Well, that is a matter of faith that Catholics might take for granted but non-Catholics obviously don’t believe the Pope is infallible (or else they would be converting to Catholicism).Therefore, the fact that there “political posturing” in all human organizations (even the Catholic Church) is not an area where an argument for “my church is better than yours” can realistically be made.
The fact the Pope is infallible on matters of Faith and Morals does not mean he can change Doctrine. That is one of the most fundamental misunderstanding of Papal Infallibility by Protestants.
But not related to Itwin’s comment. The dogma that the Pope possesses a personal charism, on matters of faith and morals, as defined and limited at Vat I, is certainly an obstacle for many non-RCs. Including those who understand the Vat I proclamation of the dogma.
Because the Episcopal Church has bishops and claims apostolic succession, its options for viable merger partners among the Mainline churches is limited. The ELCA and Episcopalians have the best chance of merging. Both have bishops (but pride themselves on their “democratic processes”), both have a “Catholic-lite” thing going on, they love their traditional forms and fashions (but not really liking the traditional gospel), and they already have full communion with each other.
I understand. Infallibility means that the Church’s teaching is protected from era. My point is that while Catholics may believe that, others don’t. Therefore, when we see “political posturing” in the Catholic Church, it is no different from “political posturing” in the Episcopal Church or any other organization of humans.
And the fact they have jettisoned doctrines that trace back to the time of the Apostles shows how they lack apostolic succession.
Bingo:thumbsup:
Bingo? No doubt estesbob enjoyed his comment, but it doesn’t actually relate in any way to what Itwin was saying.
Relatively few non Catholics understand papa infallibility. They think it means the popes are morally perfect; that the popes can predict the future; that all their administrative decisions and appointments are flawless; that the popes will always speak the true doctrine, right now, not delaying.
No doubt, as to the misconceptions. But I can find folks not RC who know what’s up. It’s folks like that I was referring to, in the bolded sentence.
You know, given that some of us have actually followed recent news about the Synod, etc., that statement is likely to be taken as comic more than anything else.
You know, people who actually worship regularly in an Episcopal church just aren’t going to recognize this description. It’s silly and spiteful.Well, I do often point out to Catholics who bang the drum for women priests, normalizing homosexual whatchamacallits, and jabbering on endlessly in Politically Correct platitudes need only look at the smoldering pile of rubble that used to be the Episcopal Church to see that it is not a growth strategy. The pleasure there is simply from being right.
And what doctrinal changes came out of thr Synod?
This certainly seems to be true in my particular area, southeast PA. At one point or another I’ve visited most every small town or country ELCA church (and several Reformed or UCC churches) in my county of about a half a million people. (I’ve either been visiting with Lutheran friends, attending a recital played on the lovely historic tracker organs in these parts, or going to some additional holiday service.) I’ve listened to sermons, read materials, and talked with pastors and congregants, and they really are quite traditional in every small town ELCA church I’ve seen.
farmers. I actually kind of regretted not being Lutheran, because this small town church is a true community church: it’s the only church in town and it brings the people together into community.I like what he said…
So did I
I don’t doubt it. Whether or not one appreciates that particular approach to discussion is no doubt a matter of taste. Whether it engaged in any way, however, with the post to which it purported to reply – that perhaps is a matter of judgement rather than liking.