How do we sin mortally against the Holy Spirit?

[Gloria_de_G]

By seeing that someone is doing things in the name of God and not wanting to believe, but attributing the things to be done by the devil, even though the person lives a righteous life. This is exactly what the religious authorities did to Jesus according to the New Testament:

"22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He is possessed by Be-el′zebul, and by the prince of demons he casts out the demons.” " Mark 3:22

"28 “Truly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter; 29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin”— 30 for they had said, “He has an unclean spirit.” " Mk 3:28-30

One can just imagine what the Church authorities are going to do when the two witnesses appear in the midst of the Catholic Church and make signs like stopping the rain, and they do not want to believe them.

What do you think it means **to sin mortally against the Holy Spirit? What Jesus meant? **

In the love of God,
Gloria
PD I understand eternal sin=mortal sin

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[GEddie]

By seeing that someone is doing things in the name of God and not wanting to believe, but attributing the things to be done by the devil, even though the person lives a righteous life. This is exactly what the religious authorities did to Jesus according to the New Testament:

"22 And the scribes who came down from Jerusalem said, “He is possessed by Be-el′zebul, and by the prince of demons he casts out the demons.” " Mark 3:22

"28 “Truly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter; 29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin”— 30 for they had said, “He has an unclean spirit.” " Mk 3:28-30

One can just imagine what the Church authorities are going to do when the two witnesses appear in the midst of the Catholic Church and make signs like stopping the rain, and they do not want to believe them.

What do you think it means **to sin mortally against the Holy Spirit? What Jesus meant? **

In the love of God,
Gloria
PD I understand eternal sin=mortal sin

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You probably should have posted this in the Apologist corner.

Us average sinners might not be able to do it justice.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Richard_White]

Blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is the only unforgivable sin, because it is the refusal to repent of one’s sins, accept God’s mercy, and actually BE forgiven. If we do not do this, then God will not forgive us, because their is no love or repentance on our parts, which is necessary for full forgiveness. Therefore, we must live in everlasting sin.

Hope this helps!

 

[Gloria_de_G]

You probably should have posted this in the Apologist corner.

Us average sinners might not be able to do it justice.

ICXC NIKA

Sorry for that :tiphat:
Now is here, and I do not know how to transfer it over there…

Gloria

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[Prayer_Warrior]

Sorry for that :tiphat:
Now is here, and I do not know how to transfer it over there…

Gloria

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From the Catechism:

1864 “Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.” There are no limits to the mercy of God, but anyone who deliberately refuses to accept his mercy by repenting, rejects the forgiveness of his sins and the salvation offered by the Holy Spirit. Such hardness of heart can lead to final impenitence and eternal loss.

 

[DMC12]

the blaspheme against the Holy Spirit is not to repent, it is not forgiven because we dont want to repent, at the moment we repent, even that sin is forgiven.

now it usually goes in this three ways:

presumption: you think that God will forgive you, no matter what, so you dont care and dont repent.

Despair: you think you are already damned so you dont repent because there is no use of it.

and simply because you dont want to repent.

 

[Gloria_de_G]

Blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is the only unforgivable sin, because it is the refusal to repent of one’s sins, accept God’s mercy, and actually BE forgiven. If we do not do this, then God will not forgive us, because their is no love or repentance on our parts, which is necessary for full forgiveness. Therefore, we must live in everlasting sin.

Hope this helps!

Yes, Richard, but these sins that you are mentioning are sins against God, not the Holy Spirit. If you refuse to repent of your sins you are sinning against God’s mercy and forgiveness, I do not think that you are blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

What Jesus said in the passage that I quote, is that because He was making miracles in front of the religious authorities, they, by denying - not wanting to see the workings of God in that, but attributing the miracles to the devil - they were blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

**So unbelief is a mortal sin which leads us to eternal condemnation: when the Holy Spirit is working through someone and we do not want to believe. **

In the love of God,
Gloria

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[DMC12]

Yes, Richard, but these sins that you are mentioning are sins against God, not the Holy Spirit. If you refuse to repent of your sins you are sinning against God’s mercy and forgiveness, I do not think that you are blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

What Jesus said in the passage that I quote, is that because He was making miracles in front of the religious authorities, they, by denying - not wanting to see the workings of God in that, but attributing the miracles to the devil - they were blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

**So unbelief is a mortal sin which leads us to eternal condemnation: when the Holy Spirit is working through someone and we do not want to believe. **

In the love of God,
Gloria

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wrong, it is not to repent. even i think that when someone does miracles we should remain somewhat skeptical, to see if there is no tricks, or even demonic influences, because many would want us to be confused about the True Faith.

 

[Nita]

Yes, Richard, but these sins that you are mentioning are sins against God, not the Holy Spirit. If you refuse to repent of your sins you are sinning against God’s mercy and forgiveness, I do not think that you are blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

What Jesus said in the passage that I quote, is that because He was making miracles in front of the religious authorities, they, by denying - not wanting to see the workings of God in that, but attributing the miracles to the devil - they were blaspheming against the Holy Spirit.

