"High tech Mass"

[dshix]

I’m sorry. It did seem like a drive-by post. I didn’t mean it to be a hit and should have explained what I meant. I’m sorry if I upset you.

Several people on this thread said that the purpose of Mass is prayer. I am disagreeing with that. I am saying that the purpose of Mass is worship, not prayer.

Worship and prayer are not the same thing. Many non-Catholics assume that we worship Mary because we pray to Mary but they are not the same thing.

We owe God worship. It is his by right. When we withhold something which belongs to someone else by right, it is an injustice. To not worship God is an injustice to God. That is why the Church, as God’s authority on earth, has the right to tell us what the minimum requirement for worship is - Sundays and holy days of obligation.

Mass satisfies the requirement that we worship God. Its primary function is to render worship. I can pray anywhere but that does not fulfill my obligation to worship.

-Tim-

Ha, fear not, it takes much more than that to upset me. I was just somewhat puzzled.

Thank you for the distinction; you are correct. What I was getting at with previous posts is that the mass IS a prayer the purpose of which is to give worship to God. I didn’t say exactly that before your clarification, since I was responding to other issues.

All of the aspects of the mass, the music, lighting, “smells and bells,” are ordered to perfect and direct the prayer of the mass to as to give even greater glory to God.

 

[englishredrose]

Smoke effect is called incense in church I thought - thruible gives of plenty at times

 

[phil19034]

Instead of Lasers, videos, etc… how about a good choir singing LATIN CHANTS???

Some of the MOST BEAUTIFUL music ever written in human history are Latin Church Chants and Hymns

 

[JPUSC]

I just came across an article that reports on a travelling priest in Germany who has developed his own form of Holy Mass. He calls that project “Veni!” (Which looks like Latin in meaningless grammar) and aims it at young people to bring them back to Mass.

In those services, the priest includes videos, light-effects and smoke/fog machines. In some churches, he even put carpets and couches. Apparently, this sort of thing is going well with people, he says.

What do you think of such Masses? Are they permitted?

Where’s the article? I want to go.

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

There is a place for loud music, strobe lights, mirrored balls, smoke machines, and pyrotechnics. They call it the Parish Hall.

 

[sumusresnovarum]

The best reply since my last was regarding the slippery slope, which is often a logical fallacy and not a true response to the point. No one has yet responded to the point accurately which is: why can we not have couches and true worship of the sacrifice of the mass? I work with high school youth for a living, and while I can defend the mass and explain it to them, it is a ridiculous thought to say that I should tell them all to simply submit to the axiom that “it’s just the way it is, now kneel with the rest of us.”

Much of my job involves convincing kids why the Church is correct, knowledgeable, reasonable, etc. Mass is defensible easily. Incense and Latin exclusively or even normatively? Not so much. Many of the trappings we associate with being proper to mass are historical accidents (in the Thomistic sense), not essential parts. I see no contradiction between rock or upbeat music, a more relaxed setting, and things like youth-specific homilies and a reverent sacrifice of the mass. Far more has to do with intentionality and catechesis than with the actual presentation.

 

[YoungTradCath]

The best reply since my last was regarding the slippery slope, which is often a logical fallacy and not a true response to the point. No one has yet responded to the point accurately which is: why can we not have couches and true worship of the sacrifice of the mass? I work with high school youth for a living, and while I can defend the mass and explain it to them, it is a ridiculous thought to say that I should tell them all to simply submit to the axiom that “it’s just the way it is, now kneel with the rest of us.”

Much of my job involves convincing kids why the Church is correct, knowledgeable, reasonable, etc. Mass is defensible easily. Incense and Latin exclusively or even normatively? Not so much. Many of the trappings we associate with being proper to mass are historical accidents (in the Thomistic sense), not essential parts. I see no contradiction between rock or upbeat music, a more relaxed setting, and things like youth-specific homilies and a reverent sacrifice of the mass. Far more has to do with intentionality and catechesis than with the actual presentation.

Well, it may be a logical fallacy, but it works. If you want couches and Metallica (or soft rock if it is more to your liking) at Mass, then I want pizza and a movie showing at Mass while Father is over there in the sanctuary consecrating.

It is not “ridiculous” to tell them to just submit. It is far more ridiculous that they will not. I am not saying that you should in fact tell them to just submit, or that it will work, because it will not, but what is ridiculous is this pervasive idea that we should accommodate to the hypothetical limit of human ability.

 

[sumusresnovarum]

Well, it may be a logical fallacy, but it works. If you want couches and Metallica (or soft rock if it is more to your liking) at Mass, then I want pizza and a movie showing at Mass while Father is over there in the sanctuary consecrating.

It is not “ridiculous” to tell them to just submit. It is far more ridiculous that they will not. I am not saying that you should in fact tell them to just submit, or that it will work, because it will not, but what is ridiculous is this pervasive idea that we should accommodate to the hypothetical limit of human ability.

The slippery slope does not work. Inculturating the music and art of contemporary times is well within the realm of completely acceptable, whether you agree with it or not. That you see these things as distasteful is just that, a matter of taste. Accommodating is a far different matter, wherein we would give individuals a choice and degree of what they want at mass. But having a more accessible mass is well within tradition and the rules.

It is not ridiculous that they don’t blindly submit, nor should it be. We help them understand that it is reasonable and proper to worship God, right and just. But we don’t have to sell them on incense, necessarily.