P
pm2222
Guest
Like if you pray for others to convert, what happens? Would’nt God already be trying to get these people to convert?
- Status
M
MarcoPolo
Guest
God may provide grace to convert a sinner through the instrumentality of your prayer. 
J
Joe_5859
Guest
Prayer is like a magical PEZ dispenser: say the right words, and the candy comes out. 
Okay, that is exactly the opposite of what prayer really is, but that can be the way we often approach it.
We pray for others not because God needs it but because we need it. God does not need us, but He has given us the capacity to be his co-worker because that is the best thing for us.
When we pray for others, we are conforming ourselves more and more to the will of God. We are opening ourselves to a relationship with Him.
Okay, that is exactly the opposite of what prayer really is, but that can be the way we often approach it.
We pray for others not because God needs it but because we need it. God does not need us, but He has given us the capacity to be his co-worker because that is the best thing for us.
When we pray for others, we are conforming ourselves more and more to the will of God. We are opening ourselves to a relationship with Him.
B
Bohm_Bawerk
Guest
Praying for others works in the sense that the Church is composed of what we call the “Communion of Saints”. Everytime you attend Mass, Catholics profess to believe it isn’t just the parishioners that you see that are attending. No, not at all. Everytime you attend Mass, both the living faithful, those in Purgatory (Holy Souls), and those in Heaven (saints and angels), are also participating. The Church is like one gigantic community, of the visible and invisible.
When you pray for someone, you are helping someone within the Church community. This is a form of charity. Intercession as a form of prayer dates all the way back to Abraham, who prayed that God may spare the city of Sodom. It is rumoured that St. Monica prayed for 30+ years for the conversion of her son who later came to be known as St. Augustine. In the Epistle of James, it instructs believers to: “confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed” (James 5:16).
Praying for a single person has a metaphysical ripple effect across the Church community. When you pray even just for one person, it benefits everyone in the Church community. In the same way, when you sin, it harms everyone in the Church community, in ways that are generally unseen. This explains why in antiquity, confession was often done public, and if memory serves me correct, penance was also done public.
When you pray for someone, you are helping someone within the Church community. This is a form of charity. Intercession as a form of prayer dates all the way back to Abraham, who prayed that God may spare the city of Sodom. It is rumoured that St. Monica prayed for 30+ years for the conversion of her son who later came to be known as St. Augustine. In the Epistle of James, it instructs believers to: “confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed” (James 5:16).
Praying for a single person has a metaphysical ripple effect across the Church community. When you pray even just for one person, it benefits everyone in the Church community. In the same way, when you sin, it harms everyone in the Church community, in ways that are generally unseen. This explains why in antiquity, confession was often done public, and if memory serves me correct, penance was also done public.
R
Road2Damascus
Guest
You certainly explain this well in spite of your own self-proclaimed status. The “Communion of Saints” is an area that at times, is difficult to understand but stated in the Creeds, is clearly believed by the early Church and references to which are clearly found in the Bible.
P
pm2222
Guest
So would I be correct in saying that praying for others is sort of the same concept of redemptive suffering? Like God doesn’t not need our prayers but he allows us to participate in praying for others so we can in a way work with him? Like in redemptive suffering He doesn’t need our suffering because Jesus suffered for everyone but we can still unite our sufferings with Jesus
J
Joe_5859
Guest
I think that’s a fair comparison. What greater job could God give to us than to give us the opportunity to participate in His saving work?
B
Benadam
Guest
St Stephen the first martyr prayed that those who were stoning him be forgiven. St Paul the person in authority at his stoning imho was the main beneficiary of this prayer.
There is a saying from those who witnessed the persecutions in the early church that describes how the power of prayer works.
" Persecuted christians rejoiced for the opportunity to forgive knowing that forgiveness adds power to their prayers."
Apply that to St Stephen’s prayer and notice how often teachings about prayer include forgiveness.
There is a saying from those who witnessed the persecutions in the early church that describes how the power of prayer works.
" Persecuted christians rejoiced for the opportunity to forgive knowing that forgiveness adds power to their prayers."
