His children don't want us to marry

[Evania]

I guess I worded my statement carelessly. I love the girls as if they were mine. If God doesn’t bless me with a biological child, loving them is enough for me. I love them all enough to not be the reason their relationship is destroyed. You’re absolutely right.

You sound like your heart is in the right place. I know it’s hard to see the situation clearly when you’re right in the thick of it. This is why you need to move out and really see it for what it is. A lot of people are seeing that there are red flags everywhere. You have a girl who lost her mother, another girl who is very sick, and a man who needs to learn to be a father to his existing kids before he takes a new wife and creates new children. I understand that you want to do the right thing. The only way you’re going to get God’s blessing on your plans is if you follow His Plans, and that is to stop the cohabitation. You mentioned that you’re in your mid-thirties and that you want to have your own natural children. There’s nothing wrong with wanting these things! However, if the foundation of this man’s relationship with his kids isn’t built and made strong, I can foresee a very unhappy future.

 

[LucyLuvs]

OK, fair question. Once you move out, then what?

There’s no easy answer. But the most important thing is for the dad to spend time with his daughters. I know finances can be hard, but the fact that they’re away from him so many nights a week right now is not great. I’d look at that for starters. But let’s assume there’s no easy solution to that issue. What about when they are there with him? Well, like I said, I think you should stay away to a degree and let the three of them be a family together. Just spending that time together is the most important thing.

Also, I think the dad needs to take on more of the parenting role. The daughter’s comments about the grandparents being like the parents now is her way of saying this. She wants a dad who will be, well, a dad. Be a strong father. Take control. Set limits and boundaries. A child of 11 needs discipline in her life. The discipline of our parents helps us feel secure, in a safe space. He is probably very afraid to do this, because he won’t want to be the bad guy and like others said, the daughter is no doubt playing dad and grandparents off each other. This is because she wants dad’s attention. If she gets it, and gets a dad who will be a rock for her, she’ll begin to heal. And that is good for you.

There are probably other practical ways to help. Dad probably needs some help in taking on a stronger fatherly role. Perhaps some counselling could help, whether professional counselling or with a trusted priest, or both. There are courses and books about such things. So your role may be largely to help your fiance. Less directly in terms of contact with the girls, but more in support. He’ll need to vent and seek advise, and you can give that if you’re a little less directly involved.

And like I said earlier, backing off to give them space would still leave you plenty of time to be together, date, etc. Most nights of the week you’d still have him to yourself. I just think on the nights the girls are there, they need him to themselves. At least for now.

Anyway, that’s just my opinion. It is truly offered from the heart.

Well said. Thank you.

 

[SlackerCatholic]

I thought I was pretty clear when I said you should move out, leave this family alone to heal, and find someone else who is ready, available, and able to be your husband and father of your children. This guy isn’t. Nor should he be, with what’s going on in his life.

 

[LucyLuvs]

You sound like your heart is in the right place. I know it’s hard to see the situation clearly when you’re right in the thick of it. This is why you need to move out and really see it for what it is. A lot of people are seeing that there are red flags everywhere. You have a girl who lost her mother, another girl who is very sick, and a man who needs to learn to be a father to his existing kids before he takes a new wife and creates new children. I understand that you want to do the right thing. The only way you’re going to get God’s blessing on your plans is if you follow His Plans, and that is to stop the cohabitation. You mentioned that you’re in your mid-thirties and that you want to have your own natural children. There’s nothing wrong with wanting these things! However, if the foundation of this man’s relationship with his kids isn’t built and made strong, I can foresee a very unhappy future.[A/QUOTE]
Also good advise thank you

 

[Xantippe]

“Moving out seems to be the only answer anyone has other than, “it will work itself out” after that. He doesn’t know how to relate to his daughters and I’m asking for him.”

Maybe it won’t work itself out. But, as a Russian physics teacher friend of mine liked to say, a negative result is also a result. If it doesn’t work out with you outside the home, it won’t work out with you in the home.

By the way, isn’t your proposed wedding date fairly close to when the younger daughter may be dying? Of course nobody knows at this point how long she will live, but that timing seems particularly unfortunate. That’s the sort of thing that the older daughter would hold against you and over her father’s head for a long time, if not forever.

Here’s are some suggestions for your wedding. 1) Move out. 2) Do your marriage prep with your priest. 3) Figure out how to do a small, festive wedding on short notice that won’t cause excessive stress.

