How do Protestants interpret 1 Cor 11:29?

[steve_b]

They would be thrown away. We don’t receive Christ by physically eating the elements.

I understand.

So my question is, why even consume those elements?
I:

We receive Him by faith as we partake. Christ is not thrown away in the trash.

Then what is the purpose of receiving something that is only going in the trash?

 

[benhur]

I apologize if there is a thread for this. I tried to search on it, but didn’t find anything. My forum-searching skills are probably lacking.

How do Protestants interpret 1 Cor 11:29:

27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For all who eat and drink[h] without discerning the body,* eat and drink judgment against themselves.

Thanks!*Hi NM,

So what is an “unworthy manner”? The context is not discerning a spiritual gathering ,a church gathering a holy gathering. Some came drunk, some brought a feast of food only for themselves, some went hungry . Does that sound like a fine tuned, spiritual Body of Christ , the church ? Paul does not say to "discern’’ the Lord’s blood , but to discern His body only, as in the church. They certainly were not being good members of that “body”, of that “one loaf” Augustine talks about.

But he does say we can be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord, via an unworthy,carnal manner of participating in the Lords supper because it tarnishes “shewing the Lord’s death till He returns”.

I understand those who say they do not discern the actual substance of the elements, but why would the Lord punish those for a doctrinal “ignorance” or differing real presence conviction ? it is more understandable that judgement comes upon a believer for carnal behavior,as in Aninias , or the carnal Corinthians Paul is referring to here.

As to whether God would punish one for unworthily taking on a “symbol”, not by itself. But if that symbol requires in its very nature to “remember”, to" shew " His death at Calvary, for our unworthiness, to be a symbol, then yes to judgement for remembering that unworthily, which is really not remembering it at all. Am I really remembering Calvary when I withhold my bread gift from a hungry brethren ? Now His name, which the believer has taken on , is at stake.

Blessings

 

[benhur]

I did read once in C literature on rules and regulations and advice on how to remove stains on cloth and any material where the consecrated communion elements may have fallen onto. I was surprised how often it was not referred to as blood removal but on how to remove the wine stain.

 

[ltwin]

I understand.

So my question is, why even consume those elements?

Because that is what Christ ordained. We remember Him the way He wants us to remember Him. It makes no difference whether the meal physically transforms into his body and blood. All that matters is that we obey Him, receiving Him by faith the way He taught us to. In that we receive blessing and strength.

Then what is the purpose of receiving something that is only going in the trash?

It’s not going in the trash. It goes in your body. You would only throw away something that was expired and unfit to eat at a later date. In that case, no one would be receiving it any way.

 

[steve_b]

Because that is what Christ ordained. We remember Him the way He wants us to remember Him. It makes no difference whether the meal physically transforms into his body and blood. All that matters is that we obey Him, receiving Him by faith the way He taught us to. In that we receive blessing and strength.

It’s not going in the trash. It goes in your body. You would only throw away something that was expired and unfit to eat at a later date. In that case, no one would be receiving it any way.

that’s not what you were saying in #39
did I misunderstand?, It looks like anything prepared at that service and not consumed at that service, is then tossed in the trash after the service

 

[MartinJordan]

Because that is what Christ ordained. We remember Him the way He wants us to remember Him. It makes no difference whether the meal physically transforms into his body and blood. All that matters is that we obey Him, receiving Him by faith the way He taught us to. In that we receive blessing and strength.

Luke 24 :

But they urged him strongly, “Stay with us, for it is nearly evening; the day is almost over.” So he went in to stay with them.

30 When he was at the table with them, he took bread, gave thanks, broke it and began to give it to them. 31 Then their eyes were opened and they recognized him, and he disappeared from their sight.

I’m not sure whether you’re right or not.

Your comment in green (bolded my me) is very interesting. It’s seems you’re connecting directly to Jesus words to your tradition?

MJ

 

[ltwin]

that’s not what you were saying in #39
did I misunderstand?, It looks like anything prepared at that service and not consumed at that service, is then tossed in the trash after the service

I think I said somewhere that we’d throw it out if it was expired but would probably keep anything unopened for the next time we have Communion.

In any event, we do not reverence leftover bread and grape juice as if it were actually Christ.