Apply that to St Stephen’s prayer and notice how often teachings about prayer include forgiveness.
J
Julia_Mae
Guest
I’m on a strange computer and so won’t leave links, however.
Prayer is a major component in what has been referred to as “the exchange of spiritual goodsd” in the encyclkical reforming indulgencdes you can find on the Vatican website tha really explains how prayer wors.
Prayer is like spiritual money. It’s a real “thing” in other words. Just as you can give money to a charity and have it converted into food on the other side of the world for someone you don’t even know, so when you pray, by the sacrifuc ice of time, by the intensity of your faith, by the intention of your heart and the action of your phjysical self, you convert matter into this special energy God uses to accomplish His Will on earth.
I don’t think it’s correct to say God doesn’t need our prayers and sacrifices. When Jesus went to His homeytown, He was not “able” according to Scriptuire, to do any great deeds there but a few simple healings “because of their lack of faith.”
“By your faith, you are healed,” He said, I think more than once. We give Him our faith, He gives us back … everything. The more we give, the more He can give to an atheist who has no faith. To a child who is too young to even know what the word means.
Your prayer is a hugely powerful force for bringing Saving Grace to the world in real ways. Ways that feed, heal, covert, ways that styop wars and lessen true suffering. You are very important, as are all the faithful, in bringiing God’s plan to fruition.
Save a life, feed someone, pray a Rosary every day.
Prayer is a major component in what has been referred to as “the exchange of spiritual goodsd” in the encyclkical reforming indulgencdes you can find on the Vatican website tha really explains how prayer wors.
Prayer is like spiritual money. It’s a real “thing” in other words. Just as you can give money to a charity and have it converted into food on the other side of the world for someone you don’t even know, so when you pray, by the sacrifuc ice of time, by the intensity of your faith, by the intention of your heart and the action of your phjysical self, you convert matter into this special energy God uses to accomplish His Will on earth.
I don’t think it’s correct to say God doesn’t need our prayers and sacrifices. When Jesus went to His homeytown, He was not “able” according to Scriptuire, to do any great deeds there but a few simple healings “because of their lack of faith.”
“By your faith, you are healed,” He said, I think more than once. We give Him our faith, He gives us back … everything. The more we give, the more He can give to an atheist who has no faith. To a child who is too young to even know what the word means.
Your prayer is a hugely powerful force for bringing Saving Grace to the world in real ways. Ways that feed, heal, covert, ways that styop wars and lessen true suffering. You are very important, as are all the faithful, in bringiing God’s plan to fruition.
Save a life, feed someone, pray a Rosary every day.
F
FaithJoy
Guest
God’s way is planting a seed.But, the person has the freedom to water that seed to grow. God isn’t going to cross that line on free will. Look up the parable of the mustard seed from Jesus.
J
Jim_Roberts
Guest
No, God has given us a free will to use and he will not interfer with our will. Because of the free-will, it is up to the infividual person,
JESUS I TRUST IN YOU
ir
P
pm2222
Guest
Ok, so we pray and God uses the time we spent in prayer and the faith we have to help others. But God is God…why cant he just help others even if we choose not to pray?
B
Benadam
Guest
I think it has to do with God’s integrity. God didn’t order creation in the way He did for us to operate in alone, He ordered it in a way that He can be with us in a familial relationship. This is the order He established in the beginning.
J
Julia_Mae
Guest
There used to be a standard joke that came from Catholic theology that made fun of all religions when there were things they couldn’t explain: “It’s a Mystery!”
But it is. It’s a word that means “We in our tiny brains cannot even begin to fathom the Divine Reality.” When you pass, you’ll know, I’m sure.
For now, this is what I know for sure. Our job here is to be Christ to everyone we meet and to do what we can to provide the means for God to do great and wondrous things in lives of those we don’t ever meet. Prayer is a real thing, not an idea or rote memorization or desperate plea or imagined way of comforting ourselves.
It’s the most powerful tool any human being possesses.
