Homosexuality in family

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To attend is to say that you approve of what he’s doing. You can’t go.

I would recommend RSVPing that you’re not available that weekend (it’s not a lie; you’re not available to attend an invalid wedding because you cannot be available) and simply send a “Thinking of You” card wishing them and their partner all the best.

It will be hard. Jesus said that He had come to bring not peace, but a sword.

My husband has cut off contact with certain members of his family - not because of homosexuality specifically, but because of toxic behavior on their part. Does it suck? Yes. But we work on carving out our own life with our friends and some family that we do still see. (It does help, admittedly, that we’re both introverts.)

I will pray for you.
 
If I had resented myself at said ceremony, I feel I would be viewed as condoning the union, which is scandal. Thus, I would politely decline.

And yes, my DH and I were bad-mouthed for making just this very decision. However, it reflected more on the family members doing the criticizing. Sadly, our Earthly relationship ended with this part of the family. However, I want to be sitting at God’s right hand when my time comes. Thus, I closely follow the tenets of the faith.
 
Dacinom said:
God bless you and thank you for sharing.

You are not alone in your belief system, in fact there is a formal name for what it’s called and it has been around for many centuries. It is called Moral Relativism. Basically, when you boil it down, you have your truth, I have my truth and they are both equally valid. I have my sins, you have your sins and we both live our own lives. It sounds good on the surface, however in reality (in my experience) most people really do believe in at least some absolute truths that should apply to everyone regardless of their personal feelings (ex: lying is wrong). There some other problems (in my opinion) that can come into play too, but I thank you for sharing your thoughts, makes for an interesting and thoughtful discussion which is what this forum is for!
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Oh I absolutely agree that most people do believe in some absolute truths - I think it’s been shown all throughout history even, that most societies, whether they have a religion, or even whether their religion is christian, polytheistic, etc - there are certain moral standards that just live through the ages (as you mentioned - lying. I’d add murder, and in many cases adultery, and even in some cases homosexuality).

Really - who wouldn’t want everyone to all have the same beliefs; there would be much less strife in the world. Unfortunately that’s not the case… so I choose to let people have their own beliefs (as long as they don’t hurt me), and live as an example of my beliefs in the hope that others will see and join me 🙂

I would like to add one other thing to this discussion:

If you had friends who were Jewish, Islamic, or some other non-Christian religion, would you refuse to go to their wedding (or whatever the name of the ceremony might be in a different religion or culture)? Because it’s not a Catholic, or Christian wedding? Because they don’t share your beliefs, or because their ceremony isn’t “blessed by God” or isn’t held in a Catholic church?

Maybe you’d answer no - I think in that case, you’re perfectly justified in not going to a gay civil ceremony - it would be consistent with your practice of your beliefs. But if you’d answer yes, that you would go to the ceremony of friends in a different non-Christian tradition, then I don’t know why you wouldn’t attend a gay civil ceremony for a family member or friend. They’re not asking you to join their religion (or become gay, or shout on the rooftops that you denounce your religion/beliefs and become a supporter). They’re just asking you to celebrate their commitment to each other.
 
tinamn said:
I would like to add one other thing to this discussion:

If you had friends who were Jewish, Islamic, or some other non-Christian religion, would you refuse to go to their wedding (or whatever the name of the ceremony might be in a different religion or culture)? Because it’s not a Catholic, or Christian wedding? Because they don’t share your beliefs, or because their ceremony isn’t “blessed by God” or isn’t held in a Catholic church?
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You might misunderstand the Catholic understanding of marriage. Only Catholics are bound by canon law requirements of marriage (unless they apply for and are granted dispensation.) Non-Catholics who marry civilly or in their own religious tradition are considered validly married. If both people are non-Catholic baptized Christians, their marriage is also sacramental. There is no issue for Catholics attending these weddings.
 
pensmama87 said:
You might misunderstand the Catholic understanding of marriage. Only Catholics are bound by canon law requirements of marriage (unless they apply for and are granted dispensation.) Non-Catholics who marry civilly or in their own religious tradition are considered validly married. If both people are non-Catholic baptized Christians, their marriage is also sacramental. There is no issue for Catholics attending these weddings.
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No, I’m not misunderstanding at all. I’m talking about non-Christians getting married. Atheist or just another religion altogether.
 
tinamn said:
No, I’m not misunderstanding at all. I’m talking about non-Christians getting married. Atheist or just another religion altogether.
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There is no problem with a Catholic attending a wedding between non-Christians. Marriages between non-Christians are just as valid and real as marriages between Christians. This is Catholic teaching.

A marriage between two unbaptized people (or one baptized, one unbaptized) would be a valid natural marriage. Not sacramental, but still valid and real, and not morally problematic.
 
Is it morally licit to attend a siblings marriage ceremony if they have been previously married and a canonical court found that the first marriage was valid?
 
