Homily on sexual morality

[goout]

Really? You know CAtholics who think gay marriage and adultery is fine?
Wow.

I almost always like your posts, but I disagree with you.

I know tons and tons of Catholics who equate gay civil unions with marriage, and excuse adultery to weakness and necessity.
tons of them.
Our parish office is staffed for the most part with folks who share these “progressive” attitudes. Good hard working people, but…

 

[CilladeRoma]

OK, I will agree with what you say here, but the question is, even if this is what these people believe, do they believe that this is what the Church teaches?

If that is the case there is a real problem. I would guess though, that they all know what the Church teaches, they just don’t agree.

 

[exnihilo]

The makeup of the congregation - children of all ages + adults probably imposes some restrictions on the content of homilies, and potentially the manner of delivery.

I don’t think the priest had a graphic sex ed class where he described how to. It sounds like he used the appropriate words to refer to sins we should not do. I don’t see any problem with that, especially seeing as how those words are in the readings.

Look, I’m sure he’s a fine priest. But coming out with guns ablazin’ is one of the mistakes often made by new priests

Why do you characterize him as guns ablaze? Neither of us was there. Neither of us have a transcript of the homily. We have a description of a priest who gave a homily on Catholic morality with some enthusiasm. We have people complaining about boring, unenthusiastic homilies. This sounds like it wasn’t at all which should be good.

 

[CilladeRoma]

hy do you characterize him as guns ablaze? Neither of us was there. Neither of us have a transcript of the homily. We have a description of a priest who gave a homily on Catholic morality with some enthusiasm. We have people complaining about boring, unenthusiastic homilies. This sounds like it wasn’t at all which should be good.

“Guns ablazin’” is exactly how this new priest has come into my parishes life.

He arrived less than 3 months ago, has taken not one minute to get to know our parish, has proceeded to all of the EMHC to the homebound by suspending their ministry so that he may do it by himself, so that he can make sure they are in a state of grace, and “no one needs weekly communion, anyway”. (And yes, this was a direct quote to me and the other coordinators of this ministry )

Our Pastor, who was a good, holy, orthodox, priest, was asked to take the helm of a very large, inner-city parish that needed his experience. His leaving, long before his term as Pastor was up, has made many of these changes very difficult for the parish to bear. Especially since our new administrator (he is not a Pastor yet) is making every “rookie” mistake, and the pastoral care of the parish has suffered.

 

[exnihilo]

Fine, but is this thread about a homily or is it about that you don’t like your priest, or his approach, or a list of decisions he has made? I could make a list of decisions my current priest made that I don’t like. But what is the point of that?

 

[pianistclare]

Oh, yes I feel your frustration I really do. My previous parish was like that.
It was a haven of sorts for those who apply precepts “loosely”.
But that’s a different problem.
Educating people on morality is far different than feeding them with Scripture during Mass.
One is about correction, the other is about mercy and hope.

I know I harp on this alot, but honestly…we are facing this problem because kids are not in Faith Formation throughout their teens years. In those Middle School and High School youth groups we tackle these things, No mincing words. Just the facts. And STILL people believe that children should receive Confirmation early in life, making Religious Ed a very low priority in families.
The “I’m Done Syndrome” we call it.
Parents are the primary educators of their children. We in the Parishes are here to HELP with that. But as long as parents think there is a bare minimum to receiving sacraments, that everything in the world is covered thoroughly in Sunday school, and that never having these conversations (or being catechized enough to do so) on the home front is all that is needed. In the end these issues will continue to be dominated by the media, celebrity, and teen wishful thinking.

It’s the same thing to believe that as long as you go to Mass, you’re covered. You’ve met an obligation, you’ve gone to communion (whether you are properly disposed or not) and you have no reason to crack open a Bible, a Catechism, or a religious book to read forevermore.

Fire and brimstone doesn’t work. Sounds fun, and we can get all rah rah about it, but education and frank “discussion” ( hint: interactive) will bring the faithful around.

