Hitchens Dying Days Reading G. K. Chesterton

[mrajax]

Oh, don’t you worry. While he was alive, he repeated over and over again that he did not want eternal life. The idea of that, to him, was hell. And also…his wife was with him until the very end and she knew and saw his state of mind…he was fine. No repentance to a God of any specific religion, no sins committed to be sorry for…just a man who did his best and loved every moment of life until the very last minute. His only regret, said his wife, was the he could not continue the work he was doing here.

Correction: he didn’t feel any sorry for his sins or demonization, lying, drunkeness, etc… the way you worded it sounded like he didn’t commit any sin that he should be sorry for.

And I disagree oh so much that he ‘hated the sin but loved the sinner’. Just look at this:

In 2005, Hitchens praised Lenin’s creation of “secular Russia” and his destruction of the Russian Orthodox Church, describing it as "an absolute warren of backwardness and evil and superstition. "[41] In an interview with Radar in 2007, Hitchens said that if the Christian right’s agenda were implemented in the United States "It wouldn’t last very long and would, I hope, lead to civil war, which they will lose, but for which it would be a great pleasure to take part. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Hitchens’_political_views#Religion

So no, Hitchens not only wanted to destroy religion and decrease it;s influence but even if he wasn’t serious about his dumb comments they are still hateful. You know, people do a ton of good when calling out bad behaviour and showing genuine concern over people who commit sin. Devout Priests and the saints did it all the time. But I never got that from hitchens or any militant atheist. All I got from them was that they were putting me down, that I was a stupid person for believing in religion. Screw this ****, 'nobody calls me an idiot or do they say that they want everyone to be atheist through some stupid ‘enlightenment’. We have a basic grasp of right and wrong through the Bible, our religious morals etc… we have our own way to express ourselves in art and we do not need a man’s dumb rants to dictate how we should live.

 

[Samson33]

Hitch’s book and the BBC documentary he hosted on Mother Teresa was published/aired years before she passed away. And while she may have meant well and been a good-hearted person, since her death (and before then, too) dozens of her colleagues and co-workers including nuns have given testimonials of serious problems and negligence in her actions.
And as you probably know, her own letters to a priest friend published after she died spoke torturously of not feeling faith or God around her for the last forty years of her life.

So again, while she tried to do good, she herself had many personal problems that the public was not aware of…and a lot of what Hitch reported was, indeed, fact.
He wasn’t a hateful person, he just loathed when people don’t want to look at the truth of a situation because they are blinded by a title or an image. And when he saw that, it frustrated him and he was not a man to mince words.

It’s like when you say in the Catholic church “love the sinner, hate the sin.”

He saw a lot of “sins” he hated, and felt a need to reveal them in whatever way he could.

I’m sorry but whenver someone argues that Mother Teresa is somehow bad, It arouses a similar reaction as to when somebody argues that Hitler was somehow good. I’m sure if you looked hard enough you could find something, but Hitchens(however intelligent he was) wrote an entire book called the “Missionary Position” just to say how horrible she is. Penn and Teller also tried to say Mother Teresa was “evil”(not that atheists believe in that concept anyway), but the arguement doesn’t hold up very well, it makes sense that Hitchens’ book is less than a hundred pages(even a brilliant polemecist like him couldn’t make that arguement.)

 

[Della]

Hitch’s book and the BBC documentary he hosted on Mother Teresa was published/aired years before she passed away. And while she may have meant well and been a good-hearted person, since her death (and before then, too) dozens of her colleagues and co-workers including nuns have given testimonials of serious problems and negligence in her actions.
And as you probably know, her own letters to a priest friend published after she died spoke torturously of not feeling faith or God around her for the last forty years of her life.

So again, while she tried to do good, she herself had many personal problems that the public was not aware of…and a lot of what Hitch reported was, indeed, fact.
He wasn’t a hateful person, he just loathed when people don’t want to look at the truth of a situation because they are blinded by a title or an image. And when he saw that, it frustrated him and he was not a man to mince words.