Dacinom said:
Unfortunately their commitment is intrinsically disordered, so I could not attend their ceremony.

Let me ask these questions and I am not throwing them out there as a straw man argument or for something trivial, I mean this for deep thought for those of you that are pro-gay marriage:

If I were going to get married to my son, assuming we were both adults and of legal age. Say I invited you to the ceremony asking you to celebrate that commitment, would you attend? I am not asking you to join my religion, I am simply asking you to support us in the life we have chosen because we make each other happy. How about if someone like Paula Deen (who got in trouble for admitting this by the way that she considered this years ago) invited you to her “Plantation Themed Wedding” where she hired all black people to serve?

If everyone here that is pro-gay marriage would accept invitations to both of these weddings, then I accept your assertion that you are open-minded and accept people for who they are and will celebrate with someone you care about under any circumstance whatsoever. The fact of the matter is most people would not. Reality is people have a line that they cannot cross when it comes to their moral compass, it’s just that simple.

Attending a marriage of a Jewish man marrying a Jewish woman is a lovely thing, I have done it. God created men and women to be together. Homosexual relationships are intrinsically disordered, that doesn’t mean the people are not loved by God and wonderful people. It just means we don’t celebrate the so-called “marriages”.

We might have to agree to disagree on this one, but thank you for a respectful discussion. God bless your day!
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Can I ask what you would do about gay people loving one another as two human beings and supporting eachother in times of need because the world seems to be against it in a way so they may only have eachother?

If it is this much of a problem then what are the solutions to said problem?

I’m just curious.
 
Dacinom said:
I know that you are pro-gay-marriage, I am not so we are not likely to agree which is fine. What I am quite curious about is the idea presented frequently about “two human beings loving each other and supporting one another.”

Does that same idea hold water with you if I want to marry my son? It’s an honest question really. What I can’t understand is when people who are pro-gay marriage say that people should be able to marry whoever they love, but then when situations of three people getting married are brought up or an uncle marrying his niece are brought up (legal now in New York see: Nguyen vs. Holder) many put their foot down. Who gets to define love then? If my son and I claim we are in love with each other who gets to say “no” to that and judge us? Same logic with three or four people marrying each other.

Once marriage isn’t one-man-one-woman and is “feelings” it can be ANYTHING and I mean ANYTHING. ** There is a case pending in New Jersey a father and daughter want to get married.**

Perhaps you are fine with these other situations. If you are then that would make sense. Most people who are pro-gay marriage are not though, which I find somewhat hypocritical because if a person’s is that you should be able to “marry whoever you love and not be judged” then that should go for everyone even if the situation is rather odd by most standards. Thank you again for an interesting conversation, God bless.
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I am pro-gay marriage as you say because I honestly do not care if two men want to get married it has no impact on my life at all.

Incest however can cause bad things if the two people decide to have children. There can be birth defects I believe due to it from what I know. The thought of a mom and son getting married is just kind of odd. It’s the parent/offspring thing that just sounds off to me.

I happen to know someone who is in a polyamorous relationship. I do not agree with it at all I don’t go telling them that though. Two gay men is still two people getting married when you add a third the situation changes trust me. I tried to wrap my head around my friends life and it’s not easy to do.

Just because I’m fine with gay marriage does not mean I am alright with other things like it.

Have a good day!
 
SilverLight said:
I am pro-gay marriage as you say because I honestly do not care if two men want to get married it has no impact on my life at all.

Incest however can cause bad things if the two people decide to have children. There can be birth defects I believe due to it from what I know. The thought of a mom and son getting married is just kind of odd. It’s the parent/offspring thing that just sounds off to me.

I happen to know someone who is in a polyamorous relationship. I do not agree with it at all I don’t go telling them that though. Two gay men is still two people getting married when you add a third the situation changes trust me. I tried to wrap my head around my friends life and it’s not easy to do.

Just because I’m fine with gay marriage does not mean I am alright with other things like it.

Have a good day!
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When you consider an *incestuous relationship *and all you can say is “that just sounds off to me,” I have to think you’ve let the doors of your mind flap a good deal too wide open.

In its present incarnation, the idea of gay marriage has lead, among people I know, to deliberate out-of-wedlock childbirth. We don’t have children raised away from one or both parents out of some accident of fate, but because their custodial parent decided that their child can just do without his or her other biological parent(s). The situation of adults stepping in as parents of children denied the parenting of their biological parents by fate has lead some to believe that those biological parents were just nothing to the child in the first place, no one to be missed, heaven knows. It makes the child into chattel is what it does.

The world has gone insane.
 
EasterJoy said:
When you consider an *incestuous relationship *and all you can say is “that just sounds off to me,” I have to think you’ve let the doors of your mind flap a good deal too wide open.

