History Repeats Itself

[Ben_Masada]

All my interpretations are quoted in the Scriptures; if you don’t accept them, it’s probably because the Church can’t agree with. And the Dead Sea scrolls confirm my Scriptures. Show me one that does not.

Just to mention one particularly pertinent one, the Septuagint reads. “They have pierced my hands and my feet,” at verse 16 of Psalm 22. The Masoretic text reads,“Like a lion my hands an my feet.” The Dead Sea Scrolls confirm the Septuagint reading in the scroll found at Nahal Hever, (abbreviated 5/6Hev Ps), the only scroll recording that Psalm. There are a multitude of divergences from youir Masoretic text, but you asked for but one. Does it matter to you? I think not. You have chosen your position, and mere facts will not influence you. How sad (and boring).

**The expression “They have pierced my hands and my feet” is expressed as a proverb to mean that I have been rendered incapable to act or to function.
It has nothing to do with crucifixion. This takes care of the Septuagint and the Dead Sea Scrolls, which is a confirmation of it. Likewise, it takes care of the assumption that it ever could be applied to Jesus.

Then, Zechariah 12:10, “And they will look at him whom they pierced” means that when the Jews returned from Babylon and aware through Ezra, of what had happened to Israel the Ten Tribes because of Judah’s sins, they would in their happiness to start anew in Jerusalem, remind themselves of Israel and mourn for him whom they had pierced with their sins. Likewise, it describes no crucifixion.**

 

[Danno2281]

Just to mention one particularly pertinent one, the Septuagint reads. “They have pierced my hands and my feet,” at verse 16 of Psalm 22. The Masoretic text reads,“Like a lion my hands an my feet.” The Dead Sea Scrolls confirm the Septuagint reading in the scroll found at Nahal Hever, (abbreviated 5/6Hev Ps), the only scroll recording that Psalm. There are a multitude of divergences from youir Masoretic text, but you asked for but one. Does it matter to you? I think not. You have chosen your position, and mere facts will not influence you. How sad (and boring).

**The expression “They have pierced my hands and my feet” is expressed as a proverb to mean that I have been rendered incapable to act or to function.
It has nothing to do with crucifixion. This takes care of the Septuagint and the Dead Sea Scrolls, which is a confirmation of it. Likewise, it takes care of the assumption that it ever could be applied to Jesus.

Then, Zechariah 12:10, “And they will look at him whom they pierced” means that when the Jews returned from Babylon and aware through Ezra, of what had happened to Israel the Ten Tribes because of Judah’s sins, they would in their happiness to start anew in Jerusalem, remind themselves of Israel and mourn for him whom they had pierced with their sins. Likewise, it describes no crucifixion.**
Subject “proverb” was, of course, well known as a proverb to the Masoretes which is why they substituted “like a lion” for it, another proverb with an obviously identical meaning to any Jew, although perhaps not quite so to any of the ignorant goyim.. These things are so because b.Masada wishes them to be so, and that, dear friends, is all that really matters after all. Boring ego. Again, I must disengage.

 

[Ben_Masada]

**The expression “They have pierced my hands and my feet” is expressed as a proverb to mean that I have been rendered incapable to act or to function.
It has nothing to do with crucifixion. This takes care of the Septuagint and the Dead Sea Scrolls, which is a confirmation of it. Likewise, it takes care of the assumption that it ever could be applied to Jesus.

Then, Zechariah 12:10, “And they will look at him whom they pierced” means that when the Jews returned from Babylon and aware through Ezra, of what had happened to Israel the Ten Tribes because of Judah’s sins, they would in their happiness to start anew in Jerusalem, remind themselves of Israel and mourn for him whom they had pierced with their sins. Likewise, it describes no crucifixion.**

Subject “proverb” was, of course, well known as a proverb to the Masoretes which is why they substituted “like a lion” for it, another proverb with an obviously identical meaning to any Jew, although perhaps not quite so to any of the ignorant goyim.. These things are so because b.Masada wishes them to be so, and that, dear friends, is all that really matters after all. Boring ego. Again, I must disengage.

**That’s interesting. You are all the time disengaging and always picking up my posts. You remind me of Paul: All the time saying, “Now, I am going to the Gentiles.” And never left the Jews in peace. **

 

[twb1621]

The opposite is rather true. Instead of attacking Christianity, I am defending Judaism from the attacks of Christianity. Whenever Christians use a religious Jew to teach Hellenism, that’s an attack against the integrity of the Jewish Faith.

Now, you tell me, don’t you find this to be true? Think of 400 years of slavery and what different could have happened?

