Holy Eucarist

[rosario]

Quite often, I find that just me and those in my family are the only ones in the Church who don’t go to receive this most Blessed Sacrament because we know we may be unworthy at that very moment. There is so much sense of entitlement when it comes to the Eucarist. Maybe we are the only sinners in the Church at the time, who knows?

I know that we don’t know what’s in people’s heart during communion, however, what about when we know for a fact that someone is unworthy to receive Holy Communion, because they are divorced, or not married in the Church, or taking birth control, or having an affair?

So then, If say, a friend who married in the Church, but is divorced, attends a service with me and stands up to receive communion. Because that is the Holy Body of Christ, and we are his militant army here on earth, shouldn’t I who knows her situation in good faith stop her from forming on the line to receive?The Priest may not know, but I know. Also, a few years back, I attended a service in which the Priest knew that a certain lady was on birth control, (I was there in the room when she told him right during mass, it was only about 3 or 4 of us there), and he gave her communion as if nothing. I don’t understand this. I was very dissappointed. I know not to cast stones, but this was dissapointing to me. My faith didn’t waiver though, I was simply very mad.

 

[Catholic_Dude]

Dont forget John Kerry!
(Never mind, dont let this get off topic)

In terms of “entitled”, thats a good point. This topic comes up all the time. I think one problem why there is so much confusion is that no priest will stand up and say anything. Its rooted in the concept of not wanting to cause anyone to “fall away” or “offend” anyone, or worse yet not be “liked by the people”, but it is wrong. If there was hard core priests telling it like it is then this would not be as big of an issue. But on such a large scale and compounded over the years, even if a moderate priest wanted to say anything he might think twice. There are Bible passages that deal with not receiving unworthily, and I think they should sneek them in on Sundays.

 

[hungry]

This sacrement you call “most blessed” is an abomination and a total denial of what Jesus Christ has already accomplished on the cross.

When He said, “It is finished.”, He meant it. There is no more sacrifice for sin. Read it in Romans, Galatians, Hebrews, and every other Epistle. Oh we are promised so much if we only believe.

See the book, The Revelation of Jesus Christ, “Worthy is the Lamb”!

Think about it. No more idols or false christs. Praise the One Who has already paid the price. Amen?

Worthy is the Lamb, Who died in awesome grief;
Worthy is the Lamb, Who saved a dying thief.
Worthy is the Lamb, to make up for my fall, yes,
Worthy is the Lamb, He is all.

 

[kaygee]

I’m going to hate myself for taking the bait, but it’s 5:14 am and I can’t get back to sleep, so here goes:

This sacrement you call “most blessed” is an abomination and a total denial of what Jesus Christ has already accomplished on the cross.
When He said, “It is finished.”, He meant it. There is no more sacrifice for sin. Read it in Romans, Galatians, Hebrews, and every other Epistle. Oh we are promised so much if we only believe.

No wonder your user name is “Hungry” – deep down you must hunger to receive Jesus Himself – His body, blood, soul and divinity in the most holy Eucharist. His holy sacrifice is Finished, as He said, but it still exists in His Eternity and is an ever present reality to the believer who will only receive Him in that way. Receiving Him in one’s heart is important, but receiving Him in one’s mouth, swallowing Him, and allowing His blessed presence to course through one’s entire body is sublime. He is indeed the Bread of Life and unless we eat His Body and drink His Blood, we cannot have life. Read the Gospel of John (especially the 6th chapter) carefully with an openness to the Spirit.

 

[LittleDeb]

rosario:

So then, If say, a friend who married in the Church, but is divorced, attends a service with me and stands up to receive communion. Because that is the Holy Body of Christ, and we are his militant army here on earth, shouldn’t I who knows her situation in good faith stop her from forming on the line to receive?

Your friend’s state of divorce does not make her unable to receive communion. Her divorced state is a civil matter. It is only if she has contracted another marriage (civil or otherwise) that would constitute inability to receive communion. Is she “re” married? (re is in quotes because as Catholics we cannot “remarry” any more than we can be “re-baptized.”)

I agree so much with you that it is a sad state for our souls if we receive Holy Eucharist while in a state of mortal sin. The one time I did not receive due to mortal sin I got my rear end to Reconciliation right away. I admire you for being aware of your own sinfullness. Please pray for others like me who do not always do an examination of conscience like we should.

