Our Lady of the Atonement is one example. Alex Jones, a convert from Pentecotalism, is another.

Pax Tecum,
Jay
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Ahh, yes, OLOA, a wonderful, worshipful experience!!🙂
 
Belcanto said:
Do you have a link to a website of an Anglo-Catholic parish, by any chance? BTW, have you ever heard of the Anglican Use Liturgy? It’s sadly rare in the US, and I have heard that the English Catholic hierarchy have bluntly said that there will be no Anglican Use in England. Our Lady of the Atonement is the most famous Anglican Use parish that I’m aware of:

atonementonline.com

Pax Tecum,
Jay
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It is also the first of its kind…and about 1 month older than me (I am twenty-three years of age).
 
Belcanto said:
I know that there’s at least one Lutheran on this board, so maybe you can shed some light on a particular subject. What are the services in the “high-church” wing of Lutheranism like? Do they include the sign of the cross? Are they pretty common among Lutheran churches, or are they relatively rare these days?

The reason I ask is that I found an interesting paper from Rolf Preus, a conservative Missouri Synod pastor. Here’s a selection:

"I don’t think that I overstate matters when I say that the worship wars in the Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod have resulted in greater bitterness and frustration during the past two decades than did the controversy over biblical inerrancy of the previous two decades. What happens on a Sunday morning in their own congregation matters more to people than what theologians in a distant city are arguing about. People expect that when they go to church certain things will happen. Certain words will be said. Certain actions will be followed. I am talking about such things as confession and absolution, singing the Kyrie followed by the Gloria in Excelsis, listening to the lessons, and confessing the Creed. This is what has happened and this is what folks expect to happen. Hymns will be sung. A man wearing a robe and standing in a Pulpit will preach a sermon based on a text from the Bible. You will sing the familiar psalms and canticles of the church, pray the Lord’s Prayer, kneel at the Lord’s Altar and eat and drink Christ’s body and blood. You will not leave before hearing the words of the Aaronic Benediction that leave you will the assurance that the God who just served you with his holy word and sacrament now gives you his peace. What takes place on Sunday morning will make you feel at home because what takes place will put you where you have met God in the past and have come to know him. You have talked to God and heard him talk to you. This is what you are looking for. This is why you go to church.

“And now you go to church and everything is different. You go expecting to find something that is no longer there. Perhaps it’s the singing of the Kyrie. Or maybe the Creed is replaced by a homemade version of it that isn’t really very good. Instead of a sermon, there is a kind of chancel drama. The familiar canticles are gone. The Lutheran chorales have given way to shallow and repetitious “praise” songs. The Benediction is replaced by a rather lengthy exhortation to be whatever kind of Christian is in vogue for the season. You don’t want to criticize. You wonder if your expectations were a bit unreasonable. After all, there must be many different ways of worshipping God. The Bible doesn’t actually set down for the church of the New Testament detailed instructions on what to do on a Sunday morning. And if such instructions aren’t laid down in the Scriptures and if the Scriptures alone are to be for us the norm and judge of all doctrine and practice in the church, why should you complain if you must endure change? Perhaps you’re just being old fashioned. Still, you have the definite sense that something important is gone and you want it back. Church is no longer home.”

christforus.org/Papers/Content/LutheranWorshipWars.html

Any thoughts from the Lutherans out there?

Pax Tecum,
Jay
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I do not like the way they have changed the church service. I liked the old way and its the same with others in my family. Unfortunatly it seems to be the norm where I come from. Everyone talks about the contempory service like they just discovered electricity. I now go to a different denomination but if I could not find one that was traditional I would just stop going.
 
prv said:
Ahh, yes, OLOA, a wonderful, worshipful experience!!🙂
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Yes, it is. I had the privelege of attending Mass there 4 years ago when I did my student teaching in San Antonio. After my student teaching ended, I attended OLOA semi-regularly, but it’s been a couple of years since I’ve been there. It really is a little miracle. When did you go?
 
Belcanto said:
Interesting that they call their service “Holy Mass.” Very interesting church, and in terms of liturgy and rubrics, it rivals all but a handful of Catholic churches.

Pax Tecum,
Jay
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This Lutheran Church has confession also. You are correct. I think it’s more beautiful than most Catholic Churches I’ve been in.
 
Belcanto said:
Do you have a link to a website of an Anglo-Catholic parish, by any chance? BTW, have you ever heard of the Anglican Use Liturgy? It’s sadly rare in the US, and I have heard that the English Catholic hierarchy have bluntly said that there will be no Anglican Use in England. Our Lady of the Atonement is the most famous Anglican Use parish that I’m aware of:

atonementonline.com

Pax Tecum,
Jay
Click to expand...
This Church is beautiful. I also read through the order of Mass. I wish I could go there. Both the Church and the Mass seem better than most I’ve been to.🙂
 
Belcanto said:
Yes, it is. I had the privelege of attending Mass there 4 years ago when I did my student teaching in San Antonio. After my student teaching ended, I attended OLOA semi-regularly, but it’s been a couple of years since I’ve been there. It really is a little miracle. When did you go?
Click to expand...
I enrolled in the parish registry the day or two after I started attending, about 7-9 weeks ago.
 
Belcanto said:
I know that there’s at least one Lutheran on this board, so maybe you can shed some light on a particular subject. What are the services in the “high-church” wing of Lutheranism like? Do they include the sign of the cross? Are they pretty common among Lutheran churches, or are they relatively rare these days?

The reason I ask is that I found an interesting paper from Rolf Preus, a conservative Missouri Synod pastor. Here’s a selection:

Any thoughts from the Lutherans out there?

Pax Tecum,
Jay
Click to expand...
Where I come from, high-church-services are becoming quite popular and have been for a while now. They might very well include the sign of the cross, and are generally similar to a Catholic mass. I enjoy both “high-church” services and “low-church” services (similar to the pentecostal), both are accepted as various forms of praising God within my Lutheran Church.
 
Im Catholic but I know the Church of Sweden (Sweden’s version of the Church of England only lutheran) are very very high church and they still call their Sunday services “mass” and they still have an historic apostolic succesion episcopate (not valid though). They also still have statues and paintings in their older churches.
 
Here’s one to look at in Minneapolis, an ELCA congregation known for being musical, liturgical and welcoming. www.mountolivechurch.org

Organ, processional cross, full on liturgy, chanting the psalms, kneelers, incense, congregation makes the sign of the cross and bow to the eucharistic elements when elevated. Dynamic singing and the congregation can sight read four part hymnody.

This is my first post, I have read many other threads with great interest and appreciate this site immensely.
 
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