In its present incarnation, the idea of gay marriage has lead, among people I know, to deliberate out-of-wedlock childbirth. We don’t have children raised away from one or both parents out of some accident of fate, but because their custodial parent decided that their child can just do without his or her other biological parent(s). The situation of adults stepping in as parents of children denied the parenting of their biological parents by fate has lead some to believe that those biological parents were just nothing to the child in the first place, no one to be missed, heaven knows. It makes the child into chattel is what it does.

The world has gone insane.
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You can think what you want about me I don’t think incest is fine at all though.

Regarding kids not being with their biological parents.

I happen to be adopted and would have had a bad life if I stayed with my birth mother. I love her but I may never get to know her. I got to finish college and so much more because I was adopted.

You sound angry to me and I hope you can find happiness in life.

Have a good day!
 
Dacinom said:
What if they are not planning on having children? Shouldn’t consenting adults be able to live together freely in a marriage without being judged? What if all they wanted to do was be supportive of one another and build a life together?

There is a 19-year old woman in New Jersey that was hoping to marry her long-lost father after dating him. Would it be judgmental not to celebrate this wedding?

The reason I am posting this Silverlight is because when I encounter people who are pro gay “marriage” the reason most often given is that “a person should be able to marry whomever they love” but in my opinion this reason is hypocritical which drives me crazy hope that makes some sense. God bless your day thank you for an interesting conversation.
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I’m sorry that drives you crazy. There is a fine line and it’s easy to cross sometimes.
If I was talking to you in person I could explain better but I can’t do that here.

I don’t agree with family getting married to family but it still happened either way in the world. I don’t agree with it but there is little I can do as one person to stop it so I choose to not stress over it.

Have a nice day
 
I probably wouldn’t attend either of your examples, and here’s why.

Father marrying a daughter - that’s incest (which is illegal, and poses genetic concerns). There is a pretty general understanding in most cultures than incest is wrong - you don’t need a religion to tell you this. If they weren’t planning to be intimate, I don’t imagine they would be pushing for a wedding… they’d just live together and have their actual father-daughter relationship the way it was intended.

In a way, I can see how you might say feeling that way doesn’t align with the thinking on the gay issue - obviously being gay has only relatively recently become accepted in the mainstream, and there were (and probably are still) laws that made just being gay (let alone getting married) illegal. The way things are going, I suppose incest maybe just one of the next things that becomes mainstream… who knows? I’m sure 100 years ago people wouldn’t have thought we’d be fighting to have the right to kill our unborn babies.

The current difference to me centers around the fact that gay marriage, while a sin in my belief system, doesn’t really hurt anyone. Incest, on the other hand, can have victims in the sense of babies born with defects that would have been completely preventable, not to mention the fact that making incest ok opens the door for creeps to be incestuous with their underage children.

I’ve heard a lot of people argue that gay it’s eroding traditional marriages/values, but I think men and women in traditional marriages have done enough damage on their own; we should maybe look at the problems we ourselves are causing before trying to look outside and say two guys or two gals living together is causing the downfall of our marriage.

Paula Deen’s example? That’s clearly extremely racist. I’m not even really sure how that example fits in here, as it’s not about the actual union or marriage, but the details of the wedding. I don’t even have to think deeply about it - it would absolutely NOT be open-minded to attend a wedding like that. If I was unaware of the situation, and went only to discover this to be the case, I would leave.

As far as the argument that people should be able to marry whomever they love - that’s not exactly how I’d put it. That’s idealistic, and I’m sure that’s what a lot of people are aiming for. My philosophy is what I’ve already said before: Just because my belief system says something is wrong or is a sin, doesn’t mean that people who don’t share my belief system should have to follow MY rules. On the flip side, just because something is culturally accepted, doesn’t mean I don’t get to use my belief system to determine whether it’s right or wrong for me (or for the people who claim to have the same belief system as myself).
 
tinamn said:
I probably wouldn’t attend either of your examples, and here’s why.

Father marrying a daughter - that’s incest (which is illegal, and poses genetic concerns). There is a pretty general understanding in most cultures than incest is wrong - you don’t need a religion to tell you this. If they weren’t planning to be intimate, I don’t imagine they would be pushing for a wedding… they’d just live together and have their actual father-daughter relationship the way it was intended.

In a way, I can see how you might say feeling that way doesn’t align with the thinking on the gay issue - obviously being gay has only relatively recently become accepted in the mainstream, and there were (and probably are still) laws that made just being gay (let alone getting married) illegal. The way things are going, I suppose incest maybe just one of the next things that becomes mainstream… who knows? I’m sure 100 years ago people wouldn’t have thought we’d be fighting to have the right to kill our unborn babies.

The current difference to me centers around the fact that gay marriage, while a sin in my belief system, doesn’t really hurt anyone. Incest, on the other hand, can have victims in the sense of babies born with defects that would have been completely preventable, not to mention the fact that making incest ok opens the door for creeps to be incestuous with their underage children.