Couples counseling for you and your fiance on how to parent together would be a good idea, too.

 

[thomasf]

Plain and simple: I wouldn’t be even thinking about marrying this dude until he sorted out his personal life with his kids. To ignore those problems and just get married any way is a recipe for disaster. His first responsibility is to those kids, and he shouldn’t even think of getting married until that sorts out.

 

[LucyLuvs]

I just want everyone to know that the child with cancer is thankfully stable. She has surpassed the doctors expectations and is no longer on a life expectancy anymore. Of course, that can change at any time, as we all know, but she’s been figuring this cancer since she has been 18 months. She will be 10 this year and she’s as strong as ever, thank God.

 

[VivienneJ]

LucyLoves, I come into this discussion with the background of having suddenly and traumatically become the single mom to my daughters who were then 11 and 13; the 13 year old being with her father when he died.

Becoming a single parent family and learning how to relate to each other was probably the most difficult thing I have faced in my life. Looking back now (more than 18 years have passed) there was no space for any kind of live-in partner in those early years BUT there was a huge space for reliable friends who could fill some of the roles traditionally taken by, in our case, a father. I think in particular of one friend who spent many weekends along with his children who were the same age as mine. Popular myth in the small town was that we would marry, however this was not the case, but I truly appreciated this friend, who had known my husband, being part of our lives at this time.

I’m thinking of the older daughter in your set-up. She has experienced more than most young girls her age. Her little sister has been ill with cancer for most of her life and her mom died suddenly and unexpectedly. Both are huge for a child her age to deal with, and each one may well result in the kind of ‘acting out’ you describe.

As a result of the manner of my husband’s death, my elder daughter needed a tremendous amount of counselling and support - this she received to the exclusion, much of the time, of her younger sister. In hindsight my younger daughter was somewhat neglected at times, and also acted out.

Please, take a step back. It is great that there seems to be great acceptance of you by much of this family. But, move out of your fiance’s house, God will be faithful with respect to the financial implications of this, continue to be involved in the lives of the family, but give this hurting, confused 11 year old the space to find her place in her father’s life.

 

[Denise1957]

I didn’t say it wasn’t helpful. I said its been said over and fad. Once I’ve moved out…then what? That’s the question. No one can get past that. Moving out seems to be the only answer anyone has other than, “it will work itself out” after that. He doesn’t know how to relate to his daughters and I’m asking for him. I don’t care so much about the judging part, if I did, as I said before, I wouldn’t have been so open about the cohabitation to begin with. Its just frustrating that so many comments have something irrelevant and even mean to say in a community that should be loving. I came for support, not to be thrown down a flight of stairs. I’m already down. But maybe everyone hasn’t read all the posts like I have.

I’m sorry that you feel that the cohabitation comments have been unhelpful and irrelevant. But given that it’s a Catholic forum, these comments are to be expected. The Catholic Church has these rules for a reason - they are based on God’s law. The aren’t just some arbitrary law designed to control people. There are sound reasons for them, which is why Catholics are going to call you on this issue. That’s just how it is.

No one here can say exactly what will happen if you move out. but you might consider the matter prayerfully. Ask God what to do. He’s your best guide. Move out, and depend on God. You obviously have a big heart and much love to give. God instilled this ability in us, so that we can love Him and other people.

 

[JackieMom]

I thought I was pretty clear when I said you should move out, leave this family alone to heal, and find someone else who is ready, available, and able to be your husband and father of your children. This guy isn’t. Nor should he be, with what’s going on in his life.

Actually I agree with this. Move out (soon, like within the week), end the romance, be a good friend to the family and supportive to the girls, and find a man who is AVAILABLE for serious dating, marriage and parenthood. I

 

[thomasf]

I will tell you what happens when you move out. You insist that he works on his relationship with his daughters. If he doesn’t know how to communicate with them then he needs to go to counseling with them and find out what the problem is. He needs to sort that out first and foremost. And then you take a step back and let him do that. If you aren’t willing to do that, or if you absolutely can’t wait, then that’s a sign of trouble on the horizon. If you love this guy and want this relationship to work, and for you all to be a family, this HAS to be sorted out first. You can’t just push forward and hope it sorts itself out. I suspect the issue is the girls don’t live with him, he’s farmed them out to the wife’s grandparents and the girls feel left out. And then to see him living with another woman, and planning a life with her while they live with grandma and grandpa? That’s got to hurt them bad. He needs to sort that out, get them back into the house with him.

