Holding Hands

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HagiaSophia

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From Andrew Santella"s current column:

"…Old-schoolers and touchy-feelies clash over a whole range of questions that might be lumped together under the heading of worship etiquette: Is it all right to applaud church musicians during Mass? Should we stand or kneel after receiving Communion? And what’s with these kids showing up for Mass in their soccer uniforms? The divide over worship etiquette is clear enough that Catholics have their own version of the red state/blue state meme: They talk about whether the Mass should be a vertical or horizontal experience. Touchy-feelies go horizontal, making the Mass increasingly about community and fellowship within the congregation. They hold hands, then they shake hands, and often take time out at the start of Mass to introduce themselves to the person in the pew next to them.

Old-schoolers want to restore the Mass’s vertical orientation—the focus on the transcendent and divine. They chant in Latin and pray solo over rosaries.
Hand-holding has established itself in many parishes. But the old-schoolers are striking back. The Catholic society Adoremus, for example, defends old-style notions of Catholic piety and aims to restore a more sober vibe to the Mass. The traditionalists are heartened by the arrival of Pope Benedict XVI, an acknowledged fan of Gregorian chant and other traditions mostly lost in the shuffle after Vatican II. One of Adoremus’ founders, Joseph Fessio, once studied under then-Professor Joseph Ratzinger (now Benedict XVI) at the University of Regensburg in Germany and has been called by Garry Wills Benedict XVI’s “man in America.”

Of course, most Catholics are neither vehemently touch-feely nor vehemently traditional. I’m not a big fan of hand-holding and have even complained about it in print. To me, it smacks of enforced good cheer and saccharine singalongs. But the trouble with being against hand-holding is that it puts you in league with the church’s most ultra-orthodox flat-Earthers. It’s a dilemma: Hold hands and give up a bit of the traditional Catholic solemnity, or forsake your neighbor’s hand for a rosary and take refuge in the practices of the past. It’s a choice between retrenchment and assimilation.

That’s pretty much the choice facing Catholics on the weightier questions about the church’s future as well. Questions like whether priests can someday marry will be settled by the church’s hierarchy. But so far, the call on whether or not to hold hands has been left to the people in the pews. The choices we make about holding hands and other points of worship etiquette may not be as binding as a papal bull. But they help articulate the faithful’s vision of the church."

slate.com/id/2128994/
 
Dear Hagia Sophia,
That is a very articulate explanation of this controversy and I appreciate it very much. As the author says about himself, I’m rather middle of the road on these matters. I agree, I feel uncomfortable with the enforced touchy feelyism of hand-holding, but I also am tolerant of the need of others to express themselves in this way.

But, as this essay says, these seemingly trivial ettiquette matters represent a larger conflict within the Church between old and new, and other controversies. Very intelligently written!
 
Interesting article.
One thing- Questions like whether priests can someday marry will be settled by the church’s hierarchy. I think that needs to be reworded something like "wether married men becoming priests will be a norm for LR Catholic’s. I don’t think the Chruch has ever allowed ordained priests to become married- or deacons, if memory serves.
 
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sententia:
Interesting article.
One thing- Questions like whether priests can someday marry will be settled by the church’s hierarchy. I think that needs to be reworded something like "wether married men becoming priests will be a norm for LR Catholic’s. I don’t think the Chruch has ever allowed ordained priests to become married- or deacons, if memory serves.
In the news a little back, a South American Bishop brought up the idea of ordaining older married men who have proved themselves reliable and faithful, much like the Greek Orthodox do. I really wouldn’t have a problem with a grandpa type being ordained if they have raised their children and have no more responcibilities to them. The idea was shot down and the last synod, (So there is the answer and I have no beef with it) but it wouldn’t surprise me if it came up again.
 
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Jayson:
Hand Holding… ewww!
What kind of comment is that? I’ll bet there are people here on these forums who like it. Your comment is disrespectful and doesn’t sound very mature. Would you care to rephrase it more articulately?

It’s good to use ‘I’ statements. For instance: “I feel uncomfortable holding hands at church” or “I feel it’s inappropriate and detracts from the solemnity of the Mass” or " I think it’s a part of the Protestantization of the Church in America today"

See what I mean? Just making a statement of disgust like that is not helpful.
 
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spiritblows:
It’s good to use ‘I’ statements. For instance: “I feel uncomfortable holding hands at church” or “I feel it’s inappropriate and detracts from the solemnity of the Mass” or " I think it’s a part of the Protestantization of the Church in America today"

See what I mean? Just making a statement of disgust like that is not helpful.
Sometimes, even using an “I” statement can get one in trouble here!

Anyway, I have to share a story about mass today. My older daughter can be dreamy and forgets her social graces sometimes. She’s eight and we’re working on it.
Today, being All Saint’s Day and a Holy Day, our parish gets lots of visitors. With visitors comes what I like to call “Liturgical Innovations”. Orans, the motion where people “Lift up their hearts”, handholding, etc.
We were having an All Saints Party where the children dressed up. They were invited to come to mass and also took up the gifts. This was a major big deal to a five year old and eight year old. My older daughter was St. Agnus complete with a toy lamb with meant that she had to be told when she could take her “prop” with her. She was distracted.
The women behind us were not from our parish. My daughter didn’t notice through most of the mass when they did the innovations. However. the Our Father started with the hand holding Orans going on behind us. I was lost in prayer when I looked over to see my daughter staring with wide eyes at the ladies behind us. Luckily, at that moment, the prayer ended and she turned to the front.
I WAS truly embarrassed!
 
