History of Islam

[Julia_Mae]

A Restatement of the History of Islam

I’ve had a link to this most excellent book, not a short simple book but a very good one worth the effort, that covers 570-661 AD and explains where Islam came from, for over ten years. After 9/11 I realized I didn’t know the first thing about Muslims. Or was it Moslems? Is that the same as Islamics? Or…?

Dum as o’ box o’ rocks on this topic.

So I found this book online. It’s exceptionally interesting. It kind of helps understand some stuff about why things are as they are now. Not everything because it stops at 661, but the background that makes this particular Abrahamic religion so very different from the others. Of course, just reading about the first 100 years of Christianity doesn’t explain everything about where we are now, and this doesn’t about Islam either, either, but it’s just really interesting. Like: Mohammed’s wife invented the caravan. Without that in that time and place with that man, the world today would look very different.

I will also say a lot of Muslims would repudiate this work, which I found quite scholarly and believe is reliable. It’s part of their tradition that Mohammed was illiterate, for instance. He was actually quite educated for his culture and essentially an accountant.

Iirc, Mohammed said there were three perfect women: Moses’ sister, Jesus’ mother and his own daughter. Moses’ sister? Interesting choice, I thought.

If anyone else here has read it or takes the time - it took me a couple weeks because I got so interested I ended up doing side research and making maps and… well… I’m a nerdy professional student at heart - please post here to discuss or just give an opinion.

I put it here, not very timely topic I guess, but because it became apparent in another conversation that folks might not know that much about how it all started. In simple hope of greater understanding and eschewing all controversy ITT,

julia mae

 

[jonbhorton]

A Restatement of the History of Islam

So I found this book online. It’s exceptionally interesting. It kind of helps understand some stuff about why things are as they are now. Not everything because it stops at 661, but the background that makes this particular Abrahamic religion so very different from the others. Of course, just reading about the first 100 years of Christianity doesn’t explain everything about where we are now, and this doesn’t about Islam either, either, but it’s just really interesting. **Like: Mohammed’s wife invented the caravan. Without that in that time and place with that man, the world today would look very different.
**
I will also say a lot of Muslims would repudiate this work, which I found quite scholarly and believe is reliable. It’s part of their tradition that Mohammed was illiterate, for instance. ** He was actually quite educated for his culture and essentially an accountant. **

#1- Khadija did NOT invent the caravan. She was a merchant who was rich enough to have a caravan larger than all the other merchants in Mecca. That’s it. The caravan is as old as trading in desert cultures.

#2- Says who? It doesn’t take a literate person to be a successful businessman. According to the Sunni, he was illiterate:

In their respective accounts of the reception by Muhammad of the First Revelation, the Sunni and the Shia Muslims are not in agreement. According to the Sunni tradition, the appearance of Gabriel surprised Muhammad, and when the former ordered him to read, he said, “I cannot read.” This happened thrice, and each time when Muhammad declared his inability to read, the angel pressed him hard to his bosom. Eventually, he was able to repeat the five verses whereupon the angel released him and disappeared

When Archangel Gabriel disappeared, Muhammad, who was now “ordained” the Messenger of Allah, descended from the cliffs of Hira, and repaired to his home in a state of great trepidation. He was shivering with cold, and when he entered his house, he asked his wife, Khadija, to cover him with a blanket which she did. When he had sufficiently recovered from the shock, he recounted to her the story of his strange encounter with Archangel Gabriel in the cave of Hira.

The traditional Sunni account of this incident is given in an article written by Shaykh Ahmad Zaki Hammad, Ph.D., captioned Be Hopeful, published in the monthly magazine, Islamic Horizons, of the Islamic Society of North America, Plainfield, Indiana, May-June 1987, as follows:

"The Prophet (pbuh) in the early stages in Makkah,** feared that the revelation experience was an evil touch preying upon him, playing with him mentally, upsetting his tranquillity and peace of mind. He was afraid that one of the jinn had touched him.** He expressed this to Khadija. **His fear increased to the point that – and please don’t be surprised by an authentic report in Bukhari **– the Prophet (pbuh) preferred to take his own life rather than to be touched by evil, to be tampered with, corrupted, or polluted.

I’d say you need to re-read, and do so critically. You espoused two false claims, one of which is only supported by the Shi’a and under what authority or source?

The man was convinced he had been in the presence of evil. His money-minded wife convinced him otherwise.

Khadija was nothing more than the Tammy Faye Bakker of Mecca; mohammed was nothing more than a stooge who was encouraged to view evil as good and to delve into it.

None of this information is new to those of us who actually do study mohammedanism before ranting about it.

 

[Voting4Life]

Mohammed said there were three perfect women: Moses’ sister, Jesus’ mother and his own daughter.

Where did that come from?

 

[Sam_777]

Where did that come from?

*Sahih Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 57, Number 113:
Allah’s Apostle said, “Many amongst men attained perfection but amongst women none attained the perfection except Mary, the daughter of Imran and Asiya, the wife of Pharaoh. And the superiority of 'Aisha to other women is like the superiority of Tharid (i.e. an Arabic dish) to other meals.”
*

 

[Zundrah]

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 57, Number 113:
Allah’s Apostle said, “Many amongst men attained perfection but amongst women none attained the perfection except Mary, the daughter of Imran and Asiya, the wife of Pharaoh. And the superiority of 'Aisha to other women is like the superiority of Tharid (i.e. an Arabic dish) to other meals.”

Is there an online Quaran, and like the Catholic Church Catechisms, are there more types than just one?

 

[GaryTaylor]

Yes, and Yes and your local library will have one. If you do not speak and read Arabic truth is you are not even considered Islamic. Its a pre-requisite to LIFE in the middle east.

