How come everyone agrees that fornication is a sin but not that masturbation is?

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Actually, many Catholics do not believe that fornication is a sin
 
Lauds said:
Actually, many Catholics do not believe that fornication is a sin
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Since when? I am pretty sure Catholics know that sexual relations outside of marriage is a sin. That being said, they may know it but they also aren’t necessarily following their faith.

Now, about that question… I guess they don’t understand how much masturbation hurts them. Many times people justify their behaviors as not sinful because they don’t think they are hurting anyone except themselves. Part of being a part of the body of Christ is loving the entire Church and respecting and helping them achieve salvation. That includes themselves…
 
Lauds is right, but I get what you’re saying, distracted. I’ve wondered similarly. I’ve seen many people (mostly cradle Catholics) come here and be genuinely surprised that the Church teaches that masturbation is a sin. And not just a sin, but a grave sin. It never seemed so surprising to me. 🤷
 
masturbation may have fewer serious consequences… after all, you are not involving another person w hn you do that…

but it distances you from God about as much or… seemingly more…

it distances you from Christ… but of course, He is God…

and since the will of God is accomplished through HIM… it is not a good thing to be separated from Him any more than we already are just by living on Earth…
 
at least fornication is somewhat like marriage… In many ways, it is very much like marriage… especially if the 2 love ea other…so maybe one doing that sin wouldn’t feel so separated from God, who is love (1 Jn 4)

I am NOT saying it is right by a LONG shot…

but masturbation is… just icky… and stuff…
 
Joe_5859 said:
Lauds is right, but I get what you’re saying, distracted. I’ve wondered similarly. I’ve seen many people (mostly cradle Catholics) come here and be genuinely surprised that the Church teaches that masturbation is a sin. And not just a sin, but a grave sin. It never seemed so surprising to me. 🤷
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yes, it surprised me that so many think it is no big deal … i heard that James Dobson made a comment once that it wasn’t that big a deal with God… to do that. well, i wouldexpect that from a non-C but Catholics… !!

the body doesn’t believe its wrong… 😃

but the body is kinda stupid… and doesn’t care about the soul much… :mad:
 
Probably because of the poor catechism they received as a child like me. I didn’t learn that it was a sin until I looked at the Catechism myself. Plus, there are priests and religious out there (sadly) who have told young people that masturbation is not a sin (they often hear, ‘it’s a way of self-discovery.’). We must pray for them to hear the truth.
 
distracted said:
yes, it surprised me that so many think it is no big deal … i heard that James Dobson made a comment once that it wasn’t that big a deal with God… to do that. well, i wouldexpect that from a non-C but Catholics… !!

the body doesn’t believe its wrong… 😃

but the body is kinda stupid… and doesn’t care about the soul much… :mad:
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Actually, our bodies have a wisdom all their own. The mind is easy to fool; the heart… well it’s made to be fooled. You can’t fool the body. It has a sense of goodness that our minds could learn from (“sense” is the key word; your senses are part of your body!)

But it’s true, our bodies don’t believe in sin. Belief is the job of the conscience and therefore the mind. We should let our bodies see, hear, smell and move for us, not believe for us:shrug:

ICXC NIKA.
 
Unfortunately my farther has the same misunderstanding. I dunno if it’s him or his Lutheranism, but it does discern me.
 
We can see the results of fornication all around us. Sexually transmitted disease, broken hearts, high divorce rates, degrading women…

Sex is supposed to be a complete giving of each to the other.

Solo sex gives to nobody.

It can make a spouse feel worthless, as in “You’d rather have sex with your hand than with me?”

The people that know that God forbids masturbation and do it anyway are rationalizing it by making excuses. They are in denial about the truth. Many of them are also deliberately keeping themselves ignorant about the whys and wherefores of it.

Someone called rationalization, denial, and ignorance the “deadly triumvirate.” They are right.

