How do we know that God is good?

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I think that these reasons are good for me, but I am a christian. It seems like whatever I am question I have about christianity will have one or a few answers that speak to me. It is different though answering someone who is inside the faith then people outside. It isn’t that you didn’t give good answers it’s just that I know the responses that atheists would give, because most of my friends are atheist. The answers seem to lack force(cogency) or they are all in the form of “faith seeking understanding”.

Thanks
Oh. You’re asking the question for an atheist. And need an answer for an atheist.

First of all, atheists don’t believe in God so He’s neither good nor evil. He’s non-existent.

Now, if they’re saying they can’t believe in God because He must not be a good God, I’d cut it short and not try to go further because you’ll be caught in quicksand very quickly.

Just ask them my favorite question: How did everything come into existence?
Why is there good and evil?
If God doesn’t exist, why aren’t we all just living in anarchy?
If there’s a natural law - WHO OR WHAT put the natural law into our hearts?

You’ll get into quicksand quickly because once they DO accept that MAYBE God is good, their next question will be: Then why doesn’t He stop the evil that happens (bad things)? So He’s good, okay, but He’s not omnipotent or he’d just stop kids getting sick and starving and wars, etc etc.

See? It’s not easy. If they’re sincere, be evangelical. If they’re not - why bother? Only a spiritual person can understand spiritual things. The material man cannot understand the things of God. Read 1 Corinthians 2:7-16.

Fran
P.S. What could be more forecful than a man coming back to life? But they don’t believe that, so…
 
In most protestant circles we say that God is good because we have defined him as omnibenevolent. In other words he is the standard for what is good or moral. The problem is that God does things we would not consider the most good, and he does not do things that we would consider moral. An example of the former is that he did not give the Jews laws that were the most moral, but only more moral then what they were doing like divorce, slavery. An example of the latter is where if we had the ability to save a persons life from starvation and we did we would be morally good but God does not. So my question is how do we come to the conclusion that God is maximally good?

If you say that the church says he is do not expect a response from me. Also if you say something about slavery being moral don’t expect a response from me.
 
In most protestant circles we say that God is good because we have defined him as omnibenevolent. In other words he is the standard for what is good or moral. The problem is that God does things we would not consider the most good, and he does not do things that we would consider moral. An example of the former is that he did not give the Jews laws that were the most moral, but only more moral then what they were doing like divorce, slavery. An example of the latter is where if we had the ability to save a persons life from starvation and we did we would be morally good but God does not. So my question is how do we come to the conclusion that God is maximally good?

If you say that the church says he is do not expect a response from me. Also if you say something about slavery being moral don’t expect a response from me.
The business about God being “good” didn’t come from the natural world. I’m on holiday at the moment, and yesterday I was having a bit of a dip in the ocean. On at least 3 occasions, a small school of fish leaped out of the water only about 15 metres away. Since this is not normal behaviour for these small fish, I have to assume something was chasing them with the specific intention of eating them.

Is this a sign of God’s goodness, in that He’s made a world where pretty much every form of animal life subsists by feeding on some other form of life, including us? It involves quite a degree of ruthlessness, from Great White Sharks eating seals to humans driving lorry loads of chickens to the abattoir.

So if God is “Good”, then we need a definition of what we mean by “Good” and then prove it.

So far I haven’t seen any argument that holds water for the simple reason that I don’t know what “Good” or “Love” mean in God’s case.

The concept comes, as far as I know, from Judeo-Christian teaching, and not much else, although others better verse in other religions and philosophical systems might be able to put me to rights.

And if that’s the case, why did God only allow this message of His “goodness” to filter through one small group of people who He in turn purged again and again and again, culminating in the Holocaust seventy five years ago?

There’s an element of ruthlessness about his “Goodness” and “Love” that I don’t like much.
 
I think it’s also important to remember that we live in a fallen world, therefore I don’t believe we can arrive to a ‘good’ creator just by looking at the state of the world we find ourselves in, if we were still in the garden of Eden, than I think simply studying our environment we could have easily derived God’s Goodness and it would have been as clear as day, but not in a fallen world as it’s mixed with the enemies lies, corruption and other evils, hence I find God’s Goodness in His revelation to the prophets and saints throughout history and most importantly His life here on Earth, culminating with the death on the Cross for us.

