Homeless Man Sleeping in Church

[martininthefiel]

Not all homeless people are addicted or crazy. We are in hard economic times, and I personally know people who have ended-up on the street for reasons that are strictly economic. I have even known homeless people who do have jobs, but don’t make enough to sustain permanent accommodations. Being poor is not a sin.

That having been said, I once worked for a parish in the downtown of a large city, and there were street people who were truly dangerous or disruptive.

I don’t think there is an easy answer to the question of whether or not to give to panhandlers, but I do think all human beings are worthy of dignified and respectful treatment.

I agree with the suggestion that you go to confession, if you are troubled by your behavior. Discussing it with a priest might well help.

 

[centurionguard]

Speaking as one who was homeless in London, don’t put anything in the pan. If you have to make it a rosary, a mass card or perhaps a sandwich. Donate to the sisters of charity or st vincents who run hostels and soup kitchens. Pray for them. Take it from me 90% have serious addiction problems and you might be feeding their habit. On the street many go cold turkey and are saved if they can’t feed off the sentiment from passer-bys. rememeber charity without truth is just sentiment. [BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]

Sorry; No Disrespect, but these kind of sentiments pigeonhole all homeless people in the same BIAS category. Not really my cup of tea of looking at every homeless person who walks in the street. You just might get a different prospective if you were take-up a Christian vocation of working with Mother Teresa’s Nuns working with the Poorest of the poor everyday. Until we can recognize Jesus hidden in every poor person we will never recognize the poor.

 

[themeginthemoon]

Very sorry that your area does not have shelters for families. I will pray for someone to open one!

Still stuck on the life looked at under a microscope idea… I have to show ID when I cash a check, I have to have references and background checks to get a job or to take out a loan, I have to verify my ID to log in to pay my phone bill - heck, I have to have a detailed application form and background check to be an usher at Church.

When did it become dehumanizing to ask for verification?

It’s not the ID thing that’s dehumanizing It’s the really invasive questions, accusations, assumptions, and biases. Our shelter workers are not very good for the most part… it seems that the sentiment is good, but the delivery (or non delivery) of services falls flat. I think they need more social workers around, really, to give people real options and resources to get them out of homelessness, instead of pointing fingers and saying “well, you should have just stayed with him until you got more money together” (actual quote at one of the shelters… the lady was a battered woman… needless to say, this was not the one that serves victims of domestic violence).

The ID issue is not dehumanizing, but can prove problematic. Many rural areas surround the metro areas in this state, and the older homeless face some major issues with ID… home births were very popular in the country until the 1950’s, and many of the rural poor never registered their babies and children with Social Security or even obtained a birth certificate. There are multiple hoops to jump through to get retro-active documents proving basic identification… it’s kind of a problem. I don’t really know what the answer is, but it’s a conundrum.

 

[ncrespi]

God gave us brains with the intellect to use it. I don’t beleive His intention was for us to be naive or misuse it.

That being said, for the same reason I would move away from a crying baby, i would change
pews away from a homeless man. Primary focus should be on the reason you are there in the first place. I doubt if homeless people are even allowed in the living quarters of priests and nuns, so you have the right, as well, to be concerned for your own welfare, as well.

 

[centurionguard]

God gave us brains with the intellect to use it. I don’t beleive His intention was for us to be naive or misuse it.

That being said, for the same reason I would move away from a crying baby, i would change
pews away from a homeless man. Primary focus should be on the reason you are there in the first place. I doubt if homeless people are even allowed in the living quarters of priests and nuns, so you have the right, as well, to be concerned for your own welfare, as well.

My question to you is why do or should all Homeless People invoke fears in you or everybody else if their not causing a disturbance?

I’ve had some bad experiences with some homeless people but it hasn’t made me judge them all the same way. On the contrary I’ve meet some beautiful respectable homeless people who would if they could give you the shirt off their backs.

