Homosexuality And Why The Church Is Wrong

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I understand that you are able to fall in love with other men, and because you fall in love with them, I’m sure you want to get married and have sexual relations. Because this is how you feel, it hurts when others say “no, you can’t or shouldn’t do that.” You feel that even though you’re gay, you should have the right to have a relationship. And when others say no, God says you cannot, you feel hurt and alone and like the church is against you. I don’t really have anything to say other than I know how you feel. I’m not gay, but knowing id have to spend the rest of my life without being married and in relationship would hurt me just as much as it hurts you. Its not about sex, its about a feeling of being alone. Granted you can have friends and love your family, but its not the same as the bond of being married and with a “partner”. Since you’re gay, you know that you can’t have that because the church is against that. And I know you’re hurt. I know it feels unfair. I guess the real question is for God, why he would allow people to be born gay. I can understand the confusion and pain you get from it. But people do not think you’re evil, they just believe what God says, and he says the act of it is wrong. I really don’t know what to say, because if I put myself in your situation I would feel like I have been given something that was unfair. I hope the best for you though. I hope you are able to over-come the feeling of wanting a loving relationship such as married couples have.
 
The only reason why I’m writing this is because I’m sick and tired of being called ‘evil’ just because of my sexual orientation.

I strongly believe I’m a loving person. I love my life, my family and friends. ALL human beings are creatures of love, no matter what they are attracted to.

At the end of the day that’s all it is, a sexual orientation. Just because I’m gay doesnt mean I’m ‘evil’. I’m tired of the Catholic Church in particular persuading people that it’s wrong. It is not, nor has it ever been.

In reference to another thread about gay couples being allowed to adopt, to quote one of this websites answers “Adoption is for the benefit of the child involved”. Are you saying a child is better to be in a foster home rather than be adopted by a same-sex couple? I am telling you that any child would be lucky to have two dads or two mothers.

Homosexuality is not contagious, its not caused by mothers ‘loving’ their child that bit too much. I was born this way.

I always wonder why the Church continues this mentality, when thousands of people (teenagers in particular) are committing suicide because they can’t live with being gay because YOU are telling them they are evil?

I know the chances of a half decent rebuttal to this is slim, but I had to let you know my opinion.
-Johnny
I have to admit there is the occasional poster who crosses the line and says things about gays and lesbians like yourself that are either untrue or blown way out of proportion.

I think we at CAF make great defenders of the faith and word of God and the truth the Church teaches on homosexuality.

But sometimes I can’t help but wonder maybe we need to be more Christlike and loving in our responses and defenses of Church teaching.

Johnny if your looking for answers that are true to the Church’s teachings but aren’t blown way out of proportion or telling half truths check out these links. Johnny I’m sorry for being homophobic and contributing to an unwelcome and unchristlike reception that a very small minority of users have made you feel unwelcome.

Here’s those resources

Archdiocese of Los Angeles Gay and Lesbian Ministry
-A great alternative to Courage. I think Courage does some great work but they have ties to the “ex-gay” movement and I don’t think that would exactly help your situation. Your probably not in Los Angeles but its one of the better responses the Church has to homosexuality.

Always Our Children-Groundbreaking USCCB document that was a response to parents who were being confused and mislead by the Evangelical right in the 80’s and 90’s.

Fortunate Families-This is one of the few Catholic LGBT groups that holds true to Church teachings on homosexuality while trying to combat bullying, misinformation, and stigma against homosexuals in the Church. A much welcome alternative to misleading groups like Dignity or New Ways.

And then here’s my favorite the Marin Foundation. Their “I’m Sorry” campaign has garnered quite a bit of reaction and attention in protestant circles. Although its focused primarily on the Evangelical community its got some great Catholic resources. This is a bridge building organization.

Hope those helped!
 
The only reason why I’m writing this is because I’m sick and tired of being called ‘evil’ just because of my sexual orientation.

