How do you experience the Holy Spirit

[Cjbhoward]

I’m somewhere in the middle of my 2nd conversion. I believe.

After my first conversion I was convinced God is real & wants a personal relationship with me.

This time, I am hearing the call to holiness.

I’m coming to realize He is communicating to me every second of every minute of the day. I get the big picture part of the conversation. It’s the same message he’s been communicating to us from the beginning. He loves us & shares His life with us & wants us to return to Him.

I “know” everything in this life points to the truth of the next life. He’s teaching me… I’m hard headed & stubborn.

I don’t think I’m special. I think He is talking to all of us, at all times, through all things.

 

[guanophore]

Well I was referring to dictating amoral things

There is no such thing as an “immoral” choice for the Christian. Every choice we make, all day every day, may have moral implications. We need to consider this in all our choices.

he certainly does have expectations

It is odd for you do say this. What might those be?

You asserted that you did not think God was interested in our daily lives, so how can the “expectations” be relevant?

some people have uncertainty about picking between 2 jobs and the like.

Why would you assume there is no “moral” element to such a decision?

So it starts edging towards some kind of new age fate and often positivism or wishful thinking.

I think you lost me here.

And once again I was speaking of people who see a disconnect between the new and old testament where their Jesus doesn’t match the God of the OT or the early teachings of the Church.

Are you one of those? No properly catechized Christian would have this view.

God can communicate to people however He wishes however He can’t contradict Himself or scripture, seeing as how often people contradict both in the name of God I would question their methods.

Yes, we are in agreement on this point. People’ perceptions often contradict the Word of God - what He has revealed to us.

Perception is a matter of experience and education, or lack of it. Not everyone has sufficient experience and education to know they have strayed from what God has revealed as True.

And I would agree with that, starting to see the problems of sola scriptural, my pastor has actually deterred me from reading outside the Bible.

Yes, this is necessary if a pastor is going to keep the flock locked into his own perceptions. If you know too much, you may start asking questions or develop a different point of view.

The worst problem for a Protestant Pastor is that a member of the flock may get deep into the history of the Church, because such persons cease to be Protestant.

 

[Savage92]

An amoral decision could be any number of things in my mind, such as work, I was working in one machine shop but moved to another because it was better run. Neither had any detremental moral implications on my life although I did pray and thank God for the opportunity to move.

As far as not dictating our lives I was referring to the above or whether we eat beef or chicken for dinner. Things that are not of a moral nature described in the Bible.

Are you one of those? No properly catechized Christian would have this view.

Absolutely not, Jesus never contradicted the OT and I never made any indication that I believed this. Not sure why you keep pushing things in that direction because it seems that I would agree with you on most points. And far as catechising you’re helping to convince me eastern orthodoxy is the way to go.

 

[guanophore]

An amoral decision could be any number of things in my mind, such as work, I was working in one machine shop but moved to another because it was better run. Neither had any detremental moral implications on my life although I did pray and thank God for the opportunity to move.

I think you have proved my point. There is no such decision that a follower of Christ can make that should not involved prayer and reflections on the moral implications.

As far as not dictating our lives I was referring to the above or whether we eat beef or chicken for dinner. Things that are not of a moral nature described in the Bible.

What we eat may be morally relevant, depending upon the day or time of the year.

Catholics are not constrained by only what can be found in the Bible. A bulk of our moral instruction comes from the Church.

Not sure why you keep pushing things in that direction

Not at all, but it is difficult to tell if your posts are representing your own views, or another view you do not espouse.

And far as catechising you’re helping to convince me eastern orthodoxy is the way to go.

I will trust that God will lead you to where you need to be to live in the fullness of the One Faith He has passed down to us.

I must warn you, however, that the EO also believe that God speaks to humans every day, all day.

If you are looking for an absentee God, a Deistic approach may be more suited to your desires.

 

[GospelOfMatthew]

People often say that converts are the most active and passionate Catholics because they had to have had some experience that triggered their conversion (thus the power of the Holy Spirit directly in their lives).

I know for me, I was always just a “Sunday Catholic” growing up and I stopped believing in chastity being important, convinced myself I’d have plenty of sex whenever I wanted and waiting was a joke (never did have sex thankfully because of conversion experience), thought gay marriage was fine, and thought the church was outdated and sexist for being pro-life. Add in masturbation and pornographic images addiction for 8 years that I indulged numerous times every day while still receiving communion even at daily mass and I was not a good Catholic.