 

[jeffrey_erwin]

Mr. Castello said: “Everyone in society has to live by rules.” This is true, and, as religious persons, we should remember our rules: “Love your neighbor as yourself,” “Give to anyone who asks,” “Do not judge, least you be judged.” It seems clear enough to me. No matter that the destitute may be lying, want money for drugs or alcohol, or just be plain lazy, in order to comply with the Law as interpreted by the great Rabbi Yehoshua ben Yosef we must give to them and give generously. If we truely “loved our neighbor as ourself,” wouldn’t that mean that we would have to give half of the cash in our wallet to a destitute person? I ask the forum to remember the great sacrifice and terrible pain that our Teacher made and endured in order to teach us how to follow the Law. How much easier it is for us to simply empty our wallets than it would be to suffer that tortuous death!

 

[centurionguard]

Mr. Castello said: “Everyone in society has to live by rules.” This is true, and, as religious persons, we should remember our rules: “Love your neighbor as yourself,” “Give to anyone who asks,” “Do not judge, least you be judged.” It seems clear enough to me. No matter that the destitute may be lying, want money for drugs or alcohol, or just be plain lazy, in order to comply with the Law as interpreted by the great Rabbi Yehoshua ben Yosef we must give to them and give generously. If we truely “loved our neighbor as ourself,” wouldn’t that mean that we would have to give half of the cash in our wallet to a destitute person? I ask the forum to remember the great sacrifice and terrible pain that our Teacher made and endured in order to teach us how to follow the Law. How much easier it is for us to simply empty our wallets than it would be to suffer that tortuous death!

The Torah and Talmud provide Jews with guidelines on the how, what and when of giving to the poor. The Torah commanded Jews to give ten percent of their earnings to the poor every third year (Deuteronomy 26:12) and an additional percentage of their income annually (Leviticus 19:9*10). After the Temple was destroyed, the annual tithe levied upon each Jew for support of the Temple priests and their assistants was suspended. **The Talmud instructed Jews to give at least ten percent of their annual net income ** to tzedakah (Maimonides, Mishneh Torah, “Laws Concerning Gifts for the Poor,” 7:5).

 

[catharina]

Today I went to daily mass at a Cathedral in a major US city. Before confession, a homeless man came up to each person standing in line, gave his story about being sick with AIDS and asked for money. I gave him money, but I had a funny feeling about it. Just after confession, as I was walking to the pews to sit down for mass, I noticed that another homeless man was sleeping in one of the pews and so I purposefully sat closer to the front to put distance between me and the man. I prayed the rosary and then mass began. Halfway through mass I felt really bad about my actions and I was afraid that I had just walked out of confession only to commit a private (potentially mortal?) sin right away.

I have two questions:

1. Was what I did mortal, or was my sense of sin heightened because I just left confession and prayed the rosary? (My sins have seemed to be really stark now, after starting daily rosary - has anyone else had this occur? Btw, I am not scrupulous.)
2. How do others react to homeless people at Church?

Here’s a bit of background on my interactions with the homeless: My first instinct is always to recoil from homeless people. I am not proud of that. A few years ago, I did just that while walking with one of my friends. As I hurriedly passed, the homeless man called my name. That stopped me in my tracks. I looked harder and noticed that I recognized the man. It was my uncle! After that I felt really convicted about having a heart for the homeless, but my gut reaction has remained the same. Most of this is because they smell bad. A few weeks ago I was eating at a mall eatery in San Francisco and a homeless man sat right next to me and started eating off the plates nearby. He smelled terrible. I lost my appetite and sat uncomfortably silent, another man’s reaction was to shoo him away, and my husband’s first reaction was to give him some food. I wish that my gut reaction was like my husbands! I do try to give money to the homeless if asked (but I am not always consistent).

A brief FYI, in San Francisco some churches are dedicated
to service of the poor. An example is St. Boniface Parish.

thegubbioproject.org/services.html

"'The goals of The Gubbio Project are two-fold:
•To provide a clean, beautiful, quiet, and safe space for people to rest during the day
•To cultivate a sense of community among the homeless and a sense of understanding and shared responsibility in the broader community
To that end we have developed the following services:

Sanctuary and Sacred SleepBetween 75-95 unhoused neighbors seek safety and rest on the pews in the sanctuary of St. Boniface church each weekday from 6 am to 1 pm. 50 more access our services (toiletries, blankets, clothing vouchers, referrals, clean bathrooms, haircuts). The Project uses the back 2/3 of the sanctuary; the church uses the front 1/3 to celebrate the two daily masses. This sends a powerful message to our unhoused neighbors - they are in essence part of the community, not to be kicked out when those with homes come in to worship. It also sends a message to those attending mass - the community includes the tired, the poor, those with mental health issues and those who are wet, cold and dirty. … ."

