How do I choose a Church?

[tequilamac]

If I were to leave the Catholic Church for a “bible believing” church, how would I choose one? The following is a list of local churches who all claim to follow the Bible. Do I choose one based on the fellowship they provide, on the worship music style that they provide, maybe what they teach as doctrine, or should I find one that believes what I believe?

ALL SAINTS EPISCOPAL CHURCH, ALLIANCE BIBLE CHURCH, ALOHA CHRISTIAN CHURCH(DISCIPLES OF CHRIST), ALOHA CHRISTIAN LIFE CENTER, BETHEL UNITED PENTECOSTAL CHURCH, BROOKWOOD BAPTIST CHURCH, CALVARY LUTHERAN CHURCH, CHRISTIAN CHURCH OF HILLSBORO, CHURCH OF CHRIST, CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS, COMMUNITY BAPTIST CHURCH, COMMUNITY OF CHRIST CHURCH, CORRIDOR BAPTIST CHURCH, EVERGREEN CHRISTIAN CENTER, FAITH CHRISTIAN FELLOWSHIP OF HILLSBORO, FIRST ASSEMBLY OF GOD, FIRST BAPTIST CHURCH, FIRST CONGREGATIONAL CHURCH, U.C.C., FOREST GROVE BIBLE CHURCH, FRIENDS CHURCH OF HILLSBORO, GOLDEN ROAD BAPTIST, HELVETIA COMMUNITY CHURCH, HERITAGE BAPTIST CHURCH, HILLSBORO FIRST CHURCH OF CHRIST SCIENTIST, HILLSBORO NAZARENE CHURCH, HILLSBORO CHRISTIAN FAITH CENTER, HILLSBORO PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH, HILLSBORO UNITED METHODIST CHURCH, IGLESIA EVANGELICA HISPANA, LAUREL COMMUNITY CHURCH, ORENCO PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH, OUR PLACE - YOUR CHRISTIAN CHURCH, REEDVILLE PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH, SALVATION ARMY, SCHOLLS COMMUNITY CHURCH, SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH OF FOREST GROVE, SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH OF HILLSBORO, SINGING HILLS CHRISTIAN CHURCH, SONRISE BAPTIST CHURCH, ST PETER’S LUTHERAN CHURCH, TRINITY LUTHERAN CHURCH, TUALATIN PLAINS PRESBYTERIAN, UNITARIAN UNIVERSALIST COMMUNITY CHURCH, UNITED CHURCH OF CHRIST, VALLEY HOPE COMMUNITY CHURCH, Westport Church, WESTSIDE BIBLE FELLOWSHIP, WEST VALLEY COMMUNITY CHURCH, WORLD OF FAITH FAMILY CENTER, WORLD OF FAITH CHRISTIAN CENTER, ZION LUTHERAN CHURCH

You know, I have often wondered that myself. Not which church but how does one differentiate between them?
Once I answered a fellowship ad for a unitarian church. We got a long fine and I learned a lot about quilting. but then I discovered that for some reason they had dumped my grandmother out of the family tree! She no longer existed! She had gone to another Christian religion so on the genealogy channels, I think it was One Family or something like that, all her brothers and sisters were listed but she was just gone. And there was no arguing with them either.
Once I attended a southern Baptist church which was doing a presentation of a passion play. I was white and it was an all black church in an all black part of town. It was great fun. People were at first very surprised to see me and quite stand offish until they found out I had been invited by a member of their church who was my co worker. In the play Jesus was a black share cropper falsely accused of raping a white woman. The passion took place in the thirties. Very interesting.
afterwards there was fellowship with chicken, ribs, green and corn bread in the church hall. Great food.
Then I attended a question and answer session at the First Church of the Thessalonians. Don’t know exactly what they subscribed to except the Bible, they acted a bit like Baptists, but then their pastor and elders were raided and arrested in the middle of the session because apparently they were manufacturing meth amphetamine in the church basement. I had some difficulty explaining to the cops why I was there in the first place. I felt real relief at not being arrested.
I like to go out and about to other Churches, not during their actual services but during other activities just to meet them and see what they are like. I’ve attended synagogues where I was treated very well and others where complete suspicion at my presence was evidenced. Same with Orthodox Catholic Churches.
I have attended actual Lutheran services with friends for weddings and funerals, a masonic funeral once, etc. I have to say, yes, for a Catholic it is a very very odd, empty, and strange thing to be in another church.
Believe me, a Catholic knows immediately when he enters a Church that is not Catholic. Immediately.
Perhaps if one has never been Catholic, or has left the faith on very terms, it is different. But these others, to me, or my kids, or my husband, are just depending on which one more or less incomplete and lacking shall we say a “certain something”? It is not proveable, nor tangible, nor obvious, it is invisible, and definately not there.

