Holding hands in mass:Our Father?

[GangGreen]

Burn it with fire, please. I can’t stand the hand holding. The fact that it’s a largely a Protestant thing is reason enough to not do it.

 

[Lormar]

Our bishop said not to do it, but not too many in my parish paid attention.

 

[CB_Catholic]

Burn it with fire, please. I can’t stand the hand holding. The fact that it’s a largely a Protestant thing is reason enough to not do it.

It’s not a Protestant thing. Why do we blame everything we don’t like on the Protestants? The practice probably started with AA, and there are plenty of Catholics in AA. When I was growing up I attended enough Protestant services to know this was NOT done. It seems to be a fairly recent phenomena of the past 30-40 years, and I daresay you will see it more among the Catholics than the Protestants, esp. the Evangelicals, who don’t tend to recite the Lord’s Prayer as much as the Catholics, as they tend to be more spontaneous in their prayers.

 

[NewLifeNeil]

I find the various hand activities going on around us at mass to be a little disordered, chaotic, and that there’s peer pressure to get on board with it at every level, even including the elderly. 30 years ago I don’t recall seeing the practice. Getting to be the norm now.

My gut is that the bishops had a golden opportunity to set the record straight when they had our complete attention, during the break in period for the new missal, the recent revisions. But they blew it. Not a peep. Maybe they feared offending anybody. Or maybe this shows they are ok with it, the fact that it did not come up in any way in teh revisions.

Or maybe they were realistic. Any self styled gesture such as that which necessitates putting the book down (both hands are busy doing something other than holding the missal), automatically wins out anyway over anything to the contrary that might be printed in there about not doing this, since they are presumably not looking at any book anyway, since their hands on on eachothers or outstretched. It’s a case of monkey see monkey do. The priest does the gesture with the arms, but the book is open faced on the altar and he is looking into it, so it kind of makes sense in his case.

The deacon is always folding his hands in prayer. I always assumed he is supposed to be whom we are modelling after, but what do I know.

I don’t mean to offend. Frankly, I am about done caring about this. But these thoughts do occur to me sometimes.

 

[lax16]

I think this answers the question:

c. Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only
the priest is given the instruction to “extend” his hands. Neither the deacon nor the
lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in
the Roman Missal; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore the
extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.

praytellblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/2011-Pastoral-Letter-with-Decree-Bulletin-Insert.pdf

(see bottom of page 3)

 

[GangGreen]

It’s not a Protestant thing. Why do we blame everything we don’t like on the Protestants? The practice probably started with AA, and there are plenty of Catholics in AA. When I was growing up I attended enough Protestant services to know this was NOT done. It seems to be a fairly recent phenomena of the past 30-40 years, and I daresay you will see it more among the Catholics than the Protestants, esp. the Evangelicals, who don’t tend to recite the Lord’s Prayer as much as the Catholics, as they tend to be more spontaneous in their prayers.

Every time I see Protestants on TV, they’re holding hands or have them in the sky. Enough evidence for me.

 

[tradcathboy]

Here in the Diocese of Covington His Excellence Bishop Roger Foys decreed that it is to be forbidden. Yet it was never enforced. Which is sad. Its a distraction for myself.

 

[Obispo]

Hoping to get a definitive answer here and I apologize if this is not in right forum but I just heard something that alluded to the notion that holding hands in mass during the Our Father prayer is somehow wrong or improper? For myself I’ve always folded my hands in prayer but never thought those that were holding hands or raising their hands were doing anything wrong? Is there an actual rule (not sure if rule is correct term but only word that comes to mind right now) given by the Church on this for mass? Hope someone can shed some light on this aspect of the liturgy of the mass?

There is no rubric against holding hands. There is also not a requirement to do so. That means that no one should ever feel coerced to hold hands.

To suggest that holding hands is wrong because it’s an unauthorized addition to the Mass is simply silly. The same people who makes such claims also defend the practice of praying the Rosary during the EF Mass.

 

[Obispo]

Here in the Diocese of Covington His Excellence Bishop Roger Foys decreed that it is to be forbidden. Yet it was never enforced. Which is sad. Its a distraction for myself.

I’m not sure that a bishop can make such a “decree” with any real authority. Maybe it would be better if he “asked” or “advised”? I know I would be more willing to follow if my bishop did rather than decree/forbid.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

There have been prolly 100 threads beating this horse to death. Nothing is ever accomplished.

But now that the horse is dead, there is nothing to prevent us from beating a dead horse…. Unless we call it a horse of a different color, resurrect it, and beat it to death again…

 

[Hmgbrd]

But now that the horse is dead, there is nothing to prevent us from beating a dead horse…. Unless we call it a horse of a different color, resurrect it, and beat it to death again…

 

[Hmgbrd]

I think this answers the question:

c. Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only
the priest is given the instruction to “extend” his hands. Neither the deacon nor the
lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in
the Roman Missal; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore the
extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.

praytellblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/2011-Pastoral-Letter-with-Decree-Bulletin-Insert.pdf

(see bottom of page 3)

One of our visiting priests from Rome addressed this in a Homily this summer saying exactly the same thing as above. The priest in persona Christi is praying for us when he assumes the orans position. He explained the background concerning the orans position and meaning during the Mass. He then suggested that it is a beautiful way for the laity to pray privately when they are at home during their daily devotions and even encouraged such behavior. But he emphasized again that during Mass only the Priest should assume the orans position during the Our Father.

