How can you question as to whether you committed a mortal sin?

[pcg2]

In another thread I asked this question:

I have a hypothetical situation here. Say that one does something that they are not sure was a mortal sin. So they receive communion (as they should). They go to confession a few days later, talk to the priest, and find out that they were in a state of mortal sin. Was it a sin for them to have received the Eucharist? If so, why? How can one commit the sin of sacrilege if one was not sure that they were in a state of mortal sin at the time they received?

To which I recieved the following reply:

you can not be in mortal sin without consent and full knowledge that the incident was grave matter

the action was grave matter, but it was not a sin then

so how come people are always discussing whether they committed a mortal sin? I don’t understand this. You either did or you didn’t. You have to know, when you committed the sin, that what you were doing was grave matter. There is no, afterwards, wondering about it. If, at the time, you were unsure, then there was no mortal sin, right? So why do people wonder about it?

 

[GratefulFred]

so how come people are always discussing whether they committed a mortal sin? I don’t understand this. You either did or you didn’t. You have to know, when you committed the sin, that what you were doing was grave matter. There is no, afterwards, wondering about it. If, at the time, you were unsure, then there was no mortal sin, right? So why do people wonder about it?

Perhaps one reason most of us worry about whether we did or did not commit a mortal sin is that we realize the consequence to our immortal soul if we die with unconfessed mortal sin. And then if we have unconfessed mortal sin and we receive Holy Communion, we realize we compounded our sorry state.

The matter has to be grave. We have to know it is grave. We have to give consent to do the grave matter. Each element can be subjected to degrees.

For most of us, Guilt comes in a matter of degrees. Rather than a pure black and white world, we live the grays. At some point our sin is venial, at some point it is mortal. To avoid feeling really guilty we may try to convince ourselves that our mortal sin was venial. Yet we worry we may be too soft on ourselves.

Did I intend to commit mortal sin? Or did I fight temptation before I gave in? Should I have fought temptation harder and longer? Or did I go through the motions so I could say I did not intend? Missing Mass on Sunday is grave. We know that. We missed because we were not “feeling well.” Just how bad do we have to feel to avoid mortal sin?

Best antedote I know is frequent Confession.

 

[Edmundus1581]

Perhaps one reason most of us worry about whether we did or did not commit a mortal sin is that we realize the consequence to our immortal soul if we die with unconfessed mortal sin. And then if we have unconfessed mortal sin and we receive Holy Communion, we realize we compounded our sorry state.

The matter has to be grave. We have to know it is grave. We have to give consent to do the grave matter. Each element can be subjected to degrees.

For most of us, Guilt comes in a matter of degrees. Rather than a pure black and white world, we live the grays. At some point our sin is venial, at some point it is mortal. To avoid feeling really guilty we may try to convince ourselves that our mortal sin was venial. Yet we worry we may be too soft on ourselves.

Did I intend to commit mortal sin? Or did I fight temptation before I gave in? Should I have fought temptation harder and longer? Or did I go through the motions so I could say I did not intend? Missing Mass on Sunday is grave. We know that. We missed because we were not “feeling well.” Just how bad do we have to feel to avoid mortal sin?

Best antedote I know is frequent Confession.

I feel as if an important part of my inner struggles has been put into words! Just brilliant!

 

[JimG]

so how come people are always discussing whether they committed a mortal sin? I don’t understand this. You either did or you didn’t. You have to know, when you committed the sin, that what you were doing was grave matter. There is no, afterwards, wondering about it. If, at the time, you were unsure, then there was no mortal sin, right? So why do people wonder about it?

You are right. If there is doubt as to whether the sin was mortal or doubtful knowledge about its gravity, it was not mortal. So why do people worry about it? Scrupulosity. It’s like constantly picking at a scab instead of letting it heal.

 

[pcg2]

Perhaps one reason most of us worry about whether we did or did not commit a mortal sin is that we realize the consequence to our immortal soul if we die with unconfessed mortal sin. And then if we have unconfessed mortal sin and we receive Holy Communion, we realize we compounded our sorry state.

The matter has to be grave. We have to know it is grave. We have to give consent to do the grave matter. Each element can be subjected to degrees.

For most of us, Guilt comes in a matter of degrees. Rather than a pure black and white world, we live the grays. At some point our sin is venial, at some point it is mortal. To avoid feeling really guilty we may try to convince ourselves that our mortal sin was venial. Yet we worry we may be too soft on ourselves.

Did I intend to commit mortal sin? Or did I fight temptation before I gave in? Should I have fought temptation harder and longer? Or did I go through the motions so I could say I did not intend? Missing Mass on Sunday is grave. We know that. We missed because we were not “feeling well.” Just how bad do we have to feel to avoid mortal sin?

Best antedote I know is frequent Confession.

I know what you mean… suffering from scrupulosity, all those things race through my head at one point or another.

 

[pcg2]

You are right. If there is doubt as to whether the sin was mortal or doubtful knowledge about its gravity, it was not mortal. So why do people worry about it? Scrupulosity. It’s like constantly picking at a scab instead of letting it heal.

I know what scrupulous people go through… seeing as how I am one of them. So I guess the answer is simply that if there is doubt, it’s not mortal, correct?