Jesus to St. Faustina
"If My death has not convinced you of My love, what will?" (Diary, 580)

Sacred Heart of Jesus - St Margaret-Mary Alacoque

http://s15.postimg.org/uc0cy5a0r/st_margaretmary2.jpg

Jesus to St Margaret-Mary Alacoque

"Behold the Heart which has so loved men that it has spared nothing, even to exhausting (Crucifixion) and consuming Itself (Last Supper, Eucharist), in order to testify Its love;

I hope this has helped

God Bless You

Thank you for reading
Josh
 
The business about God being “good” didn’t come from the natural world. I’m on holiday at the moment, and yesterday I was having a bit of a dip in the ocean. On at least 3 occasions, a small school of fish leaped out of the water only about 15 metres away. Since this is not normal behaviour for these small fish, I have to assume something was chasing them with the specific intention of eating them.

Is this a sign of God’s goodness, in that He’s made a world where pretty much every form of animal life subsists by feeding on some other form of life, including us? It involves quite a degree of ruthlessness, from Great White Sharks eating seals to humans driving lorry loads of chickens to the abattoir.

So if God is “Good”, then we need a definition of what we mean by “Good” and then prove it.

So far I haven’t seen any argument that holds water for the simple reason that I don’t know what “Good” or “Love” mean in God’s case.

The concept comes, as far as I know, from Judeo-Christian teaching, and not much else, although others better verse in other religions and philosophical systems might be able to put me to rights.

And if that’s the case, why did God only allow this message of His “goodness” to filter through one small group of people who He in turn purged again and again and again, culminating in the Holocaust seventy five years ago?

There’s an element of ruthlessness about his “Goodness” and “Love” that I don’t like much.
Bob Crowley,

You’re having a problem with the concept of evil. Think about it. If God is so good, how come all this bad?

My post no. 8 makes no sense? Are you looking for an answer to why evil exists, or where it comes from?

As a former protestant you should know these answers better than most of my catholic friends. (I feel protestants are more knowledgeable than catholics with christian concepts - church’s fault, not enough teaching).

If I’m on the right track, the thought could continue - if not, I withdraw.

Lunch time here in my part of the world.

Fran
 
God is maximally good because the immense value of life far outweighs its disadvantages, especially when an afterlife is taken into account. It is unreasonable to expect the Jews or anyone else to be infallible. God normally works through the laws of nature so that we can predict most events, survive and enjoy life. If He constantly intervened we would never know what to expect and be aware a benevolent Power is protecting us - which would defeat the purpose of giving us free will so that we can choose what to believe, how to live and who to love…
I wasn’t even responding to you specifically; I addressed all of the responses. I did this because to respond to everyone will take up more time then I have. Your response to me question is puzzling to say the least. To tell you the truth I am not responding to you at all because I am still waiting for you to clear up our conversation on the “is eternal suffering pointless” thread.

Anyway your argument, if it could be called this, lacks validity so I have no idea how you think it is cogent. Listen up I am not looking for a syllogism, but the way you put together sentences is hardly intelligible. They read like you wrote them off the top of your head.
 
I wasn’t even responding to you specifically; I addressed all of the responses. I did this because to respond to everyone will take up more time then I have. Your response to me question is puzzling to say the least. To tell you the truth I am not responding to you at all because I am still waiting for you to clear up our conversation on the “is eternal suffering pointless” thread.

Anyway your argument, if it could be called this, lacks validity so I have no idea how you think it is cogent. Listen up I am not looking for a syllogism, but the way you put together sentences is hardly intelligible. They read like you wrote them off the top of your head.
Your posts contain nothing but unsubstantiated criticisms. Farewell.
 
I wasn’t even responding to you specifically; I addressed all of the responses. I did this because to respond to everyone will take up more time then I have. Your response to me question is puzzling to say the least. To tell you the truth I am not responding to you at all because I am still waiting for you to clear up our conversation on the “is eternal suffering pointless” thread.