I’ve heard a lot of people argue that gay it’s eroding traditional marriages/values, but I think men and women in traditional marriages have done enough damage on their own; we should maybe look at the problems we ourselves are causing before trying to look outside and say two guys or two gals living together is causing the downfall of our marriage.

Paula Deen’s example? That’s clearly extremely racist. I’m not even really sure how that example fits in here, as it’s not about the actual union or marriage, but the details of the wedding. I don’t even have to think deeply about it - it would absolutely NOT be open-minded to attend a wedding like that. If I was unaware of the situation, and went only to discover this to be the case, I would leave.

As far as the argument that people should be able to marry whomever they love - that’s not exactly how I’d put it. That’s idealistic, and I’m sure that’s what a lot of people are aiming for. My philosophy is what I’ve already said before: Just because my belief system says something is wrong or is a sin, doesn’t mean that people who don’t share my belief system should have to follow MY rules. On the flip side, just because something is culturally accepted, doesn’t mean I don’t get to use my belief system to determine whether it’s right or wrong for me (or for the people who claim to have the same belief system as myself).
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Yes and 100 times yes.👍
 
The problem with gay marriage is that if we believe the church teaching that homosexual relations are intrinsically disordered, then we cannot support anyone’s homosexual relationship. If it is intrinsically disorder and a mortal sin, how is it charitable to celebrate the person’s self destruction of their immortal soul.

There is also the objection to gay marriage as a general societal evil, because any children adopted or conceived for the sake of this relationship are going to be deprived of their mother and father.

At the end of the day, if we want to normalise Gay relationships then we have to let them have families. According to the UN charter of the Rights of the Child, children have a right to know their biological parents. It’s an important part of humanity to know where you came from. From that point of view alone, it’s wrong to allow gay couples to have the same right to have children as opposite sex couples.
 
AdamPeter said:
The problem with gay marriage is that if we believe the church teaching that homosexual relations are intrinsically disordered, then we cannot support anyone’s homosexual relationship. If it is intrinsically disorder and a mortal sin, how is it charitable to celebrate the person’s self destruction of their immortal soul.

There is also the objection to gay marriage as a general societal evil, because any children adopted or conceived for the sake of this relationship are going to be deprived of their mother and father.

At the end of the day, if we want to normalise Gay relationships then we have to let them have families. According to the UN charter of the Rights of the Child, children have a right to know their biological parents. It’s an important part of humanity to know where you came from. From that point of view alone, it’s wrong to allow gay couples to have the same right to have children as opposite sex couples.
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I’m adopted and know literally the smallest amount about my mother and nothing about my father. I doubt Russia is going to do a good job in helping me get the info I want. Just because there is a rule I should know them does not mean it will happen. I don’t care if two gay people get married it’s not going to make any problem for me at all now or ever and honestly that’s fine. My husband is out there somewhere and God will help me find him if I ask for the help.
 
Petaro said:
I would just use the same decorum list I get all guests to sign at the door. Outlines taboo subjects for discussion; appropriate seating arrangements; shoes off on the cork tiles; etc the same as everyone. We have an ancilliary page on discretionary issues for people of colour, jewish persuasion and of course those not quite right.

The question of funerals is a very gray area. If it is theirs then it is appropriate to attend as many people who have failed to show any interest or care of a relative have been found in the front pews at many a funeral. There may also be cake.If it was mine, I would appreciate any number that might even resemble a crowd. That is why I will have free beer highlighted in the funeral notice.
Weddings are another story. I invited most of Perth as they would have to send presents in spite of the 4,300 km trip across Australia. So if there were presents I have no trouble being inclusive. I even had some of my wife’s relatives there in the same hope. Aren’t wedding registries just the bees’ knees?

Sometimes it is hard to leave the front of the Temple and lower one’s self to the pews of the sinners, but I feel it does us all good every once in a while. Humility may be an insult to truth, but it allows us to be unctuous and feel good about ourselves all at the same time.
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Whoa. **YOU **put in cork tiles, and now I have to sign an agreement over it? No way.
 
If it were between two men, :eek: geez, I can’t stand that!
If it were between two women, 😃 but I won’t go 😉
[SIGN]:p:p:p[/SIGN]
 
jp54321 said:
This is a hot topic. Not sure if this had been asked before here but what do you do if a close family member comes out gay and invites your family to their so called wedding?

The other members of your family go along with this. This puts you in a position where you might lose your family in terms of them ignoring you. Can you attend and sit way in back praying rosary With your wife and kids? This is very tricky. How to explain it to kids?
How about going to the gay wedding and pray as a family in back of hall for their conversion.
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What is it was your child getting so called “gay married”? What should a parent do in this situation?
 
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