I strongly believe I’m a loving person. I love my life, my family and friends. ALL human beings are creatures of love, no matter what they are attracted to.

At the end of the day that’s all it is, a sexual orientation. Just because I’m gay doesnt mean I’m ‘evil’. I’m tired of the Catholic Church in particular persuading people that it’s wrong. It is not, nor has it ever been.

In reference to another thread about gay couples being allowed to adopt, to quote one of this websites answers “Adoption is for the benefit of the child involved”. Are you saying a child is better to be in a foster home rather than be adopted by a same-sex couple? I am telling you that any child would be lucky to have two dads or two mothers.

Homosexuality is not contagious, its not caused by mothers ‘loving’ their child that bit too much. I was born this way.

I always wonder why the Church continues this mentality, when thousands of people (teenagers in particular) are committing suicide because they can’t live with being gay because YOU are telling them they are evil?

I know the chances of a half decent rebuttal to this is slim, but I had to let you know my opinion.
-Johnny
Hi Johnny,

Who is calling you evil? None of us are without sin. We’re all at risk.

Please provide documented proof that thousands of teenagers are committing suicide over this. I never had a problem with the gay persons I’ve worked with. I never called them evil. And during all my years here on earth, I never once heard anyone I know even suggest we should make a gay person feel bad because they are gay or call them names.

Peace,
Ed
 
So you think that falling in love with another man is normal and that one should pursue those feelings?
I asserted neither in my post.

To love another man is fine and even good in some cases, but to desire them sexually is most definitely not.
MIndOverMatter

**So you think that falling in love with another man is normal and that one should pursue those feelings? **

Within limits intimacy between men is good and should be pursued. I have known several men with whom I have had the closest possible friendship without thinking once that it could become sexual. To understand this you would have to have had the experience yourself.

I suspect that Jesus had an intimate relationship with the apostle John, loving him in the way that a father would love his son. That can be very intimate. It is interesting that in some ways the Gospel of John is more “loving” toward Jesus than any other. He felt the great loive and Jesus, never forgot it, and returned to it in his writings.

I believe many priests and sisters have very intimate relations of friendship that are also very chaste. I have observed some of these great friendships from afar, and I think they are not the least bit homosexual.
DRB 15:12-16 said:
12. This is my commandment, That you love one another, as I have loved you.
  1. Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
  2. You are my friends, if you do whatsoever I command you.
  3. Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knows not what his Lord does; but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known to you.
  4. You have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that you should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever you shall ask of the Father in my name, He may give it you.

This is where it is believed the rite of adoption was instituted by Christ (basically formal induction of your BFF into your family and you into his).
Yeah, i have no problem with brotherly love; which i thought was an entirely different thing to falling in love. Its precisely that kind of “brotherly love” that i seek in my brothers; and its not fair to equate that with Gay Love. Or perhaps i am wrong. **Perhaps the only reason two male heterosexual best friends are not “in love” with each-other is because they lack sexual attraction toward one-another?
**
But the Church tells people with SSA to seek disinterested relationships with people of the same sex. For example, be friends with people who you are not sexually attracted to, especially if they have SSA themselves. Am i wrong about that?
That is a fascinating idea
 
The only reason why I’m writing this is because I’m sick and tired of being called ‘evil’ just because of my sexual orientation.

I strongly believe I’m a loving person. I love my life, my family and friends. ALL human beings are creatures of love, no matter what they are attracted to.

At the end of the day that’s all it is, a sexual orientation. Just because I’m gay doesnt mean I’m ‘evil’. I’m tired of the Catholic Church in particular persuading people that it’s wrong. It is not, nor has it ever been.

In reference to another thread about gay couples being allowed to adopt, to quote one of this websites answers “Adoption is for the benefit of the child involved”. Are you saying a child is better to be in a foster home rather than be adopted by a same-sex couple? I am telling you that any child would be lucky to have two dads or two mothers.

Homosexuality is not contagious, its not caused by mothers ‘loving’ their child that bit too much. I was born this way.