To me, it smacks of enforced good cheer and saccharine singalongs. But the trouble with being against hand-holding is that it puts you in league with the church’s most ultra-orthodox flat-Earthers. It’s a dilemma: Hold hands and give up a bit of the traditional Catholic solemnity, or forsake your neighbor’s hand for a rosary and take refuge in the practices of the past. It’s a choice between retrenchment and assimilation.
It is a shame many think this way. The choice is not as he puts it. Many of the “practices of the past” are timeless and cannot be properly characterized by trendy thinkers.

It is about a glimpse into eternity not being relevant or a stick in the mud.
 
It’s just not ok. We’re not supposed to be holding hands because the GIRM does not tell us to. Period.

and the orans is for the priest, not the laity.

Angel
 
Angels Watchin:
…and the orans is for the priest, not the laity.

Angel
In my parish,the orans is for anyone who chooses.
~ Kathy ~
 
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Katie1723:
In my parish,the orans is for anyone who chooses.
Code:
                 ~ Kathy ~
The Orans position is a priestly gesture during Mass, unless you can find a single Vatican document that states it is for the laity in the Liturgy.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
The Orans position is a priestly gesture during Mass, unless you can find a single Vatican document that states it is for the laity in the Liturgy.
Here is the answer from the USCCB website usccb.org/liturgy/q&a/mass/orans.shtml to the question:

*Orans

Many Catholics are in the habit of holding their hands in the “Orans” posture during the Lord’s prayer along with the celebrant. Some do this on their own as a private devotional posture while some congregations make it a general practice for their communities.

Is this practice permissible under the current rubrics, either as a private practice not something adopted by a particular parish as a communal gesture?

No position is prescribed in the present Sacramentary for an assembly gesture during the Lord’s Prayer.*

There is no posture prescribed, including folded hands, nor is there any prohibition noted here, which there certainly would have been if it existed since the question specifically addressed whether it was acceptable. We also know that there is at least one diocese that mandates the Orans position, which they obviously could not do if it was forbidden as strictly a priestly gesture.

Long and short of it, as Netmil(name removed by moderator) has correctly expressed on many occasions, it’s up to your Bishop and you should verify what your Bishop has to say on the matter.

Peace,
 
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spiritblows:
What kind of comment is that? I’ll bet there are people here on these forums who like it. Your comment is disrespectful and doesn’t sound very mature. Would you care to rephrase it more articulately?

It’s good to use ‘I’ statements. For instance: “I feel uncomfortable holding hands at church” or “I feel it’s inappropriate and detracts from the solemnity of the Mass” or " I think it’s a part of the Protestantization of the Church in America today"

See what I mean? Just making a statement of disgust like that is not helpful.
It was just meant to be silly. I’m not holding your hand any more. So there.
 
If we continue with the holding of hands, what stops people from using it throughout the rest of the mass?
 
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SummaTheo:
If we continue with the holding of hands, what stops people from using it throughout the rest of the mass?
Common sense I would hope.

I see a mother and her daughters holding hands during the Lord’s Prayer at Mass each week, I’ve never seen them do it at any other time during Mass. It doesn’t seem inappropriate to me, most people dont (hold hands) at the Mass I go to though.
 
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HagiaSophia:
Of course, most Catholics are neither vehemently touch-feely nor vehemently traditional. I’m not a big fan of hand-holding and have even complained about it in print. To me, it smacks of enforced good cheer and saccharine singalongs. But the trouble with being against hand-holding is that it puts you in league with the church’s most ultra-orthodox flat-Earthers. It’s a dilemma: Hold hands and give up a bit of the traditional Catholic solemnity, or forsake your neighbor’s hand for a rosary and take refuge in the practices of the past. It’s a choice between retrenchment and assimilation.
This kind of sums it up for me as well. I prefer not to hold hands, don’t use the orans (as I personally think it does confuse the role of the laity and the priest, as do those cheerful souls who feel the need to chime in when the priest says “Through Him, With Him, and in Him”…if that ain’t an abuse, I don’t know what is!), and wish they would shift the Sign of Peace to after the Confeitor instead of having a “meet and greet” during the Sacrifice of the Mass. You say these things in some circles and people assume you think the Chalice should be denied the laity (I don’t), there shouldn’t be lay readers (there should) and women should veils stapled onto their heads in the narthex (they shouldn’t). So I’m accused by one camp of being a man of a “pre-Vatican II mindset” by one camp (actually by one RCIA director who wanted my confirmand and the others in the class to face and pray to the four different directions) and of being a radical modernist by the other. I can only hope Jesus likes me.
 
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SummaTheo:
If we continue with the holding of hands, what stops people from using it throughout the rest of the mass?
Anytime that my wife wants to hold my hand, I welcome the embrace and sometimes she does at Mass
 
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Orionthehunter:
Anytime that my wife wants to hold my hand, I welcome the embrace and sometimes she does at Mass
Let me correct myself. What stops the whole congregation from holding hands throughout the whole mass? Secondly, people either approve or dissapprove but I’ve never heard of why someone does it.
 
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SummaTheo:
Let me correct myself. What stops the whole congregation from holding hands throughout the whole mass? Secondly, people either approve or dissapprove but I’ve never heard of why someone does it.
Like the other poster said, common sense. It would be ridiculous to hold hands throughout the whole Mass and totally impractical but its not inappropriate during The Lord’s Prayer which is considered the family/community prayer (“Our Father”) which is why many people hold hands during this prayer only.
I still don’t understand why some people consider this an abuse because they say its not specified in the GIRM. Are these people saying they know better than the Popes and all the councils of bishops in the past 40 years or so. If it was an abuse it would have been forbidden. It has not been forbidden so it is not considered an abuse.
 
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