How Do Orthodox Christians View the Pope?

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1beleever,

Love you, too, Sister…there is a thread somewhere on CAF that talks about this misuse of ‘father’…

Christ also spoke various times in relation to venerating or affirming the 4th commandment…here in the context I assume you are referring to…this question came up in our RICA class beginning of this year with an Inquirer…in this context…along with your thinking…Our Lord is admonishing people to let go of tribal loyalties to the Big Kahuna of whomever it is…my pastor’s words…but to look to God alone.

People who are on their journey, admit that it is in the Catholic Church that they come to God…people are secondary…and people think that…as Catholic parishes after Sunday Mass are not super friendly like many non-denominational Protestants…but our worship is based on Adoration and contemplating…I don’t like coffee and donuts but take the slow way home driving around the lake…contemplating of the Word of God I heard at Mass and my experience receiving the Eucharist. I definitely need fellowship which I can get during the rest of the week in my parish groups, and more prayer groups. Without them and sharing faith, I wane. Being Church is being with each other.

God bless and on my way to work!
 
Cleaning out my house of alot of things…and came across this…COMPENDIUM, Catechism of the Catholic Church, Motu Proprio, given by Pope Benedict, June 28, 2005, vigil of the Solemnity of Holy Apostles Peter and Paul.

In the Profession of Faith, 187. How do the Bishops exercise their function of governing? E very bishop, insofar as he is a member of the college of bishops, bears collegiality the care for all particular Churches and for the entire Church along with all the other bishops who are united to the Pope. A bishop to whom a particular Church has been entrusted governs that Church with authority of his own sacred power which is ordinary and immediate and exercised in the name of Christ, the Good Shepherd, in communion with the entire Church and under the guidance of the Successor of Peter.

Back to 182. What is the mission of the Pope? The Pope, Bishop of Rome and the Successor of Saint Peter, is the perpetual, visible source and foundation of the unity of the Church. He is the vicar of Christ, the head of the College of bishops and pastor of the universal Church over which he has by divine institution full, supreme, immediate, and universal power.
 
I would interpret supremacy as one of headship…you cannot arbitrate between two heads…and the Church has always had its patriarchs, jurisdictions…Rome in the past was called upon to settle disputes as the final word…for the time.

I would not see ‘Peter’ as inherently superior in an ego sense…but more in maintaining the work of unity of oneness…the primary mark of Catholicism.
 
KathleenGee said:
That idea came, as stated before, by Martin Luther, when he then completely broke away from the Church, ‘discovering’ the papacy as the anti-Christ in one of his bitter propaganda writings, ‘Captivity in Babylon’.

Likewise…if the poster wants to hold on to Luther’s concept at the papacy as Anti-Christ…he must also realize that Luther …
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No, he needn’t, since he (e.g. me) has never said that the Pope is the Antichrist.

What you were trying to do here was a sophistry - since Luther’s conclusion was based on false premises, you rendered my conclusion invalid without examining the premises on which it was based. Consequently, you presented a logical fallacy. On top of that you tried to make my statement identical with Luther’s, although they differ.

I have never said that the Pope is the Antichrist. I said he was a precursor of his. And it was an answer to the explicit question. One shouldn’t ask questions if one can’t handle the answers.

You can check St. John of Damascus’ Exact Exposition, Chapter 99 about it; I also believe that the similar reasoning is presented by St. Goldenmouth and St. Athanasios the Great - each of them refers to heretics as precursors to Antichrist.

Edit: Needless to say, there are also more recent Saints with the same approach, and I also believe the similar wording can be found in Decisions of Ecummenical Councils.
 
I was raised to Orthodox mindset - if you speak, always tell the truth.

I’m aware that it may completely be incompatible with heterodox mindset. What do you think about it? Is speaking the truth incompatible with your mindset?
 
MrZetterlund said:
I think the title is pretty self-expanitory of my question. As a former Baptist, I was heavily convinced of the primacy of the Pope through Scriptural evidence for the primacy of St. Peter. I noticed the papacy seems to have ended for Orthodox Christians in 1045 AD, and the issue happened to be over the residency of the Pope. So my basic question is this: How do Orthodox Christians view the Pope?
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My friend this a never ending topic.
 
Yes…I just lost my post and think now it is better left unsaid.

It was about the manifestos Luther wrote prior to the reforms of the Council of Trent, when he was addressing all of Germany. I would definitely see that movement lacking in universality…and stripping of Holy Orders, reducing the Mass to no distinction between lay and ministers and bishops, the latter he proposed be locally appointed by their own immediate communities…and more emotion based songs of which many were written by Luther, and the main focus being a stirring sermon, only two sacraments, Baptism and Eucharist…people receiving the wine along with the bread taken in their hands.

Many Catholics are very aware that we have had bad popes.

I will add that I have much esteem for the Orthodox faith.
 
KathleenGee said:
1beleever,

Love you, too, Sister…there is a thread somewhere on CAF that talks about this misuse of ‘father’…

Christ also spoke various times in relation to venerating or affirming the 4th commandment…here in the context I assume you are referring to…this question came up in our RICA class beginning of this year with an Inquirer…in this context…along with your thinking…Our Lord is admonishing people to let go of tribal loyalties to the Big Kahuna of whomever it is…my pastor’s words…but to look to God alone.

