Homeless Man Sleeping in Church

[nsm]

Today I went to daily mass at a Cathedral in a major US city. Before confession, a homeless man came up to each person standing in line, gave his story about being sick with AIDS and asked for money. I gave him money, but I had a funny feeling about it.

I have an update to my post from last week. Today I went to mass and the same man who had come up to each person standing in line walked all the way across the enormous Cathedral and sat right in front of me while I was praying the Rosary. He waited quietly while I finished my prayer (during which I was VERY distracted, unfortunately) and then gave a completely different story and asked for $70.00. Remembering the discussion on this board, I felt uncomfortable and upset. Since he came all the way over to where I was sitting and sat right in front of me for twenty minutes just to ask me for more money I am feeling like a total idiot, and a target. This time I directed him to the church’s front desk for help. He was very persistent in saying that the church would not give him money, but I just continued to direct him there. Eventually he left in a huff. Throughout mass I was thinking about what had just occurred and feeling a rush of emotions. The end result was that I was distracted during the Rosary AND at mass.

After mass I went up to the woman who was manning the welcome booth and asked what the protocol is for people who come and beg at church. Was there a place that we could direct them to, etc. She said to just ignore them. I didn’t feel good about that answer but I was so flustered by the incident I just nodded and left.

I understand the imperative to give from Christ, but how can one give WITHOUT becoming a target for opportunists. As a woman, I feel the extra burden of remaining safe. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated!!!

 

[Cathryn]

I work in a parish and the usual request is “enough money for a bus ticket to_____.” They usually say they are not hungry, but stranded and need transportation money usually at least $70. They want large amounts of money not small.

 

[Castello]

I work in a parish and the usual request is “enough money for a bus ticket to_____.” They usually say they are not hungry, but stranded and need transportation money usually at least $70. They want large amounts of money not small.

If you take a few minutes to verify the story, then, you can go online and buy them a non-refundable bus ticket… when you do those things, 99% of the time you will find the story is not true.

 

[Castello]

Shelters can be cold, dirty, dangerous and degrading. The homeless are not animals that have to follow curfews in order to get a doggy treat, they are human beings, just like you. Just as you do not want others to tell you how to live your life, neither do they. A lot of these programs you speak of require a lot of things in order to get them. ID cards (almost imposable to get if you are homeless in some states) or demand that you listen to some sermon before you get help.

However far more important is this. In a few years you are going to die and stand before God, do you REALLY think he is going to give you a pass because these homeless are not like the homeless in his time? Remember that Jesus himself said that you will ALWAYS have the poor with you. He did not say, always other then in the USA in 2000 years, they are not the same kind of poor, so don’t help them.

Look, you do whatever you want to do, and think whatever you want to think. I for one am going to keep helping the homeless in any way that I can. I think the biggest thing that the homeless need is understanding and love. Not people who look down on them.

Pax

P.S. My God was a broke homeless rebel who did not like the rich, the powerful or those who thought they were better then others.

I have to obey rules. I have to come to work ontime and do my work, I would love to watch youtube videos at my desk all day long - but, in order to get a paycheck, I have to obey the rules.

I would love to have 19 dogs and paint my walls purple, but, my landlord has rules.

Everyone in society has to live by rules.

Having worked FULL TIME in outreach for the past 3 years (with 2 decades of volunteering before that), did I ever say I look down on people? I have facilitated the distro of tens of thousands of dollars in aid, am on a first name basis with most of the homeless in my town.

No, I have learned that most of the people who come asking are not telling the truth. Those really in need do not ask. We have to search for them and reach out to them.

The smartest thing to do is to direct those asking to someone who is trained in how to best assist them. Your St Vincent De Paul Society or Catholic Charities will have the resources for you.

Please, donate to your St VdP or to Catholic Charities, food bank or to you local free medical clinic. They are doing God’s work every day.

 

[ATeutonicKnight]

Today I went to daily mass at a Cathedral in a major US city. Before confession, a homeless man came up to each person standing in line, gave his story about being sick with AIDS and asked for money. I gave him money, but I had a funny feeling about it. Just after confession, as I was walking to the pews to sit down for mass, I noticed that another homeless man was sleeping in one of the pews and so I purposefully sat closer to the front to put distance between me and the man. I prayed the rosary and then mass began. Halfway through mass I felt really bad about my actions and I was afraid that I had just walked out of confession only to commit a private (potentially mortal?) sin right away.

