Homosexual co-worker?

[EasterJoy]

“She” can insist that there be none at all. (Talk about or from a person related to his/her sexual preferences, orientation, habits etc.)

What a lot of people fail to realize is that any conversation of this nature, even between two people who are “OK” with the topic, can be viewed as a form of sexual harassment if even one other person in the work area does not want to hear it. Sexual harassment is not confined to openly obvious remarks, suggestions, attempts to touch etc. All that has to be present the wish of own person to not see or hear anything of that nature.

In addition, if there are any others present in the office who are aware of this and they don’t report it they can be found guilty of sexual harassment. I learned this as a supervisor during company training on this issue as well as issues that can be viewed as “Creating a hostile work environment.”

Folks need to be very careful about what they talk about at work. If this person does not want to be subject to this type of discussion, be it about heterosexual or homosexual relationships, or simply jokes about sex, or conduct related to it, then it must be stopped. Any company that does not make this abundantly clear to staff is in for a major law suit sometime down the road. And employees need to take heed, as it is a fast way to be accused of something they might not really be guilty of and a fast way to lose a job.

The law does not go so far as to prohibit all things of that nature that are unwelcome, even though smart attorneys of employers might well imply to employees that it does–and which was certainly the implication I got in the training I have had! Smart employers try to err on the side of caution, heading off even attempts at lawsuits. If employees don’t know that the rules are being made out to be stricter than they are, what is that to the employer?

This is what the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) has as in its short recap of the rules:

*Harassment does not have to be of a sexual nature, however, and can include offensive remarks about a person’s sex. For example, it is illegal to harass a woman by making offensive comments about women in general.

Both victim and the harasser can be either a woman or a man, and the victim and harasser can be the same sex.

Although the law doesn’t prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted).

The harasser can be the victim’s supervisor, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or someone who is not an employee of the employer, such as a client or customer.*
eeoc.gov/laws/types/sexual_harassment.cfm

The offensive sexual remarks or actions do not have to be aimed at the victim, but the victim does have to make it clear that the remarks or actions are unwelcome and are rendering his/her work environment hostile and either get no redress or else suffer negative repercussions as a result of making his or her feelings known.

If an employee were to voice objection to sexual talk and as a result was subjected to a hostile work environment, that could constitute harassment. For instance, if people were making what would normally be permissible remarks, but doing it in such as way as to constitute covert aggression against her, that could make her work environment unduly difficult for her.

As other posters have wisely pointed out, though, it is far better not to make it come to that. If you don’t want your coworkers to be hostile towards you, you have to be careful not to seem hostile towards them. In this case, it is far better to make it your policy that you don’t welcome talk about sex in general or anyone’s personal sexual information in particular. If you do that, it is far less likely that a homosexual would feel you are singling him out for your hostility by saying that his remarks alone make you uncomfortable. (Besides, why would a Christian bothered by one kind of impure talk not be bothered by the rest? My sense of this OP is that she wouldn’t want to have to listen to any leering comments from men about other women, either!)

OP, you do, after all, want this fellow feel comfortable at work, too. Even if it were legal not to care two figs about his feelings, it wouldn’t be kind. When the choice is between being kind yourself or trying to get him to be kind to you, you have to start with yourself, and with him as he is right now, not as you’d hope he would be.

When in the world, expect the worldly to act worldly. Expect those in the flesh to act and talk as if they are in the flesh. Remember, too, as the Lord pointed out, that even the pagans are willing to love those who love them. This fellow is not likely to let up on talking about sex because you think there is something wrong with his sex life. It is entirely possible he will do it because you are a friend who is uncomfortable talking about sex or talking about anyone else in a way that could remotely make them into a thing instead of a person. Start with where he is, then, if at all possible.

Do not expect a person to welcome the Gospel when the news is primarily that they need to cut it out with the sinful behavior. The more likely route to giving up the flesh is to have a desire for what is of the spirit first, to have a sense that even those with the most shocking habits are still seen as human beings, with the rest to follow. You would probably be wise to stay off the subject of sex and sexual orientation entirely while at work. Making the fellow feel you are hostile to him would not only be unkind. It might also be felt as harassment, but by him.

 

[shelby_sun]

I have been reading all the post, but did I miss one saying it would have been just as offensive if a female worker had said it about the guy?

 

[DeniseNY]

More like they’re the ones more eager to talk about it than I do. I just tend to speak through my eyes.

