How Do Saints Hear Us?

[HalleluYAH]

Yes their is only one mediator between God and man. What that means though, is that Jesus is the only bridge through which the prayers flow since He is God. Catholics and Eastern Orthodox never pray outside of the body of Christ Mt 17 at Jesus’ transfiguration, Moses and Elijiah could hear Peter, James and John. James 5:16…says that “the prayers of a righteous man availeth much” and those in heaven are much more “righteous” than are we and surely you can’t say that we on earth are no different than those in heaven.

"One charge made against it is that the saints in heaven cannot even hear our prayers, making it useless to ask for their intercession. However, this is not true. As Scripture indicates, those in heaven are aware of the prayers of those on earth. This can be seen, for example, in Revelation 5:8, where John depicts the saints in heaven offering our prayers to God under the form of “golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.” But if the saints in heaven are offering our prayers to God, then they must be aware of our prayers. They are aware of our petitions and present them to God by interceding for us.

Some might try to argue that in this passage the prayers being offered were not addressed to the saints in heaven, but directly to God. Yet this argument would only strengthen the fact that those in heaven can hear our prayers, for then the saints would be aware of our prayers even when they are not directed to them!

In any event, it is clear from Revelation 5:8 that the saints in heaven do actively intercede for us. We are explicitly told by John that the incense they offer to God are the prayers of the saints. Prayers are not physical things and cannot be physically offered to God. Thus the saints in heaven are offering our prayers to God mentally. In other words, they are interceding."
catholic.com/library/Praying_to_the_Saints.asp

Revelation 5:8 refers to the 24 elders who sit upon the thrones.

The MOST HIGH does not need saints, angels or anyone else to aid him in hearing my prayers. HE is omniscient and omnipresent. HE hears my prayers as I speak them directly to HIM.

 

[HalleluYAH]

I feel that I need to point out one error here, The Bible does say the Elijah was taken bodily into heaven, but does not in the case of Moses. The story of Moses’ burial can be found in Deuteronomy, chapter 34. Specifically verse 5.

Further revelation on this matter is given us in Jude verse 9.

 

[VociMike]

The MOST HIGH does not need saints, angels or anyone else to aid him in hearing my prayers. HE is omniscient and omnipresent. HE hears my prayers as I speak them directly to HIM.

Straw man fall down go boom. The Catholic Church does not claim that God needs saints or angels or anyone else for any reason at all.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Straw man fall down go boom. The Catholic Church does not claim that God needs saints or angels or anyone else for any reason at all.

Why pruport a teaching that would lead others to pray mary, saints or anyone other than the Father through Messiah?

 

[FCEGM]

Why pruport a teaching that would lead others to pray mary, saints or anyone other than the Father through Messiah?

Yours, of course, is a common objection. See this:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthrea…27#post2158827

To quote myself -

Further, asking the intercession of the Saints is realistic humility. God hears everyone’s prayers; He does not thereby grant all that He hears - just as a human father hears all the child pleas of his offspring, but does not always grant them. God grants the prayers of the Just in Heaven, since they are in a position to be heard and accommodated, their will already being in sync with His. The faithful on earth are quite aware that they are not as pure as the Saints in Heaven. Good Christians are not in a state of sin, but they realistically know they are far from being perfectly in sync with God’s will, but those in heaven are.

And we are humans; which means that we are all in this boat together and not isolated individuals. It is therefore according to our nature created by God to do things together for a common purpose. It is our love for one another that impels us to pray for one another and to want others to pray for us. The Saints are our brothers and sisters who are in God’s Presence; but some people don’t like this interdependence.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Yours, of course, is a common objection. See this:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthrea…27#post2158827

To quote myself -

Psycho bable derived in the heart of man… this did/does not come from HIS WORD!

 

[guanophore]

Heresy^^^.

The appearance of Moses and EliYah on the Mount was only possible in that Moses and EliYah’s physical bodies never descended into Sheol.

If you read the OT carefully you will discover that the Most High had the bodies of Moses and EliYah taken up.

Where do you find that, about Moses’ body? Are you makin’ stuff up?

Other men, including your so called ‘saints’ are no different than you and I. We will die, and descend to sheol awaiting resurrection and judgement.

You didn’t answer my question about how the thief could be in Paradise that day, with Jesus!

And I would like to know what you think happened to all those that “came out of their graves” when Jesus died on the cross.

Btw, the saints do not hear your prayers.

Prove that!

However, that does necessarily mean the Most High will ignore them considering many pray to saints or mary in ignorance. You should pray to Yahshua (Jesus)… there is only one mediator between G~d and man— that is Yahshua.

3 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with **the prayers of all the saints **upon the golden altar before the throne; 4 and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God." Rev 8:3-4

8 And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints; 9 and they sang a new song,…" Rev 5:7-9

James 5:16
The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects."

Or, do you deny that those who have gone before us in the faith are righteous?

If you think that those who have fallen asleep in Christ are dead, then your arguement is not with me, but with Jesus. He is the one who says you are wrong:

34 And Jesus said to them, “The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage; 35 but those who are accounted worthy to attain to that age and to the resurrection from the dead neither marry nor are given in marriage, 36 for they cannot die any more, because they are equal to angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection. 37 But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the passage about the bush, where he calls the Lord the God of Abraham and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. 38 Now he is not God of the dead, but of the living; for all live to him.” Luke 20:34-40

27 He is not God of the dead, but of the living; you are quite wrong."
Mark 12:27

 

[Michael_Howard]

Psycho bable derived in the heart of man… this did/does not come from HIS WORD!

Friend welcome to the forum. Please be more patient and charitable in your responses though, I think you can make a strong point without harsh words. Welcome and God bless!