I have two questions:

1. Was what I did mortal, or was my sense of sin heightened because I just left confession and prayed the rosary? (My sins have seemed to be really stark now, after starting daily rosary - has anyone else had this occur? Btw, I am not scrupulous.)
2. How do others react to homeless people at Church?

Here’s a bit of background on my interactions with the homeless: My first instinct is always to recoil from homeless people. I am not proud of that. A few years ago, I did just that while walking with one of my friends. As I hurriedly passed, the homeless man called my name. That stopped me in my tracks. I looked harder and noticed that I recognized the man. It was my uncle! After that I felt really convicted about having a heart for the homeless, but my gut reaction has remained the same. Most of this is because they smell bad. A few weeks ago I was eating at a mall eatery in San Francisco and a homeless man sat right next to me and started eating off the plates nearby. He smelled terrible. I lost my appetite and sat uncomfortably silent, another man’s reaction was to shoo him away, and my husband’s first reaction was to give him some food. I wish that my gut reaction was like my husbands! I do try to give money to the homeless if asked (but I am not always consistent).

It sounds like you should pray to Saint Francis of Assisi and Blessed Mother Teresa. Saint Francis was recorded to have always have been disgusted by those with leprosy, and yet, after his conversion, he met one on a road. His appearance disgusted him, and he wanted to walk in the other direction. But instead, he walked up to him, kissed him on the cheek, and gave him money. When he started going down the road again he looked back, and the leper was no longer there. He had disappeared. Saint Francis realized the leper was a test, and he had passed it. The next time you see a homeless person, be kind to him, no matter how much he repulses you. You’re not a bad person for being repulsed by the homeless. But instead of giving into the natural feelings of wanting to go away, show the homeless man Christian charity. If he should come close to you or if you should have to come close to him, smile. A genuine smile can do so much. Women have especially been given the gift of a beautiful smile. Use this gift the Lord has given you!

My parents have been great examples of Christian charity over the years when it comes to homeless people. My parents, no matter how broke they are, will give at least five to ten dollars to homeless people. If they have more, they’ll give more. My parents have been so good about this that they even once drove a homeless man sixty-five miles to a bigger town so he would get closer to his destination, bought him dinner, and gave him enough money for his bus ticket.

Pray to Saints that were known to take care of the poor (Franciscan Saints are a great place to start), and ask Mary and God to help you to see Christ in everybody, especially homeless people. I would confess being uncharitable to homeless people, but I would also explain the situations you mentioned to him and ask him what he thinks. If he thinks there was a possible sin, he’ll absolve you and give you advice. If not, he’ll give you advice.

 

[zenith15]

Most homeless people are homeless by choice. They could be self-sufficient if they wanted to but why should they if they know they can prey on soft-hearted (soft-headed?) people for a handout?

Why do you think they hang around churches? Because they can play you for a fool and put you on a guilt trip at the thought of betraying your Catholic values of charity. Ever notice how street-people say God Bless all the time? They are trying to manipulate your conscious.

Personally, I won’t give money to homeless beggars. I may direct them to a shelter, but that’s all. Giving them money is just a disincentive for them to try and better themselves.

And anyone can better themselves if they want to bad enough and try hard enough.

Most homeless people are homeless by CHOICE??? Oh my goodness. That is such a misstatement I barely know how to respond.

Yes it’s true there are a few individuals who do prefer to live out in the open for whatever reason but they are by no means the majority. There are few public places homeless people can go, and if one is homeless or living in a car, etc there is little chance to put on a grand appearance or shower up beforehand. But being outside in the extremes of weather can be agonizing and yes, some may turn to large churches for a short respite from the heat or cold. Or they may turn to libraries, or malls.

Yes, there are shelters–but not nearly enough for all who need them, and the shelters themselves are often dangerous and frightening places, especially for those with mental illness. Shelter residents are often robbed of their meager possessions or attacked by other residents. And homeless families have it even worse. They are often forced to split up to find shelter, and are fearful of exposing their kids to a shelter environment.

Many night shelters force the residents to leave during the daylight hours–ostensibly to look for a job, although many are medically or mentally unable to work, and even if they are, in this economic era it’s hard enough to get a job without also being homeless, without access to a phone or email, or decent clothing.

