How can we justify bowing to statues?

[sinner06]

How can we justify bowing to statues when the Bible strictly forbids it in Exodus 20?

 

[rpp]

How can we justify bowing to statues when the Bible strictly forbids it in Exodus 20?

We bow to other people. We pay respect to important or heroic individuals. What is wrong withj bowing to an image that helps us focus our devotion and worship.

You mention Exodus 20. I can see clearly where we are not to worship images. I see nothing there that says not to venerate those saints and our Lord who are represented in images. After all, we are not worshiping the image. and when it comes to images of saints, Catholic not only DO NOT worship the image, we do not worship the saint either. Rather the image helps us to focus our thoughts and hearts on the Lord. Sometimes we focus our thoughts on the Lord through a saint. But saints and images are never worshiped.

 

[ohioszo]

When do we bow to statues? Or do you mean statutes?

 

[sinner06]

But it specifically says not to even bow to them, not just not to worship them, but not to bow to them at all. And I take Martial Arts, so I know what you mean by bowing to show respect, but theres an obvious difference between a short, courteous bow to show respect, and practically prostrating yourself in front of a statue, as many Catholics do.

 

[rpp]

But it specifically says not to even bow to them, not just not to worship them, but not to bow to them at all. And I take Martial Arts, so I know what you mean by bowing to show respect, but theres an obvious difference between a short, courteous bow to show respect, and practically prostrating yourself in front of a statue, as many Catholics do.

Hmm…
Your listed religion: Born a Catholic, now on the verge of converting

Looking at your word choice, then looking at your self described religious beliefs, I do not see any consistency. I will not have a conversation with someone who is not honest. Good bye.

 

[sinner06]

I don’t understand, how am I not being honest?

 

[LilyM]

But it specifically says not to even bow to them, not just not to worship them, but not to bow to them at all. And I take Martial Arts, so I know what you mean by bowing to show respect, but theres an obvious difference between a short, courteous bow to show respect, and practically prostrating yourself in front of a statue, as many Catholics do.

Jacob bowed seven times in front of his brother Esau - not exactly ‘short’, but definitely respect rather than worship. The three young men in Daniel, however, refused a simple bow before a statue - not that it was longer or more elaborate than Jacob’s gyrations, but because the INTENT behind it was worship rather than simple respect.

So at what point in time does respect change character and become worship? One second? Two? Thirty? Five minutes? Ten?

Or is the difference instead in intent of the heart rather than physical posture.

 

[rpp]

I don’t understand, how am I not being honest?

Your word choice shows that look at the Catholic Church from the outside. That is not the perspective of someone who, as you claim is “Born a Catholic, now on the verge of converting”.

In addition, your focus on interpreting the Bible in a vacuum of context is typical of non-Catholics.

 

[sinner06]

LilyM, you make a good point, I should probably not have said short, bow, as if I was putting emphasis on the length of time, and I will consider what you said. However, I would really like for someone to tell me when ban on bowing to statues at all, not just the worship of statues, but even just bowing to them at all, was lifted?

 

[Wampa]

I’ve been Catholic for 5 years now and I float around to a different parish each week, so I’ve seen a lot of different people and worship styles. I’ve never seen a Catholic bow to a statue.

I, and many other Catholics, always bow to the presence of Jesus in the host.

Are you positive they’re bowing to the statue? I’ve been in some parishes where the host is kept in an area near statutes, so I could see someone erroneously thinking they might be bowing to the statue.

 

[sinner06]

In response to rpp, I used the words I did because I don’t really longer consider myself Catholic, at least not in my heart. I don’t think it’s right of you to accuse me of being dishonest because you don’t think I have the certain perspective that you would expect me to have.

 

[Tim_Kirchoff]

LilyM, you make a good point, I should probably not have said short, bow, as if I was putting emphasis on the length of time, and I will consider what you said. However, I would really like for someone to tell me when ban on bowing to statues at all, not just the worship of statues, but even just bowing to them at all, was lifted?

Consider why God saw fit to set this ban in place. Was it because all images are bad, or because of the particular misuse of images? If it is the latter which caused God to set this law, then we can possibly understand reasonable, implied exceptions based on the reasoning behind it. If the ban is set in place to prevent idolotry, then it is relevant to idolotry, and in other cases might be understood as acceptable.

 

[Tim_Kirchoff]

In response to rpp, I used the words I did because I don’t really longer consider myself Catholic, at least not in my heart. I don’t think it’s right of you to accuse me of being dishonest because you don’t think I have the certain perspective that you would expect me to have.