 

[steve_b]

I think I said somewhere that we’d throw it out if it was expired but would probably keep anything unopened for the next time we have Communion.

In any event, we do not reverence leftover bread and grape juice as if it were actually Christ**.**

I understand.

As well you shouldn’t. That would be for you, idolatry.

that said, that is Not so, for Catholics celebrating the Eucharist with a validly ordained priest, in union with the Pope.

**1 Cor 11:29 **presumes there is a validly ordained priest to do the consecration

for context

Institution of the Lord’s Supper / Eucharist
**
1 Cor 11:**
23 For I received from the Lord what I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, “This is my body which is forc] you. Do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.
Partaking of the Supper Unworthily

27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself. 30

 

[steve_b]

I think I said somewhere that we’d throw it out if it was expired but would probably keep anything unopened for the next time we have Communion.

In any event, we do not reverence leftover bread and grape juice as if it were actually Christ**.**

I understand.

As well you shouldn’t. That would be for you, idolatry.

that said,

Re: the topic,

that is Not so, for Catholics celebrating the Eucharist.

for explanation,

**1 Cor 11:29 **presumes there is a validly ordained priest to do the consecration of bread and wine

Why? (all emphasis mine)
**
1 Cor 11:**
*23 For I received from the Lord what I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, “This is my body which is forc] you. Do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.

27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself."*

Q: Who was Jesus doing this for at the Last Supper? For His priests that He ordained. That’s what “Do this” means. He says, Do what I am doing. Make this happen for others. That is what a validly ordained priest does.

Consecration by a validly ordained priest changes those elements. To make that consequence so grave then, and to profane Our Lord, is for anyone to fail to discern,that after consecration, He is really there body and blood in the Eucharist

 

[cominghome1966]

The following video has some great Biblical exegesis as to why the Eucharist is literal, not figurative. Among other things, it compares the “bread of life discourse” in John 6, to other Bible passages where Jesus was speaking figuratively, people thought he was speaking literally or they did not understand him, and he corrected them (“We brought no bread,” “I am the door,” “Destroy this temple and I will raise it in three days.”). No correction happened in John 6 when the people indicated that he was speaking literally, but correction happened at those other times.

Plus, in every other passage regarding the Eucharist (ie, Last Supper, Paul’s admonition at 1 Cor 11), there is no indication that that the Eucharist was figurative. 1 Cor 11 is especially interesting to me. Since St. Paul was correcting the Corinthians anyway for the way they were treating the Lord’s Supper, it would have been a good time to explain or at least indicate somehow that it was not literal. But he didn’t do that.

I don’t know who this guy his, but I’ve watched a number of his videos. The name of his YouTube channel is “How To Be Christian.” He argues each topic thoroughly, and completely from the Bible. Check him out and see if you agree.

youtube.com/watch?v=hJGV-RtMEsQ&t=1679s

 

[Peter_J]

People who participate in Holy Communion without faith, without confession and repentance of sin, without love for their brothers and sisters in Christ and forgiveness for those who have wronged them are failing to take Holy Communion seriously and insulting the blood of Christ which was shed for us and the body of Christ which is the Church.

It is a warning to Christians who are willfully living in sin and unforgiveness to get their hearts right. It is a warning to non-Christians that they are bringing judgment on themselves by participating.

Although your words don’t come as a surprise, I’ve always wondered if y’all can demonstrate your interpretation if “discerning the body” being maintained by anyone in the first millennium?

 

[MartinJordan]

One shouldn’t interpret 1 Cor 11:27- 29 on it’s own, because there’s also the mention by Paul in 1 Cor 10 too of the same. And it’s not fluff.

MJ

 

[ltwin]

Although your words don’t come as a surprise, I’ve always wondered if y’all can demonstrate your interpretation if “discerning the body” being maintained by anyone in the first millennium?

Other than Paul? It’s clear from the entire context of 1 Corinthians 11 that eating/drinking in an unworthy manner and failing to “discern the body” refer to the way Christians were treating each other. Since all who are united to Christ are members of His body, those who mistreat fellow Christians–in Paul’s words “despise the church of God and humiliate those who have nothing”-- are mistreating the body of Christ.

