Holding Hands during the Our Father

  • Thread starter Thread starter Donna_P
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Annabelle_Marie said:
The laity holding hands…with no direction from the priest is NOT false teaching! And you still did not answer my question about plucking your eyes out…
Click to expand...
Since it isn’t prohibited, the plucking of a neighbor’s eye during the Our Father as long as it is done without the direction of the priest is absolutely ok and can be used to show solidarity with the blind.😃
 
Moore11 said:
Since it isn’t prohibited, the plucking of a neighbor’s eye during the Our Father as long as it is done without the direction of the priest is absolutely ok and can be used to show solidarity with the blind.😃
Click to expand...
And in the end, the one-eyed person will be king in the kingdom of the blind. 🙂
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
Ya…cause that has worked so well so far. What about seeing the forest for the trees?

Personally I think if the priest doesn’t ask for it (which he shouldnt) and that is all you have to worry about…then you’ve got it good. Personnally all the talk condemning Bishops for not personnally being there to make sure that we don’t hold hands, scratch our noses etc…then I file it under “stop complaining and get a life:rolleyes:”
Click to expand...
Hmmmm, you quote my post but I don’t remember condemning Bishops at all. Bishops have a lot on their plates but I think they would have less if they would take care of buisness. The priest in my neck of the woods are the ones who introduced this practice. It is part of what a Bishop is responsible that the people understand their faith and practices. When people add to the mass, this is not a small thing. Since I believe that this was introduced by the clergy, I hardly expect that the clergy will correct it. The Bishop is responsible for educating the people. Do people understand why the mass is celebrated the way it is? Do they understand why they hold hands? Someone here suggest unity but is that what is on peoples minds or are they just mindlessly following along with something they think should be done? There are many reasons why it shouldn’t be done but I have seen few reasons that it should be done.
 
adrift said:
Hmmmm, you quote my post but I don’t remember condemning Bishops at all. Bishops have a lot on their plates but I think they would have less if they would take care of buisness. The priest in my neck of the woods are the ones who introduced this practice. It is part of what a Bishop is responsible that the people understand their faith and practices. When people add to the mass, this is not a small thing. Since I believe that this was introduced by the clergy, I hardly expect that the clergy will correct it. The Bishop is responsible for educating the people. Do people understand why the mass is celebrated the way it is? Do they understand why they hold hands? Someone here suggest unity but is that what is on peoples minds or are they just mindlessly following along with something they think should be done? There are many reasons why it shouldn’t be done but I have seen few reasons that it should be done.
Click to expand...
I don’t think Annabelle Marie is arguing that it should be done either… It sounds to me more like she is saying, as long as there isn’t a liturgical abuse going on, then its not something to make a big deal out of.
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
Holding hands during the Our Father is dishonest? And a Bishop is supposed to personally stop all this?

Seriously people…you have Catholics that leave early, don’t have reverence for the Eucharist, go to Mass like its a time card…punch in and punch out. Our religious freedom is being eroded right and left…is hand holding REALLY where we want to hang our hat? So much so that we get after Bishops for not PERSONALLY stopping it?:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Everything you say is true and this discussion is just one part. Yes, the bishops and priests have a lot to do: if it isn’t allowed, then they should say something, tell us we MUST go to confession before communion, tell us to stay put until the Mass is ended and not to skedaddle after communion to get out of the parking lot, tell us not to send our kids to Catholic colleges that aren’t very Catholic, etc. etc.

Most Catholics would very much like to see a bunch of Catholic politicians excommunicated. What’s with that if you want a serious matter to discuss. It appears that a majority of bishops don’t care. I’m sure they do but their voices need to be louder and their reasons should be in the Church bulletins.
 
the wanderer said:
I don’t think Annabelle Marie is arguing that it should be done either… It sounds to me more like she is saying, as long as there isn’t a liturgical abuse going on, then its not something to make a big deal out of.
Click to expand...
Now there is the rub. There are those who believe it is a liturgical abuse, even though they regard it as a minor one. The question is should minor abuses be tolerated?
 