Habits are hard to break, especially old ones.

Show me one quotation from the Tanach which refers to an individul Messiah which is not a reference to a King or the High Priest.

Mine is called Biblical Judaism.

And I remember to have asked for one single prophecy that Jesus fulfilled on a personal basis that could not be fulfilled by anyone else, and you cannot provide me with.

All my interpretations are quoted in the Scriptures; if you don’t accept them, it’s probably because the Church can’t agree with. And the Dead Sea scrolls confirm my Scriptures. Show me one that does not.

Again a list of unsupported opinion tweaking scripture to fit personal desire. I asked for credible sources such as the following;

Prophecy: Born of a woman
***Genesis 3: 15 “And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel.” ***
Fulfillment
Galatians 4: 4 “But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law . . .”

Prophecy: Descendant of Isaac
Genesis 21: 12 “But God said to Abraham, "Do not let it be displeasing in your sight because of the lad or because of your bondwoman. Whatever Sarah has said to you, listen to her voice; for in Isaac your seed shall be called.”
Fulfillment
Matthew 1:1&2 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham: Abraham begot Isaac, Isaac begot Jacob, and Jacob begot Judah and his brothers.”

Prophecy: Seed of Abraham
Genesis 22:18 "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."
***Genesis 12:2,3 “I will make you a great nation; I will bless you And make your name great; And you shall be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, And I will curse him who curses you; And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.” ***
Fulfillment
Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . . . “

Prophecy: Descendant of Jacob
Numbers 24:17 "I see Him, but not now; I behold Him, but not near; A Star shall come out of Jacob; A Scepter shall rise out of Israel, And batter the brow of Moab, And destroy all the sons of tumult."
Fulfillment
Matthew 1:1,2 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham: Abraham begot Isaac, Isaac begot Jacob, and Jacob begot Judah and his brothers.”

Prophecy: Descendant of Jesse
***Isaiah 11:1 “There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots.” ***
Isaiah 11:10 “And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, Who shall stand as a banner to the people; For the Gentiles shall seek Him, And His resting place shall be glorious."
Fulfillment
Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . . . “
Matthew 1:6 “. . . and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot Solomon by her who had been the wife of Uriah.”

continued next post

 

[twb1621]

continued from previous post

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Prophecy: Descendant of David
***Jeremiah 23:5 “Behold, the days are coming,” says the LORD, “That I will raise to David a Branch of righteousness; A King shall reign and prosper, And execute judgment and righteousness in the earth.” ***

Psalm 132:11 “The LORD has sworn in truth to David; He will not turn from it: "I will set upon your throne the fruit of your body . . ."
Fulfillment
Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . . . “
Matthew 1:6 “. . . and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot Solomon by her who had been the wife of Uriah.”

Prophecy: Son of God
Psalm 2:7 "I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, "You are My Son, Today I have begotten You."

***Proverbs 30:4 “Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is His name, and what is His Son’s name, If you know?” ***
Fulfillment
Matthew 17:5 “While he was still speaking, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them; and suddenly a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!"

Luke 3:38. . . “the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.”

Luke 22:70 “Then they all said, “Are You then the Son of God?” So He said to them, "You rightly say that I am."

Now according to scripture, your group savior theory is bogus unless you can make sense out of one being born from this lineage into a whole nation.

How about giving credible sources with your responses for a change.

 

[Ben_Masada]

Again a list of unsupported opinion tweaking scripture to fit personal desire. I asked for credible sources such as the following;

Very good! Let us examine your credible sources.

Prophecy: Born of a woman Genesis 3: 15 “And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel.”

**The woman is Israel. (Amos 5:2) The seed of the woman is Judah. (Isa. 7:14,15,22; 8:8) The seed of the serpent is the anti-Semite. Of the seed of the serpent, God will eventually make an end of them. But of the seed of the woman, God will only chastise as we deserve. (Jer. 46:28) **

Fulfillment Galatians 4: 4 “But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law .

The only son God has is within the context of Exodus 4:22,23. "Israel is My son."

Prophecy: Descendant of Isaac. Genesis 21: 12 “But God said to Abraham, "Do not let it be displeasing in your sight because of the lad or because of your bondwoman. Whatever Sarah has said to you, listen to her voice; for in Isaac your seed shall be called.

**The descendants of Isaac are the Jews and not Christians. And I am sure you know very well about it. **

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1&2 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham: Abraham begot Isaac, Isaac begot Jacob, and Jacob begot Judah and his brothers.

Jesus was Jewish, and according to Judaism, Tribal genealogy is transmitted only through the father. Therefore, for Jesus to be from the Tribe of Judah, he had to be a biological son of Joseph’s. There is no other way out.