The question I would still raise is the ability to judge someone else’s worthiness. Since our Communion is distributed by Extra-ordinary Ministers in addition to Priests and Deacons, laypeople do not nor should know the state of another’s soul.

The example you gave about the Priest giving to a woman openly contracepting was a very good one. Does he have the authority to judge her soul? Probably. He can advise and help her. He can tell her until he is blue in the face that contraception is a mortal sin, but it is still her decision. If she does not have all three components of sin she might not be in a state of sin. If she really does not know artificial contraception is grave matter or does not give full consent to contracept then she might still be worthy. If he denied her Communion would she just go somewhere else where the Priest doesn’t know her?

 

[LittleDeb]

Catholic Dude:

Dont forget John Kerry!
(Never mind, dont let this get off topic)

In terms of “entitled”, thats a good point. This topic comes up all the time. I think one problem why there is so much confusion is that no priest will stand up and say anything. Its rooted in the concept of not wanting to cause anyone to “fall away” or “offend” anyone, or worse yet not be “liked by the people”, but it is wrong. If there was hard core priests telling it like it is then this would not be as big of an issue. But on such a large scale and compounded over the years, even if a moderate priest wanted to say anything he might think twice. There are Bible passages that deal with not receiving unworthily, and I think they should sneek them in on Sundays.

:yup:
I liked the reference to Sen. Kerry here. What I told my non-Catholic friends is a lot like what I am reading into what Rosario is saying. He personally should choose not to receive because public campaigning for abortion is very close to assisting or contracting in the assistance of an abortion. I would not personally withhold Communion from him if he stood before me seeking it because I do not know the state of his soul.

 

[Fergal]

hungry:

This sacrement you call “most blessed” is an abomination and a total denial of what Jesus Christ has already accomplished on the cross.

And you call yourself Christian with comments like this? Shame on you hungry. Never make little of something over 1 billion people hold sacred. It is the source and summit of our very lives.

Forget learning anything about your faith our ours, it looks as if a basic course in manners is what is needed most.

 

[Mijoy2]

Wow, Hungry didn’t last long before getting suspended.
I was wondering, if one is suspended, does one get a notice from the moderators? Or does the log-in just fail?

 

[Edwin1961]

Mijoy2:

Wow, Hungry didn’t last long before getting suspended.
I was wondering, if one is suspended, does one get a notice from the moderators? Or does the log-in just fail?

I think this is how it goes…
A person ‘suspended’ can read post, but is denied posting. It like, ‘You can see, but can’t touch.’

 

[Edwin1961]

Just a note on recieving Commuion from an Eastern Catholic.

Our Pastor is VERY orthodox (Not BIG ‘O’ but little’o’). He says that NO ONE IS worthy to accept the Eucharist for it IS Christ. HOWEVER, we accept in faith and reverence that HE IS the Eucharist.

During our Divine Liturgy, the priest says the following for those who want to receive:

“Approach, with Fear of God, and with Faith.”
‘Fear of God’=reverence. It is the awesome power of God to be the Eucharist.
That is what God does. Jesus didn’t have to institute the Eucharist but he did knowling all well that His Church needed His presence to set us apart from everyone else. Why do you think some of his Disciples walked and couldn’t take what Jesus was saying (John 6:66)

Our part is ‘with Faith.’= it is Our part to Believe that Christ IS in the Eucharist. From there, we are nourished and strengthened in our lives.

During our Communion Prayer, we pray that:
“May the partaking of You Holy Mysteries, O Lord, be not for my judgment or condemnation, but for the healing of soul and body!”

In this part of our prayer, we recognize that the Eucharist has the power to save AND condemn if taken unworthily.
Maybe if Latin Rite Catholics can attend just One Byzantine or Eastern CATHOLIC Liturgy, and listen and recite our Communion Prayer, that there is more going on there that meets the eye.

Lord, have mercy on Us all!
Edwin

 

[maendem]

rosario:

Quite often, I find that just me and those in my family are the only ones in the Church who don’t go to receive this most Blessed Sacrament because we know we may be unworthy at that very moment. There is so much sense of entitlement when it comes to the Eucarist. Maybe we are the only sinners in the Church at the time, who knows?

.

Dear Rosario,

I’m sure you have no such intention, but not receiving Communion because you may be unworthy is simply false pride. NONE of us are EVER worthy to receive the Eucharist - no saint on earth ever was. Thomas a Kempis writes in the Imitation of Christ that we could spend years preparing ourselves for just one proper reception of the Eucharist, and still, we would be utterly unworthy to ever approach our Lord.