I thank my brother for showing me a Jason Evert video back when I was 17 and I could care less about it at the time, I thought it was all bs, I was gonna do whatever I wanted whenever I wanted. But July 9th this past summer I really broke down and realized I was living a terrible and sinful life.

I remembered that Evert video and went back and watched it. This time I loved it and I went and read stuff from Christopher West, Matt Fradd, Bishop Barron, Fr. Schmitz… I really felt Jesus telling me I had to come clean, I couldn’t live this lie anymore and that He wanted to bring me back. I really think the Holy Spirit led me during this, I was committing mortal sin after mortal sin, sacrilege after sacrilege and finally I actually wanted to stop. Started praying the rosary, divine mercy Chaplet, and read the four Gospels entirely. I never did any of this, I could of cared less outside of going to Sunday mass. The Holy Spirit led me through my conversion. I never told anyone I was Catholic, I was ashamed of it but now I wear a Crucifix over my clothes 24/7 to show myself what true love is. That’s my story of how I have experienced the Holy Spirit. I could go on for an hour but I won’t lol

 

[Tis_Bearself]

mainly see the holy spirit’s voice as reading scripture, biblical stories coming to thought in times for application and general conviction/guilt. Just wondering if this is a limited view

Yes, it’s limited because you are biased too far in the other direction away from the evangelicals who ascribe every thought they have to the Holy Spirit.

As a Catholic, my belief is that the Holy Spirit does work in your life and part of building a good prayer life is to make yourself open to when the Holy Spirit is working in your life.
When the Holy Spirit wants you to do something, he isn’t wimpy about letting you know, but if you’re not open to the Holy Spirit you could probably miss the cues.

I am quite sure my marriage was completely guided by God/ the Holy Spirit as I was not all that jazzed about getting married in general, and my husband was not at all the kind of person I was originally planning to marry. I also did quite a few things which by the standards of the normal world should have precluded a marriage. The marriage happened and continued on its way, anyway.

I have heard that when something happens that’s the opposite of what you were expecting, it is a sign of God working in your life. Not sure if I totally buy that, but I have certainly received some “interesting” responses from God in my time.

When I returned to the Church after a long period of being a lukewarm/ non-practicing or poorly practicing Catholic, my confessor said it was the Holy Spirit that had inspired me to come back. I tend to agree that it was a combination of the Holy Spirit and my deceased mother that made me just wake up and decide I should get back to active practice, after I happened to read a newspaper article on the Year of Mercy.

in the past year I’ve attended a few “healing Masses” (aka, Catholic charismatic where the emphasis is on the Holy Spirit working in our lives) and also a couple of retreats and numerous prayer cenacles of the Flame of Love movement which likewise focuses on the Holy Spirit coming to us by means of Mary. I have been working on being more open to the Holy Spirit and praying to the Holy Spirit aka the Holy Ghost (I prefer the old name as that is what was more often used when I was a young child). This has been helpful to me in adding a new dimension to my relationship with God. (Just to be clear, I’m not a big charismatic so this is an occasional thing for me. I mostly attend regular OF Masses and the occasional EF Latin Mass or service.)

You can certainly get in touch with the Holy Spirit through Scripture, and I follow the practice of praying the “Come Holy Spirit” prayer before I sit down to read Scripture, but that isn’t the only way. I don’t know what you mean by “general conviction/ guilt”. I personally don’t find guilt feelings to be useful for anything, but that’s just me.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I do worry that most Catholics I know haven’t had this and it’s the true church.

The Lord comes to each person in the way that is right for them. It may be that God has decided that the Catholics you know don’t need this sort of experience to get through to them, or don’t need it at the point in their life where they are at right now; he might choose to give them the experience at some other time, even at the moment of death. Our Lord came to St. Paul by knocking him off his horse and blinding him; with St. Bartholomew he just kinda said, “hi there, I saw you under the tree” and that was all it took.

I think really that there was no other way for Him to make Himself known to me as I was from a non religious family and hadn’t been baptised at that point which reinforces the teaching that He will make himself known to all .