Prophecy: Seed of Abraham. Genesis 22:18 "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice. Genesis 12:2,3 “I will make you a great nation; I will bless you And make your name great; And you shall be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, And I will curse him who curses you; And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

**The seed of Abrham is the Jewish People. And the whole world is blessed with life free of catastrophes on behalf of Israel. (Gen. 8:21,22; Jer. 31:35,36) **

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham .

Jesus was seed of Abraham only as part of the Jewish People.

Prophecy: Descendant of Jacob. Numbers 24:17 "I see Him, but not now; I behold Him, but not near; A Star shall come out of Jacob; A Scepter shall rise out of Israel, And batter the brow of Moab, And destroy all the sons of tumult. Fulfillment.

Joseph was the one from the Tribe of Judah. If he was not a biological son of Joseph’s, there is no way to consider him in that genealogy. We are talking about Judaism and not Christianity.

Prophecy: Descendant of Jesse. Isaiah 11:1 “There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots.”

**That stem of Jesse is the House of Jacob, called by the new name of Israel from the stem of Judah. (Isa. 48:1) **

Isaiah 11:10 “And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, Who shall stand as a banner to the people; For the Gentiles shall seek Him, And His resting place shall be glorious.

Here is the real translation for Isaiah 11:10. “On that day, the Root of Jesse, set up as a signal for the nations, the Gentiles shall seek out.” Now, read Zechariah 8:23. It is about Gnetiles from all nations taking hold of the Jews by the edge of their garment and asking to let go with them, because they have finally acknowledged that God is with us.

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . Matthew 1:6 “. . . and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot Solomon by her who had been the wife of Uriah.”

**You keep repeating the same thing over and over again, which has nothing to do with Jesus if he was not a biological son of Joseph’s. At least, you can see
now that your sources are not that credible. They have been all refuted. **

 

[twb1621]

twb1621;5526491:

Again a list of unsupported opinion tweaking scripture to fit personal desire. I asked for credible sources such as the following;

Very good! Let us examine your credible sources.

Prophecy: Born of a woman Genesis 3: 15 “And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel.”

**The woman is Israel. (Amos 5:2) The seed of the woman is Judah. (Isa. 7:14,15,22; 8:8) The seed of the serpent is the anti-Semite. Of the seed of the serpent, God will eventually make an end of them. But of the seed of the woman, God will only chastise as we deserve. (Jer. 46:28) **

Fulfillment Galatians 4: 4 “But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law .

The only son God has is within the context of Exodus 4:22,23. "Israel is My son."

Prophecy: Descendant of Isaac. Genesis 21: 12 “But God said to Abraham, "Do not let it be displeasing in your sight because of the lad or because of your bondwoman. Whatever Sarah has said to you, listen to her voice; for in Isaac your seed shall be called.

**The descendants of Isaac are the Jews and not Christians. And I am sure you know very well about it. **

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1&2 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham: Abraham begot Isaac, Isaac begot Jacob, and Jacob begot Judah and his brothers.

Jesus was Jewish, and according to Judaism, Tribal genealogy is transmitted only through the father. Therefore, for Jesus to be from the Tribe of Judah, he had to be a biological son of Joseph’s. There is no other way out.

Prophecy: Seed of Abraham. Genesis 22:18 "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice. Genesis 12:2,3 “I will make you a great nation; I will bless you And make your name great; And you shall be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, And I will curse him who curses you; And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”

**The seed of Abrham is the Jewish People. And the whole world is blessed with life free of catastrophes on behalf of Israel. (Gen. 8:21,22; Jer. 31:35,36) **

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham .

Jesus was seed of Abraham only as part of the Jewish People.

Prophecy: Descendant of Jacob. Numbers 24:17 "I see Him, but not now; I behold Him, but not near; A Star shall come out of Jacob; A Scepter shall rise out of Israel, And batter the brow of Moab, And destroy all the sons of tumult. Fulfillment.

Joseph was the one from the Tribe of Judah. If he was not a biological son of Joseph’s, there is no way to consider him in that genealogy. We are talking about Judaism and not Christianity.

Prophecy: Descendant of Jesse. Isaiah 11:1 “There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots.”

**That stem of Jesse is the House of Jacob, called by the new name of Israel from the stem of Judah. (Isa. 48:1) **

Isaiah 11:10 “And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, Who shall stand as a banner to the people; For the Gentiles shall seek Him, And His resting place shall be glorious.