Ruthie, trying to reject that triumvirate…
 
Ruthie_again said:
It can make a spouse feel worthless, as in “You’d rather have sex with your hand than with me?”
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Umm, in some cases it’s the spouse that loses interest in sex and rejects the sexual advances of his or her spouse.

It’s extremely frustrating and painful, and deeply humiliating to the rejected partner.

You seem to think that we live in an ideal world. We don’t. If we did nobody would feel compelled to masturbate.

Some rejected partners satisfy themselves with masturbation. Others do worse and find sex outside the marriage. It’s not just Protestants or atheists who have mistresses or cuckold their husbands.

It’s a very very difficult situation for those in it. They’re already feeling rejected, humiliated and inadequate as a lover. I don’t think they need us to lay a guilt trip on them about masturbation on top of all that.

Fortunately most priests are a lot more delicate towards the problem than the posters on this forum.

Please don’t put words in my mouth by saying I condone masturbation. I don’t. But I think a little more pastoral charity for those who suddenly find themselves having to adjust to a life without sex with their spouses, is in order.
 
…nobody would feel compelled to masturbate.
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(begin snit) Nobody with free will is compelled to do anything. It is a choice. (end of snit)

No, I don’t think it is easy to make that choice. With the culture of death surrounding us and telling us that sex is the be-all and end-all of existence, it’s hard to choose chastity even mentally. And if one is accustomed to masturbating, one usually can’t just snap one’s fingers and say “I quit!” It takes work, and support is needed. Yes, charity is mandatory!

When a spouse stops being interested in the marital act, something is wrong. This is another place charity is required. The deprived spouse may not use it as an excuse to masturbate and blame the other for it. Both spouses need to act with enough charity to make a good effort to right things.

Charity. We are Jesus’ representatives. He said, “Come unto me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” Charity in action.

God bless us all, Ruthie
 
Ruthie_again said:
(begin snit) Nobody with free will is compelled to do anything. It is a choice. (end of snit)

No, I don’t think it is easy to make that choice. With the culture of death surrounding us and telling us that sex is the be-all and end-all of existence, it’s hard to choose chastity even mentally. And if one is accustomed to masturbating, one usually can’t just snap one’s fingers and say “I quit!” It takes work, and support is needed. Yes, charity is mandatory!

When a spouse stops being interested in the marital act, something is wrong. This is another place charity is required. The deprived spouse may not use it as an excuse to masturbate and blame the other for it. Both spouses need to act with enough charity to make a good effort to right things.

Charity. We are Jesus’ representatives. He said, “Come unto me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” Charity in action.

God bless us all, Ruthie
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Easier said than done.
 
I believe it comes from both ignorance of Church teaching and a fallible (yet understandable) conclusion of human logic.

You see fornication involves doing it with someone else. Now even people from non-Catholic (and maybe even non-Christian) religions or simply from people who count on gut feeling, can see that something is off about having sex with someone you’re not married with.

Masturbation on the other hand, is personal and something you do by yourself. It hurts you but it’s true that it doesn’t do anything to other people either. 🤷

I’m not saying masturbation ain’t wrong. Just don’t be surprised why people say fornication is wrong but are initially confused as to why masturbation is also.
 
DaughterOfMary6 said:
Probably because of the poor catechism they received as a child like me. I didn’t learn that it was a sin until I looked at the Catechism myself. Plus, there are priests and religious out there (sadly) who have told young people that masturbation is not a sin (they often hear, ‘it’s a way of self-discovery.’). We must pray for them to hear the truth.
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it is a way of self-discovery…

its a way to find out how something so seemingly desirable is NOT good for us…

i cna’t understand priests preaching this kind of thing…’

this is one for the Name Something Unfathomable thread… :confused:
 
Lauds said:
Actually, many Catholics do not believe that fornication is a sin
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Here, here. I really don’t think masturbation is a sin. You’re not not treating your neighbor as you’d want to be treated.
 
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