Best believe it… or you can just continue living in that little era you seem so comfortable in.

Lucky? I don’t really care about your luck. I’m just here to tell you that your I Love Lucy style environment doesn’t match the one I work in.

Addicted? I wouldn’t say that. We’re just not as tight-lipped that we consider words like ‘hot’ as sexually offensive.

P.S.

Hope to be? Hmm, well sometimes we twenty-somethings just hope we’ll always stay this way.

And I’m just here to tell you that not all twentysomethings have the same attitude as you. It has nothing to do with anyone living in a 1950s world; it has to do with understanding basic business etiquette. We have plenty of recent college grads working for us, and during business hours, they conduct themselves professionally. How they behave on their own time is their affair, but corporations have codes of conduct for a reason.

 

[EasterJoy]

And I’m just here to tell you that not all twentysomethings have the same attitude as you. It has nothing to do with anyone living in a 1950s world; it has to do with understanding basic business etiquette. We have plenty of recent college grads working for us, and during business hours, they conduct themselves professionally. How they behave on their own time is their affair, but corporations have codes of conduct for a reason.

It must depend on where you work and who your boss and coworkers are. It is only sexual harassment if the talk or actions are unwelcome, after all. Talk that no one minds is not against the law. People who only work in back rooms or around customers and coworkers who don’t embarrass easily may not realize that it is different anywhere else.

Still, there are such a wide variety of attitudes out there that one does not go wrong by maintaining conservative control. It is rare that you will get in trouble for the sexual comments that you don’t make at work. It is altogether possible that you will be passed over for opportunities because your supervisors don’t trust you to keep your foot out of your mouth. You may never even realize the harm you’re doing to your career by the flippant comments you think everyone enjoys as much as you do. Even supervisors who run off at the mouth themselves will trust themselves to have self-control when circumstances require it, but will put more trust in the underling who controls himself or herself as a matter of habit. Hypocritical? Maybe. But the world does work that way…

That is not the OP’s problem, but I do think she might make a little headway by telling her coworker that she has professional reasons for her standards. That, the World is more likely to understand and respect. Since the world (including many Christian denominations) is telling him that there is nothing wrong with his morals, she might not get far with that tack, and could cause a lot of strife that could have been avoided.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

And I’m just here to tell you that not all twentysomethings have the same attitude as you. It has nothing to do with anyone living in a 1950s world; it has to do with understanding basic business etiquette. We have plenty of recent college grads working for us, and during business hours, they conduct themselves professionally. How they behave on their own time is their affair, but corporations have codes of conduct for a reason.

They don’t because your environment shaped them to be that way. That’s my point. But if you want me to drive that home further, I’ll let Mark Zuckerberg tell you what he thinks of professional business etiquette:

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

It is altogether possible that you will be passed over for opportunities because your supervisors don’t trust you to keep your foot out of your mouth. You may never even realize the harm you’re doing to your career by the flippant comments you think everyone enjoys as much as you do. Even supervisors who run off at the mouth themselves will trust themselves to have self-control when circumstances require it, but will put more trust in the underling who controls himself or herself as a matter of habit. Hypocritical? Maybe. But the world does work that way…

Not exactly. Hypocrisy, as far as ‘etiquette’ goes tends to discredit the ideal more than just the person enforcing it. That’s why plenty of companies are driven more by results, experience, and sociability (which, at best, is only 50/50 guarantee of a ‘polite’ environment). I wouldn’t be surprised if my company isn’t the only one that cares more about bringing revenue and innovating products/services than what comes out of employee’s mouths.

 

[DeniseNY]

That’s one example out of millions (and also, how one dresses really hasn’t been the point of this thread). But anyway, unless one is working for Mark Zuckerberg, behave inappropirately (particularly in what can be construed as unwanted sexual disucussions) and see how that works out. No matter how much it may seem that a company doesn’t care “what come out” of their employees mouths, you will surely find out that they care if it in any way is a threat to their bottom line.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

That’s one example out of millions (and also, how one dresses really hasn’t been the point of this thread). But anyway, unless one is working for Mark Zuckerberg, behave inappropirately (particularly in what can be construed as unwanted sexual disucussions) and see how that works out.

So you’re saying my company’s one in millions too? I’ve already accepted your challenge before you even thought of putting it on this thread. The way I speak would no doubt be labeled as highly ‘inappropriate’ for someone like you and a few others here.