But what about when people go on this forum, expressing their doubt as to whether what they did was a mortal sin or not, and then some of our fellow members try to tell them whether what they did was a mortal sin? That doesn’t make any sense either! If there is doubt, then it obviously wasn’t mortal… and you can’t make it mortal by going on an internet forum and having other people tell you it’s mortal…

 

[MtnDwellar]

I know what scrupulous people go through… seeing as how I am one of them. So I guess the answer is simply that if there is doubt, it’s not mortal, correct?

But what about when people go on this forum, expressing their doubt as to whether what they did was a mortal sin or not, and then some of our fellow members try to tell them whether what they did was a mortal sin? That doesn’t make any sense either! If there is doubt, then it obviously wasn’t mortal… and you can’t make it mortal by going on an internet forum and having other people tell you it’s mortal…

You are correct that without knowledge, a sin cannot be mortal. It can still be a grave matter, which means that is very offensive to God. I suppose that when people are wondering whether or not they committed a mortal sin, they are actually concerned about whether their action was a grave matter.

Grave matters are a very serious concern. Partly because they must be atoned for and mostly because they offend God. All offenses to God must be atoned for, whether we knew they were sinful or not. So, ignorance of a sin does not let a person off of the hook.

 

[JimG]

I know what scrupulous people go through… seeing as how I am one of them. So I guess the answer is simply that if there is doubt, it’s not mortal, correct?

But what about when people go on this forum, expressing their doubt as to whether what they did was a mortal sin or not, and then some of our fellow members try to tell them whether what they did was a mortal sin? That doesn’t make any sense either! If there is doubt, then it obviously wasn’t mortal… and you can’t make it mortal by going on an internet forum and having other people tell you it’s mortal…

Yes, and I think that often even replying to such posts does nothing but feed another person’s scrupulosity to no good end. Such questions ought to be posed to a confessor and not to an internet forum. Not that we don’t have a lot of intelligent people on CAF who are knowledgeable about moral theology, but one can’t know the heart of a penitent from an internet posting, nor can one judge when obsessiveness is blinding the moral sense. That’s why it’s best to stick with one’s confessor for advice.

 

[GratefulFred]

Being human, it is very tempting for us to try and talk ourselves into thinking what we did is a mortal sin. It is also very tempting to talk ourselves into believing what we did IS NOT A MORTAL SIN.

At times we can be too tough and at other times we can be too easy on ourselves.

Discerning the proper line between mortal sin and venial sin, IN SOME, BUT NOT ALL CASES, does require gudiance available in Confession.

In the end, I would think that most people just confess their wrongs without trying to classify them to a priest as being Mortal or not. We can be just as sorry for a Mortal sin as we are for a venial sin. And forgivenss is forgiveness.

But if we think a sin is Mortal and that prevents us from receiving Holy Communion worthily, then we should ask a priest in confession for guidance so we know what side of the line we are on if we commit that sin again. If not a Mortal sin, we can receive Holy Communion.

 

[baltobetsy]

All offenses to God must be atoned for, whether we knew they were sinful or not.

Do you have a source for that, please?

 

[MtnDwellar]

Do you have a source for that, please?

I don’t have a source handy. The way that it was explained to me goes a little like this. Let’s say that you break a neighbor’s window with your baseball. You go to your neighbor and explain that it was an accident and that you never thought a foul ball would go that far. You and your friends are going to pitch and swing in the opposite direction to insure that it doesn’t happen again.

So, we have an action that took place with no knowledge of the consequences. Your neighbor realizes that there was no malicious intent. He knows that accidents happen and really has no need to forgive you because you did not break his window on purpose. You still need to replace the window.

Our actions have consequences. Some of them are offensive to God whether they are sinful or not. They also effect others around us whether we realize it or not. We need to atone for the effects of our actions, whether we knew they were wrong or not.

There is also a sin called negligence. If we fail in our responsibility to learn what is sinful, we commit the sin of negligence. Ignorance does not let us off of the hook. That is one reason why it is important for people to consider whether or not their actions are grave matters.

 

[LilyM]

Yes, and I think that often even replying to such posts does nothing but feed another person’s scrupulosity to no good end. Such questions ought to be posed to a confessor and not to an internet forum. Not that we don’t have a lot of intelligent people on CAF who are knowledgeable about moral theology, but one can’t know the heart of a penitent from an internet posting, nor can one judge when obsessiveness is blinding the moral sense. That’s why it’s best to stick with one’s confessor for advice.

Not a bad idea for the scrupulous.

I know when I ask questions about the gravity or otherwise of a certain act it’s most often for future reference, so that should I ever be tempted to commit the act again I will know whether I’m potentially dealing with a grave sin or a v\enial one.

Then again, there ARE times (not very many, though) where, as previous poster said, I worry that I may have been wilfully fooling myself into thinking a sin of mine is not grave when it really is.

If we can deceive others, it certainly stands to reason we can deceive ourselves, and we do, about all sorts of things.

 

[colmcille1]

Not a bad idea for the scrupulous.

I know when I ask questions about the gravity or otherwise of a certain act it’s most often for future reference, so that should I ever be tempted to commit the act again I will know whether I’m potentially dealing with a grave sin or a v\enial one.

Then again, there ARE times (not very many, though) where, as previous poster said, I worry that I may have been wilfully fooling myself into thinking a sin of mine is not grave when it really is.

If we can deceive others, it certainly stands to reason we can deceive ourselves, and we do, about all sorts of things.

Very true. I think it’s becoming increasingly difficult in today’s in-your-face secular world to avoid occasion of Sin also.
I guess, like the boy scouts, we must always “be prepared”!
God Bless,
Colmcille1.