I hope you understand that we get quite a few “trolls” at Catholic Answers, and many of the veteran posters here are quite wary of new posters because of this. If you’re here just to ask honest questions, not to cause trouble, you should be fine, though.

 

[rpp]

In response to rpp, I used the words I did because I don’t really longer consider myself Catholic, at least not in my heart. I don’t think it’s right of you to accuse me of being dishonest because you don’t think I have the certain perspective that you would expect me to have.

I have been here for a while. I have seen many different types of people on this forum. Think what you like, but at least in this post, you have confirmed my suspicions.

If you are truly sincere, I would invite you to employ the grace and gift of humility. Please humbly listen and try to learn and understand. There is a reason why all people, for the first 1500 years of Christianity, who called themselves Christian engaged in the very behavior you are so concerned about. Images are meant not for use to worship or bow down to but rather what they represent. They are meant to inspire. As with almost everything in Christianity, intent is the key.

If the intent is to worship paint or a piece of rock or plaster that is clearly idolatry. If the intent is to have that image help us to bring to mind the sacred and focus our thoughts on our Lord, how can that be bad?

 

[sinner06]

In response to Tim Kirchoff, I understand what your saying about how the circumstances under which the ban was instituted should be taken into consideration, but regardless of the circumstances, a law imposed by God should be obeyed, no matter what circumstances it was instituted under. In 2 Samuel, when Uzzah reached out to steady the ark, it didn’t matter what his intentions where, or the specific reason he wasn’t supposed to do it, God had said not to do it, and He struck him dead.

As a sidenote, I just want to apologize if I offended anyone, it’s late where I am, I’m tired, and I probably worded things badly. Just for the record, I have seen other Catholics bow to statues before, but it is entirely possible this could be the exception and not the rule.

 

[Little_Dove]

Hi!
Just wondering…you considering leaving the Catholic Church. Is it only because of this? For instance, what about belief in the true presence of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament Can you leave Him in the Holy Eucharist? The Catholic Church is the only Church in which you can receive The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus…

God Bless You!
To Jesus, Through Mary

 

[Tim_Kirchoff]

In response to Tim Kirchoff, I understand what your saying about how the circumstances under which the ban was instituted should be taken into consideration, but regardless of the circumstances, a law imposed by God should be obeyed, no matter what circumstances it was instituted under. In 2 Samuel, when Uzzah reached out to steady the ark, it didn’t matter what his intentions where, or the specific reason he wasn’t supposed to do it, God had said not to do it, and He struck him dead.

As a sidenote, I just want to apologize if I offended anyone, it’s late where I am, I’m tired, and I probably worded things badly. Just for the record, I have seen other Catholics bow to statues before, but it is entirely possible this could be the exception and not the rule.

God also commanded, “Do not kill” though it is evident that what was meant was “do not murder”. We are to follow the spirit of the law, not just the letter. That’s in the New Testament somewhere

 

[sinner06]

God also commanded, “Do not kill” though it is evident that what was meant was “do not murder”. We are to follow the spirit of the law, not just the letter. That’s in the New Testament somewhere

Thats very interesting. I’ll have to think about this some more, I may post back on here if i have more questions, but you may have proven me wrong on this. I’ll have to think about it but I appreciate everyone who took the time to talk about this, and for everyones insight. rpp, I am again very sorry if i offended you.
God bless you all

 

[ohioszo]

Catholics genuflect or bow towards the Tabernacle, which is Christ’s home. The Holy of Holies. This parallels the Holy Area in the old Hebrew Temple in Jerusalem. There are a few times that one might find something rather unusual with respect to our reverence of holy objects besides when we kneel before Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament, a rite which he instituted on Holy Thursday … one is during Good Friday services, when we kiss the cross of Christ. Another time may be during a procession, when a statue of Our Lady is carried. Sometimes, a Catholic may bow at the Crucified Christ or even kiss Jesus on the cross, with a smaller crucifix. When a Priest is ordained or a nun makes her vows, they may stretch themselves unto the floor when doing so. There are reasons for this, and, you could look into that, but, obviously they are submitting their whole lives to the Church, and there prostration is a symbol of that gift of themselves.

 

[1edyson]

Thats very interesting. I’ll have to think about this some more, I may post back on here if i have more questions, but you may have proven me wrong on this. I’ll have to think about it but I appreciate everyone who took the time to talk about this, and for everyones insight. rpp, I am again very sorry if i offended you.
God bless you all

It’s never a bout proving some wrong, just about making sure we proclaim Christ right. But out of curiosity, what are the other reasons you’re considering leaving the Catholic Church? Maybe a new thread would be called for ?