Unfortunately for you, this so-called conduct wasn’t even a factor when I got promoted or whenever I’m being consulted.

I hate to break it to you but it’s high time you realize the likes of the Zuckster’s company is hardly one in a million anymore.

P.S.

As for the bottom-line, that’s kind of the point. The only way this point might hit anyone harder is if they’ve actually seen how polite a sales rep is on the phone but starts swearing once the headset’s off.

Now that I think about it, even being polite can hurt the bottom line. My CEO just had a little town hall meeting last Friday. You know what he said? There’s no room for humility in this place. Not that I disagree but since this thread is all about being all nice and polite, I would think that being a doormat to an unqualified business prospect is just as painful to the bottom-line.

 

[hatchets]

In my summer job, one of the guys that I work nights with is homosexual. It breaks my heart, because he’ll talk about his lifestyle and I don’t know what to do.

I’ve only known him for two weeks, so it’s not like I want to come out and say “Gosh, you know what? You’re so much more than your homosexual tendencies. You’re an incredible child of God and deserve eternal joy. You’ re trying to stuff things into a God-shaped hole in your heart…but finite things won’t fill an infinite hole.”

How do I interact with him on a daily basis?

I haven’t been anything but treating him like a brother in Christ - which is what he is - but I don’t know how to respond when he starts talking about his blatantly homosexual practices (like commenting on how “hot” a guy who comes through our cashier line is after the customer walks away. It’s kind of awkward.

How do you interact with him on a daily basis? You treat him with respect, dignity and a profound love. If he is not a Christian then there isn’t really a conversation to have about how he has a God sized hole that he’s filling up with the wrong stuff. Preach the Gospel with your deeds. If he is a Christian then you can gently approach the topic, however if you not extremely close to this person then prayer is probably the best thing you can offer him.

I find handling people at work who make inappropriate comments about other people to be similar with handling people who gossip. When someone is gossiping about another person, all you have to do to put a stop to it is say something positive with a very approving smile and a good strong nod. So if whoever is going on about so-and-so’s constant mistakes and private life you can say with a smile “but she DID fix my filing cabinet and is always bringing coffee in for everyone! Isn’t that nice of her!”. People will stop talking smack when you do this. When people make inappropriate sexual comments, whether they be gay or straight, it can be handled in a similar manner by refocusing the conversation into something charitable and holy.

 

[DeniseNY]

So you’re saying my company’s one in millions too? I’ve already accepted your challenge before you even thought of putting it on this thread. The way I speak would no doubt be labeled as highly ‘inappropriate’ for someone like you and a few others here.

Unfortunately for you, this so-called conduct wasn’t even a factor when I got promoted or whenever I’m being consulted.

I hate to break it to you but it’s high time you realize the likes of the Zuckster’s company is hardly one in a million anymore.

P.S.

As for the bottom-line, that’s kind of the point. The only way this point might hit anyone harder is if they’ve actually seen how polite a sales rep is on the phone but starts swearing once the headset’s off.

Now that I think about it, even being polite can hurt the bottom line. My CEO just had a little town hall meeting last Friday. You know what he said? There’s no room for humility in this place. Not that I disagree but since this thread is all about being all nice and polite, I would think that being a doormat to an unqualified business prospect is just as painful to the bottom-line.

It’s not unfortunate for “someone like me” at all because I have no vested interest in whether you succeed or don’t, and like I said, the twentysomethings I’ve seen don’t conduct themselves the way someone like you does. For every “Zuckster” or company like yours, there are others who aren’t going to put up with it.

 

[shelby_sun]

No one seemed to have answer the question if this would have been such a big deal if a female co-worker had said it about a guy. IMO there are such bigger issues in the world than calling this one word sexual harassment and possibly affecting this guys future. I find that worse than anything he has done. People need to get a grip and get a life. I agree this is not the 1950s because in the 1950s if some guy said “wow she’s the bomb” people would not go press charges. Some people need to widen their scope of the horrible things going on in the world, rape, child abuse, murder, selling women as slave rather getting worked up about one word that wasn’t even degrading. I know priest that would find this thread over the top.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

It’s not unfortunate for “someone like me” at all because I have no vested interest in whether you succeed or don’t…

Really? Because I recall, you presume someone can’t get ahead of the game with the kind of attitude you find ‘inappropriate.’ Since your ideal is at stake, you’re pretty much just trying to save face here. My point isn’t even that different from yours. Environments like yours exist. Those like mine exist as well. And unlike you, I’d rather play it safe until the OP clarifies before assuming their workplace is either.