The sense of entitlement you mention is equally prevalent and misplaced, but I don’t think you’re in danger of that! Yet, Christ commands us sinners to “take and eat,” knowing that we need Him more than life itself, and that we need the Eucharist to strengthen us against sin. Christ Himself is our righteousness–only in Him, and by Him, can we come to the Father. We can’t come on our own when we finally think we’re “worthy enough.” That would be arrogance itself.

Receive the Eucharist as a child from her Father - joyfully, simply, and with great, great love, without an exaggerated analysis of your worthiness or sinfullness. Such analyzing does not come from God, but rather is a temptation.

As for the others…it’s simply not your business to monitor them. Let God see their hearts and be their judge.

 

[Lucania]

rosario:

Quite often, I find that just me and those in my family are the only ones in the Church who don’t go to receive this most Blessed Sacrament because we know we may be unworthy at that very moment. There is so much sense of entitlement when it comes to the Eucarist. Maybe we are the only sinners in the Church at the time, who knows?

I know that we don’t know what’s in people’s heart during communion, however, what about when we know for a fact that someone is unworthy to receive Holy Communion, because they are divorced, or not married in the Church, or taking birth control, or having an affair?

So then, If say, a friend who married in the Church, but is divorced, attends a service with me and stands up to receive communion. Because that is the Holy Body of Christ, and we are his militant army here on earth, shouldn’t I who knows her situation in good faith stop her from forming on the line to receive?The Priest may not know, but I know. Also, a few years back, I attended a service in which the Priest knew that a certain lady was on birth control, (I was there in the room when she told him right during mass, it was only about 3 or 4 of us there), and he gave her communion as if nothing. I don’t understand this. I was very dissappointed. I know not to cast stones, but this was dissapointing to me. My faith didn’t waiver though, I was simply very mad.

Just because someone is divorced does not make them unworthy to receive the Holy Eucharist! However, if that person is living with her boyfriend or was re-married outside of the Church that is different.So if you have come to the conclusion that she is unworthy to receive Our Lord based only on the fact that she is divorced than that is not right.

 

[LittleDeb]

maendem:

The sense of entitlement you mention is equally prevalent and misplaced, but I don’t think you’re in danger of that! Yet, Christ commands us sinners to “take and eat,” knowing that we need Him more than life itself, and that we need the Eucharist to strengthen us against sin. Christ Himself is our righteousness–only in Him, and by Him, can we come to the Father. We can’t come on our own when we finally think we’re “worthy enough.” That would be arrogance itself.

Receive the Eucharist as a child from her Father - joyfully, simply, and with great, great love, without an exaggerated analysis of your worthiness or sinfullness. Such analyzing does not come from God, but rather is a temptation.

While agree with what you are saying about judging others I have a question about the rest. From what I read it seems as if you are saying that there is no reason (for a Catholic) not to receive Communion? In my answer to Rosario I was referring to my own state of mortal sin being a reason I should not have received. Mortal sin is a (chosen) separation from God and therefore His Church. Didn’t my state of mortal sin put me in the same state as someone not in union with the Church?

I look forward to your response. The eloquent language you referenced was beautiful. I appreciated its emphasis on forgiveness and child-like love.

 

[stbruno]

Do we not all say the words right before the reception of the Holy Eucharist…Oh Lord, I am not worthy to receive, but only say the words, and I shall be healed!

We who sin, but are not in mortal sin, all are able to receive the Holy Eucharist. We are invited to a banquet, and we should eat…we need these graces that this great gift possesses.

In addition, during the Penitential Rite of the mass, we ask the Lord for mercy for our sins…

 

[maendem]

midgetface:

While agree with what you are saying about judging others I have a question about the rest. From what I read it seems as if you are saying that there is no reason (for a Catholic) not to receive Communion? In my answer to Rosario I was referring to my own state of mortal sin being a reason I should not have received. Mortal sin is a (chosen) separation from God and therefore His Church. Didn’t my state of mortal sin put me in the same state as someone not in union with the Church?

I look forward to your response. The eloquent language you referenced was beautiful. I appreciated its emphasis on forgiveness and child-like love.

