honor of women in islam

[R_not]

But frankly, the last line of your question denotes mockery inherent in your post, suggesting to me that you don’t really care what my answer is since you’ve already made a judgment about it. So I feel like I’m wasting my time to answer you.

First of all, the wisdom is with God. Surely the CREATOR knows what He has Created. God is the Creator, we are the created, so we can expect that His wisdom encompasses our creation, not that we understand ourselves better than does God.

Secondly, a person’s “honor” does not come with marriage. That is the non-Islamic concept your cohorts are trying to push, suggesting that a man with more wives has more honor. Islam doesn’t consider that to be the case.

Thirdly, women are naturally monogamous, and men are naturally polygamous. You’ll find that when you look critically at the behavior of both.

Fourthly, what is “fair” is rather much a matter of opinion. Is it fair for example, to say that I get half the orange, and you get half the orange? Or maybe it is fair for you to take the meat of the orange to eat, and for me to take the peel so I can use the rind in a recipe.

The one thing an ex-muslim knows is how islam ‘honors’ its women followers. And as for morningstar mocking islam, it is hard not to do - even for me and I am not a muslim.

Wisdom is with God, but when a man such as mohammed uses a god as a weapon, or an excuse, to dishonor women by appealing to the basic animal instincts of men - I would say there is something wrong with that ‘religion’. And it appeals to man’s animal instincts not only by saying to a man that it is ok to fart around - and that is how diseases are brought home - but that if you die killing infidels - you get a bunch more of your base animal desires met.

This whole reasoning is like having to take one’s brains and mush them up. The logic that is in islam - basically the illogic, is mind boggling how anyone can freely fall for this stuff.

All I need is the reinforcement of the muslim women I talked to, the testament of ex-muslim men on these threads, the chapter called, ‘women’ in the koran, and the daily facts coming from muslim countries on how women are treated under sharia law - and it ain’t pretty.

Basically, sister amy is enjoying our infidel laws while so many muslim women around this globe don’t have those comforts and are totally subjected to barbarism that countries decline into when sharia law is in effect.

 

[Sister_Amy]

and thats why she is a muslim. because of her lack of confidence for the dignity of women. she herself doesnt think she deserves a man all for herself. she is settling to be a second wife, against western law. a mistress for short.

I don’t think that I am less of a person because of my choice of a husband.

That you do is a shortcoming on your part, not mine.

 

[R_not]

Well remember that even Christianity has a history of polygamy–it’s in The bible whether you like it or not. If it’s so unnatural, take it up with God, and ask Him why He let men do it in the Old Testament.

A history of polygamy is totally opposite of our current laws which make polygamy a federal offense which sister amy is totally ignoring, quite often.

 

[AgnosTheist]

I don’t think that I am less of a person because of my choice of a husband.

No youre not. Only your dignity takes a beating for giving yourself to a married man.

 

[R_not]

I don’t think that I am less of a person because of my choice of a husband.

That you do is a shortcoming on your part, not mine.

Tough talk when one has no choice in the matter. In other religions you are not 1/2 a person - in islam you are indeed 1/2 that of a man.

Keep on denying it - one day you will find out.

 

[Sister_Amy]

No youre not. Only your dignity takes a beating for giving yourself to a married man.

See, you still don’t get it. I have many choices for a husband, but what is most important to me?

His dedication to God, his strength in his faith, his ability to control his anger, his capacity for stability in family life as a husband and father. It just so happens that the man I found who best fits my criteria happens to be married. And so I embrace that choice, confident that I have a smarter, more faithful husband than some of my peers.

The situation also works in my advantage–since I intend to pursue advanced degrees. Without having to spend so much time for my husband, I will have more time to study and go to school–that was important to me before, and the outlook is even better with this arrangement.

 

[morning_star777]

mr.agnos,ur current signature is very nice.i really like this and also agree with ur signature.though i am unmarried now,but when i will marry then my wife will also be the badge of my honor.

 

[Sister_Amy]

Tough talk when one has no choice in the matter. In other religions you are not 1/2 a person - in islam you are indeed 1/2 that of a man.

Keep on denying it - one day you will find out.

A woman is not half of a man in Islam, please stop repeating it–you can’t make it true by doing so, and it only demonstrates your inability to progress in understanding.

I certainly have a choice about my husband–to marry him or not.

In many ways a woman’s attributes exceed a man’s, and in some the reverse. Spiritually both are equal.

