Same GIRM also specifies it as optional. Sorry.Further signifying that it isn’t some kind of hippie innovation that we can have “feelings” about. It’s part of the Mass; Jesus requires it - live with it.
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jmcrae
Guest
Out of respect for Jesus who commanded that we make peace with our brothers and sisters before partaking of the Sacrifice, and the Apostles who responded to this commandment by including the Sign of Peace in the original Mass, I hope that not too many people omit it.
I also don’t get the fear of germs - everyone has already put their hands in the Holy Water, including you - so if you were going to get sick from something on the other person’s hand, then you already are - politely shaking their hand isn’t going to do anything worse to you.
In any case, as I already said, while I don’t have to like it, I also don’t just stand like a snob at the Ordinary Form; I do shake hands and germs are the least of my worries. I simply hold on to the position that the congregational rite can either be sobered up or moved to the Offertory while the Blessed Sacrament is not yet on the altar. This would in fact be more compliant with the Gospel command and is what the Ambrosian Rite does.Out of respect for Jesus who commanded that we make peace with our brothers and sisters before partaking of the Sacrifice, and the Apostles who responded to this commandment by including the Sign of Peace in the original Mass, I hope that not too many people omit it.
I also don’t get the fear of germs - everyone has already put their hands in the Holy Water, including you - so if you were going to get sick from something on the other person’s hand, then you already are - politely shaking their hand isn’t going to do anything worse to you.
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YoungTradCath
Guest
Jesus does not require us to do the Sign of Peace, no.Further signifying that it isn’t some kind of hippie innovation that we can have “feelings” about. It’s part of the Mass; Jesus requires it - live with it.
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YoungTradCath
Guest
Perhaps making peace with people is simple as putting aside petty, inconsequential grudges at the door. We don’t have to do sentimentalities.Out of respect for Jesus who commanded that we make peace with our brothers and sisters before partaking of the Sacrifice, and the Apostles who responded to this commandment by including the Sign of Peace in the original Mass, I hope that not too many people omit it.
I also don’t get the fear of germs - everyone has already put their hands in the Holy Water, including you - so if you were going to get sick from something on the other person’s hand, then you already are - politely shaking their hand isn’t going to do anything worse to you.
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jmcrae
Guest
If it’s done “sentimentally” where you are, I can see why you don’t like it - that aspect of it is not pertinent to the ritual itself, though. I have only ever seen it done reverently and quietly, except for two individuals who don’t really grasp the concept and think they are saying “Hi” to people - one of them has severe autism and the other is extremely elderly.
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grandfather
Guest
Suppose there were a groiup of Christians praying together, or at Mass. At any point in this activity Jesus Christ appeared in front of them all as He appeared to the apostles. Maybe he walked through the wall, or simply materialized before everyone’s eyes and He said to them what He said to Mary Magdalene at His Resuerrection, “Peace be with you”.
What does everyone think would be the congregation’s response? Would they fall on their knees and adore Him as the shepherds and magi? Would they sing out some high praise? Might they be struck speechless?
How many people think the congregation would all turn to one another and shake hands and say peace be with you, hello, how are you, good to see you, how’s the family? Would they turn their back on Him to greet the person behind them?
Our senses may fail us, but faith says this is exactly what happens at Mass. Right at that moment we start shaking hands and greeting one another. It is no surprise that so many Catholics have lost faith in the Real Presence.
Suppose two people were walking down the street, a lay person and the parish priest. They turn the corner and there is Jesus standing right in front of them. The lay person turns to his priest and asks him for his prieslty blessing. How many people think that might happen?
Suppose the two are lay people and one is an extraordinary eucharistic minister. They encounter Jesus and…
Now we come to receiving approaching Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament in the Communion line. A person who does not want to receive approaches the priest or extraordinary minister lay person. There he is in the presence of Jesus and the minister gives him a pat on the head, his SPECIAL blessing.
After a half dozen or dozen head rubs of all those too young to receive and others, a person in line comes forward and the minister puts his hand in the chalice and gives the communicant the Host on the tongue.
Imagine being in a restaurant and the waitress is coming with your food. She stops at several tables and pats the kids on the head, then puts her hand in a basket of some food and puts it on your plate.
Is any of this special blessing stuff in the rubrics? I am not a germaphobe. Does this sound a bit unsanitary?
What does everyone think would be the congregation’s response? Would they fall on their knees and adore Him as the shepherds and magi? Would they sing out some high praise? Might they be struck speechless?
How many people think the congregation would all turn to one another and shake hands and say peace be with you, hello, how are you, good to see you, how’s the family? Would they turn their back on Him to greet the person behind them?
Our senses may fail us, but faith says this is exactly what happens at Mass. Right at that moment we start shaking hands and greeting one another. It is no surprise that so many Catholics have lost faith in the Real Presence.
Suppose two people were walking down the street, a lay person and the parish priest. They turn the corner and there is Jesus standing right in front of them. The lay person turns to his priest and asks him for his prieslty blessing. How many people think that might happen?
Suppose the two are lay people and one is an extraordinary eucharistic minister. They encounter Jesus and…
Now we come to receiving approaching Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament in the Communion line. A person who does not want to receive approaches the priest or extraordinary minister lay person. There he is in the presence of Jesus and the minister gives him a pat on the head, his SPECIAL blessing.
After a half dozen or dozen head rubs of all those too young to receive and others, a person in line comes forward and the minister puts his hand in the chalice and gives the communicant the Host on the tongue.