Anyway your argument, if it could be called this, lacks validity so I have no idea how you think it is cogent. Listen up I am not looking for a syllogism, but the way you put together sentences is hardly intelligible. They read like you wrote them off the top of your head.
Your above response is to TonyRey.

Everything TonyRey says is true.

I don’t understand why you’re having a problem with it…

Fran
 
All creation is alive - structured being, existing in relation to itself and God.
Perceptions, understanding and action, journeying at its highest level, back to its Source.
From simplest matter, churned in blazing hydrogen furnaces, life on earth takes form, each expression giving itself over that others may take form.
Life feeds itself to itself, the top of the chain ultimately surrendering itself to the bottom.
In loving relation, the universe expresses the goodness of the Triune Godhead which is its Foundation.
But, in a fallen world, love is an endless battle fought tooth and nail, a perpetual re-enactment of death, as relations with each other are directed back toward self-interest, the subject, mankind, having turned away from its primary object, the Source of our existence - Love.
Yet, beneath the mundane, in awe we sit in beauty and goodness, found in those rumbling depths eternal.
 
Look at His Saints. The closer they came to God, the more they grew in moral perfection. ‘He that loveth not, knoweth not God: for God is charity’ (1 Jn. 4:8).
 
I think that these reasons are good for me, but I am a christian. It seems like whatever I am question I have about christianity will have one or a few answers that speak to me. It is different though answering someone who is inside the faith then people outside. It isn’t that you didn’t give good answers it’s just that I know the responses that atheists would give, because most of my friends are atheist. The answers seem to lack force(cogency) or they are all in the form of “faith seeking understanding”.

Thanks
When needing to help those good folks, remember that you yourself have factored the fruits of your experience into your level of faith:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=13040049&postcount=825

Post 32 above is also about this.

They may not want to be told they have got to have faith, so you and I must let them see ours. At the same time Fran’s first post covers what I would have said to you. Are your questioners sentimentalists who wear rose-tinted glasses? Just like our lives must present part of the answer, their lives are part of the question.
 
Everything TonyRey says is true. I don’t understand why you’re having a problem with it…
It may be true but the way he says it makes it so i could never know if it is or it isn’t applicable to what I saying. I am actually trying to be intellectually honest here. It’s not that I cannot translate what he is saying into coherent thoughts. It’s just that he has a very conversational style of writing that I really don’t understand what he is actually trying to say in response to me. You are more than welcome to try and explain what he is saying. I won’t retract what I have said, because it’s true. I think I may be concentrating on the first sentence too much though.

Look I said that God did not prescribe things that were the most moral thing for people to do. His response was “it is unreasonable to expect the Jews or anyone else to be infallible”. How is this a response to what i am saying? Does (most moral)=infallible or prescribe=expect for catholics or to anyone for that matter. Even if I am saying that God should be prescribing moral infallibility that wouldn’t mean that He expected them to be morally infallible all the time? God set up a system of sacrifice right? Are catholics claiming that sacrifice was meant to cover the immoral things God allowed the Jews to do as well as the other things that they were doing which were immoral?

What I am saying is that God has to have a reason to prescribe laws that were not as moral as they could be. If everything God is prescribing is not morally absolute, and at the same time He is not telling people which things are morally absolute and which he is only prescribing because it would be to hard for them to fulfill, this is a problem. God could have even said to them “you may own people, but it is better if you didn’t” or “You may divorce your wife, but it is better if you didn’t”. Really though, how hard is it to not own people, are you really claiming that is would have been impossible for the Jews to not owned people?

This is just one of his sentences. I am not going to do with every sentence in his paragraph, because I already tried to have a discussion with him elsewhere, and I tried to tease what he was saying with questions. He said questions were fallacious with no explanation, and when I ask for an explanation all I got was silence.
 
It may be true but the way he says it makes it so i could never know if it is or it isn’t applicable to what I saying. I am actually trying to be intellectually honest here. It’s not that I cannot translate what he is saying into coherent thoughts. It’s just that he has a very conversational style of writing that I really don’t understand what he is actually trying to say in response to me. You are more than welcome to try and explain what he is saying. I won’t retract what I have said, because it’s true. I think I may be concentrating on the first sentence too much though.