 

[EasterJoy]

No one seemed to have answer the question if this would have been such a big deal if a female co-worker had said it about a guy. IMO there are such bigger issues in the world than calling this one word sexual harassment and possibly affecting this guys future. I find that worse than anything he has done. People need to get a grip and get a life. I agree this is not the 1950s because in the 1950s if some guy said “wow she’s the bomb” people would not go press charges. Some people need to widen their scope of the horrible things going on in the world, rape, child abuse, murder, selling women as slave rather getting worked up about one word that wasn’t even degrading. I know priest that would find this thread over the top.

If you have a priest who feels free to tell any of his attractive parishioners that they are looking “hot” this Sunday morning, I would be very surprised. The kind of comments this coworker made about customers to the OP is not something that priests would even say to other priests in private without raising eyebrows. (How do I know? I can read the publicly-disclosed files of priests with sex abuse accusations against them, that is how.)

If you talk with your mouth full of food, it is not such a big deal as rape, child abuse or murder. It will not get you fired. It is still unprofessional and could hurt your career advancement without anyone ever telling you why. Making personal comments about customers as they leave the store and making your sexual proclivities a regular topic at work falls into that category. This is true whether you are male or female. You may not say anything that rises to the level of a lawsuit, but you still might offend the wrong people or embarrass management. That is the point.

 

[EasterJoy]

…Now that I think about it, even being polite can hurt the bottom line. My CEO just had a little town hall meeting last Friday. You know what he said? There’s no room for humility in this place. Not that I disagree but since this thread is all about being all nice and polite, I would think that being a doormat to an unqualified business prospect is just as painful to the bottom-line.

I am going to assume you are quoting him out of context. It is true that a fear of giving offense can keep people from speaking hard truths that need to be voiced or from holding a firm line where a firm line needs to be held, but anyone in management who teaches his people that the habits of common courtesy are in and of themselves habits that hurt the bottom line has lost his buttons.

He would probably tell the OP that if her coworker’s mouth is affecting her productivity, she ought to speak up about it, and not suffer for the sake of being “nice.” That does not mean she should not approach her coworker in the most genial way likely to achieve her goal, nor that she should not treat him fairly as he is likely to account justice. It only means that if he’s making it harder to come to work every day and do her job to the best of her ability, she ought to figure out a way to say so.

 

[EasterJoy]

At any rate, my points are these:

It is probably a very bad idea for the OP to tell the coworker that you do not approve of how he’s choosing to handle his sexual appetites. She does not know him anywhere close to well enough to presume to do that. In our current work atmosphere, that would be crossing a line.

Since his sexual talk bothers her and since she will have a hard time singling his sexual impurities out as worse than anyone else’s, she might try letting him know that she does not talk about sex or make any except the most polite personal comments at work. This policy, while stricter than some like, is a good way to avoid giving offense and to avoid appearing unprofessional. Yes, there are people who don’t think a thing of sex talk at work and those who don’t think “hot” has sexual connotations, but there are people who do, and you cannot tell who is who by looking at them. This is also a fair policy that will not give her coworker a reason to feel he is being discriminated against for his orientation. This is not only less likely to cause her trouble, but is also kinder to him. None of us like to be singled out as worse than everyone else.

If his talk is pervasive and affects her productivity, then it would probably be a good idea to seek out someone at work whom she could trust as a mentor, in order to decide how to handle this situation. There are some organizations where nothing will be done, but there are others that will find his behavior unacceptable. She’d do well to find out which kind of organization she’s in.

 

[DeniseNY]

Really? Because I recall, you presume someone can’t get ahead of the game with the kind of attitude you find ‘inappropriate.’ Since your ideal is at stake, you’re pretty much just trying to save face here. My point isn’t even that different from yours. Environments like yours exist. Those like mine exist as well. And unlike you, I’d rather play it safe until the OP clarifies before assuming their workplace is either.

No, just stating a fact. Trust me when I say I have no real interest in your personal success or failure. In any event, you just seem to have **a lot **of animosity towards anybody who doesn’t agree with your twentysomething mentality of “anything goes”. Having said that, I bid you a good evening and I am out of this topic.