I’m telling you this out of experience. I moved into the house with my now-wife’s girls before we were married, and there were a lot of issues with them that we went through. Her daughter at one point was living with her grandmother as well and didn’t like me being around. It took a lot to work things out with her, and I wish that had happened before the move in. That took its toll on my relationship with my wife. I gaurantee you if you don’t sort the daughter thing out now, it’s not just going to go away. Getting married and starting a family with him while they live at grandma and grandpa isn’t going to help at all. Move out, give him time to sort out that situation, THEN consider getting married. Otherwise, the marriage isn’t going to be happy or healthy.

 

[Kal2012]

Yeah - I totally get why people move in for financial reasons. It just makes sense in a lot of ways and it won’t be easy to untangle everything.

However, you could rent a house or an apartment close by and still be available for the girls and be close to the dad.

I totally understand the desire to have your own kids, but please don’t let that cloud your decision to marry into this family.

I can also see how the older girl could be totally jealous of what’s going on. Dad has a girlfriend. Her sister has cancer, so it seems like (from the older girls perspective) that a lot of people pay more attention to the younger girl than her. Kids just aren’t rational and they are selfish.

She sees the attention and doesn’t care about the why these things are important or have value.

Adults will say, “wow! I love spending time with my girlfriend/boyfriend - they are just a great person and just the most wonderful person - ever! I can’t get enough time w/this person!”

A kid will think “wow! Dad spends all this time w/girlfriend. Why doesn’t he seem interested in me?”

Adults will say “my kid has to see a lot of doctors because I’d like to see my kid be healthy.”

A kid will think “I want some of that attention/time too!”

The fact that there’s a major illness really doesn’t matter. And, it doesn’t matter if it’s attention for a good or bad reason. It doesn’t matter if it’s hugs or yelling. All that matters is the attention and the fact that someone’s paying attention.

Life is tough when you feel like everyone ignores you and you feel like you have to fight for someone to pay attention to you. It’s very lonely, regardless of how many people are physically in the room with you.

The kid probably doesn’t even really know how to articulate what I just wrote, but that’s what she probably feels. However, thanks to a lot of therapy, I know what I was feeling and I’m guessing what she’s feeling is pretty similar.

I just wanted to share that because adults view problems very differently than kids and their perspective on the world really is all about them.

I remember that my grandma had a heart attack on my birthday one year.

I felt bad…especially because everyone forgot my birthday.

Don’t get me wrong: I felt bad for grandma. Nobody wants their grandma to die. But the real tragedy of the day was that people forgot “all about my day”. (Did I mention my birthday is 6 days before Christmas?)

These days, I understand that it was a bad reaction, but I was 11, maybe? I don’t quite remember, but, as an adult, I still can’t believe that was my first reaction. Talk about selfish! I mean, grandma had a heart attack and seriously could have died! I totally didn’t get it at that age. All I saw was that my birthday was seriously screwed up and that it wasn’t going to be a happy day.

If that doesn’t give anyone perspective on how tween thought patterns are just screwed up, in general, then I don’t know what will.

Good luck to you.
Jo

 

[mayxanh]

I’m telling you this out of experience. I moved into the house with my now-wife’s girls before we were married, and there were a lot of issues with them that we went through. Her daughter at one point was living with her grandmother as well and didn’t like me being around. It took a lot to work things out with her, and I wish that had happened before the move in. That took its toll on my relationship with my wife. I gaurantee you if you don’t sort the daughter thing out now, it’s not just going to go away. Getting married and starting a family with him while they live at grandma and grandpa isn’t going to help at all. Move out, give him time to sort out that situation, THEN consider getting married. Otherwise, the marriage isn’t going to be happy or healthy.

Thomas, I apologize for my curiosity. I have never found myself in a situation similar to that of the OP, so I cannot provide her with a convincing opinion.

As you mention to your own experience and recommend her to move out, I am curious to know if this is also from your own experience? You may not answer if you feel not like to.

Thank you.

 

[LucyLuvs]

I want you all to know that I have moved out of MY OWN HOUSE to keep this family from having no place to go…today. This wasn’t a family home, it was my home. Thanks for your concern. I really don’t need any convincing as I have said numerous times. I hope that was fast enough.

 

[thomasf]

Thomas, I apologize for my curiosity. I have never found myself in a situation similar to that of the OP, so I cannot provide her with a convincing opinion.

As you mention to your own experience and recommend her to move out, I am curious to know if this is also from your own experience? You may not answer if you feel not like to.