 

[Alexius]

There is something you must realize: There is no such thing as “personal truth.” Much of society today is proud to say in a unified voice: “You have your truth and I have my truth,” when in reality they are sorely mistaken. Just because someone believes that Jesus is not really God incarnate doesn’t make it true. One cannot say: “Well, you believe that Christ is a good moral teacher and I believe that he is the God-man, but it doesn’t really matter because we both love him,” because this statement turns “true Truth” into “true Opinion .”

You say that Jesus is a son of God, not God-in-flesh. You have narrowed your choices down to three churches which claim to teach this doctrine. You now say that you prefer the Mormons because they are kind people. I am glad they are kind - I am friends with a Mormon and I can testify that he is nice - but I also know many kind and generous Muslims. Does this alone make their belief system true? Of course not! Before you join the Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter-day Saints, explore their beliefs…ALL of them. Do the same with the other two churches. By the way, if you truly deny the Trinity, you might as well look into the Arian “Catholic” Church. You can find their website on the web. I truly hope that you will find true Truth…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

 

[AlegreFe]

There is something you must realize: There is no such thing as “personal truth.” Much of society today is proud to say in a unified voice: “You have your truth and I have my truth,” when in reality they are sorely mistaken. Just because someone believes that Jesus is not really God incarnate doesn’t make it true. One cannot say: “Well, you believe that Christ is a good moral teacher and I believe that he is the God-man, but it doesn’t really matter because we both love him,” because this statement turns “true Truth” into “true Opinion .”

You say that Jesus is a son of God, not God-in-flesh. You have narrowed your choices down to three churches which claim to teach this doctrine. You now say that you prefer the Mormons because they are kind people. I am glad they are kind - I am friends with a Mormon and I can testify that he is nice - but I also know many kind and generous Muslims. Does this alone make their belief system true? Of course not! Before you join the Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter-day Saints, explore their beliefs…ALL of them. Do the same with the other two churches. By the way, if you truly deny the Trinity, you might as well look into the Arian “Catholic” Church. You can find their website on the web. I truly hope that you will find true Truth…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

I hope you realize that the starter of the OP is really not looking for another church. He/she just posted that to get a point across. You do realize this right?

 

[Alexius]

I guess you could say I got a little confused about the goal the OP was trying to accomplish. I also missed the OP’s quote towards the end of page two… Oh well, I guess no one’s perfect .

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

 

[Valke2]

If I were to leave the Catholic Church for a “bible believing” church, how would I choose one? The following is a list of local churches who all claim to follow the Bible. Do I choose one based on the fellowship they provide, on the worship music style that they provide, maybe what they teach as doctrine, or should I find one that believes what I believe?

Go with HILLSBORO NAZARENE CHURCH. It’s just a hunch but I’m getting a good vibe there.

 

[rr1213]

I hope you realize that the starter of the OP is really not looking for another church. He/she just posted that to get a point across. You do realize this right?

Yes, of course, the OP is duplicitous . That is why I responded the way I did in post number 50.