Moore11 said:
Since it isn’t prohibited, the plucking of a neighbor’s eye during the Our Father as long as it is done without the direction of the priest is absolutely ok and can be used to show solidarity with the blind.😃
Click to expand...
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
 
thewanderer said:
I don’t think Annabelle Marie is arguing that it should be done either… It sounds to me more like she is saying, as long as there isn’t a liturgical abuse going on, then its not something to make a big deal out of.
Click to expand...
This 👍
 
adrift said:
Now there is the rub. There are those who believe it is a liturgical abuse, even though they regard it as a minor one. The question is should minor abuses be tolerated?
Click to expand...
That question is irrelevant. It is not an abuse; the opinions of the misinformed vulgus are of no import whatsoever.
 
aicirt said:
Everything you say is true and this discussion is just one part. Yes, the bishops and priests have a lot to do: if it isn’t allowed, then they should say something, tell us we MUST go to confession before communion, tell us to stay put until the Mass is ended and not to skedaddle after communion to get out of the parking lot, tell us not to send our kids to Catholic colleges that aren’t very Catholic, etc. etc.

Most Catholics would very much like to see a bunch of Catholic politicians excommunicated. What’s with that if you want a serious matter to discuss. It appears that a majority of bishops don’t care. I’m sure they do but their voices need to be louder and their reasons should be in the Church bulletins.
Click to expand...
First of you…I don’t HAVE to go to confession before communion unless I have committed a mortal sin. It is a wise practice to go more than that but it is NOT a must.

And I have heard plenty of times not to skedaddle after communion and yet I know it still happens in our parish and others…and still will.

So now the Bishops are going to stop spontaous hand holding? or practiced hand holding. I know it’s done at my parish all the time and my priest is very good about NOT encouraging it at all. But is he going to risk people leaving the church or having to deal with all sorts of other issues by firmly telling people NOT to? because it still won’t make a difference…he talks about how its rude to leave after communion…and there are those that still will. Personally I don’t see a problem with it and will do it…but I won’t leap across aisles and I won’t force people to. As I understand it the laity doing the 3 crosses before the gospel wasn’t originally a proscribed posture either…🤷 And I just don’t see how a Bishop is going to waste all sorts of time on that when there are so many other issues…

Like Catholics voting for culture of death politicians…or like you said…leaving right after communion. I’m thinking those are much more offensive to God then my holding hands during the Our Father…call me crazy. When we can have some sucess with that…then we can work on other things. Have you ever heard that you can’t do it all?

And seriously…like Rome puts out about no more ceramic chalises…and yet when my priest went back for the year of the priest…what were they using during Mass their at St. Peters square with all those priest…ceramic chalises.
 
You know what I find ALOT more distracting at Mass? People letting their little kids run around and talk…sometimes you can’t even hear the priest because of it.
 
TempleServant said:
Maybe this will help.

The priest is the one offering the mass, to God.

All of the audience-participation introduced since the 60’s is actually inessential. You don’t need a congregation to say Mass, either. It’s not about the ‘Community’.

This is the problem: they’ve tried to make it populist and the operation doesn’t suit that. It’s not that sort of ritual. So it jars.
Click to expand...
It jars you. You.

It is about the community. Do I need to again post the Eucharistic prayers which talk about “The family gathered here” and such things?

Do the Eucharistic prayers which speak about family and community not mean anything to you?

Do you not undersand that if you get to heaven, you are going to love the person in the pew next to you and the guy at work and your next door neighbor more than you have ever loved anyone or anything on this earth while you were alive? Is this not a reality you can grasp?

-Tim-
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
First of you…I don’t HAVE to go to confession before communion unless I have committed a mortal sin. It is a wise practice to go more than that but it is NOT a must.

And I have heard plenty of times not to skedaddle after communion and yet I know it still happens in our parish and others…and still will.

So now the Bishops are going to stop spontaous hand holding? or practiced hand holding. I know it’s done at my parish all the time and my priest is very good about NOT encouraging it at all. But is he going to risk people leaving the church or having to deal with all sorts of other issues by firmly telling people NOT to? because it still won’t make a difference…he talks about how its rude to leave after communion…and there are those that still will. Personally I don’t see a problem with it and will do it…but I won’t leap across aisles and I won’t force people to. As I understand it the laity doing the 3 crosses before the gospel wasn’t originally a proscribed posture either…🤷 And I just don’t see how a Bishop is going to waste all sorts of time on that when there are so many other issues…

Like Catholics voting for culture of death politicians…or like you said…leaving right after communion. I’m thinking those are much more offensive to God then my holding hands during the Our Father…call me crazy. When we can have some sucess with that…then we can work on other things. Have you ever heard that you can’t do it all?