 

[guanophore]

The saints are dead… and, they are not omniscient… they can not hear your prayers. Moreover, praying to and/or conversing with spirits is an abomination to the Most High.

Again, praying to saints is sin… and now that you have heard the truth, you may go ahead and live it.

Heb 12:1
12:1 Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses,

You can read about some of the saints in Heb. ch. 11. Now, why would the Apostle tell us to be mindful that they surround us, and by that awareness, spur us to persevere? No, the saints are “in Christ” and are seated with him at the right hand of God. Or did you not read that part of your bible?

 

[HalleluYAH]

Where do you find that, about Moses’ body? Are you makin’ stuff up?

Jude verse 9

You didn’t answer my question about how the thief could be in Paradise that day, with Jesus!

He was in paradise, the same place Yahshua went when he awaited resurrection of His body. This is not the same place as Heaven, rather sheol or hades - the place the dead await judgement.

And I would like to know what you think happened to all those that “came out of their graves” when Jesus died on the cross.

Prove that!

They came out of their graves and went to hades/sheol to await judgement. There are seperate, distinct sides of hades ---- see the latter half of Luke Chapter 16.

3 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with **the prayers of all the saints **upon the golden altar before the throne; 4 and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God." Rev 8:3-4

8 And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints; 9 and they sang a new song,…" Rev 5:7-9

James 5:16
The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects."

Or, do you deny that those who have gone before us in the faith are righteous?

If you think that those who have fallen asleep in Christ are dead, then your arguement is not with me, but with Jesus. He is the one who says you are wrong:

34 And Jesus said to them, “The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage; 35 but those who are accounted worthy to attain to that age and to the resurrection from the dead neither marry nor are given in marriage, 36 for they cannot die any more, because they are equal to angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection. 37 But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the passage about the bush, where he calls the Lord the God of Abraham and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. 38 Now he is not God of the dead, but of the living; for all live to him.” Luke 20:34-40

27 He is not God of the dead, but of the living; you are quite wrong."
Mark 12:27

All of the above does nothing to advocate a biblical stance on praying to anyone other than the Father in Yahshua.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Friend welcome to the forum. Please be more patient and charitable in your responses though, I think you can make a strong point without harsh words. Welcome and God bless!

Agreed.

I do yet refuse to get tolerate men/woman purporting their own logic and attemtping to pass it off as HOLY WORD>

 

[KatholikosMercy]

Heresy^^^.

Heresy is the departure from the Doctrine the church preaches.

You can try and turn it back on the truth as the Pharasees and Levites did but you see where that got them.

What the old testaments says is fulfilled in Christ not in hell.

 

[Michael_Howard]

Agreed.

I do yet refuse to get tolerate men/woman purporting their own logic and attemtping to pass it off as HOLY WORD>

I have to ask you this question and it would be fair to the discussion, what is your current denomination? I think some background would be helpful to clarify your pacticualr bent on the scriptures. Peace of Christ to you!

 

[HalleluYAH]

Heb 12:1
12:1 Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses,

You can read about some of the saints in Heb. ch. 11. Now, why would the Apostle tell us to be mindful that they surround us, and by that awareness, spur us to persevere? No, the saints are “in Christ” and are seated with him at the right hand of God. Or did you not read that part of your bible?

Yes, the saints who are alive and in HIM are seated at the right hand. When we die our bodies lie dead, our souls got to hades, and our spirit (if we are born again) goes back to Father.

FYI… the “great cloud of witnesses” you referred to are those listed in the beginning of Heb 11… they are “witnesses” to the idea of faith.

 

[KatholikosMercy]

The saints are dead… and, they are not omniscient… they can not hear your prayers. Moreover, praying to and/or conversing with spirits is an abomination to the Most High.

Again, praying to saints is sin… and now that you have heard the truth, you may go ahead and live it.

Your arrogance is astounding.

The truth isn’t according to you.

Jesus gave you a Pillar of Truth to follow. It says that the Saints can hear us.

Your accusations are from satan and blasphemy which is the true abomination.

Now that you know you can repent.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Heresy is the departure from the Doctrine the church preaches.

You can try and turn it back on the truth as the Pharasees and Levites did but you see where that got them.

What the old testaments says is fulfilled in Christ not in hell.

Yahshua told us not ‘one jot or tittle’ would be removed from the OT until all was accomplished.

 

[HalleluYAH]

I have to ask you this question and it would be fair to the discussion, what is your current denomination? I think some background would be helpful to clarify your pacticualr bent on the scriptures. Peace of Christ to you!

I am born again of HIS spirit. Selah.

 

[FCEGM]

Agreed.

I do yet refuse to get tolerate men/woman purporting their own logic and attemtping to pass it off as HOLY WORD>

. . .as interpreted by you. However, you haven’t presented your bona fides as to why your insights into Sacred Scripture are better than those of the Church.

God bless you with Holy Wisdom.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Your arrogance is astounding.

The truth isn’t according to you.

Jesus gave you a Pillar of Truth to follow. It says that the Saints can hear us.

Your accusations are from satan and blasphemy which is the true abomination.

Now that you know you can repent.

LOL… the saints can not hear you. all of us who are saved are called saints. a saint is a man or woman washed in the blood of Christ by grace through faith. aside from this, we are not saints.

 

[HalleluYAH]

. . .as interpreted by you. However, you haven’t presented your bona fides as to why your insights into Sacred Scripture are better than those of the Church.

God bless you with Holy Wisdom.

I don’t need to… this is the holy spirit’s job… believe truth if you want to… I am not responsible for your path… I only spread truth as I learn it. and, amidst our discussions I discover further insight.

those who believe they have all the answer already will remain decived. those who are willing to learn and continually ask, seek and knock - to these the doors to truth will be opened.

i appreciate the part each of you play in my progress.

Glory HalleluYAH.