Imagine being in a restaurant and the waitress is coming with your food. She stops at several tables and pats the kids on the head, then puts her hand in a basket of some food and puts it on your plate.
Is any of this special blessing stuff in the rubrics? I am not a germaphobe. Does this sound a bit unsanitary?
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Student09
Guest
We do live with it. But it’s not as if the sign of peace has been in this precise form and in this precise part of the Mass for the entire history of Christianity. The Church moved it there fairly recently. It can be moved back to the Offertory, or the form it takes can be changed, or both - none of which is offensive to Jesus. And I don’t think that Jesus is going to throw me out of Mass for having feelings about it, especially since I usually keep them to myself.Further signifying that it isn’t some kind of hippie innovation that we can have “feelings” about. It’s part of the Mass; Jesus requires it - live with it.
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MartyrForJesus
Guest
I had never thought of it like this. Thanks.
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OraLabora
Guest
I’m Canadian. I use both. When I’m a germ factory, I use a bow. When not, a brief handshake. I’ve never seen it done “exuberantly”. If my wife is with me, I will kiss her because:
And that’s the way it’s still done by the monks of the monastery to which I’m affiliated.Imagine living in the time of the Apostles, when the rubric was to kiss each other on the cheek during the Sign of Peace - and they hadn’t even invented Lysol hand-wipes, yet!.
Indeed. People forget that in many instances, Vatican II didn’t innovate, it returned us to ancient uses. This is the case, for instance with insisting that religious orders and congregations return to their original charisms. The post-Vatican II hymnal (Latin) for the LOTH also returned many hymns to their ancient and original wording, from the more recent pre-Vatican II innovations! Just a couple of examples.
As I said earlier I hate the sign of the peace because I dislike people, especially strangers, invading my personal space. But it’s a personal distaste, and I recognize that by forcing me out of my comfort zone, this small act at Mass is playing a large role in my transformation… the transformation that causes one to get out of one’s self, and recognize that “it’s not ALL about me!”.
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Faith1960
Guest
I sometimes feel like you do, but I carry hand sanitizer in my purse and often use it before I go up to Communion.
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Faith1960
Guest
I’d like to have that more often at our Church, too.
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Faith1960
Guest
I take my coat off and just try to squeeze it in the pew with me.One of the things that amused me greatly when I converted was noticing that Catholics keep their coats on in church. At the LDS wards when I was growing up, there was alway a big coat rack in the foyer area where most people hung their coats. But Catholics, they keep their coats on, I guess because of the space they take up in a pew or something.
When I keep my long black cloak on in church (because of temperature, room, etc), I always feel like Batman. Except for, you know, the lacy veil on my head.
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Brendan
Guest
The command of Christ to make peace with our brothers happened already, during the Penitential Rite, especially in Form A.
The Sign of Peace has little to do with Christ’s command, as that command was already fulfilled earlier in Mass. Thus must be so, as the Sign of Peace is optional and after the Consecration.
Note Redemptionis Sacramentum.
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
According to the Catholic Encyclopedia it was moved to after the Our Father very early in the Western Church and is mentioned in its present place in the 5th century.
Agreed.
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Pat_Albertson
Guest
This ^^^.St. Francis kissed the leper, “and that which was bitter became sweet.”
And the leper revealed himself as Christ.
Maybe the sign of peace is a challenge to us to reach out and embrace the Christ that is within us all: the Christ we are soon to meet in the Eucharist.
If we can’t greet Christ in the pew next to us, how can we dare consume Christ in the Host?
I don’t like doing the Sign Of Peace either, but I figure one of the things I’ll be judged on is whether or not I could step out of my everyday world and behave the way Christ would have (or at least make an attempt, no matter how pathetic . . .).
That said, I like the hand-sanitizer idea. And who’s to say that the other person will be the one giving you the germs, maybe it will be the other way 'round. Perhaps we should use hand-sanitizer both before and after we do the Sign Of Peace! :newidea:
Just my :twocents:
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Sacred_Heart_1
Guest
You have to have faith in these matters. I’m sure people get sick in these matters but if you don’t believe in the sanctity of that bread and the sanctity of that wine then you probably are going to get sick. In all my years at mass I have never gotten sick because of the Sign of Peace.
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Brendan
Guest
FYI,
I noticed that I didn’t post all of RS 71. Here it is
And that is why, as Fr. NewEngland (
) noted, it can legitimately be moved elsewhere in the liturgy. Or even dispensed with.
The Pentiential Rite, on the other hand, must remain before the Offetory, as that is a command of Christ.
I noticed that I didn’t post all of RS 71. Here it is
As hopefully all can see, it is the Penitential Rite, especially Form A, that fulfills Christ’s command given in Mt 5, NOT the Sign of Peace.
And that is why, as Fr. NewEngland (
) noted, it can legitimately be moved elsewhere in the liturgy. Or even dispensed with.The Pentiential Rite, on the other hand, must remain before the Offetory, as that is a command of Christ.
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jmcrae
Guest
You are way more likely to catch something in the Holy Water, since wet hands transmit germs to your face a lot faster than dry hands.
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Elvis_Guy
Guest
Well, I must make “confession” I’m …I bit OCD in some things I’ve never been very comfortable shaking hands with those I don’t know… I glad this post came up…I’ve always felt guilty in that I , position myself…to shake the least number of hands,
…I suppose it’s not I “don’t like the Peace”… It’s this little quirk of mine, Its like I don’t like touching bathroom doors other than in my home. As I say … For me…less a position on the Peace, than a…little quirk I have…- Status