How do you get out of a vicious circle?

[fakename]

Here’s what I mean:

there are 2 people, any of these two can be good or bad, but these two people don’t know when the other is being bad or good, and also they themselves might not know when they personally are being good or bad. Now a person deserves to be rewarded or punished according as they are good or bad, but again, there are only two people in this scenario so one or both must give rewards or punishments to each other but neither are sure about how good they or the other person is. So then how do they not mistake good for bad and attack it or bad for good and reward it? And if they continuously mistake the good for bad, then will they not attack each other (and the good) constantly? Is there a way out of this?

 

[OscarsMama]

Yes, there is a way out. Get out. Walk away. Leave. Stop contact.

Those things sound horrible. But the only way off a roller coaster or a merry-go-round is to get off.

I have been on many “carnival rides” and, trust me, the only way for the ride to stop is to get off.

With that said…if it is a relationship that you do not want to end, but you just want to CHANGE, then somebody has to be the one to change. And that person could be you. You cannot change what somebody does or who somebody is, but you can change what YOU do. You can change how you react to things. You can change when, how, and how often you speak to or associate with that person.

And, of course, say lots of prayers. God does not change people, though, but when you say lots of prayers, God will help you better deal with people.

 

[fakename]

Yes, there is a way out. Get out. Walk away. Leave. Stop contact.

Those things sound horrible. But the only way off a roller coaster or a merry-go-round is to get off.

I have been on many “carnival rides” and, trust me, the only way for the ride to stop is to get off.

With that said…if it is a relationship that you do not want to end, but you just want to CHANGE, then somebody has to be the one to change. And that person could be you. You cannot change what somebody does or who somebody is, but you can change what YOU do. You can change how you react to things. You can change when, how, and how often you speak to or associate with that person.

And, of course, say lots of prayers. God does not change people, though, but when you say lots of prayers, God will help you better deal with people.

The question was a speculative question and it doesn’t have to do with me.

But assuming you meant it as such an answer -why should people give up if they have a duty towards the rebuking and punishment of wrongdoers? If there is just a chance of someone being bad towards you then you should at least not give up and invest some time assessing the situation, since it is a duty and duties shouldn’t be shrugged off?

But there is another question involved with this and that is, does God use injustice as a punishment to the unjust? If so does this mean that 2 wrongs make a right -the first injustice is remedied by the second injustice (under the aspect of punishment)?

 

[John21652]

The best way out of a vicious circle is to stand in a corner.

In other words, don’t participate.

 

[fakename]

The best way out of a vicious circle is to stand in a corner.

In other words, don’t participate.

But how does one solve the scenario? It is for instance, highly probable that two equally wrong people end up fighting and likewise it is possible for 2 equally good people to end up fighting.

Given this, what attitude should one take to conflict resolution?

 

[jpjd]

Two wrongs never make a right.

May I say that you seem very oriented toward judging whether someone is good or bad and then meteing out corresponding rewards or punishments. That is how we train animals to behave, but for humans, that is primitive. I would suggest that you simply focus on living in a loving manner. Simply live life as Christ taught. If you or the other person make a mistake, OK, then try again tomorrow. Skip the reward/punishment routine. God bless.

 

[SteveGC]

Quite nonsensical, I must say.

If you can never possess knowledge of good or bad, then it makes no sense to continue until you possess the authentic yardstick by which good or bad can be determined.

Where did you learn that it is your duty to punish the wrongdoer?

Anyway, this scenario omits a critical element: the necessity of possessing authentic knowledge of morality. Without this element, the scenario is a wash and indeed is a vicious circle.

 

[fakename]

Quite nonsensical, I must say.

If you can never possess knowledge of good or bad, then it makes no sense to continue until you possess the authentic yardstick by which good or bad can be determined.

Where did you learn that it is your duty to punish the wrongdoer?

Anyway, this scenario omits a critical element: the necessity of possessing authentic knowledge of morality. Without this element, the scenario is a wash and indeed is a vicious circle.

1. one in certain times does not possess knowledge of good and bad since all knowledge is fallible. But one could also not know that one does not know -that is one can make a mistake. This applies to every moral problem, no matter in what you think morality consists.
2. It would seem that one should punish the wrongdoer since if one shouldn’t, then one shouldn’t be contrite for one’s sins and one should not be punished for them and also the punishments of law would be evil. Also God punishes people and God’s actions are an exemplar of morality. Therefore it is okay to punish people or reward them.
3. Nonetheless if only animals should be punished or rewarded a) humans are animals so why shouldn’t we be treated likewise, b) it would seem that humans are esp. to be rewarded/punished since they are morally responsible. Also people are to be judged w/in reason. But sometimes you shouldn’t judge people because you don’t know much about their motives nonetheless -inasmuch as you do, you should judge or else how could anyone admonish anyone?
4. I suppose Ignorance excuses from any wrongdoing but in that case, would the violence be considered a good?

 

[Brendan_McCabe]

Two equally good people would agree so there would be no argument.

Thankfully we do not judge ourselves what is good or bad, that is why God gave us His commandments so that we can always know what is good and what is bad.

Gods law frees us from the vicious circle.

 

[OscarsMama]

The question was a speculative question and it doesn’t have to do with me.

But assuming you meant it as such an answer -why should people give up if they have a duty towards the rebuking and punishment of wrongdoers? If there is just a chance of someone being bad towards you then you should at least not give up and invest some time assessing the situation, since it is a duty and duties shouldn’t be shrugged off?

But there is another question involved with this and that is, does God use injustice as a punishment to the unjust? If so does this mean that 2 wrongs make a right -the first injustice is remedied by the second injustice (under the aspect of punishment)?

I think that concerning yourself with punishments and rewards of others is a waste of time. That is God’s job. If you are referring to a situation at work or something (an employee or you are in law enforcement or something), then I think that the way to clear things up is to have a set of rules that everybody must follow. Really black and white rules… ie: it is against the law to speed… therefore, if you speed you will get a ticket. I don’t think that it is OUR duty to punish or reward somebody.

As for the question about whether or not God uses injustice as a punishment to the unjust… … I really don’t know. I don’t know why God does some of the things that he does. I don’t know why “bad things happen to good people” or why “good things happen to bad people.” I just try to remind myself that it is not up to ME whether somebody is GOOD or BAD or if what is happening to them is GOOD or BAD. That is between that person and God. God said that his ways are above our ways… I think that makes the most sense. I think that it is very common human-habit to try to make ourselves ‘equal’ to God . What I mean is we are always trying to discuss who is being punished, who is not being punished, who is wrong, who is right, etc. That is GOD’s decision and his alone. Not ours.

We have rules in our society that everybody must follow, but as for the other things… totally up to GOD.