P
Paul_theApostle
Guest
What if you saw a man drowning in a river,or found a wounded man ,would you walk by and say to yourself ,its ok God will come soon to help him ,or would you help him yourself.
and why would you help him perhaps?
because you may be a good guy with a good heart who loves others and by chance believes in and even loves God ,so you lend support for your brother who is in need.
If God doesnt help ,guide ,protect or convert someone by means of one of his Angels,or one of his Priests ,or one of his Bishops or Apostles,perhaps he could use YOU to help that person
providing your one of his Servants or useful Sons that is
and not one who works iniquity or sows tares among men
P
pm2222
Guest
Ok these are some good answers, does anyone know this…Why do Mary’s prayers help us so much.
P
Paul_theApostle
Guest
She has influence over her Son being his mother
Shes closer to God than any other Saint or angel
She is Most Holy and full of Grace and Love so her prayers are powerful
I have a book about Angels ,on the last page it says-
PRAYER TO OUR LADY,QUEEN OF ANGELS
A Bernadine Sister was shown in spirit the vast desolation caused by the devil throughout the world,and at the same time she heard the Blessed Virgin telling her that it was true,Hell had been let loose upon earth;and that the time had come to pray to her as the Queen of the Angels and to ask of her the assistance of the heavenly legions to fight against these deadly foes of God and of men.
“But my good Mother”,she replied,“you who are so kind,could you not send them without our asking?”
“No”, Our Lady answered, “because prayer is one of the conditions required by God Himself for obtaining favors”, Then the Blessed Virgin communicated the following prayer,bidding the Sister to have it printed and distributed:
AUGUST QUEEN OF HEAVEN! Sovereign Mistress of the Angels! Thou who from the beginning hast recieved from God the power and mission to crush the head of Satan,we humbly beseech thee to send thy holy Legions,that,under thy command and by thy power,they may pursue the evil spirits,encounter them on every side ,resist their bold attacks and drive them hence into the abyss of eternal woe. Amen.
B
Benadam
Guest
Heaven is structured upon the bonds between persons. First the bond between the Divine Persons.
Since the Second divine Person was born as a human He is bound to a human mother, and there being no sin to obstruct this maternal bond, it places Our blessed Mother first among humans in the heavenly family.
P
PJM
Guest
God obligates Himself to make available ONE TIME sufficient grace for everyone to Know Him. If for any reason that grace is denined by the one being offered it; God has fulfilled His obligation.
So what prayer does is to encourage God to grant additional graces to the person your praying for. AGAIN in a sufficient amount for that person to KNOW God. BUT again in can be rejected and God never forces or permits His Will [His desire that everyone be saved] over our freewill as that is the very reason we are created with a mind, intellect, and freewill attached to our Souls. For us to choose to KNOW God.
The MORE we pray the more opportunities the person for whom we pray has.
While God desires that everyone be saved; it is Gods iniative BUT our choice that determines the outcome. God always respects OUR will over His; because perfect love has to be freely given. God FREELY gives it to us and we MUST freely give it back to Him.
So don’t give up’ KEEP PRAYING!
God Bless,
Pat
AND WELCOME TO THE FORUM!
J
Julia_Mae
Guest
But, you only b need to give Him the tiniest opening… even one you don’t mean…God obligates Himself to make available ONE TIME sufficient grace for everyone to Know Him. If for any reason that grace is denined by the one being offered it; God has fulfilled His obligation.
So what prayer does is to encourage God to grant additional graces to the person your praying for. AGAIN in a sufficient amount for that person to KNOW God. BUT again in can be rejected and God never forces or permits His Will [His desire that everyone be saved] over our freewill as that is the very reason we are created with a mind, intellect, and freewill attached to our Souls. For us to choose to KNOW God.
Here is a story from the other side, of an atheist who was - well - her first encounter with God, He kind of kidnapped her life. And wouldn’t let her go. She wrote a book called “Blest Atheist” but this blog post is her basic story of the night God grabbed her - mahlou.blogspot.com/2009/08/my-conversion-story.html
After you read this, you’ll know why praying for conversion is a VERY good and powerful thing.
- Status