As for my having things bassackwards, I don’t think you comprehend the point I am, so obviously, having trouble getting across. I’ll try again. If you are someone who takes your faith seriously, you will attend the Church that you are convinced is true. Frankly, this is axiomatic. Why, as a devout person would you attend a church you believe to be untrue? You, as a Catholic, believe the Catholic Church to be true. I, as a Protestant, do not believe it to be true (at least in all of its particulars). I am happy that you are comfortable with your faith in your Church. Most Protestants are just as happy with their faith in their Churches. Devout Protestants will convert to the Catholic faith only if they are convinced that it is true. If they remain unconvinced, if they are not comfortable in their minds and spirit that the Catholic faith is true, then they will not convert. Catholics who leave the Catholic faith follow a similar path, albeit in the opposite direction.

 

[rmcmullan]

There is something I’d like to bring up. Up until the time of Martin Luther, the Catholic church was truly the universal church, pretty much united in doctrine. I know that individuals don’t always believe 100% of what their church teaches, let alone know or understand it. But, anyway, one by one, groups broke away and became separate churches. In many of those cases, there were particular points of doctrine that caused them to break away (or so they claim.) The Anglicans wanted divorce, the Lutherans wanted the end of indulgences, the Baptists want baptism by immersion and no infant baptism. So clearly, these churches all teach something different and they can’t all be right together. I think people will take any many burdens if they’re convinced their church teaches the absolute truth. But belief is driven by faith and faith by hope so it’s quite a burden to pick correctly.

Another thing I’d like to mention. I believe there are certain doctrines that are actually harmful. I don’t think any differences regarding the Trinity are harmful but the teaching regarding “once saved, always saved” and the absence of penance/repentance are teachings that “cause many to stumble”. Yes, I am prepared for the flames that will follow that remark. And sadly, I think these types of churches attract more than their fair share of… insincere people. Or maybe it’s the other way round. At any rate, a church can usually tolerate certain deviances in doctrines but at some point, these deviances become downright harmful to their members or supportive of … bad practices. So yeah, we must stand on guard. For thee. Oh Canada, we stand on guard for thee!

 

[runandsew]

My original post has several points that I wanted to make.

1.To show what sola scriptura has done to the church.
(the list from my first post is from just one local community)

2.To find out what is important to people when selecting a church
(If doctrine is the most important issue)

3.To understand how some Christians can jump from church to church like changing dirty socks

4.To see if any Protestants would try to defend there being so many different churches all claiming to be Bible based, but teaching a slightly different Gospel.

I guess that I was just trying to get into the Protestant mindset to be able to understand you all better.

rr1213 I thank you for you (name removed by moderator)ut, it was very informative for me.

 

[rr1213]

There is something I’d like to bring up. Up until the time of Martin Luther, the Catholic church was truly the universal church, pretty much united in doctrine. I know that individuals don’t always believe 100% of what their church teaches, let alone know or understand it. But, anyway, one by one, groups broke away and became separate churches. In many of those cases, there were particular points of doctrine that caused them to break away (or so they claim.) The Anglicans wanted divorce, the Lutherans wanted the end of indulgences, the Baptists want baptism by immersion and no infant baptism. So clearly, these churches all teach something different and they can’t all be right together. I think people will take any many burdens if they’re convinced their church teaches the absolute truth. But belief is driven by faith and faith by hope so it’s quite a burden to pick correctly.

Another thing I’d like to mention. I believe there are certain doctrines that are actually harmful. I don’t think any differences regarding the Trinity are harmful but the teaching regarding “once saved, always saved” and the absence of penance/repentance are teachings that “cause many to stumble”. Yes, I am prepared for the flames that will follow that remark. And sadly, I think these types of churches attract more than their fair share of… insincere people. Or maybe it’s the other way round. At any rate, a church can usually tolerate certain deviances in doctrines but at some point, these deviances become downright harmful to their members or supportive of … bad practices. So yeah, we must stand on guard. For thee. Oh Canada, we stand on guard for thee!

You forget that at the time of the Reformation the Church had been divided for almost 500 years. Protestants were not the first schismatics, the Catholics and/or the Orthodox were (depending on whose version of history you accept–Catholic or Orthodox).

…the True North Strong and Free…

 

[rr1213]

My original post has several points that I wanted to make.