Here is the real translation for Isaiah 11:10. “On that day, the Root of Jesse, set up as a signal for the nations, the Gentiles shall seek out.” Now, read Zechariah 8:23. It is about Gnetiles from all nations taking hold of the Jews by the edge of their garment and asking to let go with them, because they have finally acknowledged that God is with us.

Fulfillment. Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . Matthew 1:6 “. . . and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot Solomon by her who had been the wife of Uriah.”

You keep repeating the same thing over and over again, which has nothing to do with Jesus if he was not a biological son of Joseph’s. At least, you can see
**now that your sources are not that credible. They have been all refuted. **

Ben, So God offers Israel to itself as its own Messiah even when Israel violates the laws of God to a point God determines Israel needs a Messiah to offer the Jews even the possiblity of salvation. Come on Ben, do you realize how you sound? your modern revised updated interpretations show themselves as tweaked distorted interpretations that make no reasonable sense other than to suit your needs to cover up what you don’t want to admit or accept even from your own heritage. Or maybe the problem is its not your original heritage. Regardless, good luck with that.

 

[Ben_Masada]

[Prophecy: Descendant of David. Jeremiah 23:5 “Behold, the days are coming,” says the LORD, “That I will raise to David a Branch of righteousness; A King shall reign and prosper, And execute judgment and righteousness in the earth.”

[COLOR=“Blue”]Now, read I Kings 11:36. That branch of righteousness is the Tribe of Judah, which has been left in the whole Land after Israel was removed.

Psalm 132:11 “The LORD has sworn in truth to David; He will not turn from it: "I will set upon your throne the fruit of your body . . .Fulfillment: Matthew 1:1 “The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham . Matthew 1:6 “. . . and Jesse begot David the king. David the king begot Solomon by her who had been the wife of Uriah.”

Now, you remind me of a broken record. What is this, have you run out of anything else to say?

Prophecy: Son of God. Psalm 2:7 "I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, "You are My Son, Today I have begotten You.

**God begot Israel when He established the Noahite Covenant with Mankind and created Israel as the pledge to guarantee His promise to Noah. Read Genesis 8:21,22 and Jer. 31:35,36. **

Proverbs 30:4 “Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is His name, and what is His Son’s name, If you know?”

Yes, I do know. But I am not sure if you want to know. His name is Elohim, the Almighty Creator of the Universe; and His son is Israel, as He Himself declared in Exodus 4:22,23. "Israel is My son…"

Fulfillment. Matthew 17:5 “While he was still speaking, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them; and suddenly a voice came out of the cloud, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!”

Who said that, Hellenistic Gentiles writing 50+ years after Jesus had been gone? It can’t impress a Jewish mind.

Luke 3:38. . . “the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.
Luke 22:70 “Then they all said, “Are You then the Son of God?” So He said to them, “You rightly say that I am.”

But of course! What are we to expected of a Greek Gentile? That’s what Luke was, didn’t you know?

Now according to scripture, your group savior theory is bogus unless you can make sense out of one being born from this lineage into a whole nation.

And according to the Scriptures your savior theory is based in Greek Mythology. Your theory will eventually evaporate into the wind as did all the Greek gods of the Olympian Pantheon.

How about giving credible sources with your responses for a change.

**If you follow the Scriptural quotations I have documented above, which I doulb you will, they are much more credible sources than those you have given from the Hellenistic Gentiles who wrote the NT. **

 

[ryanoneil]

The only son God has is within the context of Exodus 4:22,23. "Israel is My son."

Ex 4:22-33 does not say that Israel is the only son of God. It says they are His first-born. You forget that the Lord gave Israel a king “for the sake of His own great name” because He has made Israel “His people” (1 Samuel 12:19). In the context of Psalm 2:7 and 2 Samuel 7:14, the idea of divine sonship is applied to one individual (David and all the kings of his line).

 

[Ben_Masada]

Ex 4:22-33 does not say that Israel is the only son of God. It says they are His first-born. You forget that the Lord gave Israel a king “for the sake of His own great name” because He has made Israel “His people” (1 Samuel 12:19). In the context of Psalm 2:7 and 2 Samuel 7:14, the idea of divine sonship is applied to one individual (David and all the kings of his line).

**I meant to say that the only reference to a son of God is
in Exodus 4:22,23. Thanks anyway for giving me the chance to correct it. Firstborn is indeed the name used, but the use here of that word is prophetical for Israel the Ten Tribes
or Ephraim. Given the role of the firstborn, that Israel, after the Secession, would, as Messiah ben Joseph, have to be sacrificed to redeem Judah, or Messiah ben David, who would remain forever, according to I Kings 11:36 **

 

[ryanoneil]

Obviously I would include Jesus!