 

[CompSciGuy]

Homeless people need a lot more than a burger in a bag. Almost everything requires cash–from trying to launder your few clothes in a laundromat, to public transportation, to a respectable outfit they can apply for job in, to the ability to access shower facilities, etc.

We can provide those things too. We don’t have to just throw out cash.

 

[CompSciGuy]

Sorry; No Disrespect, but these kind of sentiments pigeonhole all homeless people in the same BIAS category. Not really my cup of tea of looking at every homeless person who walks in the street. You just might get a different prospective if you were take-up a Christian vocation of working with Mother Teresa’s Nuns working with the Poorest of the poor everyday. Until we can recognize Jesus hidden in every poor person we will never recognize the poor.

This still is not addressing the real subject at hand. We’re talking about using wisdom and discernment. In the case of Mother Teresa’s mission you have nuns who are providing medical care and other types of care for the sick and dying, and caring for orphans, not just giving a bunch of hand-outs. In America drug addiction is rampant on the streets. Using discernment isn’t a matter of pigeonholing or patronizing, it’s a matter of caring enough to do more than just to give them handouts and send them on their way, when it is very likely that you are doing them more harm than good.

 

[CompSciGuy]

I think that a lot of education is needed in this matter. Has anyone read a book called “When Helping Hurts: how to alleviate poverty without hurting the poor and yourself” by Brian Fikkert, Steve Corbett, John Perkins

 

[ncrespi]

My question to you is why do or should all Homeless People invoke fears in you or everybody else if their not causing a disturbance?

I’ve had some bad experiences with some homeless people but it hasn’t made me judge them all the same way. On the contrary I’ve meet some beautiful respectable homeless people who would if they could give you the shirt off their backs.

Did you invite those beautiful, homeless people back to your home? it’s easy to talk the talk but not so to walk the walk…

 

[zenith15]

Sorry; No Disrespect, but these kind of sentiments pigeonhole all homeless people in the same BIAS category. Not really my cup of tea of looking at every homeless person who walks in the street. You just might get a different prospective if you were take-up a Christian vocation of working with Mother Teresa’s Nuns working with the Poorest of the poor everyday. Until we can recognize Jesus hidden in every poor person we will never recognize the poor.

Exactly. You have no way of knowing that “90%” have mental problems, are addicted, etc. Also, you speak only for YOUR area, which may have more services than other areas.

Here’s my thought–and I realize it may be controversial. I would talk with the person, warmly, as though they were a human being in need of respect and caring. I would ask their needs. I would do what I could to provide them with access to those needs. Would I give them money? Maybe, unless I saw an obvious reason not to. What if they use it for drugs or alcohol, you say? What if they do? If I don’t have the means or ability to direct them to a drug rehab that will take them in instantly, for free (some cities may but mine does not)–not just some 3 day detox but a TREATMENT facility, then that simply means they will be lying on the street homeless AND sicker than sick (depending on the addiction–some withdrawals can actually klll you , such as alcohol or tranquilizers), and I don’t feel the need to sit in judgment on them for their disease and I know for a facrt that the misery of cold turkey withdrawal does not lead people to recover from addition.

 

[Catholic90]

Why do some type so big?

Regarding homeless, if I found a homeless person sleeping in my church, I would not sit by him or her, purely for my own safety. Neither would I likely approach them by myself. I would likely alert a staff person that someone was there. Then the person would be directed to one of the many resources in our community for homeless people.

 

[CompSciGuy]

Exactly. You have no way of knowing that “90%” have mental problems, are addicted, etc. Also, you speak only for YOUR area, which may have more services than other areas.