It’s like when you say in the Catholic church “love the sinner, hate the sin.”

He saw a lot of “sins” he hated, and felt a need to reveal them in whatever way he could.

Anyone who ever gained any fame, deserved or not, will have people who will say negative things about him/her just to get noticed. Do you really think the Church didn’t hear from those who thought Mother Teresa wasn’t so saintly? There is an office in the congregation of saints that is called, in common parlance, “the devil’s advocate”. It’s his job to seek out negative things about anyone being investigated for sainthood, and he does his job well because the Church wants to be sure that those who are being elevated to the altar, as it’s put, will be true examples of discipleship. The Church has pronounced Mother Teresa blessed after going through all her writings and hearing all the witnesses.

Many a saint has experienced what St. John of the Cross called “the dark night of the soul”. It is when they have no sensible enjoyment in God’s presence–there are no feelings of getting anything spiritual from God. This is where real faith kicks in because we are to love and trust God because he is God not because we get some kind of high off of feeling his presence. Many people do have what the Church calls “consolations” from God, but for some, God takes away those sensibilities so that the person will trust in God alone and not in anything they might feel. It’s a sign of very great sanctity not of someone who has lost his faith.

 

[John_Savage]

Are you saying that MT took people away from secular charities? If not, then you’re missing my point.

Was Keating convicted at the time? If so, then he wouldn’t have any money, right?

Also, what charity organizations do background checks on their contributors? Which ones turn money down from people not yet convicted?

Like Hitchens does (I read God isn’t Great and thought it was one of the worst-reasoned, least-researched, and most narrow-minded book I’ve ever read that was supposed to be good), it looks like he just threw stuff on a wall.

She accepted $1.25m from the convicted criminal Charles Keating!

When the Deputy DA of LA Paul Turley, pointed this out to her, and highlighted the fact this donated money wasn’t his to donate, and in fact had been stolen from people, many of whom were poor, he was ignored. She refused to account for, or return the money.



Just atheists?

Nobody else?

Secular organizations like Calcutta Rescue set up by Dr Jack Preger have, in my view, done just as valuable work as any religious organization.

How about the humanist Responsible Charity, set up as a direct result of the abuses witnessed in some homes run by religious organizations?

You’ll find lots of atheists, humanists and secularists right in the thick of all humanities crises.

Sarah x

 

[Charlemagne_II]

atheistgirl

**Secular organizations like Calcutta Rescue set up by Dr Jack Preger have, in my view, done just as valuable work as any religious organization. **

Is Dr. Jack Preger an atheist?

 

[Della]

atheistgirl

**Secular organizations like Calcutta Rescue set up by Dr Jack Preger have, in my view, done just as valuable work as any religious organization. **

Is Dr. Jack Preger an atheist?

I just looked him up. No, he’s not an atheist. Of course, the work he is doing and the work of Mother Teresa’s nuns are not in competition with each other. Both are doing good work, but in different ways. I see no need to write off the sisters’ efforts simply because others are also working to help the poor, if that is the point atheistgirl was making, but I’ll let her speak for herself.

 

[buffalo]

Research has show that Catholics account for the majority of volunteer hours as well as contributions. Guess where atheists stand?

 

[atheistgirl]

atheistgirl

**Secular organizations like Calcutta Rescue set up by Dr Jack Preger have, in my view, done just as valuable work as any religious organization. **

Is Dr. Jack Preger an atheist?

I said his organization, Calcutta Rescue, is a secular organization.

He was accused of being a missionary at one point which he vigorously denied, and almost deported because of it.

Look at the incredible work his organization does for a few thousand dollars per month.

Sarah x

 

[Della]

I said his organization, Calcutta Rescue, is a secular organization.

He was accused of being a missionary at one point which he vigorously denied, and almost deported because of it.

Look at the incredible work his organization does for a few thousand dollars per month.

Sarah x

I did a bit of reading about him and his organization–very inspiring and challenging. I don’t know that I’d have that kind of fortitude. And while his organization isn’t a religious one and his mission isn’t one of evangelization, he still is doing this work because he feels this is what God wants him to do.