I recently read of a methadone clinic who wanted to open in a town with a large opioid addicted population. The town illegally tried to require the clinic to locate at least 2000 feet from: schools, playgrounds, daycares, hospitals, funeral homes, libraries, nursing homes, and CHURCHES! These are people in treatment for their addiction, often to prescribed pain meds, and who come from ALL walks of life, but regardless of that, the very idea of forcing such a place to locate far away from GOD’S HOUSE, where they are most likely to get to meet Christ–“What Would Jesus Do”, indeed?

 

[zenith15]

The kind of poverty that existed in the New Testament was very different than the homeless people in the United States today.

There exists either in your town or in driving distance shelters and programs to help people out of homelessness. These programs have recovery programs for the addicted, job training, life skills, etc.

I have worked with social outreach for years and have never met someone who did not have an alternative to homelessness, they simply refuse the help that does exist. With a few minutes research you can find those places in your community and keep little cards with the information on them to give to those in need of a place to stay. Keep some granola bars, canned pop-top food and bottled water to give to those who are hungry. Don’t ever give cash.

Worked with one man who left the shelter because the beds were too hard or they did not like the curfew. Women who leave because they want to have a boyfriend sleep over.

Have never met someone who was homeless and destitute who had a home church. The first step down the road to destruction is separating oneself from the family and the Church, what God designed as the basic units of society.

I’m sorry but you are incorrect. I also work with those organizations and I know for a fact there is not enough help to go around, not enough beds at night, not enough food for those with no way to prepare it (a bag of beans does little good to someone with no home and no stove). Women often do not stay in shelters because they have a FAMILY–a husband and kids–and the shelters force these families to break up in order to accommodate them.

My church has a house that they allow homeless families to stay in for a week at a time and in that time they do all they can to assist them to find shelter, a job, food, etc. But this is only helping 52 families a year, in a very big town. Shelters are often dirty, dank, foul smelling and dangerous places where people legitimately fear to go . Additionally, most kick people out during the day. I have often gone to agencies to try and get help for people–Catholic ones included–and there just was not enough to go around, period. Assuming there is is a big mistake.

 

[Castello]

Our experiences vary.

Within 60 miles of where I work there are several “family shelters”. These are places where families stay together, get job training and placement assistance.

We also work to help the homeless to re-connect with their own God-given support system, their extended family (the homeless relief program that God designed).

I’ve yet to find an honestly homeless family that cannot be assisted by one or the other of those options.

Prayers that your area opens family shelters and programs to help families reunite.

 

[zenith15]

Yes they certainly DO vary. As I said, several of the larger churches have houses they keep especially to assist homeless families for a week or two at a time. We also have a few shelters run by Salvation Army, HoBo (helping our brothers out), and certain missions, all of which are male only. We do have a shelter for abused women and children but they do not accept people for being homeless. There are NOT ENOUGH such facilities and they are being funded less and less (if at all) by the day. Food pantries often give out food that is useless to those without a home and cooking equipment.

I once gave a homeless man $10 and he was so overcome he began to weep and hugged me. Yes he was dirty and smelled badly but he did not smell of alcohol nor did he seem to be high in any way. I hugged him back because sometimes such folks begin to feel like pariahs and need a human touch–just as St Francis hugged the Leper. Shooing everyone you encounter away to the “agencies” who are supposed to care for them reminds me of the Good Samaritan–and those who came along the road before him, assuming that someone else would care for him.

Yes, we must use good judgment in how we assist people–but we must also use love, compassion, and sympathy. Things are not so easy for the homeless as you may be led to believe, and it’s very easy to sweep their problems all into a nice little pile and say “really, they just don’t care–there’s plenty of help available for good DECENT homeless people”, etc etc.

 

[nsm]

From the discussion today, I am slightly confused as to what might be good protocol to follow in the future.

When the same man who i’d offered money to a week before sought me out again today with a new story I did not give to him because he gave a different story which was obviously untrue. I hated to turn him away, but I felt like he might just start to target me every time I came to church because he knew that I would give him money. I do not know him from Adam, and he could potentially pose a risk. But, I do not think that “ignoring” the homeless in church, as I was instructed to do by the welcome desk woman, is a good policy either.

What should a person do in this situation? Isn’t just giving continually to someone who is clearly not being truthful (but also clearly in need) creating a potentially dangerous situation?

 

[MartyrForJesus]

Bump.