**So unbelief is a mortal sin which leads us to eternal condemnation: when the Holy Spirit is working through someone and we do not want to believe. **

In the love of God,
Gloria

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John 16:8 And when he (Holy Spirit) comes, he will convince the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment:

The Holy Spirit works in us to make us aware of our sins so that we can repent of them. When we deny the sinfulness of our acts, rationalize that they really aren’t sins and that we have no reason to repent and confess, we reject the Holy Spirit; we set ourselves up as wiser than He.

 

[Gloria_de_G]

wrong, it is not to repent. even i think that when someone does miracles we should remain somewhat skeptical, to see if there is no tricks, or even demonic influences, because many would want us to be confused about the True Faith.

Precisely DMC, this is what the religious authorities are guilty of in the case of Jesus: skepticism.
Miracles are not something to take in an isolated form from the life of the person. One has to investigate (or the Church) if the person lives a righteous life.

In the love of God,
Gloria

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[Gloria_de_G]

John 16:8 And when he (Holy Spirit) comes, he will convince the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment:

The Holy Spirit works in us to make us aware of our sins so that we can repent of them. When we deny the sinfulness of our acts, rationalize that they really aren’t sins and that we have no reason to repent and confess, we reject the Holy Spirit; we set ourselves up as wiser than He.

Dear Nita, in Jn 14:26 we read also: “But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything, and remind you of all that I have said to you.”

But what do we need to do to receive him in our hearts?:

“‘If you love me, you will keep my commandments. And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate, to be with you for ever. This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, because he abides with you, and he will be in you.” Jn 14:15-17

In the love of the truth,:angel1:
Gloria

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[Bruised_Reed]

I don’t go along with the OP’s understanding that eternal sin=mortal sin so I can’t answer in that vein. And the other posters replying have the same understanding as I.

 

[Gloria_de_G]

I don’t go along with the OP’s understanding that eternal sin=mortal sin so I can’t answer in that vein. And the other posters replying have the same understanding as I.

Dear Bruised, let us see a bit.

From the CCC
1035 The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of **those who die in a state of mortal sin **descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, “eternal fire.”617 The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs. (393)

In fact the Catechism does not say anything about eternal sin, this is the closest, that is why I considered it to be the same.

The only document which I could find a reference to it is:
Ioannes Paulus PP. II
DOMINUM ET VIVIFICANTEM
On the Holy Spirit in the Life of the Church
and the World

where it says:

"If Jesus says that blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgiven either in this life or in the next, it is because this “non-forgiveness” is linked, as to its cause, to “non-repentance,” in other words to the radical refusal to be converted. "

So to me sounds that there is an agreement when we are talking about eternal sin or mortal sin.

In fact in 1 John 1:15 states that:

“If you see your brother or sister committing what is not a mortal sin, you will ask, and God will give life to such a one—to those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin that is mortal;** I do not say that you should pray about that**.”

In the love of God,
Gloria

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[Judas_Thaddeus]

I would refer to this link:
catholicdoors.com/faq/qu42.htm

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Dear Bruised, let us see a bit.

From the CCC
1035 The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of **those who die in a state of mortal sin **descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, “eternal fire.”617 The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs. (393)

In fact the Catechism does not say anything about eternal sin, this is the closest, that is why I considered it to be the same.

The only document which I could find a reference to it is:
Ioannes Paulus PP. II
DOMINUM ET VIVIFICANTEM
On the Holy Spirit in the Life of the Church
and the World

where it says:

"If Jesus says that blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgiven either in this life or in the next, it is because this “non-forgiveness” is linked, as to its cause, to “non-repentance,” in other words to the radical refusal to be converted. "

So to me sounds that there is an agreement when we are talking about eternal sin or mortal sin.

In fact in 1 John 1:15 states that:

“If you see your brother or sister committing what is not a mortal sin, you will ask, and God will give life to such a one—to those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin that is mortal;** I do not say that you should pray about that**.”

In the love of God,
Gloria

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Nope. Not convinced of your unique interpretation.

 

[Gloria_de_G]

Nope. Not convinced of your unique interpretation.

What You do not take the Catechism for right teaching or the Bible? These are the quotes I gave you… Give your quotes if you are not convince with mine, not enough for me just to oppose.

In the love of the truth,
Gloria

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[QNDNNDQDCE]

Thomas Aquinas devotes a question in his Summa Theologiae to “blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.” He gives more than one possible interpretation.