 

[Usige]

I think this answers the question:

c. Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only
the priest is given the instruction to “extend” his hands. Neither the deacon nor the
lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in
the Roman Missal; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore the
extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.

praytellblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/2011-Pastoral-Letter-with-Decree-Bulletin-Insert.pdf

(see bottom of page 3)

Thanks, lax16. Thinking I might have to move to Kentucky if you guys are so lucky to have a Bishop that not only says that holding hands at the our father should not be done but also requiring the chant mass setting.

 

[mdgspencer]

Good for this bishop. I don’t like holding hands with strangers.
However, this regulation is for his diocese. He doesn’t seem to say this ought to be the practice throughout the Church. Since this is not explicitly said in the GIRM, this seems to be his own opinion of this (though I would welcome an argument for the otherwise if it is based on liturgical law). Of course he has the right to make his reasoning decisive in his own diocese.

I think this answers the question:

c. Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only
the priest is given the instruction to “extend” his hands. Neither the deacon nor the
lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in
the Roman Missal; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore the
extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.

praytellblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/2011-Pastoral-Letter-with-Decree-Bulletin-Insert.pdf

(see bottom of page 3)

 

[OLofMtCarmel]

Sometimes I hold hands with my children. The free hand I place in the ancient traditional form that many do not like to see. Most of the time, however, I fold my hands together with head bowed slightly in reverence towards God. My family does not try to force it, nor to I respond to people around me trying to get my attention if they try. We have to set example for other sto follow. And if their feelings get hurt over it, so be it. They have no business trying to disrupt us in prayer anyway during the mass. What bothers me is when people nearly push you over to shake your hand to “make sure” you pay them the correct amount of homage. That urks me and its very disrespectful. Fortunately, We sit to the side where only my family fits. I’ll shake hands but try to gesture as much as possible. I have no problem extending peace to my brothers and sisters in Christ. I kiss my family if able.

The rubric is just that, a guide. It neither permits or denies certain actions, postures, etc. However, the priest should never say yay or nay in any fashion other than when the rubric is clear about what we are to do. My issue is the form in which people receive communion. Thought receiving on the tongue is preferred, many of us are allowed to receive in the hand. What bothers me about both is when someone uses their teeth to grab the body of christ or hold their hands down at the waste. It gets really strange when serving as an EMHC. I used to think EMHC was an abuse. But now I realize that mass would take 2 or even 3 hours if the priest were the only one serving. I struggled with that for a while. I do prefer my children go to the priest though. What irritates me is when EMHC’s try to bless my children that do not receive. So my wife always insures she takes them to the priest. I’m greatful for her understanding of this as well. I don’t like holding hands with strangers knowing all the diseases floating about.

 

[oneofmany]

I have seen priests leave out doing the sign of peace during flu season and they should, sometimes they will say something about it and sometimes not. If I have a cold I will not shake hands with anyone and shake my head or put up my hand I can’t since I am sick.

For the last few years I have not taken any Holy Water either. I guess all the talk about germs is getting to me. I do have Holy Water at home but most people do dip their fingers and take Holy Water but I don’t and I try not to be conspicuous about it.

 

[lax16]

Good for this bishop. I don’t like holding hands with strangers.
However, this regulation is for his diocese. He doesn’t seem to say this ought to be the practice throughout the Church. Since this is not explicitly said in the GIRM, this seems to be his own opinion of this (though I would welcome an argument for the otherwise if it is based on liturgical law). Of course he has the right to make his reasoning decisive in his own diocese.

mdgspencer - Yes, I think he does say this (unless I am not understanding correctly).

What do you think?

c. Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only
the priest is given the instruction to “extend” his hands. Neither the deacon nor the
lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in
the Roman Missal; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore the
extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.

Either way, I agree, good for the Bishop!

 

[lax16]

Thanks, lax16. Thinking I might have to move to Kentucky if you guys are so lucky to have a Bishop that not only says that holding hands at the our father should not be done but also requiring the chant mass setting.

I live in Utah and there is hand holding during the prayer - we even have liturgical dancers!

Catholics in Kentucky are very fortunate to have such a thorough Bishop. We have a wonderful Bishop in Utah but he has not addressed these matters.

 

[lax16]

One of our visiting priests from Rome addressed this in a Homily this summer saying exactly the same thing as above. The priest in persona Christi is praying for us when he assumes the orans position. He explained the background concerning the orans position and meaning during the Mass. He then suggested that it is a beautiful way for the laity to pray privately when they are at home during their daily devotions and even encouraged such behavior. But he emphasized again that during Mass only the Priest should assume the orans position during the Our Father.

How wonderful to have a priest visit from Rome and explain this so clearly!

My family often says we wish someone from Rome would come to Utah and put us on the map and on Pope Benedict’s radar!

 

[Brendan_64]

I don’t like it when individual families decide to hold hand with each other during the Our Father at Mass. To me this comes across as a type of seperatism and identification as themselves as a specific unit to the exclusion of others present.

At Mass we are there in communion with all persons present, not just with our own individual family unit. At Mass we are all one family, God’s family. Individual human families should not behave in an introspective manner regarding communal worship that excludes other around them. To me individual familes holding hands amongst themselves during the Our Father is a bit like give the sign of peace only to members of your own human fanily.

That said I don’t think we should be holding hands at all during the Our Father. During the Our Father we ask for forgiveness for our sins, it is not a prayer of joyous celebration. I also don’t like individual parishioners havinf their hands in the Orans position, and believe this should be reserved for the priest. Hands held in an unobtrusive, reverential position, along with a thoughtful penitential demeanour is how I think we should be encouraged to stand during the Our Father.

On another note, I live in England where most people do not hold hands during the Our Father (although the Orans position of hands is creeping in) but I have noticed that many of the people who do hold hands are indeed American. Is this practice widespread in the USA?