 

[CompSciGuy]

Today I went to daily mass at a Cathedral in a major US city. Before confession, a homeless man came up to each person standing in line, gave his story about being sick with AIDS and asked for money. I gave him money, but I had a funny feeling about it. Just after confession, as I was walking to the pews to sit down for mass, I noticed that another homeless man was sleeping in one of the pews and so I purposefully sat closer to the front to put distance between me and the man. I prayed the rosary and then mass began. Halfway through mass I felt really bad about my actions and I was afraid that I had just walked out of confession only to commit a private (potentially mortal?) sin right away.

I have two questions:

1. Was what I did mortal, or was my sense of sin heightened because I just left confession and prayed the rosary? (My sins have seemed to be really stark now, after starting daily rosary - has anyone else had this occur? Btw, I am not scrupulous.)
2. How do others react to homeless people at Church?

Here’s a bit of background on my interactions with the homeless: My first instinct is always to recoil from homeless people. I am not proud of that. A few years ago, I did just that while walking with one of my friends. As I hurriedly passed, the homeless man called my name. That stopped me in my tracks. I looked harder and noticed that I recognized the man. It was my uncle! After that I felt really convicted about having a heart for the homeless, but my gut reaction has remained the same. Most of this is because they smell bad. A few weeks ago I was eating at a mall eatery in San Francisco and a homeless man sat right next to me and started eating off the plates nearby. He smelled terrible. I lost my appetite and sat uncomfortably silent, another man’s reaction was to shoo him away, and my husband’s first reaction was to give him some food. I wish that my gut reaction was like my husbands! I do try to give money to the homeless if asked (but I am not always consistent).

I really think that people in this forum worry way too much about whether their sin is mortal. Let’s go over this again, there are three requirements for mortal sin: 1. it is of grave matter, 2. it is done with full knowledge, 3. it is done with full consent. The second two don’t matter unless the first is true. Because your sin does not meet the first requirement, it is not a mortal sin. In fact it was probably just your instinct that you were following.

 

[CompSciGuy]

If you take a few minutes to verify the story, then, you can go online and buy them a non-refundable bus ticket… when you do those things, 99% of the time you will find the story is not true.

I know it’s sad, but Castello is telling the truth. Even where I live, a small college town in Texas, there are beggars (I don’t know why… college kids are typically poor). I used to give out money to a lot of people who came along… I think some of them really are legitimate, and I can often tell pretty well when someone is lying to my face and when someone is really in need. I think it is best to do what Castello is saying - if they ask you for money for something, offer to buy them whatever it is that they are asking for. If it is food, offer to buy them food. If it is gas, offer to buy them gas. 99% of the time they will not want it. They will try to find some way to weasel their way out of it. When you take this approach you are not turning them away, and yet at the same time you are not giving them drug money.

 

[themeginthemoon]

I know it’s sad, but Castello is telling the truth. Even where I live, a small college town in Texas, there are beggars (I don’t know why… college kids are typically poor). I used to give out money to a lot of people who came along… I think some of them really are legitimate, and I can often tell pretty well when someone is lying to my face and when someone is really in need. I think it is best to do what Castello is saying - if they ask you for money for something, offer to buy them whatever it is that they are asking for. If it is food, offer to buy them food. If it is gas, offer to buy them gas. 99% of the time they will not want it. They will try to find some way to weasel their way out of it. When you take this approach you are not turning them away, and yet at the same time you are not giving them drug money.

Castello is telling their truth, in their city, as are you… but that doesn’t necessarily make it the truth, you know what I mean?
There is a different truth where I live. I am also in poverty work… our shelters are few and far between. There is not a single solitary ‘family’ shelter… there is one men’s shelter and 2 women’s shelters, and one shelter for the mentally ill and addicted that works on transitioning them into permanent housing (this one has the right idea, but again, is not in the position to help families). The women’s shelters will not accept women who have male children over 12 years of age, and the waiting lists are several months long now. Not much help to those in need of emergency care. Even better, one of them is a domestic violence shelter, with a huge waiting list as well! My state has the 8th highest rate of women murdered by men in the country… we have a major domestic violence problem.

Some places have more resources than others, my city and surrounding areas do not. We can’t blanket statement the homeless by saying ‘most of them are lying’, because that’s just not true. Even if it were, it’s dehumanizing to have your life looked at under a microscope like some type of insect. The ‘system’ here works to stigmatize people, not help them.

 

[CompSciGuy]

Some places have more resources than others, my city and surrounding areas do not. We can’t blanket statement the homeless by saying ‘most of them are lying’, because that’s just not true. Even if it were, it’s dehumanizing to have your life looked at under a microscope like some type of insect. The ‘system’ here works to stigmatize people, not help them.