1.To show what sola scriptura has done to the church.
(the list from my first post is from just one local community)

2.To find out what is important to people when selecting a church
(If doctrine is the most important issue)

3.To understand how some Christians can jump from church to church like changing dirty socks

4.To see if any Protestants would try to defend there being so many different churches all claiming to be Bible based, but teaching a slightly different Gospel.

I guess that I was just trying to get into the Protestant mindset to be able to understand you all better.

rr1213 I thank you for you (name removed by moderator)ut, it was very informative for me.

No problem. Something else you might want to consider for what its worth. It is true that the Protestant Churches are divided and that this constitutes sin. But what you probably don’t realize, is that we are more united than you think. What I mean by this is that for most people in the pews, even the devout ones and not the benchwarmers (who exist everywhere, right?), the differences in doctrine can appear slight and pretty esoteric. This makes it easier to move from Church to Church. As an example, from a doctrinal standpoint, as opposed to culture and worship styles, I think that there is much similarity between the Methodist, Weslyan, Church of the Nazarene, and even some Episcopal strains. Great differences in style of worship, much less so in doctrine.

 

[BrianH]

You forget that at the time of the Reformation the Church had been divided for almost 500 years. Protestants were not the first schismatics, the Catholics and/or the Orthodox were (depending on whose version of history you accept–Catholic or Orthodox).

…the True North Strong and Free…

and the Orthodox and Catholic have as many denominations, well not quite of course, that appeal to tradition and scripture as well…and they cannot agree either.

 

[Unfinished]

and the Orthodox and Catholic have as many denominations, well not quite of course, that appeal to tradition and scripture as well…and they cannot agree either.

No.

Many rites and Churches perhaps, but if they fall under the authority of the Pope they believe everything in the Catechism, the same as the rest of us.

If they don’t fall under the authority of the Pope, they are not Catholic.

“Superficial” difference perhaps, but no differences in belief. I cannot speak for the Orthodox.

 

[dessert]

My original post has several points that I wanted to make.

1.To show what sola scriptura has done to the church.
(the list from my first post is from just one local community)

2.To find out what is important to people when selecting a church
(If doctrine is the most important issue)

3.To understand how some Christians can jump from church to church like changing dirty socks

4.To see if any Protestants would try to defend there being so many different churches all claiming to be Bible based, but teaching a slightly different Gospel.

I guess that I was just trying to get into the Protestant mindset to be able to understand you all better.

rr1213 I thank you for you (name removed by moderator)ut, it was very informative for me.

I am a cradel catholic revert so I guess I wouldn’t quallify as having been an Origanal protestant, but my husband is and I have lived with him for 39 years now so I think I know how he thinks.

I jumped from church to church because I was rebelliooous and thought I was bored. It would have been better to get involved in choir or more so when in the cc.

Some churches I was in were more bible based but in the process left out prayer and meditaiton time and I actuall am hearing more bible quoted in the cc than in others.

I came back to the cc to get more doctrine as some prots. are anything goes. And I think there I go again I, I, I your analogy to dirty socks is not very acceptable, or appropiate. Could you change that?

Your welcome for the (name removed by moderator)ut, pray you choose wisely and yeah prayer is the best path. Dessert

“Father, as I approach this new year, I ask you to give me a deeper love. heal the wounds that have caused division in my life, and help me to forgive. I pray that you will bring all of your children together in peace.” word among us publ.

Try reading this publ you probably can get at your cc it is very helpfull to me to read daily.

 

[dessert]

Yes, of course, the OP is duplicitous . That is why I responded the way I did in post number 50.

As for my having things bassackwards, I don’t think you comprehend the point I am, so obviously, having trouble getting across. I’ll try again. If you are someone who takes your faith seriously, you will attend the Church that you are convinced is true. Frankly, this is axiomatic. Why, as a devout person would you attend a church you believe to be untrue? You, as a Catholic, believe the Catholic Church to be true. I, as a Protestant, do not believe it to be true (at least in all of its particulars). I am happy that you are comfortable with your faith in your Church. Most Protestants are just as happy with their faith in their Churches. Devout Protestants will convert to the Catholic faith only if they are convinced that it is true. If they remain unconvinced, if they are not comfortable in their minds and spirit that the Catholic faith is true, then they will not convert. Catholics who leave the Catholic faith follow a similar path, albeit in the opposite direction.