Mother Teresa’s mission doesn’t proselytize, either. They simply take people as they are and help them as best they can, becoming poor to help the poor, just as the good doctor is doing.

 

[mrajax]

I said his organization, Calcutta Rescue, is a secular organization.

He was accused of being a missionary at one point which he vigorously denied, and almost deported because of it.

Look at the incredible work his organization does for a few thousand dollars per month.

Sarah x

A few thousand dollars a month eh? Not all organizations ar elike that you know. We have a home here in our tiny island of Malta that brings in children wth disabilities who can’t live with their fmailies. Do you know how much money a year they spend for their 100 patients? 600,000 Euro, which makes it 779,141 dollars. I am not even kidding. Do you know the annual budget of Harvard? Someone said 1 billion but wikipedia says that their endowment in 2011 was 32 flipping billion. Not all organizations spend the same amount of money and as I told you, don’t lump Dr. Preger or any secular organization that isn’t dedicated to spreading secularism with atheism. There is a huge diffirence and simply because you didn’t call him an atheist doesn’t mean his organization is.

 

[Charlemagne_II]

atheistgirl
**
He was accused of being a missionary at one point which he vigorously denied, and almost deported because of it. **

That certainly does not make him an atheist or someone devoid of religious sentiments.

I am a Catholic and I have donated to many secular organizations. I don’t see how many secular organizations could survive without the good will of religious donors to their coffers.

 

[atheistgirl]

That certainly does not make him an atheist or someone devoid of religious sentiments.

Where did I say he was?

You’ve brought this up two or three times now, implying I stated he was an atheist.

For the third time, I said the organization he set up is a secular organization.

Did you watch the video?

Such a tiny organization and yet they’re providing medical care, hygiene, health advice, food, education and training.

Awesome.

Sarah x

 

[atheistgirl]

Research has show that Catholics account for the majority of volunteer hours as well as contributions. Guess where atheists stand?

Link please.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics figures released this year

More married people volunteer than unmarried people

More employed people volunteer than unemployed people

People between 35 and 44 are more likely to volunteer

Women volunteer more than men

People with higher levels of education volunteer more than those without

Religion isn’t featured in the study.

But according to the statistics, I’m more likely to do voluntary work than you



Sarah x

 

[John_Savage]

Do the secular organizations do background checks on donors?

 

[atheistgirl]

Do the secular organizations do background checks on donors?

Go and ask them.

And ask them, if it were pointed out by the DA that they were in possession of stolen money, would they return that money.

Then you’ll have your answer.

My view is the right thing to do, when you’re informed you’re in possession of stolen money, is to return it.

Go call the secular charities and ask them.

Sarah x

 

[Charlemagne_II]

atheistgirl

For the third time, I said the organization he set up is a secular organization.

And I just want to point out to you that there are hardly any secular charities that are not largely funded by donations of religious people. Subtract all those donations and you will not have much charity left.

Common sense.

 

[atheistgirl]

Common sense.

You’re making an undisputed point off the back of a point I didn’t make

Oh well, if you like stating the obvious, go for it.

Since the majority of people in the world claim some religious affiliation, it stands to reason the majority of donors would have a religious affiliation of some sort

If somebody was claiming that wasn’t the case, you might have a point, but since nobody was…

Sarah x

 

[Charlemagne_II]

atheistgirl

Since the majority of people in the world claim some religious affiliation, it stands to reason the majority of donors would have a religious affiliation of some sort.

 

[rtechie]

Do you really think the Church didn’t hear from those who thought Mother Teresa wasn’t so saintly?

Yes. Are you so naive as to think the Catholic Church gave them a fair hearing? Mother Teresa was “fast tracked” into becoming a saint and her supposed “miracles” are really weak, even for the Catholic Church. She was really popular and people really wanted her to be a Saint, so the Church cooked up a few “miracles”.

 

[Charlemagne_II]

rtechie

She was really popular and people really wanted her to be a Saint, so the Church cooked up a few “miracles”.

And you know this how?