"His Holiness the Pope?"

[Lead_Me_Home]

I hear people say “His Holiness The Pope” and I have used it before and I understand that we do not believe that the Pope is God, he is the successor of Peter. I started thinking to myself, in saying “His Holiness the Pope” does one mean that the Pope is holy? Why is he Holy? The Church is Holy, Saints are Holy, but is HE holy? I kind of think I’m being too protestant and too analytical about it. Can someone explain this to me so I don’t over think this as I already have?

BTW can someone explain “The Vicar of Christ” to me. The Pope does not literally represent or speak for Christ? Or maybe he is the Vicar of Peter who is the Vicar of Christ, when it comes to managing the Church? This makes him the Vicar of Christ?

 

[stuart12]

The man himself may be holy or he may be a tyrant. However, it is his office as successor of Saint Peter and universal pastor of the Church that is sacred and holy, which the man himself has been called by God to. It is a custom to call a judge 'your honour, even though he or she may not be worthy of such a title. It is out of respect for his position.

 

[stuart12]

‘Vicar’ means someone who stands in the place of a superior. The Pope represents Jesus Christ on earth as the head of the Church, just as Saint Peter did.

 

[Lead_Me_Home]

Thank you. It is just kind of confusing when you see “represents Christ” by itself. Then I have to think back and realize that Christ did say “you are my rock and upon this rock I shall build my Church.”

 

[stuart12]

no problem

we have had some wonderful holy men as popes, some terrible ones…but they deserved the title of ‘holy father/your holiness’ due to their office of successor to the Blessed Apostle Peter, and not due to their own merits.

 

[bpbasilphx]

FWIW, Orthodox and Non-Chalcedonian patriarchs are addressed as “Your Holiness” and referred to as “His Holiness” as well.

This is even the official title of the Dalai Lama.

I’ve often wondered if the Jewish High Priesthood were to be reinstated, if he would use this title as well.

 

[Hesychios]

‘Vicar’ means someone who stands in the place of a superior. The Pope represents Jesus Christ on earth as the head of the Church, just as Saint Peter did.

Actually, early in the church history the bishops of Rome were known as the Vicar of Saint Peter.

Later that changed.

 

[Lancer]

Actually, early in the church history the bishops of Rome were known as the Vicar of Saint Peter.

Later that changed.

Interesting…do you have a reference/source for this?..I have never ever heard “Vicar of Peter”…used before.

Pax Christi

 

[bpbasilphx]

Interesting…do you have a reference/source for this?..I have never ever heard “Vicar of Peter”…used before.

Pax Christi

I’ve seen the term referenced in books on Mediaeval history.

I’ve also seen it in Ukrainian Catholic publications.

 

[Toribus]

FWIW, Orthodox and Non-Chalcedonian patriarchs are addressed as “Your Holiness” and referred to as “His Holiness” as well.

This is even the official title of the Dalai Lama.

I’ve often wondered if the Jewish High Priesthood were to be reinstated, if he would use this title as well.

Nothing to say about Eastern Patriarchs using this title, though it’s obvious that the use by the Dalai Lama is a “borrowing” from Christianity. It is only since the 20th century that any Western country would willingly append this title to anyone other than a Christian patriarch.

Actually, early in the church history the bishops of Rome were known as the Vicar of Saint Peter.

Later that changed.

I have only ever seen this claimed in anti-Catholic literature, and never clearly sourced.

 

[StrawberryJam]

The pope is acting in the same manner Peter did. Peter was not a replacement of Christ, but a leader chosen by Christ to “feed my sheep”. Vicar of Peter makes so much more sense because Peter never took place of Christ. He simply was apparently the Bishop of all Bishops in rank and authority. Why would someone think Peter took the place of Christ? Christ did more than that role allows for. It seems insulting to Christ.

 

[Toribus]

The pope is acting in the same manner Peter did. Peter was not a replacement of Christ, but a leader chosen by Christ to “feed my sheep”. Vicar of Peter makes so much more sense because Peter never took place of Christ. He simply was apparently the Bishop of all Bishops in rank and authority. Why would someone think Peter took the place of Christ? Christ did more than that role allows for. It seems insulting to Christ.

Vicar of Peter does not make sense at all, because the Pope is not Peter’s servant but Peter’s successor. The real question is was Peter the Vicar of Christ.

The Catholic position is that he was, because to Peter alone did Christ give the greatest share of his own power (universal governance of the Church, the authority to bind and loose on heaven and earth). On Peter’s own shoulders does the Church stand, and on the shoulders of every one of his successors. This is why Peter exclusively is the Vicar of Christ, and warranting the title of “Holiness”.

 

[mardukm]

Actually, early in the church history the bishops of Rome were known as the Vicar of Saint Peter.

Later that changed.

IIRC, the Title “Vicar of Christ” and “Vicar of St. Peter” were used interchangeably by Pope St. Gelasius in the 6th century. The two titles seem to have come into vogue at around the same time.

Blessings

 

[StrawberryJam]

Vicar of Peter does not make sense at all, because the Pope is not Peter’s servant but Peter’s successor. The real question is was Peter the Vicar of Christ.

The Catholic position is that he was, because to Peter alone did Christ give the greatest share of his own power (universal governance of the Church, the authority to bind and loose on heaven and earth). On Peter’s own shoulders does the Church stand, and on the shoulders of every one of his successors. This is why Peter exclusively is the Vicar of Christ, and warranting the title of “Holiness”.

Hello again Toribus, all popes replace Peter’s role not Christ’s.
It is on Christ’s shoulders the Church stands, not the pope’s.