Look I said that God did not prescribe things that were the most moral thing for people to do. His response was “it is unreasonable to expect the Jews or anyone else to be infallible”. How is this a response to what i am saying? Does (most moral)=infallible or prescribe=expect for catholics or to anyone for that matter. Even if I am saying that God should be prescribing moral infallibility that wouldn’t mean that He expected them to be morally infallible all the time? God set up a system of sacrifice right? Are catholics claiming that sacrifice was meant to cover the immoral things God allowed the Jews to do as well as the other things that they were doing which were immoral?

What I am saying is that God has to have a reason to prescribe laws that were not as moral as they could be. If everything God is prescribing is not morally absolute, and at the same time He is not telling people which things are morally absolute and which he is only prescribing because it would be to hard for them to fulfill, this is a problem. God could have even said to them “you may own people, but it is better if you didn’t” or “You may divorce your wife, but it is better if you didn’t”. Really though, how hard is it to not own people, are you really claiming that is would have been impossible for the Jews to not owned people?

This is just one of his sentences. I am not going to do with every sentence in his paragraph, because I already tried to have a discussion with him elsewhere, and I tried to tease what he was saying with questions. He said questions were fallacious with no explanation, and when I ask for an explanation all I got was silence.
Okay. Here’s what Tony Rey said:

Originally Posted by tonyrey View Post
God is maximally good because the immense value of life far outweighs its disadvantages, especially when an afterlife is taken into account. It is unreasonable to expect the Jews or anyone else to be infallible. God normally works through the laws of nature so that we can predict most events, survive and enjoy life. If He constantly intervened we would never know what to expect and be aware a benevolent Power is protecting us - which would defeat the purpose of giving us free will so that we can choose what to believe, how to live and who to love…

He’s saying that no matter what disadvantages we have in life: poverty, sickness, lonliness, etc, it’s all worth it because life itself has value: especially in view of tha fact that we’ll be rewarded with heaven.

He’s saying Jews cannot be expected to be infallible. ( And indeed they weren’t! They made many mistakes).

Then he says what I had said in a previous post. God does not intervene in normal everyday life or we’d never know what to expect and plus it would be taking away our free will because we’d be like puppets on a string. God works through nature and the natural laws He created so we could just live and survive and enjoy our lives.

See? It’s all proper christian concepts. He might just be the type that posts and then disappears. I’ve seen this here. To each his own…​

As far as God and moral laws. All moral laws have been given by God. The natural law which is believed by everyone, even atheists was given by God. God’s moral law is ABSOLUTE.

Are you familiar with Mathew 5:17 and on? Jesus is saying: you have heard it said. He’s explaining that God had originally wanted a set of rules but that the freed slaves (Moses time) would not follow them, so God let them do whatever they wanted. They also had free will. But now Jesus says: But I say to you… So now He’s going to tell the people on the Mount where He gave His sermon what God originally wanted from everyone.

Please read my post no. 8 again. It’s really the only explanation for what you’re looking for. Not because I know more than anybody, it’s just the way it is. It’s not like God was allowing the Jews to sin - it’s that they wouldn’t listen to Him. It’s different. Nobody is infallible, Protestor. Well, the we like to say that the Pope is when he’s speaking ex-cathedra: not even all the time! He could even make a mistake!

For instance, people back in Moses’ time were allowed to give a certificate of divorce. This was a big step forward back then. Men could leave their wife for just any reason. At least now men could not just abandon their wives. But back in the beginning God had said in Genesis that a man was to leave his mother and father and become one with his wife. But sin led man astray from this. We don’t listen to God, that’s the problem.

I know what you mean about absolutes. Just remember that God has absolute morals and we’ve created relative morals. We’re at it again, Protestor!