You didn’t address what I said. If the people are telling the truth, then great, they should have no problem accepting my help in the form of food, gas, etc. rather than cash. Sometimes they do. If they are insistent on cash, and refuse to accept food, etc. then what reason do we have to believe that they are telling the truth? You may say that not trusting their intentions in this way is dehumanizing as it damages their pride, but be realistic, it is normal not to immediately trust people that you do not know. Do you really think it is doing them more good throwing money at them?

 

[themeginthemoon]

You didn’t address what I said. If the people are telling the truth, then great, they should have no problem accepting my help in the form of food, gas, etc. rather than cash. Sometimes they do. If they are insistent on cash, and refuse to accept food, etc. then what reason do we have to believe that they are telling the truth? You may say that not trusting their intentions in this way is dehumanizing as it damages their pride, but be realistic, it is normal not to immediately trust people that you do not know. Do you really think it is doing them more good throwing money at them?

I completely agree with in-kind gifts such as food and gas cards versus cash, sorry I didn’t address that. I am simply saying that being homeless is a complex problem, and that resource systems are not perfect everywhere, and in some place systems even set people up to fail.

Yes, I am looking at things from a humanist perspective… I am in graduate school studying Public Health and Social Work.

 

[bill_Karabinus]

Hello nsm, how are you? I have had some experience with this and I understand how you feel. I was the director of a homeless ministry until May of this year when I was forced into retirement due to a diagnoses of cancer. I spent 10 - 16 hours a day with these people (including parolee’s) 6 days a week and I can assure you that you most likely made the right choice. Although I do not agree that “most” of these people choose homelessness I admit that many do but either way these people are indeed often mentally impaired and dangerous. When approached, especially in Church you must trust your own judgement and it is very important that you take the fears/feelings of your fellow parishoners into account. 90% of these people come to the Churches because they know that this is the ONLY place that they will receive help, handouts, money, food, etc… I am not saying that this is wrong, indeed there are many Churches out there doing great work helping those in need but as an individual you can only do certain things. It is a great individual calling to help anyone in need and I believe you should do this but there are many ways in which you can help the homeless. Instead of giving money (you voiced worries about the use of your gift) you can give canned food to the local food bank, you can volunteer at a soup kitchen/homeless shelter. I know the Salvation Army is a good and reputable place to start. In doing this you relieve your obligations (self-inflicted) and will for sure feel better about the whole thing. If you do realize that this is something that you enjoy and wish to do more of you can speak with your priest and see if he knows of any organizations inside or outside of your parish that could use your help.

You see, there is a lot that you can do but most of all, do not punish yourself for your fears as they are healthy and normal. God loves you too and He understands so be cautious as you move forward and please, please do help, these people are lost and most would just love to have one normal day…

God bless you and yours.

Bill K.

 

[Castello]

Even if it were, it’s dehumanizing to have your life looked at under a microscope like some type of insect. The ‘system’ here works to stigmatize people, not help them.

Very sorry that your area does not have shelters for families. I will pray for someone to open one!

Still stuck on the life looked at under a microscope idea… I have to show ID when I cash a check, I have to have references and background checks to get a job or to take out a loan, I have to verify my ID to log in to pay my phone bill - heck, I have to have a detailed application form and background check to be an usher at Church.

When did it become dehumanizing to ask for verification?

 

[zenith15]

You didn’t address what I said. If the people are telling the truth, then great, they should have no problem accepting my help in the form of food, gas, etc. rather than cash. Sometimes they do. If they are insistent on cash, and refuse to accept food, etc. then what reason do we have to believe that they are telling the truth? You may say that not trusting their intentions in this way is dehumanizing as it damages their pride, but be realistic, it is normal not to immediately trust people that you do not know. Do you really think it is doing them more good throwing money at them?

Homeless people need a lot more than a burger in a bag. Almost everything requires cash–from trying to launder your few clothes in a laundromat, to public transportation, to a respectable outfit they can apply for job in, to the ability to access shower facilities, etc.

 

[brendankiwi]

Speaking as one who was homeless in London, don’t put anything in the pan. If you have to make it a rosary, a mass card or perhaps a sandwich. Donate to the sisters of charity or st vincents who run hostels and soup kitchens. Pray for them. Take it from me 90% have serious addiction problems and you might be feeding their habit. On the street many go cold turkey and are saved if they can’t feed off the sentiment from passer-bys. rememeber charity without truth is just sentiment. [BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]