Three meanings have been given to the sin against the Holy Ghost. For the earlier doctors, viz. Athanasius (Super Matth. xii, 32), Hilary (Can. xii in Matth.), Ambrose (Super Luc. xii, 10), Jerome (Super Matth. xii), and Chrysostom (Hom. xli in Matth.), say that the sin against the Holy Ghost is literally to utter a blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, whether by Holy Spirit we understand the essential name applicable to the whole Trinity, each Person of which is a Spirit and is holy, or the personal name of one of the Persons of the Trinity, in which sense blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is distinct from the blasphemy against the Son of Man (Matthew 12:32), for Christ did certain things in respect of His human nature, by eating, drinking, and such like actions, while He did others in respect of His Godhead, by casting out devils, raising the dead, and the like: which things He did both by the power of His own Godhead and by the operation of the Holy Ghost, of Whom He was full, according to his human nature. Now the Jews began by speaking blasphemy against the Son of Man, when they said (Matthew 11:19) that He was “a glutton . . . a wine drinker,” and a “friend of publicans”: but afterwards they blasphemed against the Holy Ghost, when they ascribed to the prince of devils those works which Christ did by the power of His own Divine Nature and by the operation of the Holy Ghost.

Augustine, however (De Verb. Dom., Serm. lxxi), says that blasphemy or the sin against the Holy Ghost, is final impenitence when, namely, a man perseveres in mortal sin until death, and that it is not confined to utterance by word of mouth, but extends to words in thought and deed, not to one word only, but to many. Now this word, in this sense, is said to be uttered against the Holy Ghost, because it is contrary to the remission of sins, which is the work of the Holy Ghost, Who is the charity both of the Father and of the Son. Nor did Our Lord say this to the Jews, as though they had sinned against the Holy Ghost, since they were not yet guilty of final impenitence, but He warned them, lest by similar utterances they should come to sin against the Holy Ghost: and it is in this sense that we are to understand Mark 3:29-30, where after Our Lord had said: “But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost,” etc. the Evangelist adds, “because they said: He hath an unclean spirit.”

But others understand it differently, and say that the sin of blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, is a sin committed against that good which is appropriated to the Holy Ghost: because goodness is appropriated to the Holy Ghost, just a power is appropriated to the Father, and wisdom to the Son. Hence they say that when a man sins through weakness, it is a sin “against the Father”; that when he sins through ignorance, it is a sin “against the Son”; and that when he sins through certain malice, i.e. through the very choosing of evil, as explained above (I-II, 78, 1,3), it is a sin “against the Holy Ghost.”

Now this may happen in two ways. First by reason of the very inclination of a vicious habit which we call malice, and, in this way, to sin through malice is not the same as to sin against the Holy Ghost. On another way it happens that by reason of contempt, that which might have prevented the choosing of evil, is rejected or removed; thus hope is removed by despair, and fear by presumption, and so on, as we shall explain further on (Q 20,21). Now all these things which prevent the choosing of sin are effects of the Holy Ghost in us; so that, in this sense, to sin through malice is to sin against the Holy Ghost.
newadvent.org/summa/3014.htm

 

[Gloria_de_G]

Thomas Aquinas devotes a question in his Summa Theologiae to “blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.” He gives more than one possible interpretation.

I thought I would like also to add this from the Summa Theologica:

"…blasphemy is opposed to the confession of faith, so that it contains the gravity of unbelief: while the sin is aggravated if the will’s detestation is added thereto, and yet more, if it breaks out into words, even as love and confession add to the praise of faith.

Therefore, unbelief is the greatest of sins in respect of its kind, it follows that blasphemy also is a very great sin, through belonging to the same kind as unbelief and being an aggravated form of that sin."

And this unbelief is with what I stated at the beginning of this thread.
But many thanks for your informative post.

In the love of the truth,
Gloria

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[DMC12]

here is why it can’t be what you say:

first: the unrepentance is a sin that can’t be forgiven, because the nature of it is not wanting to be forgiven, but at the moment you repent it can be forgiven.
now dont believing in someone making miracles is something that can happen once in your life, does that means that you are forever damned?

second, the Church even says that we are not obligued to believe every miracle or revelation that has been told, As far as I have seen here, not even Our Lady of Guadalupe in the Tilma.

 

[Gloria_de_G]

here is why it can’t be what you say:

first: the unrepentance is a sin that can’t be forgiven, because the nature of it is not wanting to be forgiven, but at the moment you repent it can be forgiven.
now don’t believing in someone making miracles is something that can happen once in your life, does that means that you are forever damned?

second, the Church even says that we are not obligued to believe every miracle or revelation that has been told, As far as I have seen here, not even Our Lady of Guadalupe in the Tilma.

But see DMC, this is why I quote this from Saint Thomas Aquinas:

“Therefore,** unbelief is the greatest of sins in respect of its kind**, it follows that blasphemy also is a very great sin, through belonging to the same kind as unbelief and being an aggravated form of that sin.”

The importance of believing in miracles depends of the purpose by which they are made.
If by doing them the person is fulfilling some prophecy announce by God before, this is the greatest sin when we do not want to believe.
As for minor miracles which are done for mercy or other motives, we are not obliged.
This is why I mention the two witnesses, because we are oblige to believe if they are making miracles to fulfill God’s prophecies, otherwise we are in eternal sin.:bigyikes:
In the love of God and His promises,
Gloria

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