I always wonder why the Church continues this mentality, when thousands of people (teenagers in particular) are committing suicide because they can’t live with being gay because YOU are telling them they are evil?

I know the chances of a half decent rebuttal to this is slim, but I had to let you know my opinion.
-Johnny
Amazing. You did not write a single thing that even touches on anything institutional Catholicism believes. You point-and-stutter but you aren’t even pointing at us!
 
Our lives are not the result sum of our actions/experiences (ie homosexuality) but the result sum of our relationships (ie marriage). If we pervert our relationships, namely with God, we pervert ourselves.

We can always work to right these relationships, especially with God.
 
The only reason why I’m writing this is because I’m sick and tired of being called ‘evil’ just because of my sexual orientation.
Hi johnny,

I appreciate your frustration on this subject.

But please realise the Church doesn’t say gay people are “evil”. It is explicitly stated in the Catholic Catechism that gay people are of the exact same dignity and equal worth as anyone else. It is stated that gay people deserve to be treated with the same respect and decency as anyone else, and that it is wrong to seek to harm or harass them in any way.

The Church’s teaching has no beef with gay people at all. So if anyone is saying otherwise, then they are wrong. Also, the media frequently twists and exaggerates the Church’s stance to make it seem as though it actively persecutes* gay people - it does not.

(*Quite the opposite actually, the Church is on record at the UN speaking out against nations which do persecute gay people. Additionally, Uganda recently tried to introduce a law subjecting gay people to the death penalty, purely for who they are. The Catholic Church was the only indigenous religious group to openly oppose the proposed brutal law, calling.it “fundamentally unChristian”. But of course, this is not reported - bad news about the Church sells more papers, and the media and society don’t want to lose their favourite bogeyman)

When it comes to actual homosexual activity - sexual acts with a person of the same gender - the Church’s teaching is that these acts are disordered.

People often claim that “disordered” is an offensive term, but it is not. It is a simple descriptor for an object, (in this case, the human body), being used for something other than it’s inherent purpose, which is clear via its physical form and functions.

For example, a square peg in a round hole in disordered. A square peg in a square hole is ordered.

Other sexual things which the Church teaches are disordered include masturbation and anal sex between heterosexual couples. You get the idea.

The Catholic Church’s opinion on homosexual acts is based primarily on logical conclusions from an understanding of natural law (biological science), not Old Testament references like the Protestants (traditionally anyway; some have since dropped this).

This is the extent of the Catholic Church’s position. It does not teach that gay people are evil and even has a specific policy not to use offensive Old Testament language to describe gay people, in the same way that some Protestants still do (mainly the word “abomination”).

So, if someone is familiar with human biology, and so understands the structure, features and functions of our sexual organs, then they have no option but to affirm the Church’s opinion that homosexual acts are indeed disordered. Ultimately this is logic and science, not scripture and faith.

However, the Church does acknowledge that there are many homosexual orientated people and tries to be compassionate towards them.

So, never let anyone tell you that you are “evil” because of the people you are physically attracted to. You are not.

I appreciate the above explanation of the Church’s position may offer little comfort.

I understand that you likely feel torn between your faith and what you see as your sexual orientation, which must be very difficult. The Church says gay people are called to chastity, which I guess must seem like something from another dimension in today’s western societies.

How do you feel about that - called to chastity - realistic or not? What do you say of the many gay Catholics (and likely of other religions too) who do endeavour to live faithfully like this?

What in your eyes could the Church do or say different on this matter?

Good to talk to you, and remember you are not evil! 😉

Take care,
Cheers.
 
I’m a 25 year old guy with homosexual inclinations.

If you ever decide to live in accordance with Church teaching, know that you’re not alone, and that it really doesn’t make life any less awesome. Heck, it might even mean you have an awesome eternity to look forward to.
At the end of the day that’s all it is, a sexual orientation. Just because I’m gay doesnt mean I’m ‘evil’. I’m tired of the Catholic Church in particular persuading people that it’s wrong. It is not, nor has it ever been.
The Church has never called me “evil.” I’ve confessed my sins to many priests. In the past, my sins have even involved homosexual activity, so there is no question that they knew my predispositions. I have never been met with anything other than understanding and forgiveness.