 

[AgnosTheist]

No, the way you perceive multiple sex partners is disrespectful.

My perception is that its ok for a guy to have multiple sex partners before marriage. And that we boys envy a guy who was able to do this feat. You think its disrespectful to women because of your religious convictions. But ask the women themselves who chooses to have premarital sex. This is all a matter of opinion.

Islam tried to fix this problem by legalizing polygamy. But all it really does is trap women who are naive enough to agree to a polygamous relationship.

But since you have just said that a man has a natural desire to have multiple sex partners, you proved what I said in reply to morningstar, that men are naturally polygamous. Thanks!

no problem. i’m all for the truth here.

(i.e., there is an authentic hadith saying it is a major sin to slander a woman’s honor),

i suspect you are misinterpreting that hadith. i’d really love to see it, if you can find it.

 

[Rayaan]

I have found that female converts to Islam are amongst the most pious and informed.

The majority of converts to islam are women, even in the heart of the west women convert to islam.

My wife had been a muslim for 3 years before I met her, her sister became a muslim about 2 years ago…

This isnt unique, many western women are finding peace in islam, a peace they did not feel before, a respect they did not receive before…

This is why they become Muslim

 

[Rayaan]

On a different note,

The most loyal and monogamous people in earth are the Muslims, we do not date or screw around and we tend to be loyal to our spouses regardless due to our religious beliefs.

Polygamy is not even widely practiced.

Compare this to the multiple partner dating/sex scene amongst most christian populations and the usual routine of dating, have sex, becoming boyfriend/girl friend for a little while.
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Breaking Up
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Then starting all over with someone else, is appalling and morally disgrace full.

Most westerners/christians are not pure/virgins at the point of marriage and have multiple sexual partners as well as abortions etc

Morally we aren’t even in the same ball park, you aren’t a patch on us.

 

[AgnosTheist]

See, you still don’t get it. I have many choices for a husband, but what is most important to me?

**His dedication to God, his strength in his faith, his ability to control his anger, his capacity for stability in family life as a husband and father. **It just so happens that the man I found who best fits my criteria happens to be married. And so I embrace that choice, confident that I have a smarter, more faithful husband than some of my peers.

Those are the exact same reasons why my wife chose me, well aside from my good looks. (& i’m truly humble in real life. down to earth)

I know there are a gazillion other factors why you would settle with a married man of those qualities. In the west it wont look good, so its good that you are moving to a muslim country where polygamy is legal. good luck.

The situation also works in my advantage–since I intend to pursue advanced degrees. Without having to spend so much time for my husband, I will have more time to study and go to school–that was important to me before, and the outlook is even better with this arrangement.

muslim countries dont offer many employment opportunities for women. especially the theocratic ones. you are in the field of engineering, most likely youll end up as a housewife. i hope your husband is wealthy enough to support two families.

 

[ralphinal]

If Bill Gates had a daughter who converted to Islam and inhereted 10 billion dollars, so that money was no issue for her familty for generations, would she be able to have multiple husbands?

Would she need her husband’s permission to travell to Saudi Arabia, even though she is paying for the whole trip?

Would she be in charge of the finances of the family? I know this might depend on the man, but in Islam, is it accepted for the woman to make the financial decisions?

 

[Sister_Amy]

My perception is that its ok for a guy to have multiple sex partners before marriage. And that we boys envy a guy who was able to do this feat. You think its disrespectful to women because of your religious convictions. But ask the women themselves who chooses to have premarital sex. This is all a matter of opinion.

Islamically, that isn’t allowed! No sex before marriage, for men or women. It is as bad for a man as it is for a woman. It’s a double standard here, where men think it’s okay for them but they want a virgin wife. If Muslim men act the same way (I’ve met some who do) they are wrong.

Islam tried to fix this problem by legalizing polygamy. But all it really does is trap women who are naive enough to agree to a polygamous relationship.

Not really, because divorce is allowed (did you forget that part?) No trappings. On the other hand, instead of a man having girlfriends and affairs, he is FORCED to fully support all his wives.

i suspect you are misinterpreting that hadith. i’d really love to see it, if you can find it.