God bless you. I like your posts as well!

 

[exnihilo]

Parents are the primary educators of their children. We in the Parishes are here to HELP with that. But as long as parents think there is a bare minimum to receiving sacraments, that everything in the world is covered thoroughly in Sunday school, and that never having these conversations (or being catechized enough to do so) on the home front is all that is needed. In the end these issues will continue to be dominated by the media, celebrity, and teen wishful thinking.

I absolutely agree with this. If the parents have this attitude the kids, apart from grace, don’t have much hope. The parents in this case aren’t really living the Christian life. It isn’t the core of their life. Of course kids are ultimately individuals with free will. But the proper influence to a life of faith just isn’t there in such cases.

 

[pianistclare]

Yes. Which is why I suggest a series of adult (teens invited) talks by the pastor might be much more warmly received.
God bless.

 

[CilladeRoma]

It is about both, as one feeds into the other.

 

[goout]

Oh, yes I feel your frustration I really do. My previous parish was like that.
It was a haven of sorts for those who apply precepts “loosely”.
But that’s a different problem.
Educating people on morality is far different than feeding them with Scripture during Mass.
One is about correction, the other is about mercy and hope.

I know I harp on this alot, but honestly…we are facing this problem because kids are not in Faith Formation throughout their teens years. In those Middle School and High School youth groups we tackle these things, No mincing words. Just the facts. And STILL people believe that children should receive Confirmation early in life, making Religious Ed a very low priority in families.
The “I’m Done Syndrome” we call it.
Parents are the primary educators of their children. We in the Parishes are here to HELP with that. But as long as parents think there is a bare minimum to receiving sacraments, that everything in the world is covered thoroughly in Sunday school, and that never having these conversations (or being catechized enough to do so) on the home front is all that is needed. In the end these issues will continue to be dominated by the media, celebrity, and teen wishful thinking.

It’s the same thing to believe that as long as you go to Mass, you’re covered. You’ve met an obligation, you’ve gone to communion (whether you are properly disposed or not) and you have no reason to crack open a Bible, a Catechism, or a religious book to read forevermore.

Fire and brimstone doesn’t work. Sounds fun, and we can get all rah rah about it, but education and frank “discussion” ( hint: interactive) will bring the faithful around.

God bless you. I like your posts as well!

I’ve been advocating for later sacramental prep, when the individual is mature enough to give full consent, but there is a lot of varying opinion on that.
The alternative opinion is to give the sacraments at a young age and let the grace work. But the problem you are observing is the non-actualization of that grace in lives of immature disciples, and parents who do not participate in helping that grace unpack.
They merely want their children to “get” some Catholicism and be done.

That’s not working.

 

[pianistclare]

RIght, and the actual blowback is in a very few Diocese that want the “restored order” which will essentially destroy all religious ed.
Our Archbishop is vehemently against it. He wants all our teens in Formation…and sadly, yes, holding out that Confirmation carrot is the only only way to force people to keep their kids learning.
as is often repeated here: one must COOPERATE with God’s grace.
God bless you!!!

 

[Don_Ruggero]

we are facing this problem because kids are not in Faith Formation throughout their teens years. In those Middle School and High School youth groups we tackle these things, No mincing words. Just the facts. And STILL people believe that children should receive Confirmation early in life, making Religious Ed a very low priority in families.

The “I’m Done Syndrome” we call it.

Parents are the primary educators of their children. We in the Parishes are here to HELP with that. But as long as parents think there is a bare minimum to receiving sacraments, that everything in the world is covered thoroughly in Sunday school, and that never having these conversations (or being catechized enough to do so) on the home front is all that is needed. In the end these issues will continue to be dominated by the media, celebrity, and teen wishful thinking.

It’s the same thing to believe that as long as you go to Mass, you’re covered. You’ve met an obligation, you’ve gone to communion (whether you are properly disposed or not) and you have no reason to crack open a Bible, a Catechism, or a religious book to read forevermore.