Fran
 
Okay. Here’s what Tony Rey said:

Originally Posted by tonyrey View Post
God is maximally good because the immense value of life far outweighs its disadvantages, especially when an afterlife is taken into account. It is unreasonable to expect the Jews or anyone else to be infallible. God normally works through the laws of nature so that we can predict most events, survive and enjoy life. If He constantly intervened we would never know what to expect and be aware a benevolent Power is protecting us - which would defeat the purpose of giving us free will so that we can choose what to believe, how to live and who to love…

He’s saying that no matter what disadvantages we have in life: poverty, sickness, lonliness, etc, it’s all worth it because life itself has value: especially in view of tha fact that we’ll be rewarded with heaven.

He’s saying Jews cannot be expected to be infallible. ( And indeed they weren’t! They made many mistakes).

Then he says what I had said in a previous post. God does not intervene in normal everyday life or we’d never know what to expect and plus it would be taking away our free will because we’d be like puppets on a string. God works through nature and the natural laws He created so we could just live and survive and enjoy our lives.

See? It’s all proper christian concepts. He might just be the type that posts and then disappears. I’ve seen this here. To each his own…​

As far as God and moral laws. All moral laws have been given by God. The natural law which is believed by everyone, even atheists was given by God. God’s moral law is ABSOLUTE.

Are you familiar with Mathew 5:17 and on? Jesus is saying: you have heard it said. He’s explaining that God had originally wanted a set of rules but that the freed slaves (Moses time) would not follow them, so God let them do whatever they wanted. They also had free will. But now Jesus says: But I say to you… So now He’s going to tell the people on the Mount where He gave His sermon what God originally wanted from everyone.

Please read my post no. 8 again. It’s really the only explanation for what you’re looking for. Not because I know more than anybody, it’s just the way it is. It’s not like God was allowing the Jews to sin - it’s that they wouldn’t listen to Him. It’s different. Nobody is infallible, Protestor. Well, the we like to say that the Pope is when he’s speaking ex-cathedra: not even all the time! He could even make a mistake!

For instance, people back in Moses’ time were allowed to give a certificate of divorce. This was a big step forward back then. Men could leave their wife for just any reason. At least now men could not just abandon their wives. But back in the beginning God had said in Genesis that a man was to leave his mother and father and become one with his wife. But sin led man astray from this. We don’t listen to God, that’s the problem.

I know what you mean about absolutes. Just remember that God has absolute morals and we’ve created relative morals. We’re at it again, Protestor!

Fran
I admire your patience, Fran! I’m saying a prayer for your success…🙂

NB The OP has been hijacked
 
The real test of whether we know God is good is:
  1. Whether we agree with Schopenhauer it would be better if life had never existed on this planet
  2. Whether we agree that life is valueless, purposeless and meaningless because it is a freak event caused by random combinations of molecules and fortuitous genetic mutations, i.e. absurd from start to finish.
Both views are self-contradictory because they imply that reasoning is the product of irrational processes - and truth doesn’t exist!
 
So my question is how do we come to the conclusion that God is maximally good?
Presumption of innocence.

While the suspect might be guilty of heinous crimes like personally murdering innocents (the Flood), ordering genocide, letting billions of people die due to neglicence (suffering in world + omnipotence) and operating/tolerating a hell-like torture prison, we lack the following information:
  • evidence regarding what happened (e.g. how do we know, who was killed in the Flood? was it realy worldwide? we just presume that innocent children were killed, but what if the regions effected by flood did not have innocent childrens anymore, cause they sacrificed all their children?; are Bible accounts upon genocide by Israelites accurate? who gets in Hell and why?)
  • suspect’s motives for actions (e.g. was the Flood necessary because otherwise even Noah would have turned evil and then all mankind would have been lost forever, all future generations destined for eternal damnation?; desire to bring humankind to reject evil because evil will always end with eternal damnation?)
  • suspect’s alternatives (e.g. how can he both be True, Just and Good and let those fallible humans near him? Maybe the alternative plans to the current one, aren’t that rosy either)
  • suspect’s capabilities (e.g. we do not know, what omnipotence actually means? Why or why doesn’t it include snipping your’re finger making all evil vanish and upholding human freedom at the same time?)
  • suspect’s psychology, social background, “upbringing”, etc. (What exactly does mean without beginning and end? Does this lead to any psychological situation with reduced culpability?)
No sane court would find someone guilty under that circumstances; instead further fact-finding would be required; if not possible, the suspect would have to be acquitted due to lack of evidence.