Thank you.

We had problems with my wife’s oldest daughter, and it was a strain on our relationship. But my now-wife stood with me and we addressed the issue. Had she not, and if the situation was obviously not going to get better, I would have moved out and let her work out the issue with her daughter on her own first. Thankfully, we were able to work on it as a couple and solved the problem. Had it been an issue with me, where the kids were insistent that we not get married, or if it was obvious that my wife was neglecting them to be with me, I wouldn’t have stayed. In fact, I insisted that she work out her relationship with her daughters and put them first.

Now, at the time I was not following the faith and I never considered cohabiting to be an issue. I would not recommend that now.

 

[mayxanh]

LucyLuvs.

Here are my sincere advices. There four things need to be CHANGED RIGHT NOW:

1/ Your fiance
2/ His daughter
3/ His ex-wife’s parents
4/ Yourself

Apparently, you cannot (and none of us here can help you with it) change other people. This is something completely out of your control. All you can do is pray and wait until they are willing to change themselves. All we can do to support you is to pray for you. That’s all.

At most, the only thing you can do is to change yourself. And there is no other better way to do it is through praying and listening to God’s will. None of us here can tell you what God wants you to do, specifically in your current situation.

Be patient and keep your faith tight in God because “that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?” (John 11:40)

Here is my story: Back then, I lost my faith in God and I did make a big mess with the family of my fiance, now my husband (more specifically, his sisters, my fiance loves his sisters dearly). The more I wanted to resolve the problem by myself, the more serious became the mess. Finally, I regained my faith and gave up everything in the hand of God.

Believe or not, since that moment, everything was gradually and miraculously smoothened out because “He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it” (Matthew 10:39)

We all love you and pray for you. Please have no doubt in it

 

[thomasf]

I want you all to know that I have moved out of MY OWN HOUSE to keep this family from having no place to go…today. This wasn’t a family home, it was my home. Thanks for your concern. I really don’t need any convincing as I have said numerous times. I hope that was fast enough.

I’m sorry for your problems, and I’m sorry that you find yourself in this situation. However, you’re much better off stopping now, giving it some time to work out, and helping to solve the issue. Rather than going forward and compounding the problem and having something worse happen later.

 

[Xantippe]

“I want you all to know that I have moved out of MY OWN HOUSE to keep this family from having no place to go…today. This wasn’t a family home, it was my home. Thanks for your concern. I really don’t need any convincing as I have said numerous times. I hope that was fast enough.”

I thought you moved into their house originally? I think that was the impression we were all operating under. If it was your home, that rather changes things.

Good for you that you’ve moved out. This isn’t just a question of some sort of weird, unfair Catholic rules–it’s mainstream marriage advice that single parents need to prioritize their kids and move extremely slowly in introducing a prospective spouse to their children. Parents aren’t identical widgets. When the mom widget dies, you can’t just order up a replacement mom widget and pop her into the family to keep it running. (That sounds like a duh! piece of advice, but from this thread, it sounds like a lot of dads have made that mistake.)

 

[SlackerCatholic]

He and I began dating about 6 months later. Yes, it was soon, I met the children about 9 months after their mother passed and moved in shortly after, with the encouragement of the children because I lived over an hour away. I recently found out that at the last minute, the older child said she changed her mind and didn’t want me to move in

At what point do you let a hurting child win?.

I want you all to know that I have moved out of MY OWN HOUSE to keep this family from having no place to go…today. This wasn’t a family home, it was my home. Thanks for your concern. I really don’t need any convincing as I have said numerous times. I hope that was fast enough.

buzzer

You’re angry at us for not giving you what you want, and you’ve been angry at her for a long time. Now she just won, and you are livid and making stuff up to garner sympathy you don’t deserve. You’re a piece of work and should be kept away from these children, both of them, because you just want what you want regardless of whom it destroys.

 

[VivienneJ]

I was going to say something else, but I’m confused, this:

… I met the children about 9 months after their mother passed and moved in shortly after, with the encouragement of the children because I lived over an hour away. …

…seems to contradict this:

I want you all to know that I have moved out of MY OWN HOUSE to keep this family from having no place to go…today. This wasn’t a family home, it was my home. Thanks for your concern. I really don’t need any convincing as I have said numerous times. I hope that was fast enough.

The sentence I bolded…you should not be doing this to ‘please’ a bunch of anonymous people on the internet, but because you believe it is the right thing to do.