WOW !! So typical ! Do you know there is another thread just on this. I sorry there I go again I I I will never go back to the prot faith and so you want to know WHY ?

We both believe in God the Father correct? Yes
We both believe in God the Son, Jesus the Christ correct? Yes
We both believe in God the Holy Spirit, the comforter our enlightedment to our sin to attain the forgiveness we seek for eternal life through Jesus Christ passion and death on the cross and ressurrection of His body and fullfillment of the scriptures and manifests His sacred body and blood in the celebration of the mass where we recieve His sacrifice with joy from the priest who is the designated person,under the authority of the Holy Father of the cc, to that we might receive from and who consecrated the host for the glory and worship of our God and King the Almighty Father and God of Abraham and Issac and Jacob? Dessert

 

[Cardinalsong]

I noticed after reading this thread (and many others of a similar content) that when asked about what church one should join it all comes down to what “I” want or “I” believe. What makes “me” feel right. What “I” understand.

It’s all about ME, MYSELF and I…with just a little sprinkling of you (as in "what makes ‘you’ feel good).

I’m still convinced that it’s all about me, me, ME!! MY truth, YOUR truth and that other guy’s truth.

If they remain unconvinced, if they are not comfortable in their minds and spirit that the Catholic faith is true, then they will not convert.

It isn’t a matter of whether I am comfortable with what I think is truth. I know it would be much more comfortable to remain protestant because it is an easier truth, so to speak, to understand. The CC is true whether I think so or not.

:twocents:

PS rr1213, this isn’t an attack on you. I just used what you said to get my point across. I see a lot of responses like the one you gave, this is not a reflection on you personally

 

[rr1213]

It isn’t a matter of whether I am comfortable with what I think is truth. I know it would be much more comfortable to remain protestant because it is an easier truth, so to speak, to understand. The CC is true whether I think so or not.
PS rr1213, this isn’t an attack on you. I just used what you said to get my point across. I see a lot of responses like the one you gave, this is not a reflection on you personally

How do you know that the Catholic Church is true? Because you believe it to be true. If you did not believe it to be true, then presumably you would not be Catholic. Tell me this, would you convert to a faith you believed to be false?

 

[runandsew]

How do you know that the Catholic Church is true? Because you believe it to be true. If you did not believe it to be true, then presumably you would not be Catholic. Tell me this, would you convert to a faith you believed to be false?

We know the Catholic Church is true because it has an unbroken history dating back to the Apostles, and it has the 4 marks of the Church
1 It is one
2 It is Holy
3 It is Catholic (universal)
4 it is Apostolic

We know that our Mass, is very close to what is described by St. Justin Martyr back around the year 150 AD.
read his first apology chapters 65,66 and 76

We believe in the real presense which St. Ignatius wrote about around the year 110 AD, in his Epistle to the Smyrnaeans in chapter 7.

We know that Jesus established a Church, and we can follow that Church, from the Gosples, through the Books of Acts, through the writings of the early church fathers, and the councils through out the ages. You can take our doctrines and trace them all back to the beginning as John Newman did, which after he wrote his book, “An Essay on the Development of Christian Doctrine” trying to prove the church wrong, converted to the church.
I know that it is by belief that we know that the Catholic Church is the church that Jesus established, but unlike the Mormans, who say the it went apostate, and some how found its way into North America by God’s grace, and there is a big gap in the story, our belief is more like the belief that Man landed on the moon. I have talked to people who firmly believe that we did not land on the moon. How do I prove it, they say it was faked. and unless I was there with Niel Armstrong, I really can’t prove it, except that history will show that we indeed land on the moon.
The same is true with the Catholic Church, it is a historical fact that it was the church Jesus established, but how can I prove it unless I was there on Pentecost day speaking in tounges with the other 11 Apostles. But I know by belief that this is true.