Here’s my thought–and I realize it may be controversial. I would talk with the person, warmly, as though they were a human being in need of respect and caring. I would ask their needs. I would do what I could to provide them with access to those needs. Would I give them money? Maybe, unless I saw an obvious reason not to. What if they use it for drugs or alcohol, you say? What if they do? If I don’t have the means or ability to direct them to a drug rehab that will take them in instantly, for free (some cities may but mine does not)–not just some 3 day detox but a TREATMENT facility, then that simply means they will be lying on the street homeless AND sicker than sick (depending on the addiction–some withdrawals can actually klll you , such as alcohol or tranquilizers), and I don’t feel the need to sit in judgment on them for their disease and I know for a facrt that the misery of cold turkey withdrawal does not lead people to recover from addition.

So you’re reasoning is that you should give them the money anyway, and they should be allowed to buy the drugs, as opposed to getting off cold turkey. Is this how we are to take care of them?
I am wondering, how many experiences have you had with the homeless or impoverished.
Has anyone ever approached you, given you a hard luck story, and asked you for 40 dollars for gas money, and you’d given them all they needed, only to walk by five minutes later and see them begging for more from other people? Have you ever been encountered by some guy with a great long sob story who asks you for money to help his family, and when you gave him some cash, you happened to see a few minutes later him in the checkout line of the nearest grocery store with a huge carton of Budweiser? I have heard too many phony sob stories, I’m just not a sucker anymore. It is easy for me to tell when people are lying to my face. Always it is cash that they want and only cash. And more often then not it’s in ridiculously large amounts. Again I’m not saying that these people don’t need help; they do, and on multiple levels. But again, doling out cash is almost never the best solution!
My brother and I have actually once tried to help a guy who was unemployed. We would pay him to wash our cars, mow our lawn, etc. We would give him rides to interviews, etc. We did as much as we could to help him get back on this feet. The problem was, our help was not good enough because he lacked both motivation and a good attitude. He was essentially taking advantage of us, he had no intention of getting an actual job. He would be very appreciative when we would give him things, but when we tried to help him actually get to work, he would get frustrated with us. At the interviews, he was disrespectful and rude, and when he wasn’t hired because of his bad behavior, he would be furious and accuse the manager of being racist. We would have to apologize for him. This is an example of a person who cannot be helped. Some of you, if you encountered him, might have given him 10 dollars and sent him on his way. My brother and I did much more than this. I am not sorry that I got taken advantage of by this guy. That’s life. I am glad that my brother and I did more for him than throw money at him, the only thing I am sorry about is that he was not open to accepting real help.

My point is, charity means we should be willing to help when asked. It also means that we should use wisdom and discernment in how to help best. It doesn’t mean that we are to assume that everyone in need is a responsible, honest citizen. Precaution is not the same as prejudice. When we help someone, if they prove to be responsible, then we can be more trusting. It is neither charitable nor prudent to trust everyone completely upon first meeting, and the Lord does not ask this of us.

 

[catharina]

Why do some type so big?

Regarding homeless, if I found a homeless person sleeping in my church, I would not sit by him or her, purely for my own safety. Neither would I likely approach them by myself. I would likely alert a staff person that someone was there. Then the person would be directed to one of the many resources in our community for homeless people.

Again:

A brief FYI, in San Francisco some churches are dedicated
to service of the poor. An example is St. Boniface Parish.

thegubbioproject.org/services.html

"'The goals of The Gubbio Project are two-fold:
•To provide a clean, beautiful, quiet, and safe space for people to rest during the day
•To cultivate a sense of community among the homeless and a sense of understanding and shared responsibility in the broader community
To that end we have developed the following services:

Sanctuary and Sacred SleepBetween 75-95 unhoused neighbors seek safety and rest on the pews in the sanctuary of St. Boniface church each weekday from 6 am to 1 pm. 50 more access our services (toiletries, blankets, clothing vouchers, referrals, clean bathrooms, haircuts). The Project uses the back 2/3 of the sanctuary; the church uses the front 1/3 to celebrate the two daily masses. **This sends a powerful message to our unhoused neighbors - they are in essence part of the community, not to be kicked out when those with homes come in to worship. It also sends a message to those attending mass - the community includes the tired, the poor, those with mental health issues and those who are wet, cold and dirty. … ." **

 

[mgoforth]

I’m not a woman and I usually don’t feel any fear talking to the homeless, so I can only give the OP the same advice I’d give to my wife. Try not to put yourself in a dangerous situation when you encounter a homeless person. Stay in a well-lit area with other people, don’t follow the person off by yourself, stay alert, etc.