But especially the few known actions of the suspect would be weighted. It appears the suspect claims to follow some plan to right a horrible wrong, to uphold justice and mercy, although justice demands serious punishment, which mercy strives to avoid and to save billions of sentinent beings from a horrible fate.

That does not automatically justify anything, especially the killing of innocents, as the ends do not justify the means.

But it might mean that the suspect is in a tricky damn if you do and damn if you dont situation; what is right in such situation is very hard to determine and the best criteria whether someone acted acceptable in such a situation, is whether he puts all effort to select the least bad option, if he tries realy hard and then something, giving everything; if someone then selects a from his perspective best plan, which still doesn’t look that nice, one has to presume little or no guilt.

The suspect in this situation purposedly claims to follow such a plan.

And when someone thinks for the good cause he can subject people dependent upon him to some sacrifice, he should at least not be soft upon himself and try to take part of the burden himself; especially, what the suspect himself put himself through is a indication, what the suspect himself thought, is absolutely unavoidable for the least bad plan, and hence might truly have been unavoidable, cause it can be presumed that any sentinent being would strive to avoid own suffering and only accept it as far as absolutely unavoidable.

The suspect supposedly devised as part of his grand plan a for our standards rather bizzare plan to GET HIMSELF SENTENCED TO DEATH ALTHOUGH INNOCENT AND GET HIMSELF TORTURED AND HORRENDOUSLY MURDERED ALTHOUGH INNOCENT.

Hence, it has to be presumed that the suspect truly acted out of the belief that some not so nice plan was necessary to correct some serious problem and acted out of the belief that the least bad of potential plans unfortunately required suffering of innocents and seemingly tried to provide evidence and testimony for this written in his own innocent blood.

Based upon these rather limited and potentially unreliable information, i think any decent court would have to acquit the suspect at least due to lack of evidence and one has to continue to presume him to be innocent; at most, further questioning of the suspect might be necessary to fill out the blanks and maybe arrive at a true innocent verdict.

Though as a separate charge maybe a court would have to consider, whether the suspect acted wrongly by starting this whole thing by creating something from nothing in the first place. But for that part also facts are truly limited, e.g. how does universe creation work? is creating knowing good and bad things will follow better or worse than despairing “Better not to create at all, otherwise there will be suffering”?, etc.
 
Presumption of innocence.

While the suspect might be guilty of heinous crimes like personally murdering innocents (the Flood), ordering genocide, letting billions of people die due to neglicence (suffering in world + omnipotence) and operating/tolerating a hell-like torture prison, we lack the following information:
  • evidence regarding what happened (e.g. how do we know, who was killed in the Flood? was it realy worldwide? we just presume that innocent children were killed, but what if the regions effected by flood did not have innocent childrens anymore, cause they sacrificed all their children?; are Bible accounts upon genocide by Israelites accurate? who gets in Hell and why?)
  • suspect’s motives for actions (e.g. was the Flood necessary because otherwise even Noah would have turned evil and then all mankind would have been lost forever, all future generations destined for eternal damnation?; desire to bring humankind to reject evil because evil will always end with eternal damnation?)
  • suspect’s alternatives (e.g. how can he both be True, Just and Good and let those fallible humans near him? Maybe the alternative plans to the current one, aren’t that rosy either)
  • suspect’s capabilities (e.g. we do not know, what omnipotence actually means? Why or why doesn’t it include snipping your’re finger making all evil vanish and upholding human freedom at the same time?)
  • suspect’s psychology, social background, “upbringing”, etc. (What exactly does mean without beginning and end? Does this lead to any psychological situation with reduced culpability?)
No sane court would find someone guilty under that circumstances; instead further fact-finding would be required; if not possible, the suspect would have to be acquitted due to lack of evidence.