Listen go to wwwDOTexodusfromdarknessDOTorg

The sight is set up by Dr Daniel Shayesteh from Iran. Whom was One of the leading scholars in Iran on Islamic Philosophy who excaped due to appauling Doctatorship.

Listen to what he has to say about the Quran and Islam.

Peace

 

[Zundrah]

Yes, and Yes and your local library will have one. If you do not speak and read Arabic truth is you are not even considered Islamic. Its a pre-requisite to LIFE in the middle east.

Listen go to wwwDOTexodusfromdarknessDOTorg

The sight is set up by Dr Daniel Shayesteh from Iran. Whom was One of the leading scholars in Iran on Islamic Philosophy who excaped due to appauling Doctatorship.

Listen to what he has to say about the Quran and Islam.

Peace

Okay

 

[JHow]

…Mohammed’s wife invented the caravan…

No one else had the idea to transport goods across the desert on camels before her?

 

[Julia_Mae]

No one else had the idea to transport goods across the desert on camels before her?

Read the book. There was a wasteland between present-day Israel and Babylon. That’s why Haran went up to Ur before Abraham came down to Israel, you had to go around the big wasteland. Only bandits and whatever knew where the water was. Everybody went around.

So, a caravan not only was lots of people together, it was actually like a bunch of transport trucks owned by a moving company. You could pay to send your stuff, pay to travel with it for protection, and have the benefit of extra animals that carried not goods but food and water. Now we have the “modern” caravan. But you can also send a bunch of empty camels out and bring them back loaded down. The ones you send out make you money protecting travelers and come back with stuff you sell.

The family was way rich. She is credited with inventing the caravan. For further information on the desert culture of the region at this time:

Read the book.

 

[jakasaki]

No where in the Islamic hadiths or Sunna or teachings or anything like that it is written that his first wife invented the “first” caravan.

 

[jakasaki]

Ahhhh… I understand now… I checked out the website in the OP and with a little research it is the view of the Shia and not Sunny…

A book written on 1996 with a Shia prespective of pre-islam and post-islam.

Well, one thing to note is that although Shia consider themselves as the true muslims, the Sunni don’t and vice versa.

 

[Julia_Mae]

Well, one thing to note is that although Shia consider themselves as the true muslims, the Sunni don’t and vice versa.

As I said, it would be repudiated by many. The point of putting it online so long ago was to make sure more than one version of history was available. I believe it has reliable scholarship. Others will disagree. Of such are the fortunes of book publishers built.

 

[jakasaki]

As I said, it would be repudiated by many. The point of putting it online so long ago was to make sure more than one version of history was available. I believe it has reliable scholarship. Others will disagree. Of such are the fortunes of book publishers built.

OP

Do you know or have you studied the different beliefs of Shia Islam vs Sunny islam…?

 

[1voice]

Well, one thing to note is that although Shia consider themselves as the true muslims, the Sunni don’t and vice versa.

They cancel each other out then…

 

[jakasaki]

They cancel each other out then…

They do.

 

[Julia_Mae]

OP

Do you know or have you studied the different beliefs of Shia Islam vs Sunny islam…?

Are you unable to read my screen name for some reason?

I posted a book I read and recommend so people could read it if they want and discuss it. You may do so. If you wish to converse with me, you will do me the courtesy of using my name. If you don’t wish to for some reason, you may just reply without addressing me which is how I usually reply.

What you may not do under the umbrella of courtesy is call me by something which is depersonalizing, and so, disrespectful. Of course, I can’t stop you, but I certainly won’t be replying in future.

If you wish to quote a portion of the book and comment on it, that would be appropriate.

I am not a topic.

 

[PumpkinSeed]

OP stands for Original Poster. Its easier than having to type out a username. They were not being disrespectful to you. I don’t know what you find so offensive about it.

 

[Julia_Mae]

OP stands for Original Poster. Its easier than having to type out a username. They were not being disrespectful to you. I don’t know what you find so offensive about it.

I happen to have invented the term. You’re off-topic, please PM me in future with personal remarks.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

I find Islam history very interesting and complex as it progressed from Mecca to Medina.

The Muhammad of Mecca instituted the Holy War, hostility towards Jews and Christians, violated his own lax marriage laws, instigated robberies and murders, defended his crimes by pretended revelations, from Medina reveals Muhammad to be an unscrupulous politician.

Muhammad’s first prophetic experiences are generally related to his nervous condition and epileptic fits that frequented Muhammad. Illusions and hallucinations were the causes of his early so called revelations;

Muhammad at Mecca shows him to be of profound conviction of truth from his revelations. Thirst for power and uncontrolled sensuality dictated the later additions to his visions.

While Muhammad lived, his teachings were by word of mouth. Only a small number of his sayings were written.

Muhammad’s successor Caliph Abu-Bekr, intrusted his secretary Zaid the task of collecting “all the revelations” and placed them in collection called Al-Koran, or “the reading”. Zaid’s collection was revised and officially recognized about A.D 660, when all others were destroyed.

Muhammad’s revelations reveal a kingdom of the world mixed with politics ruling over its people with the religion of Islam. Muhammad calls his followers to follow him to rule over the world, “by the planting of 99 Islam seeds seeking the 100th seed to plant in the world”.

Jesus reveals his kingdom is not of this world. Jesus calls his followers out of the world, to live in the world, until Jesus returns.

 

[Sam_777]

Is there an online Quaran, and like the Catholic Church Catechisms, are there more types than just one?

To make it simple, compare The Bible to Quran, and the CCC to the 9 books of approved Sunni hadiths.