Besides the safety issue, maybe the first thing we should try to give is our time? I haven’t followed this advice very consistently myself, I must admit. But what I would suggest is that if someone approaches you (and you’re already in a safe environment), before you give them anything, ask some sincere questions to help you get to know that person and the challenges they’re facing. Usually in my experience, the other person launches right into the explanation of why they need money (whether true or false doesn’t matter at this point). In the past I’ve tried to “reset” the conversation and say “Hi I’m Marty, what’s your name?”, along with the friendliest smile I could manage. Once we’ve both introduced ourselves and shaken hands (like most of us would tend to do with non-homeless people) it usually gets easier.

After that, maybe you could say something they wouldn’t usually hear like “I feel bad just handing you money as if I’m trying to get rid of you. You started to tell me about a problem you’re having…could you explain it to me again?” Also with a smile. The conversation will develop from there. If they say the money is needed for a bus ticket (which seems to be common), then ask followup questions. “Why are you headed there? Do you have family in that area? Oh, a job opportunity, that’s great! What kind of work do you do?” Again, it doesn’t necessarily matter if everything they tell you is the truth. You’re showing that you care enough to ask questions, but also that you’re not an “easy” mark who’s going to hand them a $5 bill just so you can escape quickly. If it’s a scam and they see you again, they may think twice about the time investment required.

I try to follow this script because even though I’m not physically frightened of the homeless, I still get nervous when I feel like someone is “fast-talking” or hustling me. When I get nervous, I end up feeling cheated after it’s all over or I feel like I was uncaring and just handed them money to end the conversation. Slowing things down helps me make a clear decision about how I’m going to help. As a Christian, the decision shouldn’t be helping vs not helping - we’re all called to help our neighbor when they ask - but whether I’m actually going to give money, buy them food, or maybe just give them directions to the local soup kitchen which is right down the street will depend on what I learn by talking to them. Plus it usually takes the homeless person by surprise - remember, most people just walk by without even speaking or hand them some cash and run, so that’s what they’ll be expecting - and might throw off the “momentum” if they were trying to hustle you.

Either way, having a friendly conversation hardly ever hurts.

 

[JoanREDirector]

I like your answer. It’s my approach as well. For some reason, beggars have always been attracted to me and I found your approach works. A handshake, a smile, a direct look into the eyes, sincere questions about the suppliant’s situation usually makes liars retreat. The hardened know not to waste time on you; the others slink away in fear or melt in shame. The honest are humbly grateful for whatever help you can give them. As a staff member at my local parish I was often the one who had to deal with beggars on behalf of our local church. I’ve come to believe that some people are given the charism to deal directly God’s dearly beloved, the outcasts, and some are not.

To all I say, “Trust your ‘spider’ sense.” Never put yourself in a situation where you are in physical danger. Stay away from places where it’s isolated or dark. Don’t get in a car with a stranger or take them alone in yours. These warnings apply especially to women, but men are suceptible to the charge, “He tried to ( fill in the blank ) me.”

I also say, never put yourself in emotional danger. Believe it or not, people who struggle with feelings of hard-heartedness to the poor or fear of them are much more likely to fall for this. Desperate outcasts will prey on our feelings of loathing, fear, or neediness. Guilt or weakness make us do dumb things that harm the ones we try to help and leave us feeling angry or ashamed.

Helping the poor should fill you with joy. If you don’t feel it, something’s wrong. Yes, indeed, at the last judgement, the Just Judge will ask you if you loved Him when He appeared to you in the guise of a beggar. But He asks of us different things.

He asks all of us to PRAY, PRAY PRAY. Are you doing that? … I thought so or you wouldn’t be on this forum asking these questions. Next, he asks all of us to give generously of our treasure to groups that work for the poor (and be wise about that … there are lots of scams).