I do understand that you may not have been so lucky. But the official stance of the Church and that of the priests who do as the Church tells them is just that - one of understanding and forgiveness.

Like you, I know I am not evil, or at least not in the colloquial sense, although we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God (Rom 3:23).
Homosexuality is not contagious, its not caused by mothers ‘loving’ their child that bit too much. I was born this way.
I agree with you that homosexuality is not contagious. Judging by my relationship with my mother, there certainly wasn’t an excess of love.
I always wonder why the Church continues this mentality, when thousands of people (teenagers in particular) are committing suicide because they can’t live with being gay because YOU are telling them they are evil?
The Church never drove me to suicide and it doesn’t say I’m evil. It says that my inclination is disordered. So what? Nobody’s perfect.

We should all strive to be, however.
Being a homosexual, the general answer here is to live a chaste, single life. I strongly disagree with this. We are creatures of love, and why shouldn’t I be able to give and receive this love to a man?
I really love my German Shepherd. Probably more than is befitting for an animal, but we humans do tend to idealise man’s best friend. Does that mean I must have sex with him?

Must I have sex with all the things I love?

And how would my having sex with a man be love? How would abusing his body for my pleasure and not for the purpose that it was created be an act of love? If anything, I see that as an act of hate. Similarly, to permit such a thing to happen to me would be an act of hate towards myself. And thus any inclination I may have towards either is clearly disordered.

I have close, loving relationships with some male friends of mine. And I have about as much need of expressing my love for them sexually as I do with my dog.

It isn’t that much different from a woman being tempted to cheat on her husband, or from a young couple wanting to sneak off to have a little premarital “fun.”

We all have different crosses to carry. If we do so faithfully, our crosses, including our disordered inclinations, will serve as a means towards our sanctification. Many people have to carry crosses much heavier than mine, so I dare not complain and am grateful for the grace that he gives me.

As a consequence of Original Sin, we all have disordered desires. The Church doesn’t hate us. I’m not that much different from the next guy, and neither are you.
 
I’m a 25 year old guy with homosexual inclinations.
Hello kch:thumbsup: This is also something i have struggled with for many years. Please pray for me.
And how would my having sex with a man be love? How would abusing his body for my pleasure and not for the purpose that it was created be an act of love? If anything, I see that as an act of hate. Similarly, to permit such a thing to happen to me would be an act of hate towards myself. And thus any inclination I may have towards either is clearly disordered.
Thankyou for your (name removed by moderator)ut.👍 Very well said. It would be an act of hate and selfishness. But a lot of people are not aware or don’t understand that they are being selfish and hateful to themselves.😦

Many people have bought into the “gay” concept. Some people feel compelled to live a homosexual lifestyle, because they think thats what they are and that they should be true to themselves.😦

Its very sad.

God save us!!!
 
Hello kch:thumbsup: This is also something i have struggled with for many years. Please pray for me.
Of course I will pray for you, brother.

And don’t give up the struggle, my friend. It will only be after this life is over that God will show us how important it was. We will see how his grace transformed our inclinations - the cross we struggle with - into blessings. We will truly understand that it is precisely through our crosses that we have struggled with our whole lives that God has granted us salvation, and that without it, we would have got nowhere.

For now, however, it is difficult for people to see what God sees, and because of this, He will reward especially those who have kept on carrying their cross even when the road ahead looked bleak. “No eye has seen, no ear has heard, and no mind has imagined” what lies beyond the mist.
Many people have bought into the “gay” concept. Some people feel compelled to live a homosexual lifestyle, because they think thats what they are and that they should be true to themselves.😦
Unfortunately that’s true. Furthermore, and I’m ashamed to say that it is with some experience that I say this, what I’ve seen is that people who buy into the actual lifestyle in the hope of liberation, with the passing of time, eventually sink either into the pits of perversion or into loneliness and despair.