And seriously…like Rome puts out about no more ceramic chalises…and yet when my priest went back for the year of the priest…what were they using during Mass their at St. Peters square with all those priest…ceramic chalises.
Click to expand...
Okay…if the handholding had been stopped, we wouldn’t have people carrying it to extremes where they join with the pew behind them, cross the aisle to hold hands, or cross the aisle to shake hands giving the sign of peace to everyone. One thing blossoms into another.

If we are not to use the oran posture (I guess this is where the hands are raised above one’s head like the priests) then someone needs to stop it and that should be the priest.

I said before I’ve been at a Mass where some people stand and some kneel. I didn’t know what was going on. It should be uniform if for only one reason…it doesn’t distract from the Mass.

I don’t know about ceramic chalices. Is that an oxymoron? Ceramics crack and bacteria can accumulate. And The REAL PRESENCE should be contained in a precious metal. I can’t imagine why any priest would consider anything else.

How about the playing of SOMEWHERE IN TIME before Mass? Appropriate?
 
TimothyH said:
It jars you. You.

It is about the community. Do I need to again post the Eucharistic prayers which talk about “The family gathered here” and such things?

Do the Eucharistic prayers which speak about family and community not mean anything to you?

Do you not undersand that if you get to heaven, you are going to love the person in the pew next to you and the guy at work and your next door neighbor more than you have ever loved anyone or anything on this earth while you were alive? Is this not a reality you can grasp?

-Tim-
Click to expand...
You are right, we are a family gathered there but he is more right. The Mass is about what Jesus did for the community not what the community is doing.

It is about Jesus’ sacrifice to the Father for us. At that moment, that is what it is about.

Just because one prefers not to hold someone’s hand next to them during the Our Father doesn’t mean they don’t love them. It just means they prefer not to pray in that way. Has absolutely nothing to do with loving the person next to them.

No one should be made to feel they are not loving their neighbor because they don’t want to participate in prayer that way during mass and no one should be made to feel uncomfortable or anxious during mass because there are people asking them to pray in a way other than the way they have done for years.

Sometimes at daily mass, there are those that raise their hands so high and then give them a good shake it is like a victory cheer. If one doesn’t want to participate in that they should not be made to feel guilty or anxious.
 
Diana_Catherine said:
You are right, we are a family gathered there but he is more right. The Mass is about what Jesus did for the community not what the community is doing.

It is about Jesus’ sacrifice to the Father for us. At that moment, that is what it is about.

Just because one prefers not to hold someone’s hand next to them during the Our Father doesn’t mean they don’t love them. It just means they prefer not to pray in that way. Has absolutely nothing to do with loving the person next to them.

No one should be made to feel they are not loving their neighbor because they don’t want to participate in prayer that way during mass and no one should be made to feel uncomfortable or anxious during mass because there are people asking them to pray in a way other than the way they have done for years.

Sometimes at daily mass, there are those that raise their hands so high and then give them a good shake it is like a victory cheer. If one doesn’t want to participate in that they should not be made to feel guilty or anxious.
Click to expand...
Just for the record …IMHO you are right that no one should be made to feel guilty or anxious because they don’t want to hold hands.
 
aicirt said:
Okay…if the handholding had been stopped, we wouldn’t have people carrying it to extremes where they join with the pew behind them, cross the aisle to hold hands, or cross the aisle to shake hands giving the sign of peace to everyone. One thing blossoms into another.

If we are not to use the oran posture (I guess this is where the hands are raised above one’s head like the priests) then someone needs to stop it and that should be the priest.

I said before I’ve been at a Mass where some people stand and some kneel. I didn’t know what was going on. It should be uniform if for only one reason…it doesn’t distract from the Mass.

I don’t know about ceramic chalices. Is that an oxymoron? Ceramics crack and bacteria can accumulate. And The REAL PRESENCE should be contained in a precious metal. I can’t imagine why any priest would consider anything else.

How about the playing of SOMEWHERE IN TIME before Mass? Appropriate?
Click to expand...
It was the Vatican using ceramic chalices…against their own new rule…probably because of money…

I have never heard somewhere in town so I can not comment…but I doubt everyone will ever agree on music.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top