Then you answered your own question about why you had an experience that other Catholics you know might not have had.

In a sense this is harder for cradle catholics as how do you recognise something that has always been there?

It’s true that a cradle might have a harder time recognizing the greatness of a God whom they take for granted as having “always been there”. However, many cradles are going to have moments in our lives when we really need God’s help or really feel His presence in a special way. It often happens when people face a hardship, a significant death, a major illness, a difficult situation involving sin. Again this recognition of God’s presence might be a quiet way (see 1 Kings 19:11-13) instead of a road-to-Damascus moment like you apparently had, but it’s a way, nonetheless.

 

[Savage92]

I think you have proved my point. There is no such decision that a follower of Christ can make that should not involved prayer and reflections on the moral implications.

I would disagree with you there, the food choice itself would still be amoral, if it were say a feast day than the meat itself would not be inherintly sinful, but your knowledge of the fast day could make it sinful to you. Just the same as the act of washing your hands is not inherently sinful or otherwise, but it may be if you are a doctor and know you may be harming someone. As far as praying that is because we can’t know for certain what exactly could have moral implications. Not because every single thing we do does and if we pick the wrong choice between 2 indistinguishable options then things will go wrong for us.

I’ve heard from Orthodox teachings and have absolutely no problem in how they teach of God’s presence. I go to a church that teaches God’s sovereignty as far as it can go (Calvinism), the only part I would disagree with is whether God allows man’s free will within His control. As far as orthodoxy I mainly like that they’re less legalistic than Catholics.

And no thanks, not interested in a deistic “church”, I’m sure that was coming from a good place seeing as how you speak of everything being of moral character. Take care now

 

[guanophore]

I would disagree with you there, the food choice itself would still be amoral, i

You are free to disagree. For Catholics, food choices can have moral implications.

As far as praying that is because we can’t know for certain what exactly could have moral implications.

We can know a great deal through what the Church teaches us, and we can trust the Holy Spirit to guide us when we are sincerely open to being corrected when necessary.

Perhaps you are unaware of how much value there is in the Church teachings about such moral decisions?

Not because every single thing we do does and if we pick the wrong choice between 2 indistinguishable options then things will go wrong for us.

Actions have consequences. When we make a poor moral choice, this usually involves unwanted consequences.

God gives us sufficient revelation to choose not to sin.

I go to a church that teaches God’s sovereignty as far as it can go (Calvinism)

In that case, why are you here? Why are you even considering making a change?

As far as orthodoxy I mainly like that they’re less legalistic than Catholics.

I am not sure what this means, but perhaps you have a warped perception of Catholicism.

And no thanks, not interested in a deistic “church”

It is a better model that provides for an “absentee landlord”. The deist approach seems to resonate more closely with your own needs. God created us, but is not interested in the day to day choices we make. Moral choices are “indistinguishable options” and can’t really go “wrong” for us because the Creator has left us on our own to figure it all out as we go along.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I have to say I’m also not sure where the OP got the idea that “orthodox are less legalistic than Catholics”.

it kinda depends on the specific Catholics and Orthodox you are looking at.

 

[Seagull]

Me - I never know - from day to day -
how I will be experiencing the Holy Ghost.

Some days - it’s wonderful -
Some days - it’s neutral -
Some days - it’s not there at all.

I’d love to be on a higher frequency - all the time - lol
But no. No way has that happened.
Padre Pio - seemed to have a 24/7 vibe about him.

 

[guanophore]

There are daily living decisions that are morally neutral, whether or not to wear my hair in a ponytail for instance.

There are potentially many of them. But suppose you know that wearing your hair in a ponytail aggravates your husband, so you do it deliberately to be hostile? Is this morally neutral act still amoral of intention?

Padre Pio - seemed to have a 24/7 vibe about him.

I think this is God’s intention for us, which is what is meant by “pray unceasingly”. It i s a state of being where we would live with our ear pressed against His lips.

 

[Savage92]

The deist approach seems to resonate more closely with your own needs.

I don’t really care for false caricatures of what I’ve been saying, are you doing this intentionally or by accident?