What being “gay” purports to offer is freedom, but what it actually gives in the long run is unhappiness, in this life and the next.
 
I have a question to counter this thread and man people replying. If God didn’t like homosexuals, or the way they are, then why did he make them? Why would he make something he is disgusted by and why doesnt he do something about it? I though god loved all of his children, no matter what they did or how they acted. I thought he was all loving.
 
I have a question to counter this thread and man people replying. If God didn’t like homosexuals, or the way they are, then why did he make them? Why would he make something he is disgusted by and why doesnt he do something about it? I though god loved all of his children, no matter what they did or how they acted. I thought he was all loving.
God also loves the person who is sexually attracted to animals. Why did he create those people? Surely not to have sex with animals? The assumption is of course that there cannot be any such thing as a “sexual health disorder”: but that assumption obviously depends on your worldveiw.

The real question is what does a persons attraction to animals have to do with how we ought to behave?
 
I have a question to counter this thread and man people replying. If God didn’t like homosexuals, or the way they are, then why did he make them?
There’s no evidence that God “made” homosexuals. He certainly didn’t “make” their behavior, and there’s no evidence that he “made” their inclinations. Our sexuality develops over time, regardless of whether we’re conscious of that development, or the mechanics of that development, or whether we “remembered” when/how it developed. Sexuality, including attraction, depends on complex dynamics which involve many factors, including environment, experience, and much else.
 
I have a question to counter this thread and man people replying. If God didn’t like homosexuals, or the way they are, then why did he make them?
God likes homosexuals. I’m pretty sure He likes me. In fact, I’m pretty sure He loves me.
Why would he make something he is disgusted by and why doesnt he do something about it? I though god loved all of his children, no matter what they did or how they acted. I thought he was all loving.
He is not disgusted by me. He made me because He loves me. And He will love me no matter what I do and no matter how I act. God is indeed all-loving.

However, like all of humanity, I bear the stain of Original Sin. And it is this sin, which gives me an inclination to act contrary to God’s Perfect Will. You too are subject to Original Sin. And you too have an inclination to act against the will of God.

Perhaps your inclination is different. But you, like me, and everyone else, will have to struggle against it. That inclination towards sin is your cross and my cross. And indeed, with His grace, we must pick up that cross and carry it, and struggle to align our wills with that of the Creator.

Our struggle to carry that cross is the repentance on which our salvation depends.
 

The only reason why I’m writing this is because I’m sick and tired of being called ‘evil’ just because of my sexual orientation.

I can understand that. So, who called you evil?
I have sometimes been called evil because I think abortion is wrong… some people think thats inhumane. I think its the only humane oppinion.


I strongly believe I’m a loving person. I love my life, my family and friends. ALL human beings are creatures of love, no matter what they are attracted to.

Good… Then you must be a really great guy. I don’t know if Im always loving… I try to be… Some people are attracted to fornication, adultery, porn or sex with children… i don’t think they were born bad but their attraction, if acted on, can cause them to commit sin. Sin changes our inner character in a negative way, just like virtue changes it in a good way

At the end of the day that’s all it is, a sexual orientation. Just because I’m gay doesnt mean I’m ‘evil’. I’m tired of the Catholic Church in particular persuading people that it’s wrong. It is not, nor has it ever been.

Who said you are evil? Surely its not in church teaching. But look, sexual impurity is evil. This is so for both empirical/natural reasons, philosophical, ethical, social and biological reasons… really common sense. We see eg. that when people are not faithful they create havoc in society and when they are promiscuous they tend to spread disease and while they are promiscuous they do not find that love and acceptance that every person is longing for…

In reference to another thread about gay couples being allowed to adopt, to quote one of this websites answers “Adoption is for the benefit of the child involved”. Are you saying a child is better to be in a foster home rather than be adopted by a same-sex couple?