This is why Paul ends the chapter with the following paragraph:

33 So then, my brothers, when you come together to eat, wait for one another— 34 if anyone is hungry, let him eat at home—so that when you come together it will not be for judgment.

The judgment comes when we fail to love the other members of the body of Christ. When we fail to love one another, we fail to discern Christ’s body. This theme is repeated later in chapter 12 when Paul speaks of the church being “one body many members.”

 

[Peter_J]

Other than Paul?

Oh no, Paul counts. But I think his words are open to interpretation, which is why we have discussions like this.

 

[MartinJordan]

Oh no, Paul counts. But I think his words are open to interpretation, which is why we have discussions like this.

Don’t forget to read 1 Cor 10 too.

MJ

 

[ltwin]

Oh no, Paul counts. But I think his words are open to interpretation, which is why we have discussions like this.

I’m not sure how later writers interpreted 1 Corinthians 11. I’ve never done a study of it. I’d assume that the Church Fathers would most likely affirm something similar to what Catholics believe. We’d probably need to look to groups labeled heretical to see if they had any beliefs similar to this, but that can be hard to do since we often don’t have much knowledge of what minority groups taught.

I do think this interpretation makes the most sense given Paul’s context here. Our failure to discern the body is one reason Paul tells us that Christians may be weak, ill and even suffer death. It is not, I believe, because we fail to believe in transubstantiation. It is because we have unforgiveness and unconfessed sin in our hearts.

This connects nicely to James 5:14-16:

14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. 16 Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working.

When we as the body of Christ are living in unforgiveness and discord, we bring judgment upon ourselves and even hinder our own healing. However, when we confess our sins to one another and pray for one another, we begin to live together as the body of Christ and healing comes.

So, before we partake of the Lord’s Supper we are to examine ourselves. If there is any sin in our lives we should confess it, and if we have anything against a brother or sister, we should do as Jesus teaches us in Matthew 5:24, “leave your gift there before the altar and go. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift.”

But that’s just my two cents.

 

[Vanny]

Haven’t read through all the responses, but checking in to say that WELS and LCMS Lutheran churches have closed communion(as does the RCC and the Orthodox)
in the case of the WELS closed communion is practiced as we believe in the Real presence and communion is for baptized believers who have been instructed and are
knowledgeable about what they are receiving in the sacrament, and to make sure they have been instructed how to examine themselves properly and confess any sins.
It is for the protection of souls, as our denomination takes 1 Corinthian 11:29 seriously.
As a matter of fact I’ve recited this verse for my evangelical (and ELCA) friends who have wondered why we have closed communion.

 

[steve_b]

The following video has some great Biblical exegesis as to why the Eucharist is literal, not figurative. Among other things, it compares the “bread of life discourse” in John 6, to other Bible passages where Jesus was speaking figuratively, people thought he was speaking literally or they did not understand him, and he corrected them (“We brought no bread,” “I am the door,” “Destroy this temple and I will raise it in three days.”). No correction happened in John 6 when the people indicated that he was speaking literally, but correction happened at those other times.

Plus, in every other passage regarding the Eucharist (ie, Last Supper, Paul’s admonition at 1 Cor 11), there is no indication that that the Eucharist was figurative. 1 Cor 11 is especially interesting to me. Since St. Paul was correcting the Corinthians anyway for the way they were treating the Lord’s Supper, it would have been a good time to explain or at least indicate somehow that it was not literal. But he didn’t do that.

I don’t know who this guy his, but I’ve watched a number of his videos. The name of his YouTube channel is “How To Be Christian.” He argues each topic thoroughly, and completely from the Bible. Check him out and see if you agree.

youtube.com/watch?v=hJGV-RtMEsQ&t=1679s

2011 was a great year.

 

[Peter_J]

I’m not sure how later writers interpreted 1 Corinthians 11. I’ve never done a study of it. I’d assume that the Church Fathers would most likely affirm something similar to what Catholics believe.

That is a very interesting assumption. (Not that I didn’t read the rest of your post as well.)

 

[susanlo]

Oh no, Paul counts. But I think his words are open to interpretation, which is why we have discussions like this.

What are the other interpretations of this passage? What is the Catholic interpretation?