Peace

 

[Ben_Masada]

Obviously I would include Jesus!

Peace

While he was alive.

 

[ryanoneil]

While he was alive.

We believe that Jesus is alive (resurrected) and ascended to heaven, and is seated at the right hand of the Father. We believe He received dominion, glory, and kingship that will not be taken away or destroyed.

 

[Ben_Masada]

We believe that Jesus is alive (resurrected) and ascended to heaven, and is seated at the right hand of the Father. We believe He received dominion, glory, and kingship that will not be taken away or destroyed.

You forgot to say the following: "…but I have only faith to substantiate what I am saying, because there is no evidence to anything I said."

 

[ryanoneil]

You forgot to say the following: "…but I have only faith to substantiate what I am saying, because there is no evidence to anything I said."

The same could be said about many things in the Tanakh, especially the further you go back in time.

 

[Ben_Masada]

The same could be said about many things in the Tanakh, especially the further you go back in time.

I am not too sure if I should agree with you. In Judaism belief is not so important as good deeds. What one does is much more important than what one believes. That’s why one does not lose his Jewishness by believing whatever he does, but by professing through his behaviour, loyalty to another religion.

 

[ryanoneil]

I am not too sure if I should agree with you. In Judaism belief is not so important as good deeds. What one does is much more important than what one believes. That’s why one does not lose his Jewishness by believing whatever he does, but by professing through his behaviour, loyalty to another religion.

Don’t both have to be working together?

But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD. I will place my law within them, and write it upon their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be my people. (Jer 31:33)

Why did Abram do what he did? Because of what he believed?

The LORD said to Abram: "Go forth from the land of your kinsfolk and from your father’s house to a land that I will show you. “I will make of you a great nation, and I will bless you; I will make your name great, so that you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you. All the communities of the earth shall find blessing in you.” Abram went as the LORD directed him, and Lot went with him. Abram was seventy-five years old when he left Haran. (Gen 12:1-4)

How about here? Negative and positive.

Abram continued, “See, you have given me no offspring, and so one of my servants will be my heir.” Then the word of the LORD came to him: “No, that one shall not be your heir; your own issue shall be your heir.” He took him outside and said: “Look up at the sky and count the stars, if you can. Just so,” he added, “shall your descendants be.” Abram put his faith in the LORD, who credited it to him as an act of righteousness. (Gen 15:3-6)

How about here?

Gen. 22:1-18.

I here what you are saying (and don’t entirely disagree with what you are saying). I’m just saying belief and action are tied together.

 

[Ben_Masada]

Don’t both have to be working together?

Not necessarily. To the end-receiver of charity, it does not matter if you are faithful or not, as long as you feed him or her. And the one who gets is more important in Judaism than the one who gives, as long as one is being helped.

But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD. I will place my law within them, and write it upon their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be my people. (Jer 31:33)

Good deeds are not related to the Covenant but to being Jewish, or who we are.

Why did Abram do what he did? Because of what he believed?

No, because he was sure of Who had made the promise. When one is sure of something, he needs no faith to believe.

The LORD said to Abram: "Go forth from the land of your kinsfolk and from your father’s house to a land that I will show you. “I will make of you a great nation, and I will bless you; I will make your name great, so that you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you. All the communities of the earth shall find blessing in you.” Abram went as the LORD directed him, and Lot went with him. Abram was seventy-five years old when he left Haran. (Gen 12:1-4)

No, Abraham was about 45 or 50. It was a tradition of that time to honor the great ones by exaggerating their age. Abraham was about 55 or 60 when Isaac was born. Sara was ten years younger.

How about here? Negative and positive.

Abram continued, “See, you have given me no offspring, and so one of my servants will be my heir.” Then the word of the LORD came to him: “No, that one shall not be your heir; your own issue shall be your heir.” He took him outside and said: “Look up at the sky and count the stars, if you can. Just so,” he added, “shall your descendants be.” Abram put his faith in the LORD, who credited it to him as an act of righteousness. (Gen 15:3-6)

That conversation happened during a vision. And Abraham’s descendants like the stars, it was not meant that they could not be counted but that they should not be counted. David tried, Joab warned him not to, he didn’t listen and the whole People was struck by a plague, losing in the process several thousands.

How about here?

Gen. 22:1-18.

I am at the office and I don’t have a Bible here to answer you this one. Pity that you didn’t mention a little of it.

I here what you are saying (and don’t entirely disagree with what you are saying). I’m just saying belief and action are tied together.

Not necessarily for the reasons stated above.