I would say that a child is best off with his two biological parents, a mother and father… There are not many empirically and methodologically valid studies made yet as to the effect of having grown up in a gay household, but the ones that are (made on children who grew up with lesbian mother(s) showed a that these children don’t do as well as other children, and there were severel issues. Major studies have furthermore been made about gay men’s ability to be physically faithful to one another. One study was conducted by gay scientist and showed that gay men are unable to be faithful to the same partner for many years.

I am telling you that any child would be lucky to have two dads or two mothers.

Im happy I have my mother and father. Its less than ideal to have to be without one of these… and society should prevent it if possible… I say the same about single-mother households. This is less than ideal, as any child who has grown up without her/his dad would tell you.

Homosexuality is not contagious, its not caused by mothers ‘loving’ their child that bit too much. I was born this way.

How do you know you were born that way? This can be no more than a belief. Would you agree that your body has a gender and is ordered towards a complimenting gender in order to procreate?

I always wonder why the Church continues this mentality, when thousands of people (teenagers in particular) are committing suicide because they can’t live with being gay because YOU are telling them they are evil?

Ehh, this is a false statement. Homosexual people everywhere tends to have higher numbers of suicide, depression and anxiety… the statistics is the same in very very liberal societies like Holland where no gay ever hears anything bad said about his same sex attraction. Please don’t spread lies.

I know the chances of a half decent rebuttal to this is slim, but I had to let you know my opinion.
-Johnny

**Well Im glad you did, and I’m glad you are here. Now I hope you also allowed you to let me share my oppinion with you :)… … By the way, I’m an unmarried woman so I have to live in chastity… that is if I believe that God made this law because its best for me. I feel protected by Jesus, and although I long for sexual intimacy I count it for more important to stay in Jesus Christ… **
 
I have a question to counter this thread and man people replying. If God didn’t like homosexuals, or the way they are, then why did he make them?

****Why indeed did he make any of us? ****

Why would he make something he is disgusted by

Why do you assume He is disgusted by us? He is disgusted by our sins… as are we ourselves when we have looked into His eyes and seen what glory He calls us to…

and why doesnt he do something about it? I though god loved all of his children, no matter what they did or how they acted. I thought he was all loving.

Maybe you should open another thread about the classical “problem of evil”…
 
God likes homosexuals. I’m pretty sure He likes me. In fact, I’m pretty sure He loves me.

He is not disgusted by me. He made me because He loves me. And He will love me no matter what I do and no matter how I act. God is indeed all-loving.

However, like all of humanity, I bear the stain of Original Sin. And it is this sin, which gives me an inclination to act contrary to God’s Perfect Will. You too are subject to Original Sin. And you too have an inclination to act against the will of God.

Perhaps your inclination is different. But you, like me, and everyone else, will have to struggle against it. That inclination towards sin is your cross and my cross. And indeed, with His grace, we must pick up that cross and carry it, and struggle to align our wills with that of the Creator.

Our struggle to carry that cross is the repentance on which our salvation depends.
I’ve give up trying to argue with some of the posters on here. They’re firmly entrenched in their views.

It’s just best to let them be and not provoke a fight or argument. Remember God loves everyone no matter what! 🙂
 
I’ve give up trying to argue with some of the posters on here. They’re firmly entrenched in their views.

It’s just best to let them be and not provoke a fight or argument. Remember God loves everyone no matter what! 🙂
I don’t really feel like I’m arguing. Opinions divergent from mine challenge me to learn more, and I just want to express what I believe to be the truth and be corrected if it turns out I’m wrong.

God loves everyone indeed. Even me, and even when I’m mistaken 😃
 
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GraceDK:
I never asumed he hated homosexuals, this is directed to thos who believe that God is disgusted by them and hates them. In my belief, god loves everyone, and everything, even those people who were born to sexually attracted to other things rather than the opposite sex and the only thing that he objects to is the sins we have done in our lives.
 
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