People who are on their journey, admit that it is in the Catholic Church that they come to God…people are secondary…and people think that…as Catholic parishes after Sunday Mass are not super friendly like many non-denominational Protestants…but our worship is based on Adoration and contemplating…I don’t like coffee and donuts but take the slow way home driving around the lake…contemplating of the Word of God I heard at Mass and my experience receiving the Eucharist. I definitely need fellowship which I can get during the rest of the week in my parish groups, and more prayer groups. Without them and sharing faith, I wane. Being Church is being with each other.

God bless and on my way to work!
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One thing I have realied in my Christian walk, which is nearing 45 years, is that like Jesus’s disciples, I am able to have a personal relationship with my Saviour! And like the disciples, because of His death on the Cross, and my acceptance of His forgiveness, and my surrendering my life to Him, I too have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit! Philippians 4:13 says,“I can do ALL things through Christ who strengthens me!” No human mediator necessary, my King is my Advocate, my Way to the Father! 👍
 
Iagree, and feel it is wrong for any denomination, cult, or otherwise to imply that anyone else is raised to tel lies!
 
KathleenGee said:
I would interpret supremacy as one of headship…you cannot arbitrate between two heads…and the Church has always had its patriarchs, jurisdictions…Rome in the past was called upon to settle disputes as the final word…for the time.

I would not see ‘Peter’ as inherently superior in an ego sense…but more in maintaining the work of unity of oneness…the primary mark of Catholicism.
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Yes, this is more in agreement what Eastern Catholics are working for and what even some Orthodox would accept. The Pope has primacy in the Church and has some authority over the entire Church. But he does not have universal jurisdiction in the sense that he can meddle directly with the affairs of other Churches. Having the power to arbitrate is separate from the power to rule over. Even in modern day democracies this is evident with the power to rule that goes to the Executive Branch, and the power to arbitrate goes to the Judicial Branch.
 
Yes, ConstantineTG…agree…how I pray we re-unite. We all have to take Peter as a sign that we need to learn infinite forgiveness for past sins.

My pastor thinks people can be fanatical when they keep living in the past. We cannot be ethnic as universal Christians…we hold on to the best of our own cultures…but beyond that…we must always seek communion with each other.
 
1beleever…

If Christ thought only He was necessary to start His church, in part He would not have apostles…You have to look at Christ and what He designated Peter to be and do…the prominence of Peter in the Gospels…so much of it his own humanity we can all identify with.

Our lives are centered on Christ, He is our life and our illumination. Without Him we are lost.
 
Well said, my friend! Every day I must ask myself," Does my life reflect Christ?" Do my words and actions match up? Is that speck in my eye hindering me from seeing the beauty in others. I believe wholheartedly in the second greatest Commandment, love others as thyself!
 
KathleenGee said:
You have to look at Christ and what He designated Peter to be and do…the prominence of Peter in the Gospels…
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All the Apostles were prominent. Heck…St John may be the most prominent. He was there on Mt Tabor (with St Peter and St James). He prayed with Christ in the garden (with St Peter and St James). He was at the foot of the Cross. Christ gave his most holy mother into his care.

But it is not about any one Apostle…all of them were equally part of the foundation…along with the prophets… with Christ as the Cornerstone.
 
Mickey said:
All the Apostles were prominent. Heck…St John may be the most prominent. He was there on Mt Tabor (with St Peter and St James). He prayed with Christ in the garden (with St Peter and St James). He was at the foot of the Cross. Christ gave his most holy mother into his care.

But it is not about any one Apostle…all of them were equally part of the foundation…along with the prophets… with Christ as the Cornerstone.
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All of them are important but not all of them had a new name, not all were given the key and 'upon u i will build my church was not said to all even though all the apostles were foundation stones of the church. Look thru the NT and u will find that among the apostle peter was recognised as first.
Ubenedictus
 
1beleevr said:
The pope is the head of the catholic church, but not the leader of all religions and denominations. He is a mortal man, with faults and shortcomings like all the rest of us. He was chosen by men to fill a spot, and he does very well!😉
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Pls is there an arguement concern wether the pope is a mortal or not. He is chosen by men is fair i can say the bible was writen by men. But in both cases something is missing, that is: the work of the holy spirit. U may want to add that next time.
Ubenedictus
 
1beleevr said:
Like many great sinners and saints before and after him. The pope is no greater or lesser than any other man. Even Paul, unquestionably the greatest evangelist/church planter/witness, recognied his shortcomings(“I am a wretched man”). So, like leaders of other churches, the pope has been chosen to lead his flock, albeit a larger flock than others. I have the utmost respect for the pope, but would not address him as Holy Father(John 17:11).🙂
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Are u suggesting that the title conflict with scripture, if so pls re-evaluate your interpretation. There is a post on ‘ask an apologetic’ section on the meaning of the title ( i’m too tire to check for it) i guess u got the meaning mixed up.
 
1beleevr said:
There’s no doubt about Peter’s greatness in serving the Lord, even in light of his denial, and him along with the other disciples falling asleep. But whatever became of his wife? I remember Jesus healed his mother-in-law. And, I read where Mary Magdelene was the first eyewitness to the risen Saviour!👍
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on peter’s wife u may want to check if there are some ‘traditions’. Magdalene was an apostle to d apostles but peter did the public…thing.
Ubenedictus
 
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