Dear medgetface,

You are right - we should not receive Communion in a state of mortal sin, but it’s not simply because we are not worthy. By ourselves, we are always unworthy. Rather, as I understand it, it is because by sinning we have wilfully cut ourselves off from God, and we cannot participate in this ultimate, intimate act of love with God if we have not repented and been forgiven. As you note, we can’t celebrate our union with God when we have deliberately placed ourself in dis-union. That entails a deep contradiction.

What I was responding to in Rosario’s message, and perhaps I misunderstood her, was the tendency to eschew Communion out of a false sense of humility, as if there ever COULD be a time when we autonomously possessed enough worthiness to take Communion. Taking Communion depending on our feelings (whether I feel holy and worthy enough today, or not) is surely a faulty and subjective basis.

No doubt the devil will always assure us we are never worthy and thus keep us from receiving. Rather than have us recognize we must run to Jesus when we have sinned so that we may quickly be reunited with Him, the devil will have us focus on how terrible we are, how far from salvation–thus he can keep us from receiving not just one but two of the sacraments - reconciliation and the Eucharist. He seeks to erode our trust in God, and tries to make salvation something we must deserve.

But yes, mortal sin would be quite different, and I did not mean to imply that Catholics in this state should be free to receive Communion.

Thank you for your kind words.

 

[puzzleannie]

In charity we are obliged to assume that everyone who approaches communion is in a state of sanctifying grace. If it so happens that we have certain knowledge of a continuing state or action of their life that contradicts Catholic moral teaching, we assume that they confessed and were absolved before coming to communion. Under no circumstances do we presume to judge the state of another person’s soul. that is reserved to the priest in the confessional. the time before and after communion should be spent praying for my worthy reception of communion, not speculation on what others are or are not doing. If I am not conscious of grave sin, I confidently receive communion in the knowledge that my venial sins have been forgiven in the penitential rite and the domine non sum dignus.

 

[Island_Oak]

maendem:

Dear Rosario,

I’m sure you have no such intention, but not receiving Communion because you may be unworthy is simply false pride. NONE of us are EVER worthy to receive the Eucharist - no saint on earth ever was. Thomas a Kempis writes in the Imitation of Christ that we could spend years preparing ourselves for just one proper reception of the Eucharist, and still, we would be utterly unworthy to ever approach our Lord.

The sense of entitlement you mention is equally prevalent and misplaced, but I don’t think you’re in danger of that! Yet, Christ commands us sinners to “take and eat,” knowing that we need Him more than life itself, and that we need the Eucharist to strengthen us against sin. Christ Himself is our righteousness–only in Him, and by Him, can we come to the Father. We can’t come on our own when we finally think we’re “worthy enough.” That would be arrogance itself.

Receive the Eucharist as a child from her Father - joyfully, simply, and with great, great love, without an exaggerated analysis of your worthiness or sinfullness. Such analyzing does not come from God, but rather is a temptation.

As for the others…it’s simply not your business to monitor them. Let God see their hearts and be their judge.

Thoughtful and generous response. I would only add that judging the purity of another’s soul, something which none of us can accurately do, and speculating or assuming that it is in a state unworthy of receiving the eucharist is not only uncharitable, but could in itself be sinful. Best to tend our own garden–so to speak–and not concern ourselves with our neighbors’ weeds.

 

[LittleDeb]

puzzleannie:

In charity we are obliged to assume that everyone who approaches communion is in a state of sanctifying grace. If it so happens that we have certain knowledge of a continuing state or action of their life that contradicts Catholic moral teaching, we assume that they confessed and were absolved before coming to communion. Under no circumstances do we presume to judge the state of another person’s soul. that is reserved to the priest in the confessional. the time before and after communion should be spent praying for my worthy reception of communion, not speculation on what others are or are not doing. If I am not conscious of grave sin, I confidently receive communion in the knowledge that my venial sins have been forgiven in the penitential rite and the domine non sum dignus.

I agree. So how DO we handle a situation such as Sen. Kerry’s seemingly contradictory public and private life? My response to people just didn’t seem sufficient. They wanted to know if I personally was offended. Honestly, it was hard not to be, but I still said it was his soul not mine.

I got asked about it a lot. Of course it was partly in fun by my friends because I happen to have an ex-boyfriend by the same name (different spelling though) who is also a Catholic.

Sorry if I took over thread but this is still an important topic in our area due to some local politicians.

 

[tradcatmel]

Its a very tricky situation.

I would seek the advice of a priest.

In some ways you could be preventing a sacriligious communion…