Anyways deism is the watchmaker God where He just sits back and lets things happen, often to the exclusion of miracles and the gospel. All I’ve said is that not every action is a moral one (not could any action be a moral one, which is a different matter)

 

[guanophore]

Anyways deism is the watchmaker God where He just sits back and lets things happen,

Is there a difference between this position, and God not being interested in our daily lives?

Well the reason I say that is because I don’t believe it’s God’s prerogative to dictate our live

If your idea of God is one that He is not interested in your daily life, would not the “watchmaker” approach make more sense? With a watchmaker God, you don’t need to worry about God speaking about just about anything.

some people will say God speaks to them on just about every matter.

And it doesn’t really sound like the God of Jacob, more like a “new testament Jesus”.

If the NT Jesus is interested in your daily life, and wants to communicate with you in a constant state of praying unceasingly, would it not be better to have a “God of Jacob”? I am not sure if that is a more 'distant" God, but maybe your concept of the God of Jacob means He is not interested in numbering the hairs on your head?

This statement does not seem to leave any room for miracles:

I would probably be on the other end of the spectrum and mainly see the holy spirit’s voice as reading scripture, biblical stories coming to thought in times for application and general conviction/guilt.

All I’ve said is that not every action is a moral one

Actually, you have said a number of things that make it sound like you are expecting a more “distant” God.

 

[Savage92]

If you had read everything I had wrote you would see otherwise, everyone else seemed to get the picture. You kinda read like a Calvinist actually, take generalizations way out of context and then ignore everything else that’s been said. Maybe you should move over to one perhaps? Or would that be off base to think I know what you’re thinking better than you do?

 

[Savage92]

My basic point is mainly this, Evangelicalism, pentacostalism and various types of charismatics have become kinda muddied among the younger generation in my area. Some think you can just write questions on a paper and the holy spirit will write the answer for you, others that you can say positive affirmations/“prophecies” to one another. So they’re looking for demonstrable signs of the Holy Spirit. When I said the Spirit’s voice I meant literal speaking from God, like scripture, people are looking for this in their own lives. Wasn’t anything about God not being able to communicate through any means He wishes, whether it be dreams, life circumstances or even for those who can see or hear God or His people/angels. But the regular means that every Christian experiences on a regular basis.

 

[guanophore]

But the regular means that every Christian experiences on a regular basis.

I must admit, some of your examples seem quite superstitious!

I think that the voice of God speaks to us both through our reason, and through our intuition. Unfortunately, people tend to discount the intuitive route, or as you have shown, blow it into superstition.

We know from reading the Saints that they had a constant conversational intercourse with the Holy Spirit, just as if a person were sitting next to them. I think this kind of awareness and dialogue is what God desires of us all. I think it takes a great deal of practice in prayer to be in the “presence” as Brother Lawrence calls it..

I commend you for resisting the types of superstitious and superficial methods you describe, and for your authentic desire to have a meaningful and realistic comprehension of experiencing the HS in your life.

When I said the Spirit’s voice I meant literal speaking from God, like scripture, people are looking for this in their own lives.

Yes, I think people are starving for this, I know I was when I set out to explore my faith and figure out how it can be done. I retrospect, I wasted many years discounting what others had learned before me. Had I begun with the practice of Lectio Divina I would have avoided a lot of useless rabbit trails.

I, too, have a strong inner resistance to what appears to me people convincing themselves they are hearing from God.

 

[guanophore]

So they’re looking for demonstrable signs of the Holy Spirit.

I think this is a very good mindset, and we are more likely to see the HS at work in our lives when we have this attitude, but I think you are right, it is so easy for us to persuade ourselves into believing it is the HS.

The Church can protect us from this, as the HS will not act outside of what has already be revealed through Scripture and Sacred Tradition. When we are well acquainted with what has already been expressed, we are better able to recognize His voice speaking in the same Sacred voice.

 

[goout]

I experience the Holy Spirit by doing God’s will.
Living a well ordered life. Good Christian habits. A well ordered prayer life.
Living sacrificially for others.

God is love. The indwelling of that love is the Holy Spirit. It seems to me, the more you try to accumulate the Spirit, the less you have. You make a space for the HS by…throwing the garbage out.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I thought a large part of the point of Ignatian spirituality was to be able to recognize / disceren where and how God (aka the Holy Spirit) is working or speaking in our lives.