But especially the few known actions of the suspect would be weighted. It appears the suspect claims to follow some plan to right a horrible wrong, to uphold justice and mercy, although justice demands serious punishment, which mercy strives to avoid and to save billions of sentinent beings from a horrible fate.

That does not automatically justify anything, especially the killing of innocents, as the ends do not justify the means.

But it might mean that the suspect is in a tricky damn if you do and damn if you dont situation; what is right in such situation is very hard to determine and the best criteria whether someone acted acceptable in such a situation, is whether he puts all effort to select the least bad option, if he tries realy hard and then something, giving everything; if someone then selects a from his perspective best plan, which still doesn’t look that nice, one has to presume little or no guilt.

The suspect in this situation purposedly claims to follow such a plan.

And when someone thinks for the good cause he can subject people dependent upon him to some sacrifice, he should at least not be soft upon himself and try to take part of the burden himself; especially, what the suspect himself put himself through is a indication, what the suspect himself thought, is absolutely unavoidable for the least bad plan, and hence might truly have been unavoidable, cause it can be presumed that any sentinent being would strive to avoid own suffering and only accept it as far as absolutely unavoidable.

The suspect supposedly devised as part of his grand plan a for our standards rather bizzare plan to GET HIMSELF SENTENCED TO DEATH ALTHOUGH INNOCENT AND GET HIMSELF TORTURED AND HORRENDOUSLY MURDERED ALTHOUGH INNOCENT.

Hence, it has to be presumed that the suspect truly acted out of the belief that some not so nice plan was necessary to correct some serious problem and acted out of the belief that the least bad of potential plans unfortunately required suffering of innocents and seemingly tried to provide evidence and testimony for this written in his own innocent blood.

Based upon these rather limited and potentially unreliable information, i think any decent court would have to acquit the suspect at least due to lack of evidence and one has to continue to presume him to be innocent; at most, further questioning of the suspect might be necessary to fill out the blanks and maybe arrive at a true innocent verdict.

Though as a separate charge maybe a court would have to consider, whether the suspect acted wrongly by starting this whole thing by creating something from nothing in the first place. But for that part also facts are truly limited, e.g. how does universe creation work? is creating knowing good and bad things will follow better or worse than despairing “Better not to create at all, otherwise there will be suffering”?, etc.
A fascinating analysis! I think the weakest part of an otherwise excellent survey is the claim that “the suspect supposedly devised as part of his grand plan a for our standards rather bizzare plan to GET HIMSELF SENTENCED TO DEATH ALTHOUGH INNOCENT AND GET HIMSELF TORTURED AND HORRENDOUSLY MURDERED ALTHOUGH INNOCENT” which suggests that self-sacrifice is an arbitrary means of solving the problem of evil. It raises the problem of an alternative way of liberating the human race from their addiction to the acquisition of power and wealth at the expense of others.

“Hence, it has to be presumed that the suspect truly acted out of the belief that some not so nice plan was necessary to correct some serious problem and acted out of the belief that the least bad of potential plans unfortunately required suffering of innocents and seemingly tried to provide evidence and testimony for this written in his own innocent blood.”

There was (and is) undoubtedly an urgent need for a revolution that transforms our indifference into concern and action for everyone who needs our help. Could it be that supernatural love is the only solution to the law of the jungle?
 
Presumption of innocence… we lack the following information: evidence regarding what happened, suspect’s motives for actions, suspect’s alternatives, suspect’s capabilities, suspect’s psychology… No sane court would find someone guilty under that circumstances; instead further fact-finding would be required; if not possible, the suspect would have to be acquitted due to lack of evidence… one has to continue to presume him to be innocent; at most, further questioning of the suspect might be necessary to fill out the blanks and maybe arrive at a true innocent verdict.
The court analogy is good but limited. In the USA our courts are set up to evaluate the claim of guilt not of innocence. So I think your response should be that you find God not guilty of being maximally good. For me I now usually say that “I do not know”, but I am also okay with people claiming not guilty. Innocence is a separate claim which for me should require more than what you presented. We could also discuss which standard of evidence are we going to use (beyond a shadow of a doubt, to a preponderance of the evidence, ect)
 
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