Do you feel called to do more? Join a group that does charitable work. I highly recommend the St Vincent De Paul Society or the Knights of Columbus. These groups will make sure that you are trained and supported and they will abide by the practical and ethical guidelines mandated by your diocese.

Finally, you’re out and about. You see a poor person crying or shivering with illness or you see children who appear to be lost. Call the police or the security guard if you are in a public place. Get the usher or someone on the church staff if you are at a church. It’s their job to handle these things.

But what if a person approaches you and asks for help. Do you feel intimidated? Is there no policeman or usher? Trust your intuition and call 911.

Sometimes the situation is different. When I was a student at Seattle University, beggars were always waiting for me when I went to pray at St Ignatius Chapel. I could honestly tell them that I had no money so I always offered to pray with them. Most walked away quickly, some cursed me. A few took me up on my offer. I held their hands, looked in their eyes, and listened to their stories. Sometimes I had to say, “Honey, you told me that story a month ago.” I directed them to St James Cathedral down the street where there was a good outreach program but I don’t think any of them took me up on it.

At fast food resturants I’ve had people ask me for money. I always offer to buy them food. Usually, they don’t want it. At the church office beggars got bus tickets and directions to St Vincent De Paul or the Pregnancy Aide office. If they got there real help began … but that’s another thread.

 

[themeginthemoon]

Exactly. You have no way of knowing that “90%” have mental problems, are addicted, etc. Also, you speak only for YOUR area, which may have more services than other areas.

Here’s my thought–and I realize it may be controversial. I would talk with the person, warmly, as though they were a human being in need of respect and caring. I would ask their needs. I would do what I could to provide them with access to those needs. Would I give them money? Maybe, unless I saw an obvious reason not to. What if they use it for drugs or alcohol, you say? What if they do? If I don’t have the means or ability to direct them to a drug rehab that will take them in instantly, for free (some cities may but mine does not)–not just some 3 day detox but a TREATMENT facility, then that simply means they will be lying on the street homeless AND sicker than sick (depending on the addiction–some withdrawals can actually klll you , such as alcohol or tranquilizers), and I don’t feel the need to sit in judgment on them for their disease and I know for a facrt that the misery of cold turkey withdrawal does not lead people to recover from addition.

I feel the same way… I have a special place in my heart for the homeless. My husband was homeless as a teenager for a while, his parents divorced and left him in charge of his 12 year old sister while they moved to new locales to ‘start over’. He couldn’t pay the rent and was evicted from his home (as a teen, mind you, still in high school), and his sister was able to stay with friends. He was not. He had to drop out of school, luckily he is very bright and was able to obtain his high school equivalency and carry on with his life.

He lived and slept out of a van for a year He could have wound up a ‘street person’, had events not fallen in to place for him. Homelessness is very complex.

Compsciguy - I do not appreciate your assertion that ‘education is needed’ on this matter, many of us speaking are quite educated, some specifically in the realms of poverty, just because we don’t hold the same opinions as you does not make us ignorant.

I always air on the side of compassion because I believe this is what Christ is calling me to do. Not everyone feels the need to be this way, and that is fine, but don’t insult those of us with big hearts.

 

[Newbie2]

Most homeless people are homeless by choice. They could be self-sufficient if they wanted to but why should they if they know they can prey on soft-hearted (soft-headed?) people for a handout?

Why do you think they hang around churches? Because they can play you for a fool and put you on a guilt trip at the thought of betraying your Catholic values of charity. Ever notice how street-people say God Bless all the time? They are trying to manipulate your conscious.

Personally, I won’t give money to homeless beggars. I may direct them to a shelter, but that’s all. Giving them money is just a disincentive for them to try and better themselves.

And anyone can better themselves if they want to bad enough and try hard enough.

Wow.

That is so cold, Bro.

“Soft-headed”. Wow. People with big hearts are “Soft headed”.

Sure, giving money may not be the best idea, as it may go directly into the hands of the nearest liquor store or drug dealer, but the notion that most homeless people choose to live in filth, squalor and poverty is ridiculous.

Try it. Take nothing, go live downtown somewhere. See how far you get in pulling yourself up by your own bootstraps.