Fire and brimstone doesn’t work.

This should be published as a column in all the newspapers in the dioceses.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I know a person who thinks that demons cause her car to break down.

There are people who think all sorts of outlandish things!

 

[Don_Ruggero]

This whole thread reminds me of Chapter 2 of the Rule of Saint Benedict (What Kind of Person the Abbot Ought to Be)

The wisdom of Saint Benedict is so extraordinary…and such a blessing to those who know it and benefit from it.

How tragic that there are so many who never encounter it and so are un-enriched by it.

 

[babochka]

Really? You know CAtholics who think gay marriage and adultery is fine?
Wow.

Sadly, I do.

Many think fornication is fine. Not regrettable, but nearly unavoidable, but fine. Most won’t say that adultery is fine, they just disagree that a remarriage after a divorce constitutes adultery. And I know several Catholics who think gay marriage is fine.

 

[pianistclare]

Well, I guess we all know a few people like that. But they are not going to be moved by a homily. It’s one of the 10 Commandments for heaven’s sake. It’s not like they DON’T know.

 

[anon64350612]

Yes to both…

 

[babochka]

My pastor is capable of giving a masterful homily on tough subjects without offending anybody. His approach is to make virtue sound so appealing that you naturally want to turn from sin. He once preached on Hell without ever saying the word. It was clear to everybody present what he was talking about. After the liturgy, a visitor to the parish marveled at his skill. We tell visitors, with just a smidgen of pride, that we have homilies like that every week. He takes on tough subjects with great respect and dignity. Except for that time he preached on the Feast of Saint Nicholas and told the kids there was no Santa. We could have done without that.

 

[pianistclare]

So you , as a catechist believe that "things will just turn out ok on their own, and we don’t need catechism classes?

They why do we teach anything? Why have the US Bishops encouraged lifelong catechesis?
Why do parishes spend so much time and money n the children?
Why do parents even bring their children?

It’s not magical action. It’s work.
We, as a church must do the work.
The world corrupts children quickly and very efficiently.
We’re kidding ourselves if we think that they don’t need our guidance and help. It’s WE who rely on the Holy Spirit to teach well. But we have to give parents help.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

It was the how. He is delivery is like that of of more Evangelical type preacher, and he loudly, with emphasis, made sure we heard pornography, masturbation, formication, adultery, about 6 times each, in 7 minutes. The only thing he didn’t do was pound his fist on the ambo.

I was at the last Mass if the weekend. Attendance was much lighter than usual, but it is also freezing here and we had nearly a foot if snow yesterday, so weather could play a factor. I have about 15 emails that I have to read that have come from friends that went to other Masses. There will be some dialogue amongst us ( a group of parishioners and the ministry staff, along with a couple members of the parish council) and then we will then plan our next steps.

I am glad, at least, that the homily did not go as badly as it might have. I can assure you that it is not anyone’s delight to have a chancery phone ringing on Monday because a homilist has chosen a course that has alternately upset or alarmed some portion of his parishioners.

My advice really remains the same.

I don’t know your diocese. Some dioceses – fortunately – have a good mentoring programme that pairs younger priests with wise, older priests…and the programme functions not simply as a box to be checked but works effectively.

That is not true for all dioceses. Beyond that, it relies on the young priest actually being responsive and of good will. When that is absent…that puts him on a collision course with the Bishop. The outcome is seldom a happy one for either the Bishop or the Priest, when the reaches the point of where the Bishop has to rein in someone who is running amok.

Stay close to the Dean and to the Priests who are your friends and continue to advise them of what is happening and to seek their counsel. More than anyone on the Internet, they would know the Diocese and the Bishop – and the Presbyterate.

Assuredly, there is always the Vicar General and the Bishop himself. If you write, make it a concise letter, one page if possible, that dispassionately lists the decisions taken that have been problematic.

I assure of my prayers.