 

[AlegreFe]

How do you know that the Catholic Church is true? Because you believe it to be true. If you did not believe it to be true, then presumably you would not be Catholic. Tell me this, would you convert to a faith you believed to be false?

It is true because it is. Not because we believe that it is. It is what it is. The Catholic Church is the ABSOLUTE Truth, OBJECTIVE Truth; and NOT because we believe it to be Truth.

Faith is Faith. We know because we have faith and we don’t need any absolute SIGN that tells us that it is true. We have faith, and that is all we need to be in the Catholic Church. God gives us the gift of His Grace in order to have Faith, which is also a Gift from God.

If you need a sign or proof, then that’s okay too. You are just being a “doubting Thomas” that’s all. God will show you in ways that we cannot show you no matter how much scripture we present to you.

29 Jesus said to him, “Have you come
to believe because you have seen me?
Blessed are those who have not seen
and have believed.” John 20:29

If you don’t believe that the Catholic Church is the ONE True Church that Jesus Christ started then all that means is that God has not given you that gift of His Grace to have Faith to believe it, it’s that simple. Since the object of our Faith is the Divine Truth, then our Faith is what it is and cannot change if it is a True Divine Faith. Nothing false can be the object of Faith. The Catholic Church just holds the FULLNESS of Truth while Protestant churches only hold part of the truth. The Catholic Church has the FULL means of Salvation. Why go anywhere else.

If you don’t have that Grace to believe then all you have to do is ask for it and God will give it to you. But don’t think that if you ask then you will get it right away. If you are doubtful about the Catholic Faith then you will resist God’s Gift of Grace. So you have to be open to that Grace that God wants to give to you.

Having Faith is believing ALL that God has revealed to us. God revealed His Truth to us through Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition; and God has given the Authority to define Sacred Scripture and Tradition through the Magisterium of the Catholic Church.

Here is a prayer which is an act of faith;
Act of Faith
O my God, I firmly believe all the truths that the
Holy Catholic Church believes and teaches;
I believe these truths, O Lord, because Thou,
the Infallible Truth, hast revealed them to her;
In this faith I am resolved to live and die.
Amen.

 

[AlegreFe]

We know the Catholic Church is true because it has an unbroken history dating back to the Apostles, and it has the 4 marks of the Church
1 It is one
2 It is Holy
3 It is Catholic (universal)
4 it is Apostolic

We know that our Mass, is very close to what is described by St. Justin Martyr back around the year 150 AD.
read his first apology chapters 65,66 and 76

We believe in the real presense which St. Ignatius wrote about around the year 110 AD, in his Epistle to the Smyrnaeans in chapter 7.

We know that Jesus established a Church, and we can follow that Church, from the Gosples, through the Books of Acts, through the writings of the early church fathers, and the councils through out the ages. You can take our doctrines and trace them all back to the beginning as John Newman did, which after he wrote his book, “An Essay on the Development of Christian Doctrine” trying to prove the church wrong, converted to the church.
I know that it is by belief that we know that the Catholic Church is the church that Jesus established, but unlike the Mormans, who say the it went apostate, and some how found its way into North America by God’s grace, and there is a big gap in the story, our belief is more like the belief that Man landed on the moon. I have talked to people who firmly believe that we did not land on the moon. How do I prove it, they say it was faked. and unless I was there with Niel Armstrong, I really can’t prove it, except that history will show that we indeed land on the moon.
The same is true with the Catholic Church, it is a historical fact that it was the church Jesus established, but how can I prove it unless I was there on Pentecost day speaking in tounges with the other 11 Apostles. But I know by belief that this is true.

:yup:

 

[Cardinalsong]

How do you know that the Catholic Church is true? Because you believe it to be true. If you did not believe it to be true, then presumably you would not be Catholic. Tell me this, would you convert to a faith you believed to be false?

It isn’t about what I believe so converting to a faith that I believe is false isn’t the point. The Catholic Church is true. Not because I believe it to be so.

Jesus said to him, “Have you come to believe because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed.”

John 20:29