 

[kelvinf]

Some guys are hot, and some girls are hot. I am not using coarse language when I say that. I could use coarse language to express a similar point, but I will not do so.

Feel free to run from me now.

(Note: In common parlance, “hot” means “beautiful” or at most “sexually attractive”. Just as women can and do take note of the sexual attractiveness of other women without desiring them, men can do the same. It’s not as socially acceptable, and maybe it shouldn’t be socially acceptable. But there’s nothing wrong with it.)

Come on. You guys should just stop pretending that “hot”, “sexy”, “beautiful” all mean the same thing. :doh2:

I can say that my mother is beautiful. But I cannot say that my mother is hot. Or do you call your mother hot?

 

[Joe_5859]

Come on. You guys should just stop pretending that “hot”, “sexy”, “beautiful” all mean the same thing. :doh2:

I can say that my mother is beautiful. But I cannot say that my mother is hot. Or do you call your mother hot?

Yes, I think it fails the “Mom test”.

 

[kelvinf]

OK So is it that a gay guy comment on another guy or that he used the word “hot”?

Both.

I have been reading all the post, but did I miss one saying it would have been just as offensive if a female worker had said it about the guy?

It’s not the same thing because the desire between opposite sexes is normal while that between same sexes isn’t. You can’t seriously compare them. Inappropriate talk is still inappropriate talk though.

 

[EasterJoy]

Come on. You guys should just stop pretending that “hot”, “sexy”, “beautiful” all mean the same thing. :doh2:

I can say that my mother is beautiful. But I cannot say that my mother is hot. Or do you call your mother hot?

Exactly. More to the point, if a man is standing on a street corner with his sixteen-year-old daughter, and some strange man comes up and tells her, “My goodness, girl, that outfit is hot,” will he take that as an innocent remark? No. If he hears it very often, he’ll try to see to it that his daughter won’t be leaving the house again in that outfit! Do you tell a man that his sister or his daughter is hot, as if it meant the same thing as beautiful? No.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

At any rate, my points are these:

It is probably a very bad idea for the OP to tell the coworker that you do not approve of how he’s choosing to handle his sexual appetites. She does not know him anywhere close to well enough to presume to do that. In our current work atmosphere, that would be crossing a line.

Since his sexual talk bothers her and since she will have a hard time singling his sexual impurities out as worse than anyone else’s, she might try letting him know that she does not talk about sex or make any except the most polite personal comments at work. This policy, while stricter than some like, is a good way to avoid giving offense and to avoid appearing unprofessional. Yes, there are people who don’t think a thing of sex talk at work and those who don’t think “hot” has sexual connotations, but there are people who do, and you cannot tell who is who by looking at them. This is also a fair policy that will not give her coworker a reason to feel he is being discriminated against for his orientation. This is not only less likely to cause her trouble, but is also kinder to him. None of us like to be singled out as worse than everyone else.

If his talk is pervasive and affects her productivity, then it would probably be a good idea to seek out someone at work whom she could trust as a mentor, in order to decide how to handle this situation. There are some organizations where nothing will be done, but there are others that will find his behavior unacceptable. She’d do well to find out which kind of organization she’s in.

You seem to have a rose-tinted view of propriety in the workplace.

The OP is a young woman who I believe is either a senior in high school or in her first year of college. This is in all likelihood a part time job at a restaurant, retail store, or something similar. It is also, in all likelihood, a place with a high employee turnover rate, and not a place that she aspires to move up in.

Having worked in many of those environments, I can say that if the OP wants to keep her job and feel comfortable in her place of employment, she needs to let this go. If this were an office environment, or a job that had long term potential for the OP, you would probably be more correct. But if this is a waitressing job, a fast food place, a retail store, etc the OP will greatly outnumbered in her attitude, people of both genders and all orientations will probably make more comments just to see her squirm, and management will not take this seriously. And if she goes over managements head? They’ll probably make up a weak excuse to fire her. Yes, this could “technically” be construed as sexual harassment, but that technicality just isn’t going to be seen as worth anyone’s time.

Those types of work environments just do not take these things seriously. Because of the low wages (even at the management level) and high turnover, it just isn’t worth the supervisor’s time or effort to pursue, because she knows that one of them will be out the door in a few months anyway.

Either the OP needs to find another job or grow thicker skin. It’s unfortunate, but the real world does not often work the way that it “ought” to.