Volume 8, Book 82, Number 840:
Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, “**Avoid the seven great destructive sins.” **They (the people!) asked, “O Allah’s Apostle! What are they?” He said, “To join partners in worship with Allah; to practice sorcery; to kill the life which Allah has forbidden except for a just cause (according to Islamic law); to eat up usury (Riba), to eat up the property of an orphan; to give one’s back to the enemy and freeing from the battle-field at the time of fighting and to accuse chaste women who never even think of anything touching chastity and are good believers.”

It’s a MAJOR SIN, like I said.

 

[Sister_Amy]

Those are the exact same reasons why my wife chose me, well aside from my good looks. (& i’m truly humble in real life. down to earth)

I know there are a gazillion other factors why you would settle with a married man of those qualities. In the west it wont look good, so its good that you are moving to a muslim country where polygamy is legal. good luck.

The best reason for moving to a muslim country is actually “riba.” Something hard to avoid. The second best reason is to study Islam, which is what I plan to do.

muslim countries dont offer many employment opportunities for women. especially the theocratic ones. you are in the field of engineering, most likely youll end up as a housewife. i hope your husband is wealthy enough to support two families.

This is only a misconception. There are women doctors and engineers even in Saudi Arabia. But I don’t intend to work in engineering, probably as a teacher. And there are loads of opportunities to do that! That’s my favorite thing to do anyway. But being a housewife isn’t a bad thing, you know. Shame on you for your low opinion of housewives! No respect!

 

[Verisimilitude]

This is why they become Muslim

Women submit themselves to a submissive state in pornography as well, it doesn’t make them any smarter or dumber than the women who willingly submit themselves to the domination of Islam.

Women in professional porn are often well informed if they lack the piety. They may flaunt their sexuality to the world while Muslim women hide theirs. The conflict between the individual right of a porn star and a Muslim woman is a matter of true freedom but is essentially the same by accepting to be dominated. The dignity of each is suppressed though both dont recognize it or choose to ignore it.

Do you defend the right of the porn star as you do the Muslim woman?

 

[Booklover]

See, you still don’t get it. I have many choices for a husband, but what is most important to me?

His dedication to God, his strength in his faith, his ability to control his anger, his capacity for stability in family life as a husband and father. It just so happens that the man I found who best fits my criteria happens to be married. And so I embrace that choice, confident that I have a smarter, more faithful husband than some of my peers.

The situation also works in my advantage–since I intend to pursue advanced degrees. Without having to spend so much time for my husband, I will have more time to study and go to school–that was important to me before, and the outlook is even better with this arrangement.

Well, you are still in the U.S.! Let’s see if all these ideals of yours hold up once you’re in Saudi Arabia!

Vickie

 

[Sister_Amy]

If Bill Gates had a daughter who converted to Islam and inhereted 10 billion dollars, so that money was no issue for her familty for generations, would she be able to have multiple husbands?

No. Money isn’t the reason. Imagine a woman with two husbands she is trying to satisfy sexually? What about if she has children, how will she know who is the father?

Would she need her husband’s permission to travell to Saudi Arabia, even though she is paying for the whole trip?

The answer to this isn’t clear to me–forgive me if I abstain.

Would she be in charge of the finances of the family? I know this might depend on the man, but in Islam, is it accepted for the woman to make the financial decisions?

She could be, yes. And I think many men rely on their wives to make financial decisions, especially if they are better at dealing with money. A man’s money, which he earns, belongs to the family. It doesn’t belong to him. So a woman could manage it. The money which a woman makes, though, is hers alone.

 

[morning_star777]

sister amy,its very easy to prove that women is 1/2 of men.neither why ur inheritance law said that daughter will get half of son of their father’s property?i think R_not was repeating because you couldn’t give him the perfect answer.

 

[Sister_Amy]

Women submit themselves to a submissive state in pornography as well, it doesn’t make them any smarter or dumber than the women who willingly submit themselves to the domination of Islam.

Women in professional porn are often well informed if they lack the piety. They may flaunt their sexuality to the world while Muslim women hide theirs. The conflict between the individual right of a porn star and a Muslim woman is a matter of true freedom but is essentially the same by accepting to be dominated. The dignity of each is suppressed though both dont recognize it or choose to ignore it.

Do you defend the right of the porn star as you do the Muslim woman?

Frankly, I think women who are “in professional porn” as you put it, are the ones who are abused, and oppressed. They aren’t exercising a right, they are the ones who are enslaved by the culture and society.

The only right which seems to exist is that of the man